Planers: 2-speed Delta or 3-knife unit?

[John Miliunas]

Once again, I turn to the wisdom of the Creek. My old Ryobi just isn't giving me the results I'd like, particularly on Maple and Cherry. Yes, I've changed the blades, but I still get a fair amount of tearout with it. And no, I'm careful to not take too big a bite per pass.

I understand that, especially with the slower feed speed on the Delta, one can eliminate much of it, as well as minimizing snipe. On the other hand, it's also my understanding that 3-blade planers have less tearout associated with them, too.

I'm hoping someone here at SMC can give me a little food for thought regarding the choices. Unfortunately, funds do put limits on such a purchase, hence the Delta 2-speed or 3-knife unit for a bit more. Suggestions? Comments? Personal experience? :cool:

[Chris Oakley]

I like my dewalt. With some care there is no snipe and as long as I don't try to have it bite off more than it can chew I get smooth cuts.

[David Rose]

John,

I replaced an old PSI (Ryobi I think) with the Delta 2 speed. These are my only experiences so I don't have much background. I was working with some figured maple when I made the planer change. It wasn't birdseye but had a lot of wild grain. Sometimes the grain would change directions three times in a foot.

With new blades in the PSI I got less tearout than with slightly dull. Same with the Delta. I seldom use high speed on the Delta and take mostly light cuts. I did notice some difference in tearout with the lower speed. I still had to wet the boards to cut it way back. With both tables slightly elevated snipe is less than the PSI also. I still have to apply upward pressure or I get it on the very last cut. I can take off a 1/4" with no snipe, then the last cut... Murphy's Law at work, huh? :rolleyes:

The Delta dust pickup housing lightly drags on the wood with mine. That makes lifting short boards a little difficult sometimes.

If I can help with any specific questions on the Delta, just "holler".

David

[Doug Jones]

Does the ryobi work? Only just not to your expectations? If so and if you do replace it give me a yell. Maybe I need a planer that works but not the best.

[John Miliunas]

Thanks for the input guys.

Chris, I've heard some pretty good stuff about the DeWalt, but still not as highly rated as the Delta. I figure if I buy, I don't want to do it again.

Dave, you've managed to smack me upside the head with a tip I'd totally forgotten about: Wet the dern wood down! That'll be next on my trials. The downside would be, there goes my bonafied excuse for a new planer! :(

Doug, if I go forth with a replacement, I'll let you know. I certainly don't need two planers and yes, the Ryobi has a lot of service left in it. For MOST stuff, it does a great job and I crafted a home-built dust collector (4" outlet) for it, which gets no less than 95% of the chips handled.

I'll keep you guys posted as to the progress.... :cool:

[Jim Becker]

One of my friends up in Nova Scotia recently added the Delta two speed planer to his shop to replace a larger 20" planer that was "kaput". He does custom picture framing and uses a lot of extraordinary figured lumber. His comments on the Delta 22-580 are entirely complimentary, other than the fact that the dust hood could be designed a lot better. (Most folks have that comment) The slow feed speed really gets nice results on figured lumber, cutting down on his need to use one of his Performax drum sanders for major thicknessing work.

I would consider this unit for my shop when my 22-560 dies, other than the fact that I have a craving for the MiniMax FS-350 14" jointer/planer...it's only money. :D

[Daniel Rabinovitz]

John
I have a two speed Delta and like it very much although it is LOUD - (what did you say?)
It's LOUD!
But I have been ker-chunking red oak in 12-1/2 inch and 11 inch wide boards for the present project. Did I say it's LOUD?

But it does a real nice job.
I did find that I ought to put the board through twice on wide stuff. Why you ask? because it works so hard on the first cut that it takes some more off on the second cut with the same setting. Don't ask me why, ok! It just does - yes I lock the head.
Sooooo, try two cuts at the same setting and see.

Oh! yes, you have to be careful with the depth setting - 1/8 turn per run through (no more) - man it's LOUD.

Daniel
Addendum: I love it, it works really well.
I do use ear plugs.
It does not snipe the wood and leaves a smooooth finish. Lots of ooooooo's in smooth.

[John Weber]

John,

You have been on a tool buying frenzy... Anyway, here is a great buy on the DeWalt for $289.

http://woodworker.com/cgi-bin/fullpres.exe?PARTNUM=913-840

Like another poster, unless your other planer is busted, I'm not sure your results will differ greatly.

The new Delta is a fine machine, and made do slightly better then the others.

If yout tool fund stream continues to be strong, I would hold out for a larger machine such as a 15" Powermatic, Delta, or Jet, or even better a 14" General or 12" Powermatic Model 100.

