Dovetails-PC 4212, Keller or Festool?

[Roland Chung]

I've got a small pullout project on a kitchen remodel where I would like to use dovetails. The rest of the drawers are assembled with pocket screws and have separate drawer fronts. These pullouts will not have a separate front and I would like the boxes to look sharp.

I've done a search and read some discussion about the 4212 and Keller jigs, but I was wondering if anyone would be able to compare those jigs to the Festool dovetail system. I already have the OF1010, MFT and Vacuum.

Thanks in advance!

[Per Swenson]

Hi Roland,

Let me see if I can do this with out offending anyone.

We own the 1010 and a 1400 Festool routers,

We own 6 p/c routers. Plus milk crates full of antique routers.

We own the leigh dovetail jig.

I am pro festool.

But my next dovetail jig will be a Akeda.

Per

[Jerry Olexa]

The other jigs mentioned are all high quality performers BUT I'm told, the best value (bang for the $) is the Porter Cable.

[Allen Bookout]

Let me see if I can do this with out offending anyone.



You did that well Per. You are a natural born politician.

Allen

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

a few DTs ?? can you just borrow a jig?

I own the Leigh D4 and the Omnijig with both the fixed blind DT pattern and the adjustable through pattern. I like the Omnijig oodles better.

If you want fast & easy go Akeda.

If you want the maximum out-of-the-box flexibility go Leigh.

If you want fast easy little factory looking DTs go with the little 12" PC. It's what about a hundred bucks?

If you want the workhorse of the industry with plenty of flexibility - later - at a price go with the PC Omnijig.

[tod evans]

Hi Roland,

Let me see if I can do this with out offending anyone.


Per

why? heck if i shaved some would be offended-`cause i don`t some are...big deal!
my vote for a tank is the omnijig.........but everybody should learn to handcut! every pos importer now owns a dovetailer and offers machine cuts. i wouldn`t be supprised to see them in wally-world furniture...02 tod

[Bob Noles]

Roland,

I can't help by comparison, but I do own the PC4212 and find it to be most adequate for anything I ask of it. Price was right also :)

[Al Willits]

Just wondering, appears the PC 4212 can't be adjusted for spacing, that seem to pose a problem?
I'm looking for one to.

What would the Omnijig give me over the 4212 and is it reasonbly easy to use?

Al

[Deirdre Saoirse Moen]

The other jigs mentioned are all high quality performers BUT I'm told, the best value (bang for the $) is the Porter Cable.

Well, the best bang for the buck is a dovetail saw. Just takes a tidge longer. :)

[Deirdre Saoirse Moen]

Keller only does through dovetails, so unless you want to put a false front on, that's not the jig for you (you'll lose drawer space).

The other jigs you mention, iirc, are all half-blind jigs.

Half-blinds are more of a pita to do by hand, but I personally prefer the look to ANY of the dovetail jigs, including Leigh (which I used to own). For one thing, you can make the pins narrower than a router bit can get.

[Steve Clardy]

I got the pc4212 on amazons sale.
Nice well made unit looks like.
Haven't had any play time with it though. Soon

[Bob Noles]

Perhaps some videos on the PC4212 would be helpful and dispell some myths as well.

http://www.porter-cable.com/jigs/

[Roland Chung]

Thank you for the quick responses! Sounds like I could be happy with any one of the several jigs that you recommended. I need to get off my bottom and make a decision so I can wrap up this project. Thanks again!

Roland

[Mike Cutler]

Roland.

If you are just making drawers, and you don't want to watch 45 minutes of instruction videos, read a 150 page manual, or spend an extra day or so making a jig. The PC 4212 is the ticket.

Take it out of the box, check some basic alignment, put some scrap wood in it to learn on, and within an hour of opening the box you'll be well on your way to having your drawers done.

Those other jigs are nice, especially the Akeda, but the PC just works. Nothing fancy, no frills, it just works.

[Allen Bookout]

You know what is funny Mike? When I started reading your post just above this one I thought that you were describing the Akeda which is what I have.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

Just wondering, appears the PC 4212 can't be adjusted for spacing, that seem to pose a problem?
I'm looking for one to.

What would the Omnijig give me over the 4212 and is it reasonbly easy to use?

Al
Well for starters you can do casework as it's 24". If that's not an issue, the Akeda may look better and better.

Ease of use? Oh YEah baby. The initial set up is fairly straight forward and once you do it you are done. I mean you are done for ever until you install a different joint template.

To establish a return position for the stops (when switching templates) You can use a razor knife as the manual says: scribe a mark in the metal body & simply relocate the stops to the mark.

Or you can use dowel pins to have a positive permant relocation point. I love dowel pins. All you need is a drill and two reamers (one a half tenth under and one a half tenth over). If you are using spring pins you don't need the reamers.


The Omnijig comes with a fixed machined aluminum finger pattern for 1/2" blind DTs. You can purchase other patterns. I have the flexible adjustable one that is a lot like my Leigh except you don't flip it as must do for the liegh. It's a lot heavier than the Leigh too.

The omnijg is not the tool to get if you will never use it again as it's expensive - so to the leigh. I recall the OP was contemplating a small job. The fact that one must purchase the adjustable finger pattern as an extra discourages many folks who wanted to get adjustability right out of the box. Leigh gives you instant adjustability out of the box.

The Omnijig, is I think, Bullet proof. The heavy 73 pounds of machined Aluminum holds your work dead square. You can drop the thing off an overpass while cutting your DTs and you won't notice any thing other than the broken bones you'll suffer but the jig and your DTs will be fine. Not too sure about the subsequent impact from an 80 ton rig at 90 MPH.

You can't over-tighten the clamp handles and distort the jig. The clamps are about 1&1/4" thick steel bar stock with a 3/8" (guess) steel plate to bear against the work.

The leigh clamps depend on a couple of little plastic knoby thingies of which I dissaprove. The manual is strict about overtightening them. The clamp bars are alum extrusions. I don't trust them.

The Omnijig is going to give you perfect repeatability - over and over and over.

I see the leigh as more of a short run tool. It's less sturdy takes a bit more care to use and can give you perfect DTs every time or give you one screw up after another depending on how careful you are with it.

If they'd made the Leigh a little (OK a lot) heavier I'd like it more, but that's just me.

The Omnijig seems not to care whether my router is heavy or light or whether I have a heavy hand or not. The leigh is fussy that way.

I can hold the Omni jig one end in each hand and tru to deform it for all I'm worth and it budges not a bit. I can clamp it hanging half wao off a bench and jump on it like a diving board.

The Leigh is an extrusion. the older D4's were two extrusions the new one is a single extrusion. I can still flex it with my hands, and having designed and built extruders I am unsure about trusting the factory extrusion for squareness. I prefer machined cast or solid billit metal.

[Mike Cutler]

You know what is funny Mike? When I started reading your post just above this one I thought that you were describing the Akeda which is what I have.


Allen.

My post was most definitely not targeted at any one specific jig or fixture. It also wasn't meant to be in any way negative with respect to the other jigs.

Roland's post seemed to imply that he was already in the middle of the project. The fastest jig in his list to accomplish the task was the PC. There is just about a zero learning curve with it. Get the bit set correctly, and go.

The Akeda is a really nice jig. Definitely on my "to buy" list.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

Well, the best bang for the buck is a dovetail saw. Just takes a tidge longer. :)

Well said.