Carter band saw blade tension gauge

[Paul Prescott]

Can anyone explain to me just how this works? It obviously can not connect to the blade itself, so what is it measuring and how does it measure it?

Considering buying one but ...

[Brian Hale]

I thought they connected to the blade and read the tension as you tightened the blade.

[David Eisenhauer]

I don't know the Carter gauge in particular, but I thought that BS tension gauges in general lightly "clamp" or "grip" the blade with a two-arm-squared -off U type gizmo that then measures the amount of "stretch" or travel in the blade (over the distance between the two arms) as it is tensioned. As I recall, X amount of travel (in thousandths) equals to X amount of tension in punds of pull.

[Ken Garlock]

Paul, the info on the Carter website says that the gauge does not attach to the blade. I suspect that they use their replacement tension spring and measure how the spring moves as the tension adjuster is turned. Take a close look at the picture (http://www.carterproducts.com/product.asp?product_id=312&cat_id=46)of it installed on a band-saw.

[lou sansone]

looks like a load cell to me... I would say you divide the force on the cell by 2 in order to get the tension in the blade. I would assume that there must be a way to enter the blade width and thickness into the electronic Gage. that information coupled with the load cell info should give you the venerable PSI that some folks really want to know.

Lou

[Allen Bookout]

Wow! I do not know how it works but for two hundred bucks I think that I will just continue to tighten untill the blade doesn't flutter anymore.

[Paul Prescott]

Interesting discussion. I know there are BS tension gauges that measure tension on the blade but the Carter doesn't. It does look like it might connect to the spring (which would have to be their replacement spring), but I wonder how accurate this would be over time?

The reason I was interested in this (the more expensive $300 gauge, which cuts power if the blade breaks) is because I had a blade break in use not long ago. No injury but scared me a LOT!

That ever happen to anyone???

While on the subject, the "flutter" test is what Timberwolf recommends. To do this correctly I've loosened all 4 cool blocks and backed off both backing wheels (with my "Sometimers Disease" I can't think of the correct term just now!), but on my Ridgid BS I really don't see a "flutter" like they describe. Maybe that's a product of Ridgid construction. Just don't know. Am I doing it right?

Another blade snap in use and I might just be done with bandsaws!

[Mark Rios]

To all you engineer types out there.....isn't there a whole load of variables by measuring the tension there? Isn't a measurement actually on each individual blade itself much more accurate?

[Norman Hitt]

To all you engineer types out there.....isn't there a whole load of variables by measuring the tension there? Isn't a measurement actually on each individual blade itself much more accurate?

You are 100% CORRECT, Mark. YOU Win the Cupie Doll.:D

[lou sansone]

You are 100% CORRECT, Mark. YOU Win the Cupie Doll.:D

I disagree... this is a simple pulley system and the tension on the blade will be ~1/2 of the force exerted by the upper wheel ( neglecting friction ). Having said that, I do personally think the flutter method of tensioning the blade the simplest for wood working applications.

Lou

[lou sansone]

Interesting discussion. I know there are BS tension gauges that measure tension on the blade but the Carter doesn't. It does look like it might connect to the spring (which would have to be their replacement spring), but I wonder how accurate this would be over time?

The reason I was interested in this (the more expensive $300 gauge, which cuts power if the blade breaks) is because I had a blade break in use not long ago. No injury but scared me a LOT!

That ever happen to anyone???

While on the subject, the "flutter" test is what Timberwolf recommends. To do this correctly I've loosened all 4 cool blocks and backed off both backing wheels (with my "Sometimers Disease" I can't think of the correct term just now!), but on my Ridgid BS I really don't see a "flutter" like they describe. Maybe that's a product of Ridgid construction. Just don't know. Am I doing it right?

Another blade snap in use and I might just be done with bandsaws!

the flutter method work well with big saws where there is a long straight section between the upper and lower wheels. It works very well on my 36" bandsaw ( it takes a ~ 20 foot blade ), but I would think that on the smaller saws it would be much more difficult to really see the blade fluttering

lou

[Chet Parks]

Looking at the Carter site and how the unit is installed, I'd say that they are using a small load cell and just measuring the pressure that the blade adjustment spring is exerting on the stationary part of the saw frame. Since this would be the tension on both sides of the blade, This would give a very acurate read out of the tension on the blale. It certainly would give you a very reproduceable read out as blades were changed--assuming that the guides for the upper wheel adjustment were well lubricated and did not bind.

In my proir life, I have used these load cells under 4 legs of process tanks to measure the weight of the contents - 20,000+ lbs - with accurcy as close as 1 pound.

Chet Parks

[tod evans]

i don`t get all the hoopla over tensioning a blade? after just a short time using a bandsaw most folks will find a method that works for them, lou flutters, i pluck, some guys check deflection between the guides by finger pressure. i think these gizmos are for the crowd who worries more about their tables being flat to within.00001 than woodworking? in the end bandsaw blades are all disposable(even the trimaster) and if you`re first learning buy 10-15$ blades and fiddle with different methods untill you`re comfortable with your saw. you`ll be a better woodworker for your efforts and will have the better part of the two bills in question still in your pocket......02 tod

[Nick Clayton]

I don't know the first thing about band saws, in fact I just bought a used one last night. However, I am one of those obsessive compulsive folks that Tod spoke of that worries about tolerances; hey I'm a scientist by trade. On the other had, band saws have been around for a while and I don't think they had electronic tensioning gauges when they were first resawing with them;)

However, due to my compulsive nature couple with Yankee tendencies towards "thriftiness", I found a neat article in Fine Wood Working titled "Shop made Tension Gauge" Volume 147, pages 80-83. I don't know how well it is going to work, but since I don't have anyone to demonstrate fluttering or the correct tone of the pluck I'm going to give it a shot. Perhaps a creeker has tied it and could give their opinion?

