Jorgenson Clamp Marketing Strategy

[Dave Avery]

Ok, for the admitted few that care to read about the business strategy implications of the latest clamp frenzy........

Some facts.......

Bessey is the market leader in square jaw clamps by a huge margin - they work well and last a long time

There is no price difference between Bessey and Jorgenson

Therefore, there's no reason for happy Bessey customers to try Jorgensons

As such, Jorgenson is having trouble penetrating the square jaw clamp market.

Sooooooooo...... the people in the Jorgenson marketing department decide that a 100 year anniversary 50% off clamp sale is just the way to get the word out. So, they make a limited number of clamps available at the sale price, create a frenzy, get a bunch of people to try the clamps that wouldn't have tried them otherwise, and everyone is happy (or not happy if they didn't get any).

Let's say they're losing $10 per clamp (I don't beleive that this is the case, but let's say they are). If they sold 5000 clamps at a $10 loss, they've incurred $50K in advertising expense. This is a VERY small amount considering the awareness created by the sale.

HERE'S MY PROBLEM WITH THIS. Jorgenson knew that the demand created by the sale would far exceed supply. In fact, I'm sure they planned on it. What they didn't account for was the ill-will created by the limited supply. People are none too happy that they missed out.

I REALLY don't like the tactic. I REALLY LIKE their clamps - and their strategy worked on me - up to a point. I bought some clamps on sale and I like them a lot. But, I dislike the ethical aspects of the strategy enough so that - even though I like the Jorgenson clamps better than the Bessey's - I probably continue to buy Bessey's. A far more effective strategy would have been a 30% off sale with far more clamps available, but hindsight is 20/20.

Anyway, I'm curious, for those who have bothered to read this far, whether I'm alone in this viewpoint or are there are others who share the same perspective. Dave.

[Howard Norman]

I haven't the faintest idea if your theory is correct or not. In fact, I don't care whatt the motives were, I was able to purchase two of each size of clamps on sale at a price that was outstanding. If others were unable to get the clamps-too bad. Everyone had the same chance as far as I am concerned. Amazon has e-mailed that one clamp has been shipped. I will be able to make a decision if I like the calmps after I use them.

Howard

[Jim Becker]

I think that you make a lot of very good points and those about good will are right on. I'm a happy Bessy owner, yet I bought 10 of the J's due to the price alone--and I really did have a need for more 24" clamps. That is unlikely to make me buy more of the J's given the normal partity of price and the fact that I have a dealer who cuts me a break on the B's when I need some. (I have spent a ton of money with them over the years and for my loyalty they are nice to me--and don't carry J)

[Kirk (KC) Constable]

Last time I bought clamps, the Jorgensens were cheaper. Not by much...but cheaper.

If your theory is correct and they deliberately understocked to create a frenzy, then someone at the clamp company oughta be getting a promotion for being a marketing genius. The problem I have with this whole deal is that guys like me that would buy the clamps at the regular price can't get any for who knows how long now because of all the people that are only buying them because they're giving them away.

After using a couple Besseys and a few of the CMs for several months now, I'm still frustrated with the damn head movement on both of them...and the only reason I have any at all is because the deep head is good for gluing up laminations.

KC

[Dave Avery]

KC,

I was similarly frustrated with the head movement issue, but I think I've figured it out. To move the head large distances quickly, back off on the handle all the way, then pull the handle away from the bar as you slide. To tighten, push the handle toward the bar while turning. Dave.


PS - meant to comment a while back - great job on the big conference table.

[Keith Outten]

Dave,

I agree 100% except that there is genius in this particular situation. I think this is a classic snake oil salesman technique as old as the dirt under your feet. This is in fact very cheap advertising but will certainly backfire with a percentage of the people who bought the product and certainly with many who felt left out of the promotion.

I would have given $50,000 worth of clamps away for free, the cost would have been the same but the results would have been significantly different. Every woodworking forum and sales outlet in the country would have loved to get involved with the distribution of the clamps to the winners and it would have served another goal promoting good will with the organizations who sell and promote their products.

[Dave Arbuckle]

I find it hilarious that people are upset because they missed out on a limited availability promotion. I reckon they need to suck it up a little better.

For the record, I've bought no clamps in any recent promotions.

