Real Small Shop advice

[John Stankus]

I will be moving to San Antonio to take a university Teaching position. After looking at some houses down there, I realized that I may have to downsize my shop (at the least the space it will fit in). Right now I have one bay in a three car garage, potentially in S.A. I will have a 6x12 space off a two car garage. And suggestions on where to get Ideas of how to fit it all in? I was looking in the bookstore at Taunton's/FW Small Woodworking shops, but they showed a 26 x 60 ft (or thereabouts) building as one of their "small shops" are there any books on "real" small shops?

Regards

John
stankus@ix.netcom.com

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

6*12 space? Take up hand carving or park the cars in the driveway and take over the garage.

When I was much younger I has an alleyway shop just large enough for one bench and one TS and me in between. Everything else was hand tools or hand held powertools.
I don't think I'd do that again.

What do you teach?

[John Branam]

John I have that book it does have some real small shops in it. I found it helpful.

[glenn bradley]

This book has some good ideas in it, some not so good:

http://www.woodsmithstore.com/8010286.html

This is a cool look at what can be done in a one-car space. I know your looking at less but this is a COOL 360 degree tour:

http://www.woodmagazine.com/wood/story.jhtml?storyid=/templatedata/wood/story/data/463.xml&categoryid=/templatedata/wood/category/data/Wood_Magazine_Shop_Tours.xml&page=7

[Burt Waddell]

I had one shop that was only 8 x 12 so I can understand what you are going thru. I moved into that from a nice big basement shop.

If I had to do that again today, I'd take an awfully hard look at the EZ Smart stuff. The basic table is only 2' x 4' but it is the work center for the entire system. There is a new routing center on the way that will work with the smart table. It will be nice (I'm doing final testing before turning it over to Dino for production). With the EZ Smart setup, you could literally build an entitre kitchen in your 6' x 12' shop.

When you have a few minutes, go to www.eurekazone.com (http://www.eurekazone.com) and take a look at the photo gallery and Dino's gallery which is located inside the regular photo gallery. It will give you an idea of some of the capabilities of the system.

Burt

[Art Mulder]

Please excuse my ignorance, but in a warm climate like Texas (that is to say, no snow) just how prevalent is the use of garages?

My brother used to live on Vancouver island, in BC, and there is virtually no snow in that mild climate. He only had a one-car garage, but that was fine, because the truck always stayed on the driveway, and he had the whole garage for his shop.

So, I would have thought the same thing about texas: leave the cars on the driveway, and hey, presto, a 2 car garage shop.

what am I missing?

...art (who has never, ever, been to Texas.)

[John Huber]

John,

I have lived in Austin, TX, just 90 miles north of San Antonio, for 20 years. Nearly everybody parks their cars in the driveway and uses the garage for other stuff, like bikes, mowers, etc. Check your neighborhood and see what everyone else does.

If you are up to changing some tools, consider the Bosch 4000-10 with the folding stand. In one storage mode, it tilts up like a two-wheel cart (the one that movers use). That's how I store mine in my apartment, where my "shop" is a patio about 8' x 12'.

Welcome to Texas!

[Christian Aufreiter]

Hi John,

welcome to the Creek.
Please give us a few more details on your current and future shop.
Which tools do you own and would you like to keep? I’m not asking for a detailed inventory description that lists every single nail.;) Just basic information, especially about larger stuff.
You mention that you will have a 6x12 space off a two car garage. Does this mean that you actually have to work at 6 x 12? Or can you “expand” your shop during projects?

Christian

[Corey Hallagan]

John my shop is very small, basically the front portion of a one car garage. About 12" wide and 8 foot deep. You can see how I layed out my shop on my webpage. Use as much of the wall space as you can, put as much on wheels as you can. Make your workbenchs up off the foor along the walls and store machinery and tools underneath. Put your cabinets on the walls where you can. Hope this helps.
Corey

[Art Davis]

John,

First, please tell me what is wrong? I thought EVERYTHING was big in Texas?

I am interested in what you teach? I just retired (about two years ago) from a teaching position at San Jose State University in Electrical Engineering. Just wondered how your teaching fits in with woodworking---if at all.

My solution was in the retirement process: I now have a renovated 16x40 rv garage that I wired for ac, added lights and heating to, insulated, and added workbenches and pegboards to. I guess the moral of the story is to just retire and cut out the intervening years!

