Built-in Bench

[Rob Bodenschatz]

I'm building a built-in bench for my mudroom. Here's the plan:
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This will be built between two walls. The right wall was omitted for clarity.

I'm going to be using 3/4" plywood to build the carcase and attaching a panel (possibly another 3/4" sheet, maybe glued-up hardwood?) to the top to form the bench. Does that sound like it will provide a solid bench given the two 3'6" spans? Should I be providing more support? Feedback appreciated.

[Alan Turner]

Rob
Take a look at this link.
http://www.woodbin.com/calcs/sagulator.htm

If you are talking about putting a solid wood panel on top of a plywood panel, be careful about how you attach the two since if it is tight, as with either glue or screws, you could get some splitting. Red Oak at that width will move as much as nearly 1/2", winter to summer, in an emc range of 6 to 13%, so you will need to accomodate that movement.

[Kelly C. Hanna]

Yes....I never span more than 24" using 3/4 ply....now if you double the layer you can go 36" no problem, especially when you use 1.5" front trim.

[Jamie Buxton]

You didn't ask about this, but I see a lot of potential storage space above your crown moulding. In most houses, more storage is a good thing. Maybe you could move the crown up to the ceiling, and use doors to cover the front of the storage area.

[Rob Bodenschatz]

Jamie, for some reason I was going to do that and then decided not to. I can't remember the reason, though. I think maybe it was because we wanted them open and liked the squareness of the way they are shown. I may draw it up as you describe. Sounds like a good way to go.

Since we're going to be painting the top, I think I'll probably go with the plywood which should alleviate your concern, Alan. Right?

As far as the span goes, the way I currently have it designed would have the top of the carcase (3/4") plus the bench top for a total of 1 1/2". According to that sagulator, the bench would sag .05" at 250 lbs (center load distribution). Would it be overkill to laminate another sheet of plywood to the top of the carcase bringing the total thickness to 2 1/4"? That would result in a .01" sag.

[Kent Fitzgerald]

Laminating two layers of similar plywood should be fine. You won't see or feel 0.05" deflection.

On another issue, your drawing doesn't show the depth of the upper shelves. People will usually lean forward when rising from a seat, but you might want to mock this up to be sure it's not a headbanger for taller folks.

[Rob Bodenschatz]

Jamie, took your advice and I like it better that way. Didn't feel like redraewing the crown molding but it'll be there.
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[Rob Bodenschatz]

OK, it's been a while since I've been spending a lot of time setting up my workshop but now I'm getting ready to start working on this project. I have a question though:

The bench will be sitting on a tile floor. 12" x 12" tiles with wide groutlines. The tiles themselves are a rough texture. The grout is sunken below the face of the tiles. Woul it be proper to scribe the bottom of the face frame to the floor? Or, would it look weird? Is it not worth the effort? Being a mudroom, I worry a little about water/grime getting under the bench. This is my first built-in so your feedback would be appreciated.

[Jamie Buxton]

Rob, you can scribe the bottom of the front to exactly match the tile and grout if you're really obsessive. A much easier approach is to use a small piece of molding to cover any gaps. The molding is flexible enough that you can make it conform to any curves in the floor. Quarter round or base shoe moldings are the common choice.

If you do want to scribe the junction, don't scribe the face frame itself. You'll want to be putting the scribed piece in and out while you adjust it. It is easier to put the seat in place, and scribe a molding to fit the floor. The molding might be a couple inches tall so that the height changes due to the trimming are concealed.

If you need the junction to be watertight, no molding or scribing job will do. To get watertight you could use caulk. Squeeze caulk into the gap and then nail the molding on.

[Ben Grunow]

I have built several of these for clients and the best solution IMHO is to eliminate the bottom of the cabinet (no face frame parallel to the floor and no plywood floor in the cabinet) and just tile under the bench. THe tile looks good and is able to take the abuse and moisture from shoes. It also allows people to kick their shoes under there without worrying about damaging the paint on the bottom of the cab. Wish I sime pics. I have even built some with turned legs for a more funitury (yes that is a word) look. I usually make a set of uppers and mount them over some beadboard, flat panels or v joint with the bench below. Some hooks for hanging coats on the beadboard (toward the ends where most peoplpe won't sit) are nice too.

[Rob Bodenschatz]

Ben, just wanted to let you know that I followed your advice and eliminated the bottom of the cabinet. I'll post pictures when it's completely done. I'm actually making another change. LOML wants the cubbies up top instead of the enclosed cabinets. Like this:

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I realize they look pretty simple but I do have a question about construction. I plan to make these using 3/4" plywood. I think I want a thicker base and top like in the picture. Maybe 2"? Does that sound like a good thickness? I'm not sure the best way to build that so the face frame doesn't hang over the top or bottom. I do have some ideas but I'm not sure I like any of them. Advice would be appreciated.

Edit: Come to think of it, maybe 2" is too thick. Would it be best to just laminate two sheets of ply to get 1 1/2"?

[Ben Grunow]

I would use 3/4" strips glued and pinned to the bottom of those tops as long as the seat span is shorter than about 20". Make the top and edge to desired thickness and profile and build up the edges of the ply to match the edge you want. Put continuous 3" rippings around the edge of the sheet and more where there is support from below. Just keep the spans down and use 2 layers of ply (or more) if the spans get too big. Glad I could help.

Just re-read your post and realized you were talking about the cubbies, not the seat and tops in the pic. I just built a room of cubbies (only 8" high opening and up tight to the crown mldg) and the bottom was 3/4 and 1/2 ply glued up with 1 1/2" face frames. The 1/4" lip actually keeps the mittens and things that are going to be stored in there from falling. It might get dinged up over time but no worse than if it were flush. Could have used thicker ply to eliminate lip. Carpenters choice as we say.