Lock Miter Router Bits, (whatcha think)

[Aaron Beaver]

I have seen old post about these bits, most I found were a year or older that I read/found.

Anyone got one recently or still use one with good sucess? I was looking at getting one and would prefer one where the board doesn't have to be cut at 45 first (at least the entire profile). Just seeing if there is something just as good, maybe easier to use but still make an attactive joint to use sometimes for 45 corners

[Jim Bills]

I bought the "smaller" 3/4" max thickness bit from Rockler last month. I used the lock miter joint constructing 4 - 3"x3" x 30" legs from quarter sawn red oak. The bit took quite a few test pieces to get set up properly, but after I got what I wanted, worked as advertised. I didn't pre cut the sides at all. The pieces ran fine on the router table in one pass. Actually turned out better than anticipated.

Jim

[Mack Cameron]

I have Freud's 99-034 lock mitre sitting in my router bit cabinet. After I finally got a good practice joint out of it, I've never had a use for it. That's at least 10 yrs past. It just sits there like a good little bit should. It is a b---er to set up.

I prefer Freud's 99-240 Drawer Lock bit & LV's 16J76.72 1/2 size Drawer Lock bit. You can do 90* corners on a box (assuming the wood grains are running parallel to each other) and the joints are invisible to the naked eye.

[Mike Cutler]

I bought the "smaller" 3/4" max thickness bit from Rockler last month. I used the lock miter joint constructing 4 - 3"x3" x 30" legs from quarter sawn red oak. The bit took quite a few test pieces to get set up properly, but after I got what I wanted, worked as advertised. I didn't pre cut the sides at all. The pieces ran fine on the router table in one pass. Actually turned out better than anticipated.

Jim

You got it in a single pass :eek: You must have nerves of steel.

I do them in two passes. The vib's were horrendous in a single pass. I didn't find that pre-cutting the miter helped at all. In fact it had the opposite effect, The material wanted to climb the face of the bit. I have precut a 3/8x3/8 miter. That part of the profile is waste.

It's a nerve wracking bit. But it does work well once setup properly. It makes a great glue joint.

[John Nixon]

Rockler sells a setup block for the smaller bit. I wish they had one for the large bit too. I made my own setup blocks, but getting it setup correctly was a chore.

I remember seeing a website (can't find it now) where the guy made a simple sled that the piece rode on as it passed the bit. The advantage was that the sled had a place to fasten the work piece (via a screw in the end of the piece being milled). It seemed much safer / stable this way.

I too do it all in one pass simply because I don't want to reset any thing. I suppose I could rectify this by adding a 1/4 piece of something to my fence that I could remove for the second pass.

It does make a great joint when you get it setup correctly.

John

[glenn bradley]

Featherboards?

[terry hansen]

FWW ran an article on use of locking miter bit and it's included in the fww Book on joinery, article named: Stickley Style Legs by Patrick Nelson. I have the book and pdf'd the article so I could use reprint in shop as go by for jigs and how to clamp the glue up. I also have some comments culled from other boards on use of the lock miter bit.

I used bit to make legs and it is truely a life altering experience when that bit catches in the oak and hurls it across the room like a spear but the joint is nice.
Let me know if you'd like more info.

[Jim Bills]

I purchased the set-up block from Rocklers, it wasn't even close to the required set-up (at least for me) a total waste of money. But you can bet your sweet bippy I saved a piece of my properly set-up run for future reference (both for height and fence settings)

I don't have nerves of steel, just used a fairly high router speed, and a fairly low feed rate. Didn't notice any scary vibrations of any kind, it actually cut nice and smooth. That said it wouldn't hurt to run a 3/8" bevel prior to profiling.

Jim

[Mike Cutler]

Featherboards?

Glenn.

I honestly don't think that a featherboard alone would be strong enough. There is a lot of material being removed at once. The chatter and vibration are pretty significant, at least for me. I was using a Whiteside large lock miter bit. I might try the smaller bit next time. The whiteside is almost 3' in diameter. Maybe the decreased size, and weight of the smaller one will have less chatter.

