New basement shop floor questions

[Wes Billups]

I'm finally getting ready to start on my basement shop as it's been 5 months since I've had one to work in. I've got all of my tools out of the area that I plan on finishing and would like some input on the floor. I plan on painting or epoxy coating the floor and have a couple of questions. There are some rough areas around a support column and plumbing fixtures. The builder did a decent job of smoothing out the field of the floor but left a 8" radius around any obstruction. It's not bad, probably the equivalent of a driveway. Is there any way to smooth this out prior to finishing the floor? I also have a question about the plumbing rough-in for a bathroom. There are 3 PVC pipes sticking 2' out of the concrete in areas that I'd like to place tools. Is there a way to cut them flush to the floor and still allow them to be used for plumbing in the future? The toilet and shower drains are near a wall so they're not a big deal the sink drain is about 3' from the wall and would be a pain if I have to leave it sticking up more than an inch.

Thanks,
Wes

I'm sure there will be many more questions but I wanted to get these two items handled before I start framing up partition walls.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

Sounds like they broom finished the concrete or do is it smooth everywhere but those 8" radii?. I know of no way to smooth that out short of troweling a skim coat over it.
You can lay finish on thickly to fill in the coarseness.

The PVC pipes: Depends on what they are. If they are nothing more than portals through which you will shove your copper lines then I guess you can make 'em flush with the concrete with no harm. However it those pipes are the actual plumbing and intended to have couplings glued on to hook up the rest of the plumbing job then, Don't touch 'em with that hacksaw.

[tod evans]

wes, a diamond cup wheel on an angle grinder will smooth out your rough concrete....02 tod

[Rob Russell]

There are self-levelling finishes that you could mix up and pour over the whole floor. That would give you a nice smooth surface. They use these under radiant heat to give a nice level surface.

[Wes Billups]

wes, a diamond cup wheel on an angle grinder will smooth out your rough concrete....02 tod

One more quick question. I plan on painting the walls with water proof paint. Will an airless sprayer work with the thick paints designed for basement walls?

[Rob Russell]

One more quick question. I plan on painting the walls with water proof paint. Will an airless sprayer work with the thick paints designed for basement walls?

If you're talking about Drylock, I can't imagine a sprayer shooting that stuff - it's tooooo thick. Besides, you sort of want to force the paint into the concrete pores.

I put multiple 5 gallon pails of Drylock on a cottage basement, so I've "been there, done that".

Rob

[Wes Billups]

Rob, that's what I assumed but I wanted to make sure. Thanks for the reply. I'm hoping to begin my shop project this weekend by painting the walls with Drylock or similar product. I'd also like to get to a point of having the floor ready to paint also but that may be too optimistic. I plan on taking plenty of pictures of this whole process as I have received a ton of help from viewing other Creeker's shop projects and want to return the favor.

[Jim Becker]

'Suggest you "be careful" with those plumbing rough-ins. They already cost a bundle to be put in and making them difficult to use in the future may compromise resale if you don't use them yourself.

[Eric Shields]

Wes,

It looks like you and I are on the same road, though I'm at the rest stop ahead of you (I'll be there for a long while and am sure will see you pass by). The shop hasn't seen much action since I painted the walls with Zinssers Water Tite (consistancy of pancake batter, though I've never used a sprayer, I never would have attempted to spray this stuff) and the floor with Rust-Oleum Epoxy Shield (kit from the Orange BORG). I honestly didn't pay much attention to correcting any of the deficiencies in the concrete around my support column or water line. I just didn't see the purpose of making it "perfect" as the basement is for storage and my shop. It took me one day of prep and one day of painting to do the floors and the difference is amazing. The attached thread shows before and after shots.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=31716 (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=31716)

At the moment I've got 2 walls framed and have no clue when I'll have time or funds to complete the others (summer is a busy time for me). Hope to see you progress past me sooner rathar than later. Best of luck with your transformation and look forward to watching your progress.

Eric

[Wes Billups]

Eric, thanks for your words of encouragment. I'm in the same boat you are as my time will be very limited as we have a 2 year old and 5 month old which end up being my number one priority when I'm home. My hope is to get the walls painted this weekend and then paint the floor the next weekend when my dad comes to visit. After that it will take a while to get the framing done as I'm still weighing whether I want to fur out the block walls or just leave them as is. I know cost wise which is cheapest but I also want to make my shop comfortable to work in. I spent too much time in a shop which I wished I had done it right the first time.

Does anyone have a good estimate of the cost to finish a basment shop? I realize this is very dependent on how much finish I put in but I am just looking for a ballpark (+/- $10/sq ft). I'm going to try to nail down a firm cost this weekend before I decide how much finish to put in as I plan on building it as I can afford materials.

Thanks,
Wes

[JayStPeter]

Wes,
I did my basement shop shown here (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=10597) for just under $6K. It is right around 600 sq ft with 9' ceilings. The soundproofing (which I recommend) added around $1K to the cost. It could be done cheaper still if you don't overkill on electrical and lighting. I hired out the drywall portion which could also save some cash.

BTW, one of my concerns with painting the floor was etching the floor. I helped a friend do his garage floor and the acid did some minor etching of his garage door rails. Nothing major, but I was concerned about the closed in area with all my major household systems nearby. I think it's doable if you can get adequate ventilation and some good fans. But, painting the floor will save you yet even more money over what I spent :rolleyes: .

Jay

[Chris Padilla]

For a good floor coating, look at www.ucoatit.com (http://www.ucoatit.com) This stuff works amazingly well for a garage floor but could be overkill/overly expensive for a basement floor.

I assume you want some level of smoothness for your basement floor to make sawdust clean up go easy.

