To Festool or not to Festool....

[Tom Pritchard]

...that is my question!:D I am currently looking to buy a 2nd router to use freehand. I currently have a Bosch 1619EVS mounted in my router table, and an old Sears Craftsman that I use for freehand stuff. Well, the Sears won't take a 1/2" bit, it isn't variable speed, no softstart, etc. so I want to replace it. I have been looking at the Bosch 1617EVSPK 2.25 Horsepower Electronic Variable Speed Plunge and Fixed Base Router Kit which is currently on sale at Amazon for around $208.00. I'm a little nervous about it when I read the Amazon reviews that talk about problems with warped bases and problematic power switches.

So I started looking at the Festool line. They have 2 models that look like they may more than suit my needs. They are the Router OF 1400 EQ (http://www.festoolusa.com/ProductDetails.aspx?id=4&prodid=574224) and the Router OF 2000 E (http://www.festoolusa.com/ProductDetails.aspx?id=4&prodid=574216).

What are your suggestions/opinions? Is the Festool router that much better than other routers that it should demand such a premium in price? I would appreciate your feedback. Thanks!

[Frank Pellow]

Festool!

Tom, I have the 1400 router and use it either hand held or guided on a Festool rail. I really like it, except for edge routing with a big bit. In that case the cut is still good but the dust collection is no better than any other router.

Since, I started using the 1400 router to cut dados and rabbets on my Festool multi-function table, I gave away the daos blades for my table saw.

I have used a friend,s 2000 router and find it too heavy for (my) handheld use.

[Rich Person]

Tim,

I'm not the most experienced woodworker on the board, but I did make the Festool jump last Fall and picked up a whole set of tools. I purchased the 1400 as my hand router (Hitachi under the table). I like this router. It is not the lightest router I've ever used, but it has some nice features. The dust collection isn't perfect, but I think it is better than anyone else. The locking handle is really nice on a plunge router. The pop-in template guides are nice too. I think they even come with a P-C bushing pop-in free now. The ratcheting spindle is nice too.

One of the main things I like about the Festool system is they way it interacts with other equipment. I purchased the multi-function table and can do stop dados with my 1400 on the track and see exactly where I'm going.

My favorite part of the system is the rotex sander. I built a face frame this last week and rough sanded it with 80 grit in stock removal mode and didn't see, smell or detect any dust in the air at all. To me that is amazing.

I'm pretty happy with all my Festool stuff as it feels sturdy and smooth. I hope this helps.

[Jim Becker]

The 2000 is a big, heavy beast and not necessary for most hand-held work...it's an industrial strength...kinda the PC 5718 of the Festool line. The OF 1400 would be a better choice for hand-held work...and it's excellent.

[Rich Person]

I even saw the great David Marks using one on a couple of Wood Works episodes.

[John Keane]

Two excellent choices are the PC 690 or 890 series. Festool is great but if you are not going to use it everyday, then go functional.

[John Stevens]

Is the Festool router that much better than other routers that it should demand such a premium in price? I would appreciate your feedback.

Tough call, because it really depends on each person's individual needs. For example, I own the smallest Festool router (OF1010) and for me, the answer is "yes," despite the quirky depth turret (very much like the quirky one on the OF1400) and the fact that the dust collection is "state of the art," but state of the art doesn't mean 100% of the dust is collected all the time. The reasons I think the Festool is worth the money are:

1. Great customer service
2. Has reputation for reliability and longevity
3. I like the guide rail accessory, although others still prefer shop-made jigs for ploughing dados and the like
4. Can be used with the VS600 joint-making fixture and LR32 hole-drilling system...although I'm not sure how well the OF1400 works with these. The OF1400 works with another routing accessory called the "MFS," which I know very little about. You may want to look into the things you can do with it. On the Festool Owners' Group, Jerry Work posted a message to announce that he will be publishing a user's manual for the MFS, and the list of things it can do looked very impressive. BTW, the festool owners' group is at groups.yahoo.com

[JayStPeter]

Tough call there. I have both the Bosch and the Festool OF1400. I like them each for different things. I thought the 1400 would replace the Bosch, but that hasn't been the case. The ultra stable fixed base of the Bosch probably gives it the advantage if I could only keep one of them.