[Scott Banbury]

On my 36", I pluck for E, then tune out any flutter and then listen for harmonic vibration while cutting and adjust accordingly :cool:

[Scott Steeves]

However, due to my compulsive nature couple with Yankee tendencies towards "thriftiness", I found a neat article in Fine Wood Working titled "Shop made Tension Gauge" Volume 147, pages 80-83. I'm fairly positive that John White's book, Care and Repair of Shop Machines (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000GAB0ZI/qid=1152284132/sr=8-2/ref=sr_1_2/002-5445044-5518446?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance&n=228013), has instructions for making a shop-made tension gauge, too.

[Kurt Loup]

The reason I was interested in this (the more expensive $300 gauge, which cuts power if the blade breaks) is because I had a blade break in use not long ago. No injury but scared me a LOT!

That ever happen to anyone???




A blade broke on me once. It was a 1/2" blade on my Jet 12" saw. I assure you that saw didn't put excessive tension on the blade. I assume it was a bad weld. The blade was replaced by the retailer and I've not had any other problems with blades breaking.

Kurt

[Mike Cutler]

The instrumentation technician in me says that the Carter Product is some form of a Peizeo electronic force transducer(load Cell). It is measuring the force applied by the end of the threaded rod on a plate. It's just measuring the pressure applied to the plate, and converting it to a force.

I think that the method detailed in the following post would be a lot cheaper for someone to replicate.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=22144

There have been some really good threads on the subject of bandsaw blade tensioning over the last few years. Someday we should collect them all and make an article from the collective posts.

[Frank Fusco]

i don`t get all the hoopla over tensioning a blade? after just a short time using a bandsaw most folks will find a method that works for them, lou flutters, i pluck, some guys check deflection between the guides by finger pressure. i think these gizmos are for the crowd who worries more about their tables being flat to within.00001 than woodworking? in the end bandsaw blades are all disposable(even the trimaster) and if you`re first learning buy 10-15$ blades and fiddle with different methods untill you`re comfortable with your saw. you`ll be a better woodworker for your efforts and will have the better part of the two bills in question still in your pocket......02 tod

Eminently good sense in that post, Tod. I have another name for the 'flutter' method. It is......:eek: .... nebber mind.

[glenn bradley]

I may be off base but the Suffolk blades run at a much lower tension on my saw than say, a Vermont. I never had the nerve to get a Vermont loose enough to flutter. That being said:

[Mike Cutler]

On my 36", I pluck for E, then tune out any flutter and then listen for harmonic vibration while cutting and adjust accordingly :cool:

So... uhhh. Is that a harmonic,or an order of the harmonic of concert E, or the sympathetic harmonic of E at 659 hz.:p

Cool response.

[Tom Hamilton]

Couple of thoughts: I installed a new Timberwolf 1/4" today on my Griz 513X, one of four I purchased on their current buy three get one free dea, and following the instructions that came with the blades, used the flutter method.

After marking the front of the tension wheel with a piece of tape I loosened to flutter and tightened until no flutter. I cut a series of curves in 3/4 ply and a cabriolet leg and it worked great.

So, for the Timberwolf blades at least, I would follow their instructions.

The homemade tension gage referenced above was the topic of a major thread on the OWWM forum earlier this month and received high marks from some very knowledgable folks. Probably worth trying if measuring is your thing.

Tom, in Houston, fluttering his Timberwolf blades to a perfect cut

[Curt Harms]

I've been using Twolf blades lightly for a few years. I've been happy with the result, but thought the resaw could be smoother. Greater tension didn't seem to help with either cut quality or tracking. One day I was tinkering and did the flutter thing. All blade guides raised and/or moved away from the blade. Snug the blade, start the saw, loosen until flutter starts, then tighten about 1 turn. I tried 7" white oak jointed on one face. The cut wasn't bad before but it's smoother now. The piece still needs to be sanded, but 1 pass thru a Performax will do it.

I did have tracking problems with one Twolf blade but that was a worn blade, not a tension problem. I've also found that the top guides don't necessarily need to right on top of the work in order to track right. My saw will only resaw about 7 1/2" but I've resawed with a 1/4" 6tpi blade and the blade guides fully raised resawing 4" stock. It tracked fine and gave a smooth cut. This is a mediocre G1148. I did tweak the wheels however.

Curt

[Boyd Gathwright]

i don`t get all the hoopla over tensioning a blade? after just a short time using a bandsaw most folks will find a method that works for them, lou flutters, i pluck, some guys check deflection between the guides by finger pressure. i think these gizmos are for the crowd who worries more about their tables being flat to within.00001 than woodworking? in the end bandsaw blades are all disposable(even the trimaster) and if you`re first learning buy 10-15$ blades and fiddle with different methods untill you`re comfortable with your saw. you`ll be a better woodworker for your efforts and will have the better part of the two bills in question still in your pocket......02 tod


.... Tod, I have to agree with you. After a while you get to know your saw and your tensioning is going to fall in to a certain range, it becomes a “feel”. And you look on the saw tensioning gauge to see what that range and number is for that blade ;).

.