RO/Palm sanders...the real skinny?

[Mark Rios]

Can someone give a non-judgemental, quantifiable expalnation (if one exists) on why Festool sanders may be better than other sanders of the same type?

OTHER THAN dust collection, does a Festool sander actually sand better? Does it make the material smoother than another sander with the same grit?

If there are answers, please make them physical, tangible, and quantifiable (as opposed to emotional) so that we can avoid opinion/feelings wars. :D

I notice that alot of the posts that mention Festool sanders often refer to the round pad sanders, i.e. 150, 125, etc. I have a round pad sander and a 1/4 sheet sander. I find that I use the 1/4 sheet more. I don't have to hand sand in the corners and the paper seems to be cheaper than buying premade discs. However, my round pad sander is also taller and therefore it seems that it requires a little more attention to keep flat, thereby causing me to simply like the feel of sanding with the 1/4 sheet better.

My 1/4 sheet sander is getting a little tired. It has seen considrable use and it has served me well but I'm starting to look at replacing it. I was literally raised in a body shop and wearing dust masks and respirators is second nature to me so dust collection, from sanding, isn't a real issue for me.

So...... why/how would one look at and compare the Festool brand of sanders to another quality sander?

[Jim DeLaney]

I upgraded from a PC 333 to the Festool ES125 ROS a few years ago. Nearly no comparison between the two.

The Festool seems more aggressive (subjective opinion). The Festool has way better dust collection, and most importantly to me, way less vibration. I found that I could sand about twice as long, without arm/wrist fatigue, with the Festool than with the PC.

A couple months ago, I was able to try out a Festool Rotax sander at WoodWerks in Columbus. Very impressive! I'm saving my pennies toward that, now...

[Steve Clardy]

Festoo 150/3
Almost no noticable vibration. Very easy on these old hands, arms.
Very different animal compared to my PC, Makita ROS sanders.

[Jamie Buxton]

Palm sanders are usually orbital, but not random-orbit. Sanders with round sandpaper are usually random-orbit. The benefit of the randomness is that you're less likely to see random scratches. The benefit of rectangular sanders is that you can get into corners where a round one won't fit. Me, I use a random-orbit for most stuff, and a palm sander occasionally for corners.

As to the pros and cons of Festool, I think I'll stay out of that one.:)

[Ian Barley]

I have a 150/5 ad a Metabo SXE450 (sold in the US with Ridgid colours). They both do a very similar job in a very similar amount of time. The Festool just feels like it is doing a better job quicker because it is Soooooo much more pleasant to use. I barely use the Metabo, not because it is worse, but because it seems worse. If you spend a big chunk of any day sanding then get a Festool 'cos it makes life more pleasant.

[Jim Becker]

Aside from the excellent dust collection, it was the nearly total lack of vibration that sold me on Festool sanders. When I was using the PC333 sanders, I had to stop using them after a very short period of time due to numbness in my hand. With the Festool sanders, I can work for hours with no tingling or numbness.

[Keith Barkhau]

As with the others, I was sold on the dust collection (which I know you're aware of) and the lack of vibration. I have previously used the pc333 and the Metabo 450 and have swapped both of them for the Festool 125 and Rotex. In both cases there is to me a *noticable* improvement in the amount of vibration, especially between the Metabo and the Rotex. Can I quantify this. Nope. Don't have the tools, don't have the time.

Why the difference--I can offer two suggestions. One possibility is better machining, tighter tolerances and more controlled assembly yielding a better balanced sander. Possibility two, since I paid twice (or more) as much for the Festool I am unconsciously justifying this purchase by convincing myself its superior through the well known psychological principal of cognitive dissonance reduction.

Either way, my hands feel better after a couple of hours of sanding. As far as the actual sanded surface, I don't think it actually creates a smoother surface, but does make the process less painful/unpleasant for me.

[Dave Falkenstein]

If there are answers, please make them physical, tangible, and quantifiable...

My prior experience with ROS was using PC and Dewalt 5" ROS for a lot of years. I now own the old sanders, which I NEVER use, and a Festool ETS150/3, a Rotex 150 and a DS400 detail sander. Based on my home shop experience:

Festool sanders do a far better job of dust control. Festool sanders are smoother operating with very little vibration. Sandpaper lasts noticeably longer using the Festool sanders. The sanding seems to go a lot faster, and I feel I get better results at a lower grit.

