About Pen finishes

[Bart Leetch]

So which pen finish holds up to sweat & the acid in peoples sweat depending on their PH balance?

Or is there a finished that is not advertised as a pen finishes that will work just as well or better.


I'm am not sure about shell wax , hut pen polish they just don't sound very good to me.

[Raymond Overman]

Well, this will be an interesting thread. Hut and Shell-a-wax will hold up to moderate use for a short amount of time. The oils in your hand will make the pen darker and smooth with use after the finish has worn off.

Personally, I use a CA finish which is both time consuming and aggravating to apply. I've heard arguments against it as well but have pens that have lasted for at least a couple of years with it.

[Gary Max]

And then you can talk about how different woods like different finishes.
But at the end of the day---Raymond hit it right on the head.
CA is hard and will not lose it's shine under nornal conditions.

[Jeff Myers]

How do you all apply the CA,,,several coats of thin,med.,thick???
Sand in between coats? Sand out to micro mesh 12K??

[Dario Octaviano]

I use CA or lacquer almost exclusively now.

All the rest that I tried (including the ones you mentioned and more) fails sooner than I care for.

[Claude Arragon]

Very quick and easy to use "Speed & eeze".
It combines polisher and wax and does hold when using the pen intensively ;)

[Bart Leetch]

One of my first thoughts was why not a hardwood floor finish? I've not heard of anything harder.

Another question do most pen kits come with instructions?

[Dario Octaviano]

I tried one hardwood finish thinking it takes a lot of abuse and should work better. WRONG!!! It still can't beat lacquer or CA.

You are welcome to try it ...makes all these finishing more interesting but believe me it is like re-inventing the wheel...only you are starting with an octagon or something (that is how I felt after) ;)

[Scott Donley]

Another question do most pen kits come with instructions?Yes, you can also get most of them online, PSI has all their kit instructions here (http://www.pennstateind.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=LIBR&Store_Code=PSI)

[Mike Vickery]

Bart I almost always use a CA finish it takes a beating like none other that I have found. Most high quality wood finishes should work well on a pen. Another consideration though is the time it takes a finish to cure. For a laquer or oil based poly finish I would usually give it a week to cure before rubbing out a finish. Maybe that is excessive but that is what I do. If you add this to the time before you can reapply 1/2 hour or more it ends up takeing quite a long time to get a finished product. Some swear by high end waterbased finishes like Enduro. I have used Enduro and General finishes High Peformance Water based poly and they worked good but I did not get the shine I am used to from CA.
With a CA finish you can reapply coats within 20 or 30 second of each other and rub out almost immediately ( I usually wait overnight but you can do it). Some people who are better at do ing a CA BLO finish say the can get a finish that does not need rubbing out.

Personally the performance of friction polish and wax is poor. The best of the friction polishes I have found is Mylands and I sometimes use it over my CA finish for a little extra shine and protection.

[Raymond Overman]

Bart,

After turning the pen to final dimensions, I sand from 100 grit through about 2400-3600 micromesh. I clean the blank with denatured alchohol and sand with the last couple of grits again if it looks fuzzy. I then apply a coat of thin CA using a piece of wax paper to coat the entire blank. I sand the blanks again starting at 1200 MM - 12000 MM. I apply a liberal coat of thick CA to the pen using wax paper and let it dry naturally. Using the catalyst seems to make the CA dry unevenly or leave dimples. I sand from 1200-12000MM again and apply a second coat if there seems to be imperfections. After sanding the second coat I apply a friction polish or carnauba wax as extra layer of protection against "in store" handling.

You can see the results of this finish in the following two pictures. I've been carrying the first pen since June and it looks the same as the day I took it off the lathe.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=40793&thumb=1&d=1150262199 http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=35361&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1143867562

[Travis White]

I have made 100+ pens out of wood and antler. I have tryed every kind of wax besides ear wax. The pen looks great on the lathe but the finish breaks down fast. CA works very good but it takes a while to learn how to do it right. My all-time favorite finish for wood is Midwax clear gloss Polyurethane, two coats. It holds up very well.

[Wayne Bitting]

After learning the hard way that HUT didn’t really hold its polish I researched (at the Creek of course) a stronger finish and CA seemed to be the winner. This weekend while working on my first batch of Freedom pens, I was practicing the CA process and had great success on the first couple of pens. It went down hill from there. I noticed that the CA is peeling away at the ends and the pens look rather cheap now and I’m not sure if I’ll donate them or not. Any comments on why its peeling? I am sure that it has to do with the glue over lapping the bushings but not sure.


Overall though the CA finish came out very nice.

