Mitered dovetails ...a tutorial

[Mark Singer]

Mitered dovetails are done much like through doves... Set te marking gauge for the thickness plus a 32....Scribe a baseline on 4 sides...edges too... , These are 8 to 1 ...use a bevel guage to mark and use the second board to support the bevel gauge. Start by sawing the tail board. Saw on the waste side. Start the saw on the outside corner and lower it checking for plumb cutting as you go.... The first pin on this sample is 1" from the end. Mark lines on the edge to help keep the saw verticle. Using a knife and a square cut deeper on the tail board at each pin...this prevents tearout and seats the chisel in its first cut.. Easy on the first chisel cut...remove the waste ...now you have a shoulder to bed the chisel to... Flip the board at the halfway point... Remove the waste. Clean with a knife.
Using the tail vise to hold the pin bard scribe...the tail board limits the scribe... use 2 hands to hold the knife... Do Not Saw the last Pin line! This one miteres and blends to the pin... Mark the end miters with a 45 on the square and saw those to the 45 cut on te last pin... Don't overcut!
:rolleyes:
Try the joint by tapping togeter lightly...take it apart and rasp or pare with a chisel at the shiney or tight spots...re try...pare again under cut inside mark tigh spots... Re try...soon only the miters are keeping the joint from closing...mark them and rasp the miteres to fit...re try...
Glue up using clamps in both directions and check for square inside... Clamping removes gaps at the baseline... Even if your sawing of the miters was a bit off ....you can correct it...by this method....This technique works well for many hand joints

[Mark Singer]

More confusing pics....:confused:

[Mark Singer]

and some more....

[Mark Singer]

and a few I missed in the confusion:confused:

[Ted Calver]

...if it is, could you show us how to do the joint in some other kind of wood? I read somewhere that the best craftsmen hate working with Teak:rolleyes: :D
Thanks Mark! This tutorial convinced me to give it a shot.
Ted

[Mark Singer]

...if it is, could you show us how to do the joint in some other kind of wood? I read somewhere that the best craftsmen hate working with Teak:rolleyes: :D
Thanks Mark! This tutorial convinced me to give it a shot.
Ted
It is Shedua.....another unforgiving hard as a rock wood... In pine or poplar the joint will allow for tightness witout cracking....some of the videos are done that way and its like cheating a litle...those guys are really good though!

[Chris Barton]

Very nice piece Mark! Tutorials are always enjoyable to read.

[Maurice Metzger]

Mark, thanks very much for the profusely illustrated tutorial, it's definitely a keeper.

Maurice

[Jim W. White]

Thanks Mark!!!

Very instructive... although I still doubt I could pull them off :D ...they are extremely cool though!

[Mark Singer]

The process that I explained is probably more useful than the specific application to making mitered dovetails. The idea of cutting a bit "fat" and paring to fit will produce a better joint consistently..... I can make a joint in one try...sometimes it will be good sometimes I will miss ... This technique applies to exposed joints of every type and creates confidence. Through tenons, half laps, bridal joints, tapered slip joints, all the dovetails ....make um fit ...!:rolleyes:

[John Miliunas]

Awesome, Mark! Saved in "favorites" and "shortcut" on my desktop! :) Now, I'm not sure I can pull it off but, it's definitely on my short list of things to try!!! :D Much appreciate the nice tutorial, my friend! :) :cool:

[Don Baer]

Thanks Mark. You might get me to try some hand cut dovetails if I can get them to come out as nice as that.

[Dan Larson]

Ah... another joint for me to aspire to... I think I have a ways to go before I even think about trying this one!

For past few months I've been plugging away at learning hand joinery techniques. I'm still terrible at it, but slowly getting better... it's fun! As a beginner, I've had much better luck using the "fat" cut & pare to fit technique that you describe here. My work creeps along pretty slowly when I do this, but it's a much better learning experience.

Well, regardless of the joint, I've gotten some useful nuggets of info from your tutorial. Thanks for the lesson Prof. Singer!

Dan

[Zahid Naqvi]

Thank you sir, as usual excellent stuff. A while back I had made a rough sketch of something similar in my sketch book, glad to see it actually being executed.

