Question about sanding

[Louis Brandt]

Hello,
I’m almost finished with the construction work on my fireplace mantel and surround, and I’m ready to begin the finishing operation. I’ve got a question on sanding the wood before applying the finish. Whenever I’ve done any finish work in the past, I’ve always hand sanded the wood before applying the stain, but since I see so many posts about random orbit sanders, I’d like to find out more about them. The only power sander that I have is just a small palm sander.
So my question is simple, but it may seem dumb to some of you experienced woodworkers. If I want a good finish on my completed project, is hand sanding all that I need, or do I need to use a random orbit sander and if so, please explain why.
Louis

[Ron Blaise]

The way to go Louis. It cuts quick, yet gives a very good finish in much less time than hand sanding. I bought a 5" Ridged because it had very good reviews for the price and I like the hook & loop feature with it. Makes disks easy to change and I can hook my shop vac to it & no dust! Just my 2 cents worth.
Ron

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

Your palm sander is most likely a ROS.

Power tools merely make the difficult easier, the booring less tedious and the mundane appear sublime.

That said they are also a hell of a lot of fun.

No you do not to buy a sander.
Yes your finish work can be the best on the planet.
Hells bells it was centuries of wood workers making superb art before electricity was discovered much less how to harness it to do something so mundane as drag an abrasive rag across a slab of lumber.

However you would enjoy a nice ROS like a porter cable speed blok or a festertool

[Ben Grunow]

They are great but take some getting used to if you have vibrating sander. You must have the sander on the wood when you turn it on or some will spool up to a high speed and can make a deep swirl if touched to the wood. They also leave the wood somewhat "furry" IMHO (if you have ever scraped wood or planed wood you know how smooth a fresh pass leaves the wood- if you could look at the wood with a microscope after using the ROS I think it would look furry) but woking down through finer grits helps that. I know several painters and finishers and the last step is always hand sanding at 220 or even finer.

[Troy White]

Unless you like swirls I would hand sand.

[Vaughn McMillan]

Unless you like swirls I would hand sand.
I disagree. I use a ROS a lot, and don't get swirl marks unless I'm being sloppy with the sander. And hand-sanding in the wrong manner can also leave undesirable marks. With either method, technique plays a big role. I prefer the ROS since it's faster and has better dust collection potential (with a shop vac).

Also, while I'm disagreeing with folks, not all "palm sanders" move in a random orbital pattern. Orbital maybe, but random orbital, no. Big difference in finish and effectiveness.

Louis, to address your original question, I'd say either method can produce a good finish. A ROS can speed things up and be less dusty. I'd hate to be without either of mine.

- Vaughn

[Brian Hale]

I use a ROS on most every piece of wood i process as it's quick to remove the little dings and scrapes you get when handling lumber, however i Always finish the process with hand sanding. IMHO, the stain looks better with hand sanding than it does with an ROS.

If you've got an orbital sander you'll see a bigger difference hand sanding than you would with an ROS. Even with the best orbital it's easy to leave little curly-ques on the wood that seem to only show up with stain.

Having said that, I'm beginning to use a card scraper more and more but still haven't gotten to the skill level where i can skip hand sanding.

If you don't have an ROS, i believe it would be a good investment for you.

Brian :)

[John Kain]

I disagree. I use a ROS a lot, and don't get swirl marks unless I'm being sloppy with the sander. And hand-sanding in the wrong manner can also leave undesirable marks. With either method, technique plays a big role. I prefer the ROS since it's faster and has better dust collection potential (with a shop vac).

Also, while I'm disagreeing with folks, not all "palm sanders" move in a random orbital pattern. Orbital maybe, but random orbital, no. Big difference in finish and effectiveness.

Louis, to address your original question, I'd say either method can produce a good finish. A ROS can speed things up and be less dusty. I'd hate to be without either of mine.

- Vaughn

I agree with this in my experience so far. ROS do a good job on most everyjob. Your fireplace is no different.

Like Brian, I have started really using scrapers. I like how easy they work in order to get a beautiful finish. I'm working on some bookcases for my son's room right now and LOVE the look, with minimal effort.

I don't usually like promoting a product (OK, I do) but I took the plunge and bought the Veritas scraper kit and I couldn't be more impressed. It comes with 4 scrapers, a burnisher, a file, and an angle finder. Resharpening/Burnishing scrapers might not be the hardest thing is the world, but I really love the burnisher for it's ease of use and 90 deg exactness (if that's a word). I started using scrapers on my last project and was hooked.

[Bob Childress]

Whether you hand sand, use an ROS, a scraper, or a nice, sharp piece of flint you can get a great finished surface. But how long do you want to take to get it? By definition, a tool is something that helps us do a task more easily than without it. Even plain old sandpaper is a tool.

If you are a methodical, painstaking type of person, hand sanding may be for you. I just don't have the patience for it.:o Tools save time but technique makes for great finishes, by hand or otherwise.

Whew, I feel better. Now that I've said all that, go get a nice hook and loop ROS with D/C and never look back. :D

[Mike Cutler]

My final sanding is always by hand. I have a drum sander, belt sanders, palm sanders and an ROS. The combination(s) of them is used on all projects, but the final sanding ,prior to finishing is by hand. That's just me though. Believe it or not, I actually like sanding. Sort of therapuetic.

[Steve Schoene]

There are lots of ways to skin this cat. I seldom use a ROS for finish sanding, and if I do I always had sand using the same grit.

Personally I find that using a smoothing plane, followed by a scraper will work fine for most projects. If for some reason there are parts of the project that have been sanded instead of planed, I had sand the entire surface with the final grit--which is usually 220. I don't like to scrape or place surfaces that have already been sanded--its pretty hard on edges.

[Jerry Olexa]

A ROS is simply much faster to achieve the look you seeking. I use it on all my furniture projects and I never get swirl marks.

[Mike Null]

I like the quiet of hand sanding.

Mike

[Todd Burch]

Boy, responses all over the board on this one!

For me, I do use ROS's. I have several. However, there is a price to pay for using them. That price? Swirl marks - UNLESS you are VERY thorough and never stop before 220 grit.

They don't do inside corners, and don't do well when you can't overshoot an edge, like a drawer bottom up against the inside edges after assembled. As with any power sander, they are heck on sharp edges. Your crisp, clean edges can turn into a roundover (an inconsistent roundover at that) in a split second.

If I'm hand sanding, I usually stop at 120 for good stain penetration.

When ROSing, having to stop at 220 to not get swirl marks, you just punished yourself in the staining department (on closed pore woods) if you are looking to go dark. The surface is somewhat burnished when stopping at 220 with a ROS.

I'm no expert, and I've only been woodworking for 23 years, but whoever made the comment about a ROS not being as dusty as hand sanding baffles me. I don't think so. You will take off more wood with a power sander, I promise. You may choose to vacuum it up as you go (more $$ for that ROS), but more dust is produced, and gets flung into the air, and is finer, blah blah, blah.

Is ROS faster? It can be. It's noisy. It vibrates your hand and arm. You wear hearing protection and lung protection and eye protection. Enjoyable? Sanding is never enjoyable. It's a necessary evil (unless you scrape).