[Henry C. Gernhardt, III]

I wouldn't want to use ear wax, Travis. It tends to have a funky smell. :)

[Mike Vickery]

I noticed that the CA is peeling away at the ends and the pens look rather cheap now and I’m not sure if I’ll donate them or not. Any comments on why its peeling? I am sure that it has to do with the glue over lapping the bushings but not sure.


Overall though the CA finish came out very nice.

I have never had adhesion problems with CA but if I had to hazard a couple guesses.
1. Maybe the ca chipped when you seperated the barrels from the bushing.
2. Did you use an oil prior to ca and not let it dry.
3. Possibly the surface was contaminated with some kind of oil, wax of silicon based product.

[Frank Fusco]

After learning the hard way that HUT didn’t really hold its polish I researched (at the Creek of course) a stronger finish and CA seemed to be the winner. This weekend while working on my first batch of Freedom pens, I was practicing the CA process and had great success on the first couple of pens. It went down hill from there. I noticed that the CA is peeling away at the ends and the pens look rather cheap now and I’m not sure if I’ll donate them or not. Any comments on why its peeling? I am sure that it has to do with the glue over lapping the bushings but not sure.


Overall though the CA finish came out very nice.


Freedom Pens? Are you using Corian? I understand that plastics are often very adhesive specific in what will/will not stick to them. If you are finishing Corian, it begs the question: Why? Just sand and polish to desired state and leave be.

[Wayne Bitting]

Not using Corian, still learning with wood.

[Michael Cody]

I use CA/BLO and have found it to be the best overall for speed & durability. I sand the wood to 120-220-300-400-600 w/the last 2 steps sanded wet with Watco .. then I apply a coat of med CA w/the oil still wet. This has a reaction with the BLO in Watco and forms a very hard surface. Then I do 2-3 coats of thin CA and polish with MicroMesh up to 12000. Then I buff out with my Beal Buffer finishing with Carnuba wax.. looks good.. I also like a lacquer finish, but it takes a lot longer. I think it's a better hi-gloss shine than CA but it takes an hour or more to do the finish, instead of 5 minutes, but Lacquer & TSW makes a nice looking pen, just not sure it 55 minutes per pen better.

[tuffy holland]

After learning the hard way that HUT didn’t really hold its polish I researched (at the Creek of course) a stronger finish and CA seemed to be the winner. This weekend while working on my first batch of Freedom pens, I was practicing the CA process and had great success on the first couple of pens. It went down hill from there. I noticed that the CA is peeling away at the ends and the pens look rather cheap now and I’m not sure if I’ll donate them or not. Any comments on why its peeling? I am sure that it has to do with the glue over lapping the bushings but not sure.


Overall though the CA finish came out very nice.
wayne
I use CA on a number of pens. When I take them off the lathe I lightly rub the ends on 400 grit sand paper, This takes the fuzz and leaves the pen end looking good. Do not use coarse paper use 400 or finer. I just glued a sheet to a piece of masonite and rub the ends on it. Don't rub hard. By using the finepaper you won't distort he square end of the pens.:) Tuffy Holland

[Mike Jory]

I've tried a CA finish several times. I get lucky with a good gloss about 1 in 5 pens. All the others seem to have minor problems. Good enough for gifts to friends, but not for sale. I've glued blanks to mandrils, bushings, and had the CA "orange peel" after application. At fine sanding the CA it does get glossy, but my process still needs a lot of tweaking.

I've been pretty lucky with the Lacquer with the finger in the paper towel method. In the future, I'd like to try a liquid finish of some sort then buff it out. Sanding Sealer / EEE / Friction polish looks great when new, but as everyone knows, won't hold up over time.

I'd like to figure out how to let a few blanks sit and cure, off the mandril, while I turn a couple more?

[Wally Wenzel]

Bart, I have just started to use Watco brand laquer in a spray can, i stick the pen parts on a piece of 1/4 in. dowel and hit it withe the spray while turning it, can be recoated in a few min. I usualy give them 3 or more coats and let ythem set over nite. some times i rub them out but most look very good without. Wally

[Bart Leetch]

I use CA/BLO and have found it to be the best overall for speed & durability. I sand the wood to 120-220-300-400-600 w/the last 2 steps sanded wet with Watco .. then I apply a coat of med CA w/the oil still wet. This has a reaction with the BLO in Watco and forms a very hard surface. Then I do 2-3 coats of thin CA and polish with MicroMesh up to 12000. Then I buff out with my Beal Buffer finishing with Carnuba wax.. looks good.. I also like a lacquer finish, but it takes a lot longer. I think it's a better hi-gloss shine than CA but it takes an hour or more to do the finish, instead of 5 minutes, but Lacquer & TSW makes a nice looking pen, just not sure it 55 minutes per pen better.