[Mark Singer]

Thank you sir, as usual excellent stuff. A while back I had made a rough sketch of something similar in my sketch book, glad to see it actually being executed.
Actually sketching joints and details is a key to making them.....it allows you to visualize what will show and what is hidden... This is where practice pays off....if you know what shows you can go fast and still end up with a nice lookin joint...

[Brett Baldwin]

A joint I hadn't seen yet and how to make it, all in one shot. Thanks Mark.

[James Mittlefehldt]

very nice Mark I will have tor reread that one when I can.

Have you ever done compound angle dovetails, ie say you were making a cradle where the ends slope towards the front and to the centre at the same time, it sounds siimple but I read an article on it in FWW a few years back and it seemed complicated.

I think Ian Kirby shows that joint you describe in The Complete Dovetail but less profusely illustrated, good work sir.

[Mark Singer]

very nice Mark I will have tor reread that one when I can.

Have you ever done compound angle dovetails, ie say you were making a cradle where the ends slope towards the front and to the centre at the same time, it sounds siimple but I read an article on it in FWW a few years back and it seemed complicated.

I think Ian Kirby shows that joint you describe in The Complete Dovetail but less profusely illustrated, good work sir.

I have made doves on battered corners which makes te angle compound...it is done the same way....basically...and the hand work and tecnique is the same..just cut one side and scribe the other

[jonathan snyder]

Mark,

You sure make it look easy!! Very nice work. One of these days, i'm going to tackle dovetails, but I wont start with a mitered dovetail!!

Thanks for taking the time to show us how its done!

Jonathan

[Derek Cohen]

Hi Mark

That is an excellent tutorial. Moreover, I am very impressed with your sawing accuracy in joining hardwood-to-hardwood. There is no room for fudging at all!

This article is a definite keeper, one to recommend to all. Thanks again for the time and effort that went into it.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Jim Becker]

Thanks, Mark...you are a master!

[Mark Singer]

Hi Mark

That is an excellent tutorial. Moreover, I am very impressed with your sawing accuracy in joining hardwood-to-hardwood. There is no room for fudging at all!

This article is a definite keeper, one to recommend to all. Thanks again for the time and effort that went into it.

Regards from Perth

Derek

I appreciate the comments...Thank you!
While I have been sawing by hand most of my life, the point of this post is that by fitting and adjusting with rasps and chisels and knives...a just average sawing job can still produce a fine joint. This is only true if you stay on the "waste" side of the scribe when cutting the second board....the pins in this case. I actually got a few degrees of on a miter when making this test joint and it was easy to adjust as I fitted the joint.
In making a piece of furniture like my recent sofa....I take more time than I did here...every cut is key...every mistake will show ...an ugly exposed joint will ruin the look of another wise nice piece..
The key is to really visualize the joint and its surfaces and be very aware of what shows and what is hidden...
When we look at the work of Nakashima, Krenov and other real masters, it is the fluency and mastery of chosing and producing the correct ,well executed joints that elevates simple elegant pieces to a higher art form.This is the langauge of hand made furniture and it is worth the time to learn ...practice is the key....and attitude....We had Sushi last week and I watched the chef concentrating on a piece of fish he was about to cut....he stood there and I could see him visualizing the piece of fish becoming the finished and finely presented piece of sushi....a full minute went by before he let the knife drop into the fish....a few deep breaths as well....mental preparation is very important.....seeing the piece completed in your head....and practice!
If any of you make this joint 3 times for practice, you will surprise yourselves....it is not that difficult and you will see improvement with each new try...

[Roy Wall]

I appreciate the comments...Thank you!
While I have been sawing by hand most of my life, the point of this post is that by fitting and adjusting with rasps and chisels and knives...a just average sawing job can still produce a fine joint. This is only true if you stay on the "waste" side of the scribe when cutting the second board....the pins in this case. I actually got a few degrees of on a miter when making this test joint and it was easy to adjust as I fitted the joint.
In making a piece of furniture like my recent sofa....I take more time than I did here...every cut is key...every mistake will show ...an ugly exposed joint will ruin the look of another wise nice piece..
The key is to really visualize the joint and its surfaces and be very aware of what shows and what is hidden...
When we look at the work of Nakashima, Krenov and other real masters, it is the fluency and mastery of chosing and producing the correct ,well executed joints that elevates simple elegant pieces to a higher art form.This is the langauge of hand made furniture and it is worth the time to learn ...practice is the key....and attitude....We had Sushi last week and I watched the chef concentrating on a piece of fish he was about to cut....he stood there and I could see him visualizing the pice of fish becoming the finished and finely presented piece of sushi....a full minute went by before he let the knife drop into the fish....a few deep breaths as well....mental preparation is very important.....seeing the piece completed in your head....and practice!
If any of you make this joint 3 times for practice, you will surprise yourselves....it is not that difficult and you will see improvement with each new try...