I set the bit up with a pine board, and then switched to brazillian cherry. It was a bit of a workout to say the least. I couldn't cut the brazillian cherry in a single pass.

John Nixon.

There is an excellent article on the Lock miter in the book, "In The Craftsman Style". The author clearly demonstrates how to make the sled. It sounds exactly like the sled you are describing. It may be the same article that Terry is referring to in his post.

John Lucas, of Woodshop Demo,s and a member here also, has an excellent pictorial essay of the lock miter and the setup on his website.

[Aaron Beaver]

FWW ran an article on use of locking miter bit and it's included in the fww Book on joinery, article named: Stickley Style Legs by Patrick Nelson. I have the book and pdf'd the article so I could use reprint in shop as go by for jigs and how to clamp the glue up. I also have some comments culled from other boards on use of the lock miter bit.

I used bit to make legs and it is truely a life altering experience when that bit catches in the oak and hurls it across the room like a spear but the joint is nice.
Let me know if you'd like more info.

I'll take all the info I can get.



John Lucas, of Woodshop Demo,s and a member here also, has an excellent pictorial essay of the lock miter and the setup on his website.

Mike I looked at that a little and it seemed complicated for just a jig, maybe if I read the whole thing it wasn't it just seemed that way when I glanced at it.

[Mike Cutler]

I'll take all the info I can get.



Mike I looked at that a little and it seemed complicated for just a jig, maybe if I read the whole thing it wasn't it just seemed that way when I glanced at it.

Aaron.

Once you have the bit in your hand, or mounted in the table, John's demonstration makes a lot more sense. to correct the error of the bit you have to move the bit in the opposite direction of what seems right(Because the bit is upside down). It seems as if you are moving in the direction of error. It's wierd at first.

For the cost of the setup jig from Rockler. It may just be easier to get the bit and the jig from them. Of course I'm certain that the jig is assuming that you have exactly 3/4" thick material.

The bit gets a lot of negative press, but once you get it setup it's pretty cool. It doesn't just do corner joints either. It makes a good glue line bit for edge gluing.

[Luciano Burtini]

Just had to add my $0.02.

Freud 99-034 Lock Miter Bit

http://www.freudtools.com/woodworkers/rep/router_bits/Router_Bits/Lock_Miter/311_LOCKMITER_A.jpg

This is the scariest bit I have ever used. I was going to purchase one, but decided to try a friends first. One day of trying this monster and I figured that I really did not need one.

They do make nice joints AFTER setting everything up for the nth time AND if you have the nerves to push a board through the spinning chunk of iron and carbide.

If you do get one, make setup blocks for the material thickness you are cutting. It will save you a bunch of time and material in the future. Oh yeah, and use push sticks :eek:

[Aaron Beaver]

From the sounds of it this bit sounds like a MONSTER! Borad chatter, wood shooting like spears. lol Might it help of you take some of the wood off like has been suggested maybe 3/8 or a little more that way the bit doesn't have to chew on so much? Or...does taking some off take away from being able to keep the board flat against the table or fence (depending on which cut you are maing)?

[glenn bradley]

Mike,

Thanks for the feedback. I've been thinking about one of these bits and have wondered if it would just end up not getting used. It sounds like the material needs to be really well controlled as it's fed through. I don't know if my skinny 155lbs is up to it. I appreciate your (and the others) comments; think I just saved a little $$.

[Gary Curtis]

Lee Valley sells such a bit, and they have a free online tutorial for using it. Go to their website, find the bit, and on the left side of the screen is a button. I think it says INFO, or TECH. Something like that. Print it out.

It tells everything about setting fences and height adjustment for the joint.

Gary Curtis

[Hank Knight]

Aaron,

I guess I'm in a distinct minority. I like my lock miter bits a lot. I have both the big one and the small one. I've made a lot of boxes and drawers with them and they have preformed well for me. I don't find them scary at all. The set up is a little finiky, but not terrible. It does take a little getting used to, but I don't dread setting them up.

