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Dave Lehnert
06-06-2006, 11:27 PM
Looking at a Toro Estate model for my 2acrs. Anyone have problems with one brand over the other?
Asked around on Lawnsite.com but most are pro’s working with equipment everyday. If I took their advice I need a 72” deck with a 30 something HP Cat diesel for $18,000. I thought our woodworking tools got out of control but they are nuts!

Keith Outten
06-07-2006, 6:22 AM
Dave,

I own a Dixie Chopper, 72" model with a 26 HP Kohler engine. I'm in my 5th season with my Chopper cutting 6 acres and can't say enough good things about the machine. I guess you would consider my mower big iron but I wanted a machine that would last a lifetime as I find it cheaper in the long run than buying less expensive machines every few years.

The folks at Lawnsite.com are pros and like wood working pros they tend to buy big iron which is better suited to their profession...and yes mowers have gotten real expensive like everything else these days.

Cut to the chase...for me a major consideration is time in the seat and my Chopper has right at 400 hours on the meter cutting 6 acres going into my 5th season. You do the math, a professional machine will do a great job and real quick which is a good thing when it is 95 degrees and 90% humidity.

I have never seen the Toro model you are considering but I suggest that you look very close at any machine you are serious about. Look at the frame and particularly at the maintenance points like grease fittings and what it takes to sharpen the blades. Look at dealer specific parts and consider the cost of ownership through the years. The fancy sheet metal just gets in the way when you need to perform maintenance.

Love my Dixie Chopper!

.

Gary Max
06-07-2006, 6:52 AM
Dave one of the biggest things I look at these days when it comes to buying any machine---service.
When the dang thing breaks who is going to fix it.
So I only buy machines that have good service in my area. You will find this change form one part of the country to the next.
That is a good thing about Keith's Dixie---most of the time the dealer is also doing the service work.

Ed Lang
06-07-2006, 8:34 AM
This year my wife and I bought a Cub Cadet ZT from Tractor Supply. It is one of their units with the welded frame, not the stamped steel. My wife took a look at the units and quickly decided that the welded frame was the way to go. It has grease fittings and they are easy to get to. Quite simple to work on and parts are easy for me to get since I will not be using a dealer for repairs after warranty. I would not put this machine in the PRO line up, but with the 20HP Kohler and the build of the rest of the machine I do see why a LOT of the small lawn guys in my area are running this machine everyday in their business.

Be sure to take all the units you look at for a test drive. That is what helped the most for my wife.

Oh, she said I could buy a new string trimmer so I would have something to do while she cuts the grass.

Matt Meiser
06-07-2006, 8:47 AM
Definitely consider service. Big box stores aren't going to service it for you or have much in the way of parts. If you are buying from an established local dealer, they'll have or be able to get what you need. Even if you buy a brand that has local dealers from a big box store, you probably aren't going to get the same level of service from the dealer when you need service.

Also, at least with John Deere, the big box stuff is no where near the quality (or price) as what the dealers sell. Neither my John Deere dealer or the John Deere dealer where my boss bought his tractor even sell the line that HD and Lowes sells, even though they are allowed to.

Using my boss as an example--he bought a big box store lawn tractor which lasted about 4 years before he had to start doing regular repairs. He's on his 4th season with the John Deere and it still looks like new and all he's had to do was the yearly service.

Jim Becker
06-07-2006, 9:37 AM
Matt's advise is good...go to a tractor/lawn dealer for something like this and stick to name-brands. Service is important since the intention is for the ZTR to last for many, many, many more years than a typical "garden tractor". JD, Kubota, Dixie, etc., are all good choices to look at. And I personally prefer diesel for any kind of gear like this...the engines run "forever" with proper care.

Eddie Watkins
06-07-2006, 9:54 AM
You didn't say how much you were mowing or what. One advantage of the "commercial" mowers is the speed they will mow at. I can mow at about 8mph. I can mow 5 acres in about 3 hours. I have a Grasshopper 721D which has a 21hp Kubota engine and a 54" deck. I use about 4 gallons of diesel to mow 5 acres. My brother has the same mower with a 25hp Kawasaki gas engine and it takes him about 10 gallons to mow the same amount. As a non-pro, I doubt that I could have bought a new diesel and made the fuel savings pay but I bought my mower used in 2000 at less than half the cost of a new one including some repairs and it has worked well. One problem with buying used commercial mowers is that they have probably been used by pros meaning abused. I had to replace the mower deck for about $1800 but I knew that going in. The mower has been great. I hate having to grease it every second mowing or so but that is one of the prices of longevity. Grease zerks just never seem to work easily.
Eddie

Eddie

Jeff Kerr
06-07-2006, 10:21 AM
FWIW I have the same size lawn and went with a Bunton commercial ZTR with a Kawasaki motor and 60 inch deck. Does a fantastic job and I no longer needed the push mower to do the trim mowing.

Service is a huge issue. Bying something from a big box store is great on price but if you need service you have to go somewhere else.

I ended up going with a local dealer and get great service. While the price tag is high at first, it honestly is the last mower I will probably ever need. In speaking to the mechanic as to how long a pro keeps one of these until they trade in for a new one I will never need a new mower. These are built to mow 8 hours a day 7 days a week. So over time the cost of this will be very low.