Is that answer physical, tangible and/or quantifiable? Got me, but it sure makes a lot of sense to me to use Festool sanders.

[Mark Rios]

Well, that's kinda what I was looking for, thanks very much.

So there's not really difference in sanding but 6 out of 7 of you (so far) responded with the "less vibration" theme. Hmmm....very interesting. I can relate to the vibrations thing even though that's all I've known; after a while of sanding the hands start to hurt.

I'll assume that the Festool tools/machines are going to last longer (i.e. bearings, races, motors, etc) due to being made to higher quality standards.(?) Any comments?

My round pad sander is fairly new but my 1/4 sheet sander is at least 7 years old. I've replaced the platen/sanding pad once, about 3 months ago, and the bag on the back can't hold any more duct tape and the dust spews out the back through numerous holes in the fabric.:D It seems to sand just fine and produces results that are expected with no suprises or questions. But I don't know how much longer the bearings will last. The switch is showing signs of having a little dust inside. It tends to turn off and on with varying levels of force on the switch.:D

I look forward to reading more replies.

[Lee DeRaud]

...like anybody expected anything else from me...:p


So there's not really difference in sanding but 6 out of 7 of you (so far) responded with the "less vibration" theme. Hmmm....very interesting. I can relate to the vibrations thing even though that's all I've known; after a while of sanding the hands start to hurt.Just seems like you can buy a lot of padded gloves for the price difference of a Festool sander.

With the Festool sanders, I can work for hours with no tingling or numbness.See above, but I'll admit I don't do (and don't want to do) the kinds of projects that require hours of sanding.

I'll assume that the Festool tools/machines are going to last longer (i.e. bearings, races, motors, etc) due to being made to higher quality standards.(?) Any comments?Again, file that under "things that matter to a pro". Does it really matter in a home/hobby environment if a $100 sander needs replacing every couple of years? I know all the arguments for "buy the best you can afford", but a ROS doesn't quite fall into the category of "heirloom tool".

The Festool sander is probably worth every nickel they're charging for it, if that's what you need to get the job done. If you don't, there's a lot of other things that can be done with that money.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I think the PC and the FesterTool are about on a par with the FesterTool having a slightly better DC on board.


It is error to simply assume that FesterTool prices so high just because they are so much better than everything else. While it is true that FesterTool makes excellent tools the same can be said of PC and Bosch and a couple others. It's simply true that in Germany (all Europe actually) the cost of having an employee in a industrial manufacturing setting is very , very, very expensive. They get paid very well, get a month or more off a year, have 100% medical & dental & Optometric coverage, get transportatin allowances, and all manner of other bennies including stunningly good unemployment insurance. The aggregate effect of all the costs hidden and otherwise is substantially higher end product prices.

So, one of the things you are paying for when you buy European is the lifestyle of the laborer's utopia.

That said one of the things they must do to compete is make good products. After all they have high cost built in comming out of the gate and for no good reason. ERGO they gotta put value in or they are going to be unable to compete.

So will you hate yourself for paying the huge premium of a FesterTool? No, you will like the tool I guarantee it. However, you could have a PC sander that will perform about as well and have enough money left over to do something else. Maybe not enough to go Paraguay for a month and go Deep Sea Fishing but you get my drift.

Another consideration is how it'll feel to drop the sander in a way that breaks it, it gets lost, or stolen. The purchase price may influence how big a blue streak you curse.

[Mark Rios]

Another consideration is how it'll feel to drop the sander in a way that breaks it, it gets lost, or stolen. The purchase price may influence how big a blue streak you curse.


Yeah, that's something I've thought about as well. I've watched my 1/4 sheet sander bounce off the floor a couple of times. Fortunately, It hasn't landed on the platen thereby bending it but I wince really, really hard. It's still sanding flat though.

I've just finished a cabinet job across the street from where I live and when I had to take my sander over there for some touch up I thought about having to drag a DC vac along as well. I don't think I'd really like it. I'm very careful with my tools (I never loan them) and I try to take very good care of them but things happen and I think that I would rather replace an $80 sander than a $250 plus sander.