I can offer four tips that might help:

(1) I find that if you adjust the fence by sighting down the fence with your eye level with the bit and a piece of your stock against the fence behind the bit, you can get pretty close with your first try. Adjust the bit height and depth of cut so that the 45 degree line of the bit cuts the stock exactly at the corners. Then a little tweaking is all that's needed. The easy way to tell if you've got the set-up right is to fit the pieces together so that you have a continuous flat piece rather than a 90 degree angle. If the stock is smooth across the joint you're on the money.

(2) Once you get it set up, make and keep a couple of set-up blocks. Make sets in standard sized stock (I keep 1/2" and 3/4" BB ply set-up blocks). Use them next time for the preliminary set up. I can usually hit it dead on with the set-up blocks, but if tweaking is necessary, it's minimal.

(3) The bits are bad to tear out the inside face veneer on plywood and sometimes on solid stock too. This usually makes a lot of noise and may be the reason some find the bits scary. Be sure to score the inside face to minimize tear-out. I usually forget to do this and destroy my first piece. Also, the bits tear out at the end of the cut too. I usually make my pieces a little wide and rip off the tear-out after the lock miter cut. Backer boards can be a help with this too.

(4) Feather boards - top and side - are a must. On 3/4" stock I sometimes make a preliminary 45 degree cut along the edge to waste off some of the stock before the lock miter cut, but I've done it both ways and I don't find this step necessary. If you do this, it's not necessary to waste off all the stock with the 45 degree cut. In fact, I find it works best if I leave part of the 90 degree edge to ride against the router table fence the table top for the vertical cut.

I had the large bit for a long time before I used it. I decided to make some drawers from 1/2" BB plywood for my workbench, so I bought the smaller lock miter bit for the job. I liked it so much, I tried the large one, and it worked as advertised too. Since then I've used them a lot. They make a nice clean, strong joint. Perfect for plywood case work. Try it; you might like it.

My $.02

Hank

[terry hansen]

I got my whiteside bits from routerbits.com, (no affiliation, just order from them way too much) they have a good visual presentation at their site - I attempted to attach as pdf so if it worked great.

As everyone has said - take your time in set up and cut some blanks for practice (plan on running at least one leg or whatever thru all the way, especially if it's a first time for you)
I found the sled jigs to be useful in holding the leg pieces stable and easier to run thru bit.

Alan - don't be discouraged if we never tried anything new, how could we justify all those tools to our SO?

[Joe Spear]

I just used the smaller one on 1/2" thick maple to make a kitchen wastebasket for my daughter and her husband. The 4 sides are 30 inches long. I made about 5 tests to get the bit height just right and ran the sides on the router table. No first removal of a little stock. No feather boards. Just one pass for each edge. Everything fit together perfectly. (That means within 1/100th of an inch for woodworking.) I made myself a router table with a top 36 inches wide, which does help steady things. The Incra fence with the height extending gizmo also helps.

[pat warner]

See FAQ #10. (http://patwarner.com/faq.html)

[Aaron Beaver]

Thanks for all the tips and help, I will see what I decide to do. Maybe look at other types of corner connections like dovetails or something.

[Chris Padilla]

I like this joint but setup is PITA! I'm an educated man and I read John Lucas' site but I'll be darned if I didn't chew threw a couple feet of test cuts before getting things right.

I dunno about this bit but maybe it is just me...there must be a null spot in my brain with this router bit.... :( :confused:

[Mike Cutler]

I like this joint but setup is PITA! I'm an educated man and I read John Lucas' site but I'll be darned if I didn't chew threw a couple feet of test cuts before getting things right.

I dunno about this bit but maybe it is just me...there must be a null spot in my brain with this router bit.... :( :confused:

Chris.

You got it. That is exactly waht you are looking for when setting up the Lock Miter, the "Null Spot". ;)

As soon as I get my router table finished. I might try a pictographic essay on the bit. That is, if I can find the "null spot". :D

[Mike Kelly]

I did the corners on this chest with the lock miter bit. It is a chore to set up and understand, but it will never come apart! A zero clearance insert on your router fence helps quite a bit too.