Dave

[Bart Leetch]

I agree with Dave. I have not purchased either Bessy's or Jorg's. I'll stick with a wider assortment of different clamps & more of them & spend the money on wood. Without wood I'd have no use for clamps anyway.

[John Weber]

I agree with Dave, I don't understand all the ill-will. Amazon lower the price, word got out, adn there was a feeding frenzy. Did Sears and Bessey plan the same thing a couple years ago when they cleared out Bessey clamps - I don't think so. Anyway, I ordered 4, hopefully they will come, and they will be my first, so if it was a marketing move, well see how successful it will be. Adjustable Clamp Co. is a small more or less family run business, I think the sale was sincere enough for me. While I'm sorry for those that missed out, it was hinted that other retailers will be able to pass on the same savings (the largest being WoodCraft). So hopefully there will be another opportunity. Some guy on the Oak went off on Tool Crib for being out of stock - oh well...

John

P.S. I did stop at the local Sears and they had them regular price...

[David Rose]

Most sales don't last indefinitely. Even if they had said "we will sell 5000 clamps at 1/2 price", lots of folks would have missed out for timing or other reasons. If they think their clamp is superior to the primary competition, at least they will get some (more) out for folks to try. That could have been part of their motive. In either case, it got them some exposure which was the whole point. I just hope ill will of the program doesn't offset the benefit. If I had needed clamps (I can't believe I said that) and wanted to try the Js, and had the money to spare at the time, I might have joined the frenzy. I see it more as a positive move on their part that did benefit some folks.

David

[Lloyd Robins]

I probably would have tried a few due to the price, but I have switched over to the Gross Stabil clamps, not that the number I buy will change their profit by much.

[Rob Russell]

I talked with the Manager of Adjustable Clamp's Service Department early this week when I had a stuck clamp. I absolutely believe the "wanted to do something nice" as he explained it to me. I do think that they misunderderstood the frenzy that would be created nor the demand for a great product at a cheap price. There are also people who would buy them cheap just to sell them at "25% of retail" on Ebay.

I do not, in any way, think this was some slick marketing scheme ontheir part. I also absolutely believe that ACC lost money on the clamps. The retailers had to be able to buy the 24" size for around $10 (maybe less) to sell it at m$15. You try to make one of those clamps, even en mass, for $10 in the USA. Compare what you get for a Far East import bar clamp at $5 and I think you'll believe the lost money part.

I also do not think there is a version 1 and version 2 - the clamp design is what it is.

Rob

[David LaRue]

All I have to say is Happy Birthday Jorgenson, and thank you for sharing the party with all of us.


Dave

[Dave Avery]

Dave,

Did Amazon or Jorgenson promote this as a "limited availability promotion"?

[Tom Sweeney]

Everyone knows my opinions are worth more than 2¢! :rolleyes:

I'm relatively new to WW'ing. I'm also on an extremely tight budget & shouldn't really have bought the tools that I have over the last year or so, from a strictly economical point anyway.

My clamp collection till now consisted of a gaggle of Harbor Freight type sliding bar clamps with the skinny heads on them & 2 of the plastic adj clamps..

Thanks to Adj. Clamp Co. I now have 4 real nice clamps on their way to my shop. I bought mine late the night before Amazon ran out - so they could have just as easily ran out before I got to them - just like the Bessey frenzy at Sears did. I wasn't mad at Sears cause I didn't get any clamps - I'm glad some of the folks on BP & WC were able to get theirs.

Now to the marketing part:
A.) small family run business :) B.) selling clamps at a loss to thank WW'ers for their support :) C.) now - how many newer WW'ers like me will be buying Jorg's for their cabinet clamps from now on because they're the type that we now have? :) D.) in a month or two anyone that is mad cause they didn't get any - will have forgotten about it :rolleyes:

I've been involved in sales of some sort most of my life. The fact is this: If marketing doesn't do their job then there isn't much of a need for production to do their job or management to do their job. If products don't sell then the company goes out of business & everyone loses their jobs. Unless of course it is one of those products that sell themselves (as one of the builders I used to represent was fond of telling me) :rolleyes:

YMMV

[Tom Suter]

This is not the first Jorgensen 50% sale. About a month or so ago Woodworkers Source (Sells Lumber mostly) Had the clamp sale orginally only as a walk in the store but went to the online store. It sold out in a very short time. I missed that one just like I missed the tail end of this sale. But this will continue on during the rest of this year. Its not knowing which store will be next. Jorgensen passed these saving on to their customers with the hopes that they would pass these deals directly to the buyers.