Have Fun - John

[Kevin Gerstenecker]

May as well throw my 2 cents in too! ;) I have great results with my Dewalt. Properly tweaked, and with the cutter head locked, it does a fine job with no snipe. If you are getting tear out on Maple and Cherry, I would think the culprit is something other than the machine itself. I have seen some el cheapo planers do a nice job when properly adjusted and with sharp knives. Some woods will tear out no matter what you do. I have been able to minimize or eliminate most tear out on difficult wood by using patience and taking VERY little with each pass. If the boards are narrow enough, feeding at an angle to the cutter helps at times also. :)

[John Miliunas]

Boys, boys, boys...."Tool buying frenzy"? Not at all. Just playing "catch up", that's all. And no, I didn't win the lottery. If I did, I wouldn't be looking at the "small stuff", nor even trying to sell the house in hopes of getting into a bigger shop. Naw, partial "mad money", partial "plastic fantastic"! It's just that a guy reaches a point where you're WW time is limited and then, having to work with stuff that just "makes do", gets to be a drag. I'm also looking at reducing strain and pain to this aging body of mine. Tools requiring even a bit less effort to get the job done, will keep my WW enjoyable and safer. (As we all know the pain which Terry has gone through recently....) Having said all that, funds continue to be an issue and I still try to get the most bang for my buck. I appreciate all your input, even the smart@$$ remarks help put a smile on my face! :D Thanks!!! :cool:

[Dan McLaughlin]

I have the Delta 580. Works great as long as you either have a good DC system or take off the ^&*$%# dust hood. Otherwise, the "chips" get clogged in the dust hood port and leave impressions (probably there is a technical term for it) on your freshly planed wood.

[Tom Pritchard]

Hi John, I'm a "new guy" in this forum! I bought the 22-580 about 5 months ago, and I couldn't be happier with it. I always run it hooked to a 2 HP dust collector, and I have never noticed some of the problems that others have listed here. I have used it on white oak, rock maple, figured maple, and cherry, and have not experienced tearout in the pieces that I have run through. I use both speeds, the finishing speed giving the best results. As far as the noise goes, I wear hearing protection when I run my tools, and have not really found the noise level to be a factor. I am extremely satisfied with this tool, and would recommend it highly. BTW, I found replacement blades for the 22-580 at my local Lowe's for $28.00! The blades are reversable, and I'm still on my first set. Good luck on your purchase.

[Tom Sweeney]

I bought the 2 speed Delta a few months ago. It's my first planer - as a matter of fact it's my first brand new WW'ing machine. So I don't have a lot of other experiences with planers.

It does a great job on figured maple I have experienced very little tearout. I have had some snipe issues - but I'm pretty sure it's operator error. The finish speed leaves a finish so smooth I hardly have to sand. It is loud - I wear my chainsaw helmet with hearing protection when using it - looks funny but it's all I got. Also the machine is heavy - much heavier than some of it's competition so If you don't have a dedicated spot for it then you'll be putting more strain on that aging body of yours :D

Good luck with your decision.

[David Rose]

Why is it that part of the fun of this is tool research, search, and finally acquistion? It really is. I just don't understand the psychology of it. Or is that just "pscho"? :D For me the Delta planer mostly meant less fiddling and fussing with the PSI. I was finally having to retap for stripped housing screws after so many teardowns and reassemblies.

Doug, I gave mine back to my Dad "from whence it came" or I would talk to you. It has a few quirks, but what tool doesn't.

Depending on the wood, my Delta takes off a little more on one side than the other. Repeated passes, unless unless the board is run the other way, don't seem to matter. One time I think it is hard wood doing it and the next it seems like softer wood. I don't dare try to adjust it out because sometimes it is within a couple thou side to side. It is puzzling. This is my only real gripe with this machine. I have to watch for it.

DC in my shop is very inadequate. It is the teeny Delta. Terry is holding a cyclone for me until we can figure the best way to configure it. It does a fairly decent job on the planer though. I've kept the run to a minimum.

David

[John Miliunas]

Dan, I'm hopeful that the OEM dust collector would be, at least, as good as the "homebrew" one I made for the Ryobi. If so, it shouldn't be an issue: 2hp DC, 12" impeller, 4" ducts throughout. (No, it's NOT a cyclone, but....)

Tom P., welcome aboard! It's just absolutely *fantastic* that a "new guy" jumps right in with helpful feedback for your first post. I'm impressed. Stop by often, as you'll find there are a whole bunch of nice folks hangin' out at the Creek! Thanks for the input. Precisely the kind of info I'm looking for. I wish we had a Lowe's handy around here. If this happens, I'll need to source out blades somewhere, but in reality, I'm pretty easy on them. I'm only on my second set (double-sided) for the Ryobi after several years of use.

Tom S., just as Tom P. and Daniel have said, hearing protection is pretty much a gimme' when it comes to planing or jointing in my shop. The ear protection permanently hangs on the handle of the Ryobi, which is also in close proximity to the jointer. Believe me, those muffs get used 100% of the time! And yes, I definitely do have a "permanent" home for the current planer. Just a cheapie homebuilt cabinet on wheels, but enough to roll it into place without having to lift it to and from storage. I'm glad to hear that the Delta has some heft to it.

Kevin and John W., seem to be sold on the DeWalt. I have no doubt you guys are happy with it and, if my skills and patience were up to it, I may even be able to make one of those work equally well. But, I need all the help I can get from my tools. At this point, I think the Delta may give me a bit of an edge.