[Charlie Plesums]

FWW ran an article on use of locking miter bit and it's included in the fww Book on joinery, article named: Stickley Style Legs by Patrick Nelson. I have the book and pdf'd the article so I could use reprint in shop as go by for jigs and how to clamp the glue up. I also have some comments culled from other boards on use of the lock

If it is the FWW article I remember, be sure to read the letters to the editor an issue or two later. The glue up described in the article was wrong (in many people's opinion, including mine).

I second the many comments that this cutter is a bear to set up, and adds new meaning to the word "tear out" at the end of the cut.

I can't imagine buying or making a setup block for it. If the thickness of the board is off by even a few hundredths of an inch, you need to change the setup. With most cutters, if you are off by 1/32 inch you say, "it could be prettier," but if the lock miter is off by 1/32 inch the joint sucks.

[Norman Hitt]

I like this joint but setup is PITA! I'm an educated man and I read John Lucas' site but I'll be darned if I didn't chew threw a couple feet of test cuts before getting things right.

I dunno about this bit but maybe it is just me...there must be a null spot in my brain with this router bit.... :( :confused:

Chris, I think the thing that makes it hardest is because of the (tabs, I'll call them) sticking out in the middle that makes it hard to get the wood up close enough to site past the bit without getting parallax involved. The other thing is that if you "Raise the bit", then you must move the fence toward the cutting side of the bit, because as the bit is raised, more of the bit is exposed in the horizontal direction, and if the bit is lowered, the fence must be moved the opposite direction. (Same is true if you move the fence first, then the bit height must be adjusted),

You might try making a jig by taking a short length of scrap of the material you are going to be milling, about 2 or more inches wide and lay it on the table with the end butted against the fence, then lay another short piece (of the same thickness) on edge, on top of it, (also against the fence), then take another piece like the first one and lay it flat on top of the one laying flat on the table and press it against the one on edge, then holding all three pieces firmly against the fence pin the two flat pieces together with two brads or screws. Now, discard the piece that was standing on edge and turn the jig over and push it against the fence real close to the bit, and then adjust the bit height and fence until the jig will slide along the fence until it is directly over the bit, with the top and bottom edges of the bit just barely touching the jig's edges equally. The other thing to remember, is that you only make an adjustment of 1/2 of the amount that the bit needs to be moved, because when you move the other part, (either the fence or bit height, depending on which one you adjust first), it will make up the other half of the needed adjustment amount.

(Clear as MUD, Yeah?):confused: :rolleyes: :D :D let me know if this helps any.

[Charlie Plesums]

If you are going to use the Lock Miter, this is the setup procedure that has worked for me.

Set the height of the bit first... One of the things lock miters can do (or at least mine can) is to join boards end to end. Cut the end of two boards...flip one over, and if the height is right, they will join perfectly. Or maybe I should say, after numerous tries, when you finally get the height right, they will fit perfectly. From that point on, DO NOT touch the height, no matter how it seems that will fix the problems.

Since you know the height is now perfect, you can adjust the fence for the "end boards." DO NOT change the height while setting the fence.

Cut both ends of the end boards on the fence, both ends of the side boards on the table (unlike the FWW article), and you will discover how easy this joint is to clamp.

It is so critical that the work be kept tight to the fence/table, and absolutely square, that I have made special push blocks just for the lock miter.

[Randy Ferguson]

When one of these things spins it created its own weather patterns.

[Norman Hitt]

If you are going to use the Lock Miter, this is the setup procedure that has worked for me.

Set the height of the bit first... One of the things lock miters can do (or at least mine can) is to join boards end to end. Cut the end of two boards...flip one over, and if the height is right, they will join perfectly. Or maybe I should say, after numerous tries, ""when you finally get the height right"", they will fit perfectly.