So if your like me and missed out you just have to keep checking different sites to find out where the next sale is. It is not like there were only a few of them I know of about 100 of them that was bought actually sucked right up. People who really were not looking for clamps saw a deal so good they could not pass it up. Thats me I have a lot of clamps Bessys and bar clamps and I beams but you can never have too many. SO I will keep searching for the next sale. In fact thats how I found this board I was searching for Jorgensen clamps and this thread came up. I guess I still am not a winner yet, but then I found another bulletin board to bookmark.

Arent these guy just so evil passing on a really fantastic sale to woodworkers who have made them who they are. If it wasn't for us there would be no them. Its is there way of saying thanks for all the purchases in the past and hopefully more in the future.

SawdustBlues
Tom

[Tom Sweeney]

SO I will keep searching for the next sale. In fact thats how I found this board I was searching for Jorgensen clamps and this thread came up. I guess I still am not a winner yet, but then I found another bulletin board to bookmark.
SawdustBlues
Tom

Hey Tom,

Welcome to Saw Mill Creek - glad you found us - now pull up a log a stay a while - It's a nice place to hang your hat.

[Bryan Danner]

I gotta agree with Dr. Arbuckle again, on this one.

I think this whole "backlash" issue is kind of ridiculous. ACC had a good deal on clamps, and sold them at a discount. Some people missed out. A small (but vocal) minority of those who missed out, became angry, and blamed the clamp company because they missed out.

This just seems to me that people are blaming others for their own misfortune or mistakes. Further, they become embittered about the situation, and project nefarious motives upon those they blame.

This really is not a conspiracy to prevent some people from getting clamps. I also don't think that this is some sleazy marketing move.

What bothers me most, however, is that the ACC's goodwill (as I percieve it) is being met with angry backlash.

Next time, they may likely decide to do nothing.

I guess this is just a matter of "no good deed goes unpunished".

-Bryan

Oh, by the way, ACC is giving away a bunch of free clamps to celebrate their 100 year anniversary. The registration is being conducted through their web site.

[Jeff Watson]

here is their web site in case anyone was looking for it. http://www.adjustableclamp.com/

[Dave Arbuckle]

Dave,

Did Amazon or Jorgenson promote this as a "limited availability promotion"?

I have no idea how Amazon promotes their sales, I don't buy from them. To the best of my knowledge, Adjustable Clamp didn't promote a sale at all. My understanding is that they have offered special pricing to major resellers, possibly with a catch that the product be sold for a really good price, possibly with no catch at all. Adjustable (Jorgensen) does not sell their product direct to the end user.

What would an "unlimited availability promotion" be, other than a permanent lower price?

Dave

[Howard Barlow]

Dave, I can't subscribe to your theory. What if they had all the clamps anybody wanted, unlimited, but...they only ran the special one day? Then tomorrow I could claim foul that they didn't give me enough notice to find out before the sale was over.

Many sales are limited to product on hand. I see no reason whatsoever for any manufacturer to have a bottomless pit of supply.

I would rather be glad they made the offer to begin with.

Did I buy any? No. Why? They weren't free and I can't afford to spend any money on clamps right now. It wouldn't matter if thery had 1000 more.

Just MHO. :)

[Dave Avery]

My point exactly....... the right thing to have done would have been to make clear that supplies were limited. The fact that Amazon continued to take orders after they sold out - assuming, I'm sure, that ACC would honor the sale price and backorder the required quantities - tells me that Amazon had no reason top believe that quantities were limited. I'm guessing that, only after subsequently checking with ACC and finding that supplies were limited, Amazon had to stop taking orders.

I've been accused of being cynical before, but B-school 101 says TANSTAAFL - a term I know that Mr. Arbuckle is fond of. It's rare to get something for less that full value. It's even more rare for a manufacturer to offer a "thank you" at a loss. If I'm wrong about the motives, I apologize.

And for the record, my original post had nothing to do with being upset at the inability to get clamps at a good price. Thanks to Rob Russell, I have a local source from which I can still get heavily discounted clamps, if I so desire. So I guess I don't need to "suck it up a little better". I was simply questioning the motivation for the sale.

