Need some screw help.

[Mike Cutler]

I seem to work quite a bit with very dense, tropical harwoods. Trying to thread a screw into these woods is a pain. I just about have to size the screwhole with a tap chart for metal, even then the screws tend to bugger up, and I have to put new ones in.

I am looking for a source of high quality brass screws, preferably slotted head, and not phillips head. The 'Borg stuff doesn't cut it. I have used Lawsons with success, but they are difficult to come by( I actually buy them from the auto parts store)
I am also looking for a tap, or quality gimlet for #6,8,10 and 12 screws. So far the ones I have seen do not appear to be made for the long haul. I would even consider paying one of the machinists here on the board to make me a high quality set of these out of tool steel.

One more item. I have tried a lot of different tapered drills, and counters for wood screws with no real success. If someone knows of a really nice set, that works, I would appreciate the info.

Not exactly a woodworking question per se.

[Gary Breckenridge]

:rolleyes: Brass screws are about as strong as a bar of soap. People use brass for looks and because it doesn't rust, think wooden boats. I'd suggest that you tap the holes and then put in a strong steel screw. Then remove the steel and put the same sized brass screw into the hole.:cool:

[Mack Cameron]

I'm not certain if this is what you are looking for. I use them instead of screws in many cases.
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=1&cat=3,41306,41330,40057&p=40057
Hope it helps. They have never failed me.

[John Piwaron]

What I do is "tap" the hole with a lubricated steel screw of the same size brass screw I'll be using. Even then I'm very careful with the steel screw.

I use parafin to lubricate the threads. I used to use soap, but some people say that this can cause problems over time.

Until I began doing those two things, I too broke a lot of brass screws. Not any more.

[David Rose]

Lee Valley sells good tapered drills for pilots. I usually drill just a bit deeper than needed. I like brass butt hinges which need brass screws, IMO. For most of the doors I build, I use two sizes of hinges and screws. I took a longer shanked steel screw with matching threads (to the brass screws), cut off the head, and epoxied the butt end into a wooden file handle. It is simple to dip the handled screw into some mink oil and screw it into the pilot hole. Then the hole is prelubed for the brass screws and prethreaded. I've not had any trouble with this method. Oh, and the "mink oil" was just handy. About any good wax would likely work.

David

[Nancy Laird]

:rolleyes: Brass screws are about as strong as a bar of soap. People use brass for looks and because it doesn't rust, think wooden boats. I'd suggest that you tap the holes and then put in a strong steel screw. Then remove the steel and put the same sized brass screw into the hole.:cool:

My other half seconds/thirds this piece of advice wholeheartedly.

Nancy

[Mike Cutler]

Gary. The Lawson brand of screws are much higher in quality than the 'borg junk. I pretty much follow the steps you have outlined. I'm trying to decrease some of the steps. I'll probably have to keep doing it the same way I reckon.

Mack. I've definitely thought about drilling and tapping for 10-24, and 12-24. Especially in Jatoba.

John. I'm not having a problem breaking the screws, per se. the problem is that by the time I get them in I have to file the heads, because they have gotten a little buggered up. Nice suggestion about the paraffin. With 14 beehives, I may try beeswax.

David. I'll try Lee Valley. I hate using slotted brass screws, but I agree that they look better for some reason when the project is done, phillips just looks wrong for some reason. Still I hate using them. I'll look at Lee Valley.

Nancy. You're other half is right. No strength in the rotational axis. Once in though....

I'll tell ya' though, stainless steel woodscrews are very fragile. Almost as bad as brass.

[Paul Libby]

I assume that you are lubricating your screws with bee's wax or parafin? That makes them drive much easier in hard wood.

[glenn bradley]

Gary's got the idea. Brass screws will not take a lot of torque. I keep some steel square drive screws that match my brass screw thread pattern handy (traditional machine cut threads in most cases). Mc Feely's carries quality brass screws and steel screws that match pretty close.

Follow your chart (#8 screw, hardwood, 5/32 shank hole, 7/64 pilot for example). Then drive a steel screw into the hole to prep it to receive the soft brass screw. I like the square heads for the steel screws as I don't slip and damage my work while preparing the hole to receive the brass screw.

Extra work? Yes. Reduced frustration and damaged brass screws as a result? Yes again.

As for counter sinks. Some fellow Creekers steered me onto the style used in the aircraft industry in this thread:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=40441

I picked ones small enough to handle #4 through #8 and others to go from #6 through around 1/4". This design has proven better for me than the single or multi-flute designs so often sold for woodworking. Just make sure to order the right angle, 82* IIRC.