Ken Garlock
06-07-2006, 10:56 AM
Dave, take a look at the SCAG ZTR (http://www.scag.com/zeroturns.html)mowers. They only make professional equipment, and I can say from experience with my Tiger Cub that they are built like the old brick outhouse.:) But, with quality comes price, expect to pay anywhere from $7000 up to $12000 depending the the model.

Made in Wisconsin.:cool:

Dave Lehnert
06-08-2006, 12:37 AM
Thanks guys.

Dealer support is a big factor for me also. I have a 15 year old mower now and can go to the dealer and most parts are in stock or a day away.

Michael Gabbay
06-08-2006, 7:52 PM
Dave - I just got the Ariens MiniZoom 1534 with the Kohler engine. I only have 2/3 of an acre and was able to cut down my mowing time from 1 1/2 to 2 hours to 50 minutes including edging/trimming and cleaning the mower. I've heard good things about Toro, Hustler, Ariens, Gravley, etc. If you get commercial grade you really can't go wrong. Most of the commercial manufacturers make a residential line that is basically commercial with slightly smaller engines or decks.

Definately go to a dealer. Mine offers free pick up and delivery when I get service over the winter. The borgs generally leave you on your own for service.

Mike

Joe Mioux
06-09-2006, 9:55 PM
Dave, take a look at the SCAG ZTR (http://www.scag.com/zeroturns.html)mowers. They only make professional equipment, and I can say from experience with my Tiger Cub that they are built like the old brick outhouse.:) But, with quality comes price, expect to pay anywhere from $7000 up to $12000 depending the the model.

Made in Wisconsin.:cool:

Ditto Ken's comment! I have a Scag Cub, 48 inch deck, 19 hp Kaw gas engine. This thing is built tough! I bought this end of July 03. Up until last year it cut 3 acres. Now it cuts half of that.

Jim Bell
06-09-2006, 10:10 PM
I have an acre that in summer needs cutting every 4-7 days. I bought a HD orange mower that quit on me after 7 yrs. I paid $2000.00 new and ran pretty much trouble free. Last yr chassis parts and steering began giving up. It ran fine just no steering. Gave it to my BIL who loves to tinker. I replaced it w a Kubota 48" 3 blade deck. The engine [Kawasaki]is a gas 18 HP V- twin. It actually has springs and shock absorbers on the rear for my tired old body. I mow my property in about 40 min. The cost was just over $3500.00. I occasionally pull a 5'x10' trailer loaded w/ up to 1000 lbs of "stuff" with no problem. I am careful to balance the load forward of center to keep me and the mower attached to the ground.:eek: I like the ability to tow things. I am always amazed what that little tractor can do. I really can't say for sure about 6 acres. If it were me I might be looking to a Dixie Chopper. For what they cost though a 4wd kubota that is very flexible in terms of different capabilities would be hard to beat. What I find to be great is having so many choices of good machines to choose from. Imagine living in a country where a Yugo is considered a fine automobile. A good mower there is probably a goat!:D
Jim

Christopher Stahl
06-09-2006, 11:08 PM
I have an eXmark Lazer Z HP 23hp Kawasaki with a 52" deck. I use this to mow about .85 acres which, needless to say, doesn't take me very long.

When it comes to ZTR mowers, it's probably best to spend the extra money and get a commercial grade model that will last. Check what your local lawn care professionals use and this will give you an idea what's popular in your area. Here it's eXmark, others might be Scag and so on. Then go to the dealer and get a demo model. If they don't bring one to your home to try, then find a dealer who will. Any respectable dealer will let you try a commercial grade ZTR before purchasing.

Good thing about these dealers is the maintanance. They will pick it up during the off season and take care of everything for me.

Like others said, a commercial model will start at $7000 and up.

Dave Lehnert
06-10-2006, 12:12 AM
Ditto Ken's comment! I have a Scag Cub, 48 inch deck, 19 hp Kaw gas engine. This thing is built tough! I bought this end of July 03. Up until last year it cut 3 acres. Now it cuts half of that.

Joe!

I was looking at a Scag Cub mower but on lawn site.com there is a post with people saying there is a problem with the belts breaking on the 48" models. How many hours do you have on yours and had any belt problems. problems seem to happen arouns 100 to 200 hrs.

Ernie Nyvall
06-10-2006, 8:47 AM
Dave, most of the non commercial units will give a recommended acreage... usually from one to two so if you are mowing two acres, you are stretching it's limit unless you mow it over a 3 or 4 day period. I went through 3 of these mowers so when I added 2.5 more acres, I went to the ZTR eXmark LazerZ... somewhere around 6 grand. I mow it in three hours and it takes about 3.5 gallons of gasoline. That's less fuel than my other mowers did the 2.5 acres. Too the dealer/repair shop is 2 miles from my house. The commercial unit shops that I ran into will bring a mower out for a test drive... they keep one one hand just for this. One warning though... If you have one come out, have your checkbook ready, because once you've been on one, there's no going back.

Ernie