More than enough from me on this subject, back to WW topics.

[Dave Arbuckle]

the right thing to have done would have been to make clear that supplies were limited.

That's the reseller's job, not the manufacturer's. Blame Amazon. Believe me (or not, I guess ;)), their buyer knew this was a special deal.

Dave

[Tom Leavitt]

Hey Dave,

I appreciate the fact that I can get these clamps at this price. I have chosen to believe their reason for doing so and seriously doubt they are loosing money on this (break-even...maybe). I will buy a few more if the opportunity arises and I am able to make it in time.

Enjoy your new clamps, I'll probably have mine for the rest of my life and remember their 100th anniversary every time I use them.

Tom

[Steve Clardy]

I was able to get my clamps at this unbelievable price. Thanks to the tip on one of the posts, I went right to Amazon and ordered 12 of the 36" clamps. To be truthful, I would not have bought them or any other brand if they were not on sale, as I have always felt that they were too high priced. Used to be clamps were the most reasonable cost tools you could buy in tools for woodworking. But not any more. I just received 8 of the 12 I ordered, and it will give me something else to do, [like I realy need to fill my time], is to make another clamp rack!! Ha.
I have lots of clamps, and really did not have a serious need for these, but always wanted to try them out.
I have always used pipe clamps, bar clamps, I-bar clamps, c-clamps, spring clamps. I did a tool inventory here while back, and counted 236 combined clamps. I told the guys on the chat the other day I have 248 clamps, which includes the 12 new Jorgensons. But I found three more f- clamps on my molder the next day, totaling 251 clamps now.
Would I have been mad if I had missed Amazon's sale? No. Maybe disappointed, but no mad at anyone.
I did miss out on sears sale when it was on. I was going to buy some then, but it was over.
To me I cannot figure out the ranting and raving over these clamps, like whats going on on some of the other forums. I'm just glad that one of the AMERICAN manufacturers is kind enough to have a sale once in a while. I'll get off the box now, Steve

[Terre Hooks]

I don't feel that you are correct about their strategy. I haven't read through all of the replies, but this is America and free enterprise is here. For all we know, Bessey will have a sale next month at Amazon, Lowes, HD, and Woodcraft where all of their K-bodies are $16 each. What is going to be their 'tactic'?

Adjustable Clamp is an American Owned company, using USA made steel and other parts to manufacturer their products. Not too many companies today can make that claim. So what if they want to lose $50k, even $100k on selling some clamps at 55% off? I think it is great. From what I hear, Amazon/Tool Crib was flooded with orders in less than 24 hours and Adjustable agreed to let Amazon have all inventory left. That means that every single 24", 36", and 48" CabinetMaster clamp that Adjustable had produced up until last week, and possibly for a few more weeks, was sold. What company wouldn't want that??

I also have a 'personal' theory as to what Adjustable's motives are, other than the publicly claimed customer appreciation, which I think they are being honest with that. My personal theory is that if they flood the market with these, there is no need for someone to buy K-bodies for awhile. I didn't see many people raising up against Bessey back when they raised clamp prices.


For what it is worth, this sale at Amazon wasn't the first CabinetMaster sale, and it will not be the last. I'm sure that Amazon sold more clamps in 6 hours than they thought they would during the whole month. You got to think, whoever decided to put it in the monthly catalog doesn't know a clamp from a saw blade. They only knew that they sold 10 or 20 a month. Not a minute. Their (Amazon's) buyer knew it was a good deal, but probably should not have run the ad in the monthly catalog.

Adjustable Clamp has done nothing wrong, at least in my book. I do know one thing-woodworkers on the internet are a very big target to companies. Maybe one day they will figure out how so much product gets sold to us woodworkers so fast.

I would really like to see the orders taken online and through the phone for these clamps last week. Don't you really feel for the poor saps that have mailed in the order form along with their credit card info or personal check???

Oh yeah, this from an owner of 17 K-bodies, many Tradesman clamps, and hopefully an undisclosed number of CabinetMasters. And yeah, I plan on getting some more at the next sale.

[Jeff Watson]

Nicely put Terre,
I agree with your comments 100%. I myself missed out on this sale. Oh well. Hope they have another one soon. Free enterprise is a great thing.

[John Weber]

Well put...