I'm just not seeing an advantage for me right now, other than the vibration issue (still mulling that one over), to justify the expense.

Hmmmmmm............

[Jim Becker]

Lee, I was using the gel-filled gloves with the PC sanders but still had problems with numbing and tingling after only about a half-hour of work. I don't need the gloves with the Festool even after a couple hours of sanding...my armoire project was a good example of that.

[Ian Barley]

I think the PC and the Festool are about on a par with the Festool having a slightly better DC on board.


It is error to simply assume that Festool prices so high just because they are so much better than everything else. While it is true that Festool makes excellent tools the same can be said of PC and Bosch and a couple others. It's simply true that in Germany (all Europe actually) the cost of having an employee in a industrial manufacturing setting is very , very, very expensive. They get paid very well, get a month or more off a year, have 100% medical & dental & Optometric coverage, get transportatin allowances, and all manner of other bennies including stunningly good unemployment insurance. The aggregate effect of all the costs hidden and otherwise is substantially higher end product prices.

So, one of the things you are paying for when you buy European is the lifestyle of the laborer's utopia.


Cliff - your summary of the position is about as accurate as my teenage assumption that all Americans looked like Rock Hudson, were married to Doris Day and had 2 swimming pools in their back gardens. Yes the political systems are different but intrinsic differences in cost base have as much to do with the differential cost of real estate as with any of the factors that you propound.

Most European societies do have a social medical policy, Some national some regional. I get full medical cover as part of my tax package. I get 20% of dental covered - I pay the other 80%. I get no cover for opticians - if I need specs I pay for the specs and the tests. This is not the case for kids but everybody else pays. I know of nobody, in my 30 years of working, who gets a "transportation allowance" beyond a low interest loan for a train season ticket. If I am unemployed I get the equivalent of about $60/week as part of social security benefits. There are lots of factors at play in pricing between relative economies. I have no intention of stirring a political debate but neither does a one sided rhetorical outburst seem to fit in the sprit of this forum or the content of this thread.

[Ian Barley]

Yeah, that's something I've thought about as well. I've watched my 1/4 sheet sander bounce off the floor a couple of times. Fortunately, It hasn't landed on the platen thereby bending it but I wince really, really hard. It's still sanding flat though.

I've just finished a cabinet job across the street from where I live and when I had to take my sander over there for some touch up I thought about having to drag a DC vac along as well. I don't think I'd really like it. I'm very careful with my tools (I never loan them) and I try to take very good care of them but things happen and I think that I would rather replace an $80 sander than a $250 plus sander.

I'm just not seeing an advantage for me right now, other than the vibration issue (still mulling that one over), to justify the expense.

Hmmmmmm............

I have dropped my 150/5 lots of times (way too often for my nerves). 3-4ft drop onto concrete. Bounces every time. Not recommending it but not losing sleep over it either.

My honest summary. If you spen more than 10 hours in a week or 2 hours in any one day sanding then the vibration clinches it. If not then you have to be a keen hobbyist with a desire for comfort to make the cost worthwhile.

[Jamie Buxton]

I've just finished a cabinet job across the street from where I live and when I had to take my sander over there for some touch up I thought about having to drag a DC vac along as well. I don't think I'd really like it.

Boy, working in somebody else's home is a terrific reason to hook your sander to a vacuum -- and carry the darn thing along. If I make messes in my own shop, nobody cares. But if I make messes in somebody else's home, they really, really, really care. You can build beautiful cabinets, but if you leave a film of dust on the kitchen counters, your name is mud. When I finally got around to plumbing my sanders to a vacuum, homeowners were the big reason. I can sand for hours without offending anybody.

[Vaughn McMillan]

I haven't used the Festool sanders, so I can't answer your questions about that. However, I repeatedly see complaints about the vibration from the PC 333, and wanted to mention that not all non-Festool RO sanders vibrate to the point of pain. I have a little 5" Ryobi ROS that I paid about $50 for, and I have used it for 3 to 4 hours at a stretch without being bothered by the vibration. (I also have several 1/3 and 1/4 sheet sanders that do cause vibration pain, so I know it's the sander, not me.) Hooked up to my shop vac, the Ryobi leaves virtually no dust, and although it's not quite as agressive as my 6" Ridgid ROS, it does an excellent job.