Visualize the joint and know what shows!! Yes, that's what I've been getting a grip on ---the more joints I cut.........it gives you confidence because YOU KNOW how the paring is working toward a proper fit!

Cut n pasted to a MS Word (that's Mark Singer Word:cool: ) FILE!

Thanks Mark!

[James Mittlefehldt]

Just wondering what the practical application of this joint would be, I suppose if you wanted the strength of the dovetails but wanted a nice looking miitre joint showing.

I am going to make a copy of a cabinet I saw in the Henry Ford Museum recently and that technique would I thnk be ideal for it, thanks again for taking the time.

[Jerry Strojny]

This is great Mark. You da man! Maybe now I can start learning how to do these. Thank you so much for all you who do tutorials. I love them. Now, if I can just figure out how to get back to this thread when I'm hard down lost in a dovetail.

[Martin Shupe]

Just wondering what the practical application of this joint would be, I suppose if you wanted the strength of the dovetails but wanted a nice looking miitre joint showing.

I am going to make a copy of a cabinet I saw in the Henry Ford Museum recently and that technique would I thnk be ideal for it, thanks again for taking the time.

Here's one...

I have been planning to use this joint on the plinth of a blanket chest.

I need to practice it a few times first.

Thanks, Mark, for an excellent tutorial.

[Jake Darvall]

Great pictures. Always good to see how others do it and compare.

I've always like the mitred dovetails as well......prefer if possible just making them with a single tail and 2 pins if possible......for some reason I feel they look better. Less end grain. Not so busy looking.

I'm not sure if its already been mentioned, but theres another advantage to mitring dovetails for a box or draws or whatever, apart from the asthetic reasons........When you groove the base to take a bottom, you don't have to stop them, if you lay out the mitre over the groove. Can take the groove straight through cause it'll be hidden from the ends by the mitre.

This speeds up the process plenty in my opinion. A through groove is rapidly cut with a plough plane. Stopping a groove is more involved by hand.

Thanks for the photos. :)

[Wiktor Kuc]

Hi All,

Many of you visited my website - www.wkFineTools.com (http://www.wkfinetools.com/) before. If not, here is good reason - I have worked with Mark on making his Tutorial available on the site and here it is:

http://www.wkfinetools.com/MUTools/uTools/miteredDovet/miteredDov.asp

Mark has done superb job with this tutorial and I appreciate his willingness to share with a wider world.

I will also make PDF file for these who would like to print this good instructional material.

Thanks Mark.

Wiktor
- it is Victor, just a bit different (Polish).

[Dennis Peacock]

OK.....I'm jealous.!!!! I've wanted to make handcut dovetails for a long time. Jeff Hamilton showed me show it was done at one of Terry's BBQ's. I don't have a decent handsaw (yet) and am looking for a decent price on a Dozuki for my 1st dovetail saw.

Very well done Mark..!!!! Thank you for posting this. :D

[Mark Singer]

Hi All,

Many of you visited my website - www.wkFineTools.com (http://www.wkfinetools.com/) before. If not, here is good reason - I have worked with Mark on making his Tutorial available on the site and here it is:

http://www.wkfinetools.com/MUTools/uTools/miteredDovet/miteredDov.asp

Mark has done superb job with this tutorial and I appreciate his willingness to share with a wider world.

I will also make PDF file for these who would like to print this good instructional material.

Thanks Mark.

Wiktor
- it is Victor, just a bit different (Polish).

Wiktor,
Thanks for the great job! You really made it shine!
Mark

[Dave Ray]

Thanks Mark, great learning experience again. Thank you for your time,effort and including pictures. Have already been practicing, got close, but will get better.