On a more serious note, thought, I did ww for a number of years in my garage and found that mobile bases really helped.

Good luck!

[Greg Koch]

Check out Glen's flip stand...cool even is a "not so small" shop!

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showpost.php?p=356186&postcount=1

[John Bailey]

Check out Bob Nole's threads about his shop. It's small, but not as small as yours. He's got the best set up small shop I've seen. Of course, that's only my humble opinion.

John

[Jim O'Dell]

I'm another voice for making everything mobile. When you have a project, park the cars in the drive and do your work. On a long weekend, put enough up to get the LOYL's car inside at night, then get it back out the next morning. If the door to the storage room (that's what a 6 X 12 space attached to the garage is called in Texas:D . That or a utility room:rolleyes: ) is big enough, you can store some of the tools in there during the week. Build a work bench in front of your wife's car, and store tools in front of yours during the week. You could even have a dust collection system piped in and just roll the tool under it and hook up at the ceiling or wall. I'd suggest cutting out semi scale drawings of tool footprint on card stock, and have the garage and storage closet laid out on graph paper, then play around with it. Cheap and easy to do. Jim.

edit. One other thought...make sure all your benches or other structures have the ability to store other tools under them. For instance, a planer (portable type on a stand) could be designed to fit under the extension wing of your table saw for a smaller foot print when storing the tools.

[Frank Pellow]

First of all John, let me welcome you to Saw Mill Creek.

There was a very good article iby Bill Endress in the 2003/2004 Tools and Shops issue of Fine Woodworking (issue 167). His shop is "on wheels" in a two car garage where both cars sometimes have to be in the garage. If I were in your position, I would probably design my shop very much like Bill's.

[Kirk (KC) Constable]

If you haven't already bought something, allow me to suggest you look a bit outside of San Antonio. Both east and west on (east on I-10) and wesr on (Hwy 90) there is a point a few miles (3?) out of town where all of a sudden it's 'country'....and then 10 miles up the road is a 'suburb' that still has the small town 'charm'...but they're growing enough to have ammentites.

KC

[Mike Wilkins]

John, congrats on the teaching position. After getting established in your new office, learning your way around, finding the coffee supply, wander over to the schools' technology department or arts school. I would be willing to bet a $2 dollar bill that a school that large has a well-equiped woodshop with some solid machinery. After introducing yourself to the director of that dept. let him/her know you are a serious maker of sawdust, and that you need some access to machinery. After drawing plans, making your cutlist and selecting some fine hardwoods, use this well equiped shop to cut to length and width, make joints and sand smooth. Then go back home and assemble it all, apply a finish and enjoy your efforts.
Just a thought.

[Chuck Saunders]

Does this house not have a bedroom or living room? These can make good shop space too. Oh, were you married?
Chuck

[Michael Gibbons]

John, In the same book you mentioned there is a article about Matthew Teauge's small shop. If I remember correctly it's about 8X20 or close to it. check it out.


Mike

[Jon Masterson]

I'm a 'professional' joiner here in the UK. I make windows, doors and sometimes cabinetry. My joinery is generally for old buildings which have been 'listed' (means that you can't change them without a lot of hassle - even down to the materials used in some cases - if pine was good enough for the Victorians then we have to use pine when we make replacements)

My workshop is a single car garage with a bit cut out for the washer and dryer and a bit extra at the front. All in All it is a singe car garage. Every tool I have (and I have too many) is on wheels and I have three flip top tools stands for the tools such as sanders , planers, morticers and spindle molder. I have a separate jointer which is on it's own stand. The Miter Saw is as well and the air compressor lives under it. The Bandsaw is on another and has the fine dust extractor under it.

My Table Saw and fixed Router are on the same unit and share extraction, fencing and extensions tables. Needless to say that is on wheels as well. The thing I could not live without is my 'workbench'. It has a tilting top so that I can slide 8 x 4 sheets onto it. It is open frame at the top so I can put jobs on it and uses clamps on the framework. The top is 4ft x 4ft. I can turn it on the spot since it has four turning castors and that means I can get to all four sides in a space about 6 feet square.

I have a 2ft x 4ft flat workboard which is used for assembly. Everything that can is on the walls. Sheet lives in a cage down one side and comes in thru the door at th front and out the back onto the tilting table. Lumber lives on top of the cage.

I don't have enough space and sometimes it drives me crazy but it sure keeps me organisrd and I don't have to pay rent on it :) All in all it works :)

[Jim VanBramer]

Hi John,

I'm going through the same thought process right now, so I've been looking around alot as well. I came across a great article in the April/May 2005 issue of WOOD magazine. They went into someone's shop (one bay of a garage) in Seattle and totally renovated it (and quite inexpensively too). Definitely worth checking out. If you can't get your hands on a copy of it let me know and I can scan the article for you. Good luck!

Jim V

[Bob Noles]

John,

Here is a link to my revised small shop tour that John Bailey mentioned.

http://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=35712

You are welcome to look around and steal any ideas from it that may help you out. :)

Best of luck in the new venture.

[Jim Becker]

1) Mobility: as so many others have already indicated, this is really important in the small shop...not to mention in the larger shop for versatility. You need to be able to reconfigure to fit the project

2)Work surfaces: keep them all at the same height so you can use, say, your router table as outfeed support for another tool and assembly space later on. (Consider building router table functionality into your workbench rather than going with a smaller, more limited solution

3)Tools: sometimes bench-top tools take up MORE space. The drill press is an example of that but is also a tool you may be able to do without in the small shop, depending on your projects. A cabinet that can hold two or three bench-top tools in a flip-top configuration, however, can work well in the small shop...be sure that infeed and outfeed hights are in concert with other work surfaces as in #2

4) Tools: consider new methods, such as one of the guided tool systems. They take up less space and can often do better work than substandard bench-top tools

[John Stankus]

I'll try to answer some of the questions/concerns folks asked in response to my original inquiry.

First I will be teaching chemistry at the University of the Incarnate Word (gotta love those Catholic university names :) ). I am a physical chemist by training (Stanford Ph.D.) and spent the last 13 years off in industrial research, before deciding to go back into the academic world. (better job satisfaction, but significantly lower pay)

We haven't purchased a house in San Antonio yet, but many in our price range only have 2 car garages or no access to yards for a stand alone shop. With the fuel prices, we also want to keep the commute distance down a bit. (I didn't inherit the long-haul commute gene ... my mom used to commute 45 miles each way, my brother does something similar now)
I grew up in Austin and my wife grew up 90 miles west of San Antonio, so we know what the weather is like down there.

My current shop is in the third bay of a three car garage and is packed pretty tight. I need to pull out one of the cars to do much there. One of the cars is a convertible that needs to be stored indoors (read that as the top leaks:D ). The other is my wife's car which I would like for her to be able to store inside. We may not have snow down here but we do get hail (up to softball size :eek: )
In my current shop most things are on wheels now.
Left tilt cabinet saw with the long rails
8" jointer
Drill press
14" closed base band saw
1100 cfm dust collector
router table
2 huge workbenches (these will probably have to go)
bunch of smaller tools
mini-lathe
lunchbox planer
dovetail jig
mortise/tenon jig
plus stuff from my autocrossing (racing in parking lots)
Air compressor
two sets of wheels and tires
and other assorted flotsam and jetsam

Some of the houses we have seen have an approximately (forgot to bring a tape measure) 6x12 side storage space off the garage. So I was looking for ideas on how to utilize this amount of space, even if it means pulling out a car to work. Though it would be nice to not have to reconfigure everything to get out into the shop. Currently it takes about 20 minutes to setup shop and 20 minutes to knock it down.

Thanks for the help

John

John Stankus, Ph.D.
stankus@ix.netcom.com

p.s. Thanks to all who welcomed me to sawmillcreek, but I have been a member for about 3 years. I was on Badger Pond originally and then mostly on woodcentral, but have been spending more and more time here.

[Jim Becker]

John, congratulations on your new appointment! I hope your students appreciate your "woodworking pain" in moving down to help them learn! :D (Dr. SWMBO is about to move into academia at Drexel School of Public Heath, so I can appreciate the excitement of a new position)

Hopefully, you can keep your cabinet saw nestled in the garage somehow, even if you make the potential 6" x 12" cubby your official shop. And making any of your work surfaces do double duty will help out a lot.