As for the plumbing, you could cut them down (but could depend on what the pipes are exactly for) but I think making them flush could render them useless in the future. You'd likely need at least an inch or two sticking out to put a coupler out to re-extend the length at a later date.

Post a couple of pictures...it could help us help you.

[Andy Fox]

Wes,

I'll share some of my experiences with a basement shop

I just moved my shop into my basement from my garage last winter. You can guess why it was during the winter. :) I quickly added some temporary fluorescent shop lights, and I'm running tools off the existing outlets which were there for other purposes (sump pump, laundry). I pay close attention to circuit loads. I didn't have the time or budget to setup a proper shop, and I wanted to try out the space first. It would be nice to have a finished space, but I enjoy working down there just as much.

I had already painted the walls with two coats of white Drylock when we first moved in (new build), and that helped a lot with lighting and humidity. Get one of those large masonry brushes to work the paint into the pores. I think I used a long knap roller for the second coat.

I now have a much better idea of my electrical outlet placements and lighting needs. When I finish off the walls, I plan to cover them with 2" rigid foam insulation and build a standard framed 2x4 wall against that which will be fastened to the floor and ceiling joists. That's easier than attaching furring strips to block, and it leaves more room for wiring, boxes, and optional batt insulation. Here is a document I found helpful: http://www.buildingscience.com/resources/foundations/renovating_your_basement.pdf

In your planning, don't forget to factor in resale value for when you want to sell your house someday. More buyers will want to see a finished family or media room than a workshop.

Don't let that furnace become your house's dust distribution system. :) My furnace's blower compartment was very poorly sealed (a big no-no in HVAC), and was sucking a lot of air from the basement and distributing it throughout the house. I found this out when our water heater mutated into a carbon monoxide generator. The furnace blower was on (connected with air conditioner), and it was sucking air and toxic gases down the flue. :eek: I replaced the water heater, and sealed the bottom panel of the blower with special butyl-backed foil tape on the outside of the compartment. I sealed all of the air return ducts down there too, including the filter slot (folded hinge of tape).

[Wes Billups]

Sorry for so many questions. I checked at HD yesterday and they have concrete paint which runs $26/gal (400 sq ft coverage) and the two part epoxy $45/gal (250 sq ft coverage). I had the concrete paint in my old shop and can't complain as it made it much easier to sweep up. I've seen alot of positive feedback about the 2 part systems. I figure it'd be $75 for paint and $135 for epoxy to cover the area I'm planning for my shop. Is the durability of the epoxy that much better than paint? Remember there won't be any hot tires parked in my basement.

I also wanted to attach this picture showing the plumbing rough-in's. From what everyone is saying I'll leave them about 3-4" high and recap them so if we do add a bathroom in the future I'll only need to cut off the cap and glue on a connection.

Thanks for everyone's help.
Wes

[Jim Becker]

Wes, one consideration with using the epoxy/2-part floor paint system is ventilation...you need to be able to deal with that since this is your home and the floor is below your living space. If you cannot fully ventilate...go with the regular paint. In both cases, good preparation makes for a better result.

[Chip Charnley]

I also have a question about the plumbing rough-in for a bathroom. There are 3 PVC pipes sticking 2' out of the concrete in areas that I'd like to place tools. Is there a way to cut them flush to the floor and still allow them to be used for plumbing in the future? The toilet and shower drains are near a wall so they're not a big deal the sink drain is about 3' from the wall and would be a pain if I have to leave it sticking up more than an inch.

If it was me, I'd install a deep sink to that sink drain if at all possible. It will come in very handy on many occasions. As to the other drains, as others have said, don't touch them. Plan around them. Perhaps build some storage cabinetry around them or a machine base.

[Wes Billups]

Jim, the ventilation issue is important since I have small kids in the house. I think I'll stick with the paint since I have experience using it in my last shop.

Chip, my plan on the drain lines is to leave the toilet and shower as is and build cabinets around them. The sink line will get cut to be approx. 6" above the floor and recapped. I'll place my tablesaw right in front of it so I'm not tripping over it. A deep well sink may be a later addition in one of the cabinets covering the shower drain.

Thanks again for everyone's help. I am working up costs now on wall systems and have a couple of ideas that I'll be running by everyone once I figure out which ones I can afford.

Thanks,
Wes

[tod evans]

One more quick question. I plan on painting the walls with water proof paint. Will an airless sprayer work with the thick paints designed for basement walls?

wes, if the local rental center has a graco king air pump on an airless unit they will spray tar so blockfiller is nothing. yes the blockfiller paint can be sprayed.....02 tod

[edit] here`s a link to gracos extreme series pumps guaranteed to spray whatever.
http://www.graco.com/Internet/T_PDB.nsf/SearchView/Xtreme451561681801

[Eric Shields]

Wes,

We certainly do have a lot in common so far as our shop/time is related. I have a 13 and a 15 yr old (step children), along with LOML that take priority over my shop and time. I guess that is partially why I never attempted to "budget" the cost of my shop. I work out the "plan" for my next phase (knowing I want to do what's right for me the first time around), save what can be saved, purchase my materials, and then construct. You never know what expenses are going to come up, and as we both stated, the family is first priority. I'll admit it is slow going, sometimes frustrating, but I'll eventually get it done knowing I didn't short my family or cut corners in my shop.

As for painting (walls and floor), I opened the two windows in our basement (fortunately on the shop side) and turned on a fan. I'm not saying there were not any fumes, but I didn't see any pink elephants or get any complaints (headaches or otherwise) from the kids playing in the adjoining room. The noticeable scent went away after a day or two.

Enjoy the experience (kids and the shop) and I look forward to comparing progress and experiences in the future.

Eric