Similar to Lee's comments, I can buy and replace several $50 Ryobi sanders for the cost of a single Festool. Mine has been used pretty hard for the past year, dropped a number of times (on carpeted floors, though), and is showing no signs of slowing down.

Just another viewpoint -

- Vaughn

[Chris Barton]

OK, color me a pragmatist but, at some point it becomes an equation of economics. I got my smaller PC as a give away with a down draft sanding table. It's dust controll is magnificent, I actually save the dust to fill voids. But, it's like a car at some point. My wife drives a MB320 but, a Chevy will get you to the same place, It is all about the experience of the trip. For me, the plain vanilla PC is fine for me but, I know that some need the upscale experience...

[Steve Clardy]

OK, color me a pragmatist but, at some point it becomes an equation of economics. I got my smaller PC as a give away with a down draft sanding table. It's dust controll is magnificent, I actually save the dust to fill voids. But, it's like a car at some point. My wife drives a MB320 but, a Chevy will get you to the same place, It is all about the experience of the trip. For me, the plain vanilla PC is fine for me but, I know that some need the upscale experience...

Sure. Point taken.
But when you are on a sander almost everyday like me, 1-2 hours at a time, or less, or more, the vibration really shows up in our elbows, hands.
So the comfort factor means a lot to me.
I was in my second head-on accident in 1993 [not my fault] and I got some bum knees and elbows out of the deal from bending the dash with my knees [1965 ford truck] and folding the steering wheel over to the dash, trying to hold myself from hitting the steering wheel.

So the vibration in those $65.00 or so sanders really bothers me.
You young whipper snappers can probably handle the vibration

[Frank Chaffee]

Sure. Point taken.
But when you are on a sander almost everyday like me, 1-2 hours at a time, or less, or more, the vibration really shows up in our elbows, hands.
So the vibration in those $65.00 or so sanders really bothers me.
You young whipper snappers can probably handle the vibration
With ya there cowboy, but ten or twenty minutes on a vibrator does me in these days.
Regards,
(Festool) Frank

[Steve Clardy]

With ya there cowboy, but ten or twenty minutes on a vibrator does me in these days.
Regards,
(Festool) Frank



:D :D :D:D :D

[Lee DeRaud]

With ya there cowboy, but ten or twenty minutes on a vibrator does me in these days.
Regards,
(Festool) Frank:D :D :D:D :DYou misspelled ":eek: :eek: :eek::eek: :eek:"

[Steve Clardy]

You misspelled " :eek::eek: :eek:"

And I thought I only caught that:rolleyes: ;) :D

And I just asked Frank yesterday if He had screwed anything up lately.:eek: :rolleyes: :D ;)

[Norman Hitt]

As a side note, I have Carpal Tunnel Syndrome in both wrists, and ANY Vibration really agitates those problems, no matter what kind of machine is doing the vibration.:o It is also my understanding that continued vibration for any length of time on a repetitive basis can and will cause the Carpal Tunnel Syndrome to develop (in those that have the genetic makeup or tendency toward that problem). In short, buying machines, (whether Sanders or other types), with the least vibration could be considered a health preventative measure, just like wearing a High Quality Dust Mask, or Safety Glasses. Believe me when I say that if you DON'T Have any Carpal Tunnel Problems, you Sure don't want to do anything that will develop them as they are painful, and really limit many of your activities.

Note: I do not own any FesTool equipment, Buuuut........as it stands today, I'm saving my coins for one or more of their sanders, (unless some other brand develops a tool in the meantime with less vibration), and it certainly won't have anything to do with "Brand Ego".:rolleyes:

Note 2: I do believe that one of the design functions of the Festool sanders is noteworthy above the others, and that is the fact that air is channeled through the center hole and then passes outward between the pad and the workpiece and is then picked up by the vacuum holes, keeping the sanding dust and loose grit cleared away and also keeping it from packing up on the sandpaper which makes the sandpaper more effecient and also last longer.

