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Jerry Solomon
09-27-2003, 6:01 PM
Is it legal to take a plan from a magazine or purchase a plan from some other source and then sell the items that you build from that plan? Obviously, the plans themselves are copyright material but does this cover the downstream use of the plan?

Steve Hepditch
09-27-2003, 6:24 PM
From a purely non-legal standpoint, I do recall reading in the "letters" section of one of the woodworking mags this exact question. The editor's reply was that people were free to use the plans and sell the product, it was only the plan itself that could not be resold. I don't know if that is the letter of the law, or simply that magazine's standpoint.

I've always assumed that anything I produce was mine to do with as I see fit - no matter if I used a plan or my own design. I don't know if that's the proper legal standpoint, but I sure do *hope* it is. I guess if it were a problem, you could simply tweak a dimension here and there and it would be "your adaptation" of another plan, therefore your own design. I can't imagine it needs to be that complex, though...

Steve

Keith Outten
09-27-2003, 7:26 PM
Jerry,

Each magazine, book or other source should post any restrictions concerning the use of their property. Don't make any assumptions concerning your legal rights to sell any project from a plan that you did not author.

If you check out Patrick Spielman's books he normally restricts your right to use his plans for personal use only, you are not allowed to sell any project you made from his plans. The folks at CarvingPatterns.com allow you to sell projects that you make from their patterns.....

So check carefuly, read the fine print and if your not sure call them and ask for written permission, they won't remember your phone call if someone calls the author and inquires about a project you sold them.

Dave Hammelef
09-28-2003, 8:02 PM
Jerry,

Each magazine, book or other source should post any restrictions concerning the use of their property. Don't make any assumptions concerning your legal rights to sell any project from a plan that you did not author.

If you check out Patrick Spielman's books he normally restricks your right to use his plans for personal use only, you are not allowed to sell any project you made from his plans. The folks at CarvingPatterns.com allow you to sell projects that you make from their patterns.....

So check carefuly, read the fine print and if your not sure call them and ask for written permission, they won't remember your phone call if someone calls the author and inquires about a project your sold them.
But can Patrick restrict your rights legally? I dont know the law, but If I were going to start a business selling furniture I made from a plan, and the furniture design was very unique, I would get clarification from an attorney. Can you imagine buying house plans building the house then not being able to sell it? But hey the law is strange in lots of areas so when in doubt ask, then get it in writing.

Lee Schierer
09-29-2003, 11:11 AM
THis question came up several times over on "Wood" and they apparently feel you can make up to 40 (I think that is the number) of an object from their plans and sell them. After that you need permission. Each person or publisher probably has their own restrictions on published plans.

With that said, how hard would it be for you to make your own plans with some "personal" variations or changes? As long as you are not making direct copies from the plans, you really aren't copying their design. You also have to consder what is morally right. If you feel you owe the orignator of the plans something, then by all means send them something. I doubt they would refuse it.

Ed Marks
09-29-2003, 11:44 PM
Maybe 1-2 years ago, I saw a set of plans I liked and made the object. It soon became quite popular and I was making quite a few. I went to the magazine where I got them and found some awful restictions related to selling things from the plans. I asked a question similar to the one you did at Badger Pond and landed up with an e-mail from the editor of the magazine saying I could make some number of them per year for sale (although that's not what the magazine said in the fine print).

What irked me was that the object was not an original idea at all. In fact it had the word "Shaker" in it's name and I had seen plenty of similar objects in a few Shaker communities/museums I've visited made for the same use. So, what gave a magazine the right to say I could only build a certain number of these objects that people had been building for 100+ years? What about the uncountable number that had been made? What if I had never read that magazine and made one anyway? What if I chopped off an inch or added my own personal touch in some way?

I never really pursued it and the fad wore off (yea!). I don't think I get the magazine any more. Frankly, I forgot which one it was and don't feel like trotting out to the shop to find out. I was flabbergasted by the whole concept and I'd prefer not give anyone else the opportunity to say they own what's in my head.

Jerry Solomon
09-30-2003, 10:15 AM
Thanks to all for sharing your experiences and views. I occasionally have a vision of selling a few hundred thousand copies of some uncomplicated project portrayed in a magazine. I recently downloaded a set of plans for a project from an on-line source. They plainly state that the plans can't be reproduced and sold but there's nothing about selling the object produced from the plan. I sent them an e-mail inquiry but, so far, no reply.