The thing that makes setting up this bit so difficult is the fact that although they say to set the mid point of the bit to a height that is even with the midpoint of the wood to be milled, it is too difficult to determine exactly where they are calling the center point of the bit. The mfrs could FIX that problem if they would just etch a fine line on the non cutting part of the bit that you could actually see to line up with the centerline marked on the wood and that would simplify the setup tremenduously.

A typical example of setup instructions can be seen at http://www.infinitytools.com/pdf/lockmitre.pdf and the picture in the example illustrates how arbitrary the "Center Point" of the bit can be.

[Mike Cutler]

If it is the FWW article I remember, be sure to read the letters to the editor an issue or two later. The glue up described in the article was wrong (in many people's opinion, including mine).

Charlie.

What specifically is incorrect about the glue up procedure? I have the book "In The Craftsman Style", Taunton Press, 2001 in front of me.Patrick's technique appears on pages 132-135.

I've used this method to make the legs, but I used epoxy for the glue up.

I don't have the FWW Mag, but I would like to know the responses. If there is an error. I'd like to annotate it in my book for future reference.

Thanks in advance.

Mike.

[Chris Padilla]

...it is too difficult to determine exactly where they are calling the center point of the bit...

Boy, there is a mouthful! I used a bunch of expletives and profanity and really bad stuff when I saw that little tidbit on setting up the bit. Just where in the HECK is the midpoint of this bit???????? :confused: :confused: :confused: It might as well be on Mars for all the good that line of instruction does... :mad:

Norman/Charlie, I will take up your advice next time I feel masochistic and want to try using this bit again. I hope it helps me! :D

[Mack Cameron]

There a lots of good instructions including pics etc. for setting up this bit. Just google "lock mitre bit".

[Charlie Plesums]

...I don't have the FWW Mag, but I would like to know the responses. If there is an error. I'd like to annotate it in my book for future reference...
I am working from memory, so bear with me.

Whether you are making a box or legs, the issue is the same, so let me refer to one pair of parallel boards as the sides and the other pair of parallel boards as the ends. (And in a box it doesn't matter whether the short sides are called sides or ends...maybe I should have just said A and B or something)

In the FWW article, one side of each board was cut on the table and the other side was cut on the fence. When you glue up, you need to clamp in both directions, and juggle to be sure things stay square (like a normal miter joint).

The other approach that I prefer (and lots of letter writers in FWW) is to cut both sides of the "sides" on the table, and both sides of the "ends" on the fence. You now only have to clamp in one direction, and the pressure is even so it doesn't try to twist - it is basically self-squaring.

Look closely at the corners of this small candy box... it would only have to be clamped from the sides. Does this make sense?

[Aaron Beaver]

Look closely at the corners of this small candy box... it would only have to be clamped from the sides. Does this make sense?
I want to see if I have this correct. In the Article you took a side and did one end of it on the table then took that same piece and put it against the fence to do the other end.

What you are saying is better is to do is each end of a piece against the same surface be it either the fence or table.

Am I following?

[Mike Cutler]

Charlie.

Ahh... Now I see. Excellent point! I'll be sure to write that in the book I have. Thank you.

[Chris Padilla]

I want to see if I have this correct. In the Article you took a side and did one end of it on the table then took that same piece and put it against the fence to do the other end.

What you are saying is better is to do is each end of a piece against the same surface be it either the fence or table.

Am I following?

Aaron,

No, he took a side and cut both ends of it flat on the table. He then took the other side and did the same.

Next, he took the "front" and "back" and cut both ends of that using the fence. Look at his diagram...you can see how he cut everything. Nice idea! :)

[Aaron Beaver]

Aaron,

No, he took a side and cut both ends of it flat on the table. He then took the other side and did the same.

Next, he took the "front" and "back" and cut both ends of that using the fence. Look at his diagram...you can see how he cut everything. Nice idea! :)

I looked at the picture again (I couldn't blow it up before), curious is that a drawer lock router bit connection? I know the process is probably the same but when I look that the picture it doesn't look like a lock miter prep.