As with all tools, everyone has their own items of importance, and also their own budget, and you just have find the one that fits your situation best. I don't think that most of us actually give anywhere near enough consideration to the selection of sanders, especially considering that on many projects those machines are operated at least three or four times as long as all the other tools together that were used to make the project.

just my dollar/two ninety eight:D

[Joe Unni]

Mark,

I was in a similar situation not long ago. After much soul searching I just could not justify the cost of the festool stuff. Though I do this for a living, the added cost didn't fit into my budget. I ended up with the 6" Rigid and connected it to an existing Rigid vacuum. I could not be happier! I had the PC333 for some years. Sanding was, well sanding and dust control was ok even though it was connected to the same vac. Apples and oranges (no pun intended :D ) with the Rigid. A lot less vibration - at least compared to the PC and dust control is FANTASTIC! I bought a 4 pack of each grit of the 6" discs and I'm still using them. Agressiveness? I just used the wide orbit setting for the first time the other day and I couldn't believe it - sanding time was cut in half.

Though I believe in buying the best tool for the job. In this case, save your money and put what you would have spent towards another tool.

That's my 2 cents.

Good luck,
-joe

[Chris Barton]

Sure. Point taken.
But when you are on a sander almost everyday like me, 1-2 hours at a time, or less, or more, the vibration really shows up in our elbows, hands.
So the comfort factor means a lot to me.
I was in my second head-on accident in 1993 [not my fault] and I got some bum knees and elbows out of the deal from bending the dash with my knees [1965 ford truck] and folding the steering wheel over to the dash, trying to hold myself from hitting the steering wheel.

So the vibration in those $65.00 or so sanders really bothers me.
You young whipper snappers can probably handle the vibration

I would agree that the expectation should match the selection. However, comparing a $65 PC to a $200 festool is not a fair compairson. I would put my large PC up against the efficiency of the festool, and at a similar price...

[Steve Clardy]

I would agree that the expectation should match the selection. However, comparing a $65 PC to a $200 festool is not a fair compairson. I would put my large PC up against the efficiency of the festool, and at a similar price...

Hi Chris. I'm not really comparing, or wasn't I don't think.
A 200.+ sander is off the comparsions charts of a $65.+ one I think.
Kinda like a bicycle and a car. A bicycle will get you there, but at a lot more effort.

[Mark Rios]

Boy, working in somebody else's home is a terrific reason to hook your sander to a vacuum -- and carry the darn thing along. If I make messes in my own shop, nobody cares. But if I make messes in somebody else's home, they really, really, really care. You can build beautiful cabinets, but if you leave a film of dust on the kitchen counters, your name is mud. When I finally got around to plumbing my sanders to a vacuum, homeowners were the big reason. I can sand for hours without offending anybody.


You're right Jamie and I agree and do take necessary precautions when in someone elses home. However, in this case, this is a COMPLETE remodel of a spec home. No one is living there. No countertops or flooring yet.

[Allen Bookout]

Mark,

I was in a similar situation not long ago. After much soul searching I just could not justify the cost of the festool stuff. Though I do this for a living, the added cost didn't fit into my budget. I ended up with the 6" Rigid and connected it to an existing Rigid vacuum. I could not be happier! I had the PC333 for some years. Sanding was, well sanding and dust control was ok even though it was connected to the same vac. Apples and oranges (no pun intended :D ) with the Rigid. A lot less vibration - at least compared to the PC and dust control is FANTASTIC! I bought a 4 pack of each grit of the 6" discs and I'm still using them. Agressiveness? I just used the wide orbit setting for the first time the other day and I couldn't believe it - sanding time was cut in half.

Though I believe in buying the best tool for the job. In this case, save your money and put what you would have spent towards another tool.

That's my 2 cents.

Good luck,
-joe
Thanks Joe!!

I was just going down to get a Ridgid 6" ROS and started reading this thread. I began to change my mind but the money that I was going to have to pay for the Festool was starting to bother me so I was glad to see your post. I am going with the Ridgid and use it untill the vibration starts to bother me, if it ever does. Not so much to loose that way.