Jim B., the ever-present wealth and giver of knowledge! Is there *ANY* power tool out there you *don't* know about?! I really appreciate the comparison you offer with your friend in Nova Scotia. Replacing a 20" planer can be no small feat!

So, guess which way I'm leaning, guys?! I still have the "wet it down" trick to try out and need to check on my own "bottom line", so it may be a bit before it happens, but I think I have all the food for thought I need now. As is always the case, thank you so very much for your candid and very helpful info! You guys are the BEST!!! :D :cool:

[Doug Jones]

John,
Don't get in a hurry yet about buying. Word has it that the new Dewalt 2 speed 13" planer is due out soon. This should do one of two(if not both) things. One being the Dewalt 12 1/2" planer should start dropping in price, and B) it may cause Delta to drop thier price a bit. Just some info I thought you could use.
Doug

[John Miliunas]

John,
Don't get in a hurry yet about buying. Word has it that the new Dewalt 2 speed 13" planer is due out soon. This should do one of two(if not both) things. One being the Dewalt 12 1/2" planer should start dropping in price, and B) it may cause Delta to drop thier price a bit. Just some info I thought you could use.
Doug

Thanks Doug! No, I didn't know Dewalt was going in that direction. You're right...It may be interesting to see what happens. Oh, and I'm not in a real particular hurry, either. The Ryobi is still doing a fine job for most of my stuff and I've made a number of recent tool purchases as it is, so I may want the dust to settle a bit, anyway! :D Strange as it may sound, though, when I mentioned to LOML that I may be replacing it, her response was that I should wait until "the fat lady sings", so to speak. In other words, wait until we know for sure that we're taking the house off the market. In the meantime, if it sells and I get my bigger shop, she's all for me getting a *real* planer! Ah yes...Gotta' love her! :cool:

[Ken Salisbury]

John,
Don't get in a hurry yet about buying. Word has it that the new Dewalt 2 speed 13" planer is due out soon. This should do one of two(if not both) things. One being the Dewalt 12 1/2" planer should start dropping in price, and B) it may cause Delta to drop thier price a bit. Just some info I thought you could use.
Doug
Well - the "old man" has to throw his 2¢ into the mix after reading Doug's post. He is absolutely right in that new planers are due out soon. The same holds true for BS's, TS's, Jointers, Mortisers, etc, etc, etc. If you try to chase technology - you will never buy a new power tool. There is always gonna be a new version coming.

My philosophy would be to research what is available at the time you decide to buy and buy the machine that best matches your needs/budget, buy it and get on with it.

[John Miliunas]

Well - the "old man" has to throw his 2¢ into the mix after reading Doug's post. He is absolutely right in that new planers are due out soon. The same holds true for BS's, TS's, Jointers, Mortisers, etc, etc, etc. If you try to chase technology - you will never buy a new power tool. There is always gonna be a new version coming.

My philosophy would be to research what is available at the time you decide to buy and buy the machine that best matches your needs/budget, buy it and get on with it.

Couldn't agree more, Ken! And don't I know that theory real well, being in the IT industry! Heck, most stuff "on the shelf" is obsolete the day it gets there!!! I figure a month or so down the road for this purchase. If I see something of interest in the meantime, great. If not, I revert back to your assumptions! :cool:

[Tom Pritchard]

Tom P., welcome aboard! It's just absolutely *fantastic* that a "new guy" jumps right in with helpful feedback for your first post. I'm impressed. Stop by often, as you'll find there are a whole bunch of nice folks hangin' out at the Creek! Thanks for the input. Precisely the kind of info I'm looking for. I wish we had a Lowe's handy around here. If this happens, I'll need to source out blades somewhere, but in reality, I'm pretty easy on them. I'm only on my second set (double-sided) for the Ryobi after several years of use.

John, just a quick addition to my original post. Last night, I turned my planer blades around to use the second side. I was planing some 5/4 rock maple, and I was getting some fine grooves that I didn't like. To my surprise, changing the blades was a simple task! There are 7 Torx style screws that you loosen for each blade, and the blade lifts out with the little magnetic tool that Delta provides. Once reversed, the blade sits back in on pins so that there is no need to align the blades! I was done in about 10 minutes. I know I might be biased, but this planer is a wonderful tool. Good luck!

[Sparky Paessler]

John

I just upgraded to the 15" powermatic from a 12" delta. (don't remember the model # but was the orginal 12" one). What a difference there is between them! The powermatic feed boards thru it much easier. The old delta I have I had to sometimes help the boards thru it when it hit a hard spot. I also think it is a little quieter or at least the sound is not so high pitched as the Delta. The powermatic also seems to take off more in a pass so I don't have to make as many passes thru the planner and then there is always that extra 3 inches in width. Of course there is a big price difference but to me it was worth it. (I had to trim out a house for a friend on the weekends to pay for mine.)

[Rob Russell]

John,

Give it up. Just go for a big ole variable feed speed jointer/planer combo. You only live once.

Rob