[Chris Padilla]

No, that is the lock miter bit. :)

[Mark Rios]

Here's one link:

http://www.binkyswoodworking.com/DrawerLockMiter.html

Here's a link to the one that I have:

http://www.freudtools.com/woodworkers/rep/router_bits/Router_Bits/Lock_Miter/html/Lock_Miter_1.html

I spent about half of a day one time awhile ago and played with the bit geting it set up and trying different materials. I made a set up block and found that after finally getting the bit adjusted right it wasn't TOO awful setting it up again.

[Aaron Beaver]

No, that is the lock miter bit. :)
Still looks like a drawer lock bit to me:D, but maybe its not a 45 lock miter bit. It looks like it makes a 90 degree lock miter instead of a 45 lock miter. Charlie what is it?

[Mack Cameron]

a lock mitre bit would have a 45* in it. this one doesn't from what I can see. unless someone makes one that looks like a drawer lock mitre bit. they are easy to confuse.

[glenn bradley]

If we look at the inside corners carefully, we see the 45*. There just doesn't appear to be much material on the outer corner. Or maybe that's just the 60's calling me back!

[Chris Padilla]

It *is* a lock miter...the outer corners have been sanded down a bit. Charlie, where are ya, Bud?! ;) Aren't yer ears burnin' yet?? :D

[Jason Simon]

I bought the large whiteside lm bit to make some assembly table legs.

I did get a little nervous, but made 4 legs using 3/4 sandply. All cuts were made in 1 pass.

I used a PC7518 on the lowest speed setting mounted in a Bench Dog table. I used the bench dog plastic featherboards to hold the boards down or against the fence depending on the side of the leg being cut. I also used push blocks like I would on a jointer.

I agree that setup blocks are fairly useless, as accuracy really depends on setup precisely to the thickness of the board being jointed.

I found chip out on the plywood to be minimized by routing in the grain direction.

Overall, I liked the bit, and am looking forward to using it to make some boxes.

[Charlie Plesums]

Sorry guys... I have been busy on other things today, rather than watching my computer.

My bit is a lock miter, but a small one. Most require 3/4 inch wood. This one www.woodline.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=144 (http://www.woodline.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=144) is for wood 3/8 to 1/2 inch thick. The sides of the candy box are barely 3/8 inch, so there isn't much left at the 45 degree part - most of it is the "lock" rather than the "miter". When I use that bit on thicker material, the 45 degree part becomes more obvious.

The key point here, that folks figured out desite my explanation, is that you cut both ends of two of the sides on the table, then cut both ends of the other two sides on the fence, and clamping becomes easy.

[Jim Mackell]

I have seen this bit used and would like to try it out at home. Routerbits.com has their #3360 for sale at $97.60 and Amazon.com has the Freud #99-034 on sale at $80.99. Both seem to have similiar diamters and allow for working with 3/4 or 1 inch stock. The Grizzley #C1712 on the other hand at $32.95 only allows for 9/16 maximum thickness.

Any other brands worth considering? I'm kind of having a tough time choking down $80 to $100. and still facing the wife across the dining room table.:D

Thanks!

Jim

[Chris Padilla]

Jim,

The bit is just massive...it just costs a lot for the big ones that handle the 3/4" to 1" boards. Mine is from CMT just to throw in another brand to consider. CMT is rarely the cheapest but I'm happy with the quality so "ole orange" is all I have in my router bit storage box.

[Mike Spanbauer]

CMT / Sommerfeld has a Lock Mitre bit setup tool in addition to the bit and they seem to work fairly well. I may have some time this weekend to run a couple test cuts to demonstrate.

http://www.sommerfeldtools.com/products.asp?id=200

http://www.sommerfeldtools.com/products.asp?id=198

Any error is generally attributable to me.