Jay

[Dev Emch]

Tuff Call.

First of all, you said freehand. Any router I have has to support the Micro Fence or it does not pass muster. The larger Festoolean is actually made by Mafell for Festool. Mafell even uses the same boxes made by the same company so there is some inbreeding going on here. The 1400 is actually a very nice router. I am still using my 690 with a toggle switch. Trust me, you will only make the mistake of plugging one of these in ONCE without checking the toggle switch to make sure its OFF!!!!!!!! If I buy another router, most likely its going to be the 1400. They have done most of their homework. But the major question is how many of your existing jigs and addons will work with the new router.

[Ed Labadie]

Tom,
I have the 2000 Festool & Jim was correct, it's a beast. The 1400 would be a much better choice for your primary handheld router.

Ed

[John Hebert]

All have a purpose. I bought the smaller Festool because I already had the saw system, guide, and vac and was really pleased, so this would make a nice addition. I also had my current situation in mind and thought the system would be perfect. For those who don’t know already, I’ve relocated the Maine and building a log home and shop with the cedar logs I harvest from my own land. The router would be just the ticket grooving a center dado for a log splines, but also needed something for building my cabinets in the temporary camp, while we build and alos just an all around router for anything else I needed to do. I knew I’d be without my shop equipment and anything stationary during the construction, and the Festool system was just the right combination to do accurate work on site.

http://www.cjohnhebert.com/festoolcabinetmaking1.jpg
Doors made by my buddy Dalton Theriot,

http://www.cjohnhebert.com/kitchendoors.jpg
From cabinets in the camp to ship lapped edges on the rough sawn lumber for the wife’s goat barn,

http://www.cjohnhebert.com/shiplapjoint.jpg to even making some replacement mutton molding on this antique window, the router did better than expected.

http://www.cjohnhebert.com/windowmoldingbefore2.jpg
The rough sawn lumber off my logosol, that in some cases wasn’t exactly dry enough use, but thought a ship lap joint would be in order so that when shrinking occurred, this joint would still be good enough to stop draft.
I found that I cut take a full 3/8" x ½ deep cut and move right along on 8' boards without too much trouble. Only trouble I encountered that if the lumber was to green (wet) or the bit was dull, taking the full cut would cause the router to shut down due to over heating. I thought this was a great feature to avoid burning out the router, and been there done that before! ANY router would have been under the same strain, and most assuredly burnt out for sure.
Never did use it for the spline dado, but am using it with a 3/4" plow bit to grove out my log walls to lay electrical wire in them.
In conclusion, I like the router! Nice and light, easy to control, did everything I wanted so far. You can’t use large bits like raised panel cutters but that’s not what I wanted to do with it anyhow.

[Frank Pellow]

John, I really like the photos. Maybe you could start your own thread with more about your cabin.

I can really relate to what you are doing, because I have a remote cabin in Northern Ontario, where my Festool stuff comes in really handy. We have no mains electricity, so I need to run the tools with a generator. That's about the only thing that we use the generator for.

[John Hebert]

:D
http://www.cjohnhebert.com/cutting02.jpg

[Frank Pellow]

:D
Heck ... it could get wild and wooly

You are right it could. You look like you are having "fun" John. I guess that that's not a Festool chain saw -although, a long time ago, they did make chainsaws.

[John Hebert]

ha ha ha isn't the right word for it. More like a nice adventure :D
This is a Logosol Sweedish mill using a Husky 85. Its done one hell of a job so far.

http://www.cjohnhebert.com/3logdeer.jpg

[Tom Pritchard]

First off, I want to thank everyone for the thoughtful and detailed replies. This is exactly the kind of information I was looking to get on this topic. I have really thought a great deal about the purchase, and the data provided helped me make a decision.