Allen

[Andrew Alexander]

This opinion is strictly from a hobbyist point of view. I try to keep sanding to a minimum with various planes and scrapers…but sanding is inevitable…I’m just glad I don’t have to do it daily like some of you pros. With that said I recently began doing the dust control thing in my small shop. This included upgrading to sanders that have dust control capability. My big splurge was the Fein Mini Turbo (the model being discontinued) $139 at Woodcraft.
<O:p</O:p
Also after reading a number of threads about both ¼” and ROS I elected to purchase Rigid models (non-Metabo). Both of them are made in China but that really does not bother me they seem well built. The deal sealer for me was the lifetime warranty I got with both tools. Now I would love to spring for the Festool lineup but honestly for the hobbyist that I am I could not see forking out $500 to $750 buckaroos. So far my outlay for the vacuum and two (2) sanders is less than $250. It is certainly too early to tell about the long-term durability but the dust collection is quite effective.
<O:p
BTW…when I purchased the Rigid models it was advertised with a three (3) year warranty which ain’t bad and I was OK with that…. but inside the storage box was some paperwork for the lifetime deal…no catches, no extra bucks…now that really made the deal sweet for me.

[David Klug]

I guess I'm just one lucky sonofagun because I just fininshed 3 hrs. of sanding with my PC 333 and I feel just fine. I've read these complaints before and so I was really thinking about it and I didn't feel any unusual vibration while I was sanding.

DK

[Per Swenson]

Flat, Thats right,Flat.

I will take dust I will take vibration.

The fact that festool offers flat with out dust and vibe is a bonus.

I cannot put 2000 grit paper in my drum sander.

I have 4000 grit loaded on the rotex 150 right now.

I do large on site installs where air is not possible.

Want a flat (as in glass mirror finish) only festool.

Worth every nickle.

Per

[John Miliunas]

OK, please don't take this to sound like a "paid advertisement" for Festool but, I figured it was time to chime in. I guess I'm a bit biased, as I own 4 Festool sanders, with the 150/5 being my main "go-to" unit. Granted, I bought them when my finances were in a bit better shape but, having used them, I would now wait until I had enough money to buy another one, if the need arose! :)

As for the "why": I've owned several other ROS units and still have a Bosch VS unit. I also suffer with some very extreme arthritis in my thumb, so the vibration issue does come to surface with me. I think we've already established that vibration from a Fes unit is not an issue! But, besides that, there are a couple points, which I don't feel have been addressed and are further justifications to the expense of a Festool piece of equipment. Yes, the dust collection is awesome, but so are some of the other brands. However, the way the Festool accomplishes it is unique and offers yet another advantage. Besides the holes around the perimeter of the paper, there is an additional one in the center. In operation, air is actually pushed out of that hole, and sucked in through the ones on the outside. The advantage of this is, while it's pushing the air, it's also carrying additional sawdust to the "intake" holes. Ultimately, this also translates to paper which cuts more efficiently and lasts significantly longer! There are times when I literally "force" myself to change paper, because I'm thinking to myself that, "...this stuff just can't be lasting that long." :)

The other point is, I've read far too many posts both, here and through other sources which, when people having trouble with their Brand-X unit will sometimes have an excessively hard time getting proper Customer Service for their unit(s). I can wholeheartedly say, that is NOT the case with Festool!!! Personally, I purchased all of my Fes equipment through Bob Marino and he has always answered any questions I have about the equipment and treated me as though I was his only customer! I had a problem once with one of my 12v charging units. Bob immediately arranged to have a new one shipped out to me, complete with a return pickup tag for the delivery service to ship them back the defective unit! Not many places or OEM's will provide advance exchange for defective pieces! :)

While I'm sure there are a number of formidable OEM's out there with decent sanders, I'm sold on the Festool line, its quality, its representation and its customer support. On top of all that, the Systainers their equipment comes in are equally as well thought out as the machines themselves. IMHO, I believe they are worth the extra investment and, after using one for just a little while, you quickly forget the initial expense! As one of other other esteemed members would say, "That's my .02". :D :cool:

[Keith Barkhau]

Mark,

To Festool or not certainly stirs up a lot of viewpoints. I've offered you mine, as have several others, but since its your money, its your opinon that matters. Considering the price I'd suggest you try one out if that's at all possible. If you happen to be passing through Chicago I'd be more than happy to let you do a little sanding for me :) . But if that's not feasible maybe someone a little closer to home could make the same offer. Or, if you've got a Woodcraft near you could demo one there.

