Doing things the hard way

[Keith Christopher]

So I decided to play a little last night/today. I wanted to make a "laminate" bowl. So I glued up 4 small boards (two purpleheart and two cherry) and cut them to octagons. Don't comment yet....then I get the bright idea to do some off center turning with this. So I put in the steb centerput a wedge between the tail stock and my board sandwich. And turn on the lathe. working like a champ ! Well until I put the tool to it. And I wasn't thinking. I was getting BRUTAL chatter. Anyone care to guess why ? Well I continued in small passes until I got it roung then turned a tenon and took off the wedge and chucked it up on the nova chuck. Hollowed out a little last night then finished up today. Here it is with two coats of shellac as a sealer.


Anyone guess the troubles I didn't think about ? (think segmented bowls)


http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b179/goyde/Portfolio/bowl1.jpg

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b179/goyde/Portfolio/bowl2.jpg

[Christopher K. Hartley]

Well I don't know what you look like after all that, but you could take this bowl to the Prom. She be lookin GOOD!!:D Great job! Are you going to be Lee's new challenger?

[Henry C. Gernhardt, III]

Ya got me stumped, Kieth, but then again I've never done either segmented or off-center work. By the way---your bowl looks quite nice.

[Keith Christopher]

well I glued up 4 boards, and as they spun it was, long grain/endgrain/long grain/end grain. in other words... smooth cutting, chatter, smooth, chatter. WOWZA that end grain sucked. Thought it was gonna break my roughing gouge at one point. And yes my tools were sharp. You know segmented bowls are done all long grain but I was too lazy to do that :eek: besides I just wanted to turn something.

[Henry C. Gernhardt, III]

You know segmented bowls are done all long grain

Actually, I didn't. :/ So why does the chatter happen so much more readily with a lamination than with a solid facework blank?

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Henry.....a TRUE segmented bowl like you see people here post.....they take a gazillion little pieces and glue them up. You never turn end grain ....always side grain or long grain or with the grain....turning or cutting end grain is what causes the chatter........

[Ernie Nyvall]

Well, it looks like you got'er done though. Nice job Keith.

Ernie

[Keith Christopher]

BTW the off center turning was to make the 'stripes' seem slanted. If you look you'll see the are 'tilted' down to the right. I was looking for more of a steep tilt. Maybe next time now that I learned a thing or two.


Keith

[Lee DeRaud]

So why does the chatter happen so much more readily with a lamination than with a solid facework blank?It doesn't, at least not so I can tell. The off-center mounting doesn't help, as it makes the blank way "out-of round" everywhere but right in the middle. But I think the main issue was the tool.

Keith, was that really a "roughing gouge" you were using, as in a wide, shallow-flute straight gouge normally used for taking spindle stock from square to round? Because that's definitely not the right tool for facework, no matter how sharp it is. DAMHIKT

[Keith Christopher]

Lee recommendations on tool usage ?

[Lee DeRaud]

Lee recommendations on tool usage ?Bowl gouge, a nice heavy one.

I've been told you can actually break a spindle roughing gouge using it on a bowl blank, but I've never been brave enough to attempt to prove that. :eek:

[Keith Christopher]

Bowl gouge, a nice heavy one.

I've been told you can actually break a spindle roughing gouge using it on a bowl blank, but I've never been brave enough to attempt to prove that. :eek:

Ok, I didn't know if you had a better suggestion. That is what I used... eventually.

Oh let me tell you, I can believe it. I stopped and switched to my bowl gouge after the second WHAM when it hit the end grain. It was kickin my *you know what* before I switched.

[Vaughn McMillan]

OK, I'll profess my ignorance. :o How does a bowl gouge differ from a roughing gouge? I've looked at pictures in catalogs and on the net, but I'm not sure what differences I'm looking at. Could someone post pics that show the differences?

BTW, nice bowl, Keith. I like the combination of woods.

- Vaughn

[Stu Ablett in Tokyo Japan]

http://www.henrytaylortools.co.uk/gifs/ch6.gif
Bowl Gouge

http://www.henrytaylortools.co.uk/gifs/ch.gif
Roughing Gouge

http://www.henrytaylortools.co.uk/gifs/ch9.gif
Spindle Gouge

Clear as Mud :)

BTW, while watching Eli Avisera, we saw him present his tools to the wood very differently than I've seen most do, plus, all of his tools have a second bevel on them which you have to have to present the tools his way.

http://www.ablett.jp/workshop/images/lathe/eli_avisera_july_06_demo/day1/dsc06646.jpg
Typical presentation, you get a rough cut.

http://www.ablett.jp/workshop/images/lathe/eli_avisera_july_06_demo/day1/dsc06647.jpg
His presentation, with his tools ground his way, and you get an amazingly smooth cut.

http://www.ablett.jp/workshop/images/lathe/eli_avisera_july_06_demo/day1/dsc06649.jpg
Roughing gouge... :eek:

http://www.ablett.jp/workshop/images/lathe/eli_avisera_july_06_demo/day1/dsc06675.jpg
Yep, again roughing gouge

The roughing gouge is not ground flat on across the nose, but has the wings ground back a bit, plus the second bevel make on heck of a dif.

I'm getting smooth cuts now with my bowl gouge on faceplate work, that I start sanding at #320, no kidding.

http://www.ablett.jp/workshop/images/lathe/eli_avisera_july_06_demo/day2/dsc06696.jpg
The cut is so smooth, because you are cutting he grain, not opening it as with a scraping motion.

I'll write more about this later, I still have some questions for Eli, but his site is down, and he may be just a bit too busy at the moment to answer.

Cheers!

PS Keith nice bowl, love the color contrast!

[Tom Sherman]

Keith that is a nice looking bowl. Great learning experience I'll bet the next one will probably be easier.

[Keith Burns]

Your experiment turned out good and you learned a few things, what could be better ? Keep it up:) :)

[Mark Pruitt]

I've been told you can actually break a spindle roughing gouge using it on a bowl blank, but I've never been brave enough to attempt to prove that. :eek:
I remember Bill Grumbine posting a thread about a roughing gouge that broke while he was using it, although he was not using it on a bowl blank. Here is the thread where he discussed it:
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=38139
Mark

[Lee DeRaud]

http://www.henrytaylortools.co.uk/gifs/ch6.gif
Bowl Gouge

http://www.henrytaylortools.co.uk/gifs/ch.gif
Roughing Gouge
What those pictures don't show is what's going on at the handle end of the tool. Example: my bowl gouge is 1/2" diameter up at the cutting edge and maintains that diameter all the way down. The HF roughing gouge I have is about 7/8" across the cutting edge...and necks down to less than 3/8" at the tang (where it enters the handle).