Secondly, John Hebert is the luckiest man I know! John, I can only dream about doing what you are accomplishing! I was totally blown away looking at the pictures you provided and thinking about how wonderful it would be to be able to build my own home, out of my own trees. You are truly a fortunate and very talented individual. If anyone is reading this string for the first time, you have to scroll down and look at John's posts and pictures. I love the last one with the snow and the deer framing your mill. Fantastic!

Lastly, I have decided to go with the Festool 1400 EQ. My reasons are:

1) Anything recommended by John Hebert has to be good :D
2) Festool provides the best chip/dust collection capability of all the models I was considering
3) I have no current jigs or add-ons, so I would be starting clean and Festool offers a lot of add-ons (thanks for that thought Dev!)
4) I read the review on Jim Becker's website and was impressed on the performance and overall recommendation
5) I think the 2000 EQ would be too big and heavy (thanks Ed)
6) I like the idea of using it for dado work as opposed to dado blades on the TS once I get the multi-function table (thanks Frank)
7) I am looking forward to using it with the guide rail system as I have heard many good things about it

So thanks to all for helping me with the decision. It is going to cost me a little more initially, but I think I'll be happier with it in the long run. I'll post pics when I get it (tax return purchase:rolleyes: ) so Tyler will believe me;) !

[Frank Pellow]

Good decision, Tom. Congratulations and welcome to the "Festool Club"!

[John Lucas]

Tom,
I am too late to change your mind and fortunately I donthave to. The Festool 1400 is a super router. I use it with the Micro Fence jig and it just makes it more super.
http://www.woodshopdemos.com/l-m&t-118.jpg
Here is the how-to page:
http://www.woodshopdemos.com/l-m&t-14.htm

[Jim Becker]

Tom, don't forget that Uncle Bob is the guy to buy it from... ;)

[Tom Ruflin]

Tom,

I have 2 Bosch 1617's and have had no problems with them. One for free hand and one in a table. Could be because I do not do alot of routing but they suit my needs just fine.

[Michael Simpson Virgina]

I just purchased a FESTool OF 1400 and like and use the router as my primary hand held router. I have a couple other routers I use for Router table use. It makes doing dados easy when used with the MFT3.

That said I dont thing the rout makes a very good router for doing inlay work. The Bushing adapter has no means of adjustment and in mycase it is not perfectly centered. I it also has a slght amount of slop that is not adjustable and for that reason I do not recomend it for fine woodworking inlays. I have used the bushings for such things as cutting receses for casters and other general woodworking tasks.

[Rick Fisher]

I have the Festool OF 1400 and the Festool 700 Trim router..

The OF1400 is my favorite router.. period .. ever.. I have 5 others which are not Festool.

I also have the sliding track set-up for the OF1400 and its the most irritating, frustrating POS ever.. I don't use it .. Its an expensive wall hanging ..

The router is fantastic. The collet has a ratchet, so you dont have to disengage the wrench.. The Dust collection is amazing.. Its not 100% .. but when I use my Milwaukee or Porter Cable, I am quickly reminded that its darn good ..

The Dust collection on the Festool 700 Trim router is actually better than the OF1400 IMO..

For power, its tremendous.. When your using it, you can just tell that your using the Ferrari of routers..

[John Piwaron]

I'm using a Bosch 1617EVS fixed base. It's never had any problems at all. It's like the Energizer bunny. It keeps going and going. But I recently bought a PC 894PK to go along with it. The method of adjusting bit height looks to be better, plus it's got the dust grip handle. It's the dust collection that was the primary reason I got it.

[Michael Simpson Virgina]

Just remember if you purchase a FesTool you will be converting from mm to in and back. I do this with a small digital calipers. That said I cant believe no one has come out with any replacement inch stickers for the router.

[Ted Wong]

I like the Bosch 1617 and as you mentioned the switches on the newer ones go out. Maybe they have fixed that problem now. Other than that it is a great workhorse and we have 2 of them. We also have the Festool and have found it to be