Michael



Are you using MicroMesh to wet sand or sandpaper, if your using sand paper which brand? Also what are you using to apply the CA?


Thanks.

[Michael Cody]

Michael
Are you using MicroMesh to wet sand or sandpaper, if your using sand paper which brand? Also what are you using to apply the CA?
Thanks.

The wet sanding is all standard sandpaper -- 120/150/180/220 are mirka (at this time anyway), 320 & up are automotive wet dry sandpaper usually 3m brand. I don't switch to micromesh until I get the CA/BLO film on and hardened. I apply the CA with the little plastic bags the pen parts come in, sorta like little finger cots. I also switch out to wood bushings for that last shearing cuts and when I am sanding anything that is light colored, saves me a lot of issues with staining the ends of light wood w/metal contamination. the wood bushings are maple soaked in hot 50/50 wax/turps mix so they don't stick to the ends of the blanks if/when I am sloppy with the CA (at least most of the time they don't ;) ). I make a bunch at a time so it's only a once/year exercise..

I wet sand because that fills, with Watco/Sawdust slurry, any imperfections in the surface or if the wood has open pores is fills them too .. I find that really makes a nice surface for the finish. IE idea being the wood looks almost good enough w/o any finish so if the finish every wears through it won't be noticeable and looking through the film the wood underneath is nice too.

[terry miller]

Bart I use the Plexi finish exclusively. I started using it over a year ago and still frequently carry my first pen with no sign of wear, compared to the Ca pen that I made just prior to this which is showing signs of wear around the CB. I dont know if anyone here has tried it yet but on a different forum several others have tried it and have been very impressed with the ease and shine produced.

[Bart Leetch]

Terry

Where did you purchase this Plexi finish? It sound like something I'd like to try.

[Dario Octaviano]

You make the solution out of plexiglass dissolved in acetone.

[Wayne Bitting]

Is there a ratio for plexi to acetone? Safety issues? Just wipe or brush it on?

I heard about a plexi finish before and wondered - what if I soaked the wood in it (under pressure, in a vacumm, or just in a bucket), would it be come "stablized" since the acetone would evaporate and leave the wood full of plastic. Any thoughts...?

[Jason Christenson]

I haven't tried a plexi finish yet, but when I do, this is the procedure I intend to follow: http://www.thepenshop.net/plexi.pdf.

[terry miller]

Bart like Dario said the finish is disolve plexiglass in acetone. The link that Jason provided is to the tutorial that I wrote up, the only thing I do differently now is I use a different type of wax in the final stage. Wayne this solution in a thicker stage can also be use for stabilizing under vacuum as well. I dont have an exact ratio for the solution, when I started I took and covered the bottom of a new paint can with about 2 inches of plexi then added acetone. I would shake the can a couple of times a day until the solution was dissolved to the consistency of about thick syrup. I then take this solution and transfer some to my bottle and thin with more acetone to a consistency of a little thicker than thin CA. The finish produces a really nice high gloss just like the lacquer does.

[Dario Octaviano]

I've done stabilizing wood with the plexi-acetone in vacuum and the results were okay but not impressive. I also do not recommend vacuum because you will end up (boiling and) vacuuming the acetone which turns into gas form fast.

I am about to try it on pressure in a week.

Solution wise, I tend to just let the acetone dissolve as much as it can...it takes a few days and shaking the bottle helps speed it a bit. It should reach a liquid but thick solution. When you shake it vigorously, bubbles should move very slowly through the solution. Sorry cannot describe it any better.

[Bart Leetch]

Bart like Dario said the finish is disolve plexiglass in acetone. The link that Jason provided is to the tutorial that I wrote up, the only thing I do differently now is I use a different type of wax in the final stage. Wayne this solution in a thicker stage can also be use for stabilizing under vacuum as well. I dont have an exact ratio for the solution, when I started I took and covered the bottom of a new paint can with about 2 inches of plexi then added acetone. I would shake the can a couple of times a day until the solution was dissolved to the consistency of about thick syrup. I then take this solution and transfer some to my bottle and thin with more acetone to a consistency of a little thicker than thin CA. The finish produces a really nice high gloss just like the lacquer does.

So do you make the Plexiglass into shavings? I was thinking of getting a new gallon paint can from like ACE & making the plexglass into shavings or little thin strips & then adding the acetone.

[Dario Octaviano]

I cut them into strips and break it to as small pieces as I can.

I dissolve them in big glass jars. I have a few gallon sized from pickles but those are getting difficult to find.