Mike

[PeterTorresani]

I've never setup this bit or even looked closely at one, but the instructions from Infinity give me an idea. Firstly, I have an assumption; if it is wrong, ignore the rest of this thread. ASSUMPTION- the midpoint of the bit is centered between the flat top and flat bottom. If this is correct then:

The height of the bit is "H".
The thickness of the board is "T"
Set the bit so the exposed height (to the top flat) is (H/2 + T/2)
.
If the midpoint is not exactly centered between the two flats, it seems pretty simple to use this logic for adjustments from one thickness to another.
.
But remember my first statement, I've never set one of these up

[Chris Padilla]

Peter,

The main difficulty is that figuring out the midpoint of this bit is tough...it happens to not be where you think it is...that is most of the challenge. Check out the instructions on Lee Valley or Veritas for their lock-miter bit...they are quite good and you'll see what I mean.

[Aaron Beaver]

Are Sommerfiled good bits? I have never used them only Whiteside and CMT. Seems like a good price for the "kit".

[Mike Kelly]

Whiteside is very good also, but not cheap.

[Chris Padilla]

Marc Sommerfeld has recently introduced his own line of router bits. I have not tried them so I cannot say but I've bought almost all my CMT bits from Sommerfelds. :)

[Mike Spanbauer]

Yes Aaron. I've used them now for a while and get excellent cut quality on them. also, the Sommerfeld bit setter that I mentioned above in thread really works as advertised.

It's a pretty cool gizmo that has a ratcheting mechanism that raises the 'adjuster' by 1/128" every click. Works like a charm the dozen or so times I've used it so far.

Just to be clear, I don't have the mitre bit set, but rather the joint makers set with the lock mitre bit in it.

Pretty solid merchandise imo.

mike

[Cjing Cazares]

Just had to add my $0.02.

Freud 99-034 Lock Miter Bit

http://www.freudtools.com/woodworkers/rep/router_bits/Router_Bits/Lock_Miter/311_LOCKMITER_A.jpg

This is the scariest bit I have ever used. I was going to purchase one, but decided to try a friends first. One day of trying this monster and I figured that I really did not need one.

They do make nice joints AFTER setting everything up for the nth time AND if you have the nerves to push a board through the spinning chunk of iron and carbide.

If you do get one, make setup blocks for the material thickness you are cutting. It will save you a bunch of time and material in the future. Oh yeah, and use push sticks :eek:

Pat Warner, of routerman fame, has said very much the same thing. I bet if you asked for advice from people who'd have to pay for the wasted materials and possible injuries, this bit design would go into the trash bin. It is a nice idea, it looks good on paper, but most woodworkers can't get efficient, economical use out of it. The result isn't fancy enough to justify the expenditure of time, energy, materials and self-confidence. If you want to spend a lot of materials and practice making a drawer, do dovetails. Everybody will applaud when you get it right.

[Jim Mackell]

Well, I ordered the bit from MLCS for $47.50 Arrived promptly, good quality but as mentioned by several others, no instructions.

http://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/bt_lockmiter.html

Set it up based on what I read here. Took about an hour. It is a scary mother to run because so much of the bit surface is exposed. No margin for error at all.:eek:If you are going to play with one, always use push blocks!

After one hour was able to create nice locking joint in some cheap pine. Now that I have made my own setup blocks, I'll give the hardwood a try tonight.

It will never be a favorite bit or one that I feel warm and fuzzy about, but it does make a nice tight concealed joint.

[Aaron Beaver]

Well, I ordered the bit from MLCS for $47.50 Arrived promptly, good quality but as mentioned by several others, no instructions.

http://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/bt_lockmiter.html

Set it up based on what I read here. Took about an hour. It is a scary mother to run because so much of the bit surface is exposed. No margin for error at all.:eek:If you are going to play with one, always use push blocks!

After one hour was able to create nice locking joint in some cheap pine. Now that I have made my own setup blocks, I'll give the hardwood a try tonight.

It will never be a favorite bit or one that I feel warm and fuzzy about, but it does make a nice tight concealed joint.

Let us know what happens with the hardwood you try. I saw some instructions at Lee Valley but since you have yours all figured out know you might not need it. Still considering buying the Sommerfield Jointmaking package.

oh yeah, post some pics of the joint if you can when you get it done.