Just another $0.02.

[Allen Bookout]

You guys sure make it difficult to just go out and buy a new sander without wondering if you are doing the right thing or not. Allen

[Vaughn McMillan]

Let me correct that for ya...:)


You guys sure make it difficult to just go out and buy a [insert tool name here] without wondering if you are doing the right thing or not. Allen
- Vaughn

[Allen Bookout]

Well, you are right Vaughn. I was thinking about the Ridgid 6" but, after all of the discussion, I am a little bit worried about letting the cat out of the bag.

Allen

[Ian Barley]

Well, you are right Vaughn. I was thinking about the Ridgid 6" but, after all of the discussion, I am a little bit worried about letting the cat out of the bag.

Allen
Allen

If this is the "Metabo" unit and you have never used Festool you will be very happy. Anybody buying the Ridgid (Metabo) unit will be very happy and will get very good value for money. Probably for most users better value for money than the Festool. But - If you have sensitivity to vibration, if you have to sand for long periods or every day or frequently, if you need to sand in other peoples homes and look like you know what you are doing, then the Festool offerings start to earn their extra cost

[Pete Harbin]

Allen,

Ridgid has a 90 day, no questions asked, return policy through Home Depot, so you could take one for a test drive. Correct me if I'm wrong guys, but I think Festool has something simlar. Woodcraft has been carrying Festool in their stores for a while now, so you could demo them there as well.

For me, the cost and the amount of sanding I do was the main factor for going with Ridgid. I'm not a pro, so I don't do much sanding on a dialy basis, or for extended periods of time on a regular basis. The lifetime service agreement is a nice touch too. I get very little vibration...it doesn't even bother me to think about it, and when hooked up to a vac I get almost zero dust. A little swipe with a tack cloth is all that's needed after sanding. I added a power tool switch (Craftsman, for about $20) so I can run the sander and vac together off the sander's power switch.

I haven't used the Bosch, and it's been a while since I used a DeWalt or PC.

Godd luck bud!

Pete

[Allen Bookout]

Sorry Mark! I did not intend to intend to dominate your thread but I thank you for starting it as it was time for me to do something. I hope that the responses to my questions helped you also.

Thanks guys! Since I do not sand for extended periods and not on a daily basis I think that I will give the Ridgid a shot. Like some of you say, if I haven't tried something better I probably will not know the difference. Thanks for the report on the Ridgid from you guys that have them.

Allen

[Chris Barton]

In a fairly recent review of 1/4 sheet sanders the Ridgid did fine. I suppose the point I am most amazed about in this thread is anyone needing to do hours of sanding with a 1/4 sheet sander on any kind of new cabinetry or furniture. I have the PC340 that only sees 220 and higher grits. I use my 6" round PC for the relatively few occasions where I need to use some 120-220 on a project but, even then my sanding is measured in minutes, not hours. Admitedly, I am a hobbiest not a professional. But, I can't help but wonder how big a project or how rough a collection of raw materials you have to have to need to spend hours using a hand sander.

[Steve Clardy]

Chris. Hours of sanding means you have built a lot of stuff.
Say 6-8 hours building 8-10 boxes, face frames for all, all drawer fronts, and maybe a few doors the same day. Lots of sanding, prep time.
Most of the time I stretch my sanding time out, due to my bum elbows.
Build 3-4 carcasses, face frames. Attach, sand, take to finish room and stain.
While the oil base stain is drying, I start the routine over again. This lessens the long extended time riding a sander.
Before I got this 6" Festool, I would wear out at least two pc333's, or a makita or two.

[Steve Clardy]

Chris. Hours of sanding means you have built a lot of stuff.
Say 6-8 hours building 8-10 boxes, face frames for all, all drawer fronts, and maybe a few doors the same day. Lots of sanding, prep time.
Most of the time I stretch my sanding time out, due to my bum elbows.
Build 3-4 carcasses, face frames. Attach, sand, take to finish room and stain.
While the oil base stain is drying, I start the routine over again. This lessens the long extended time riding a sander.
Before I got this 6" Festool, I would wear out at least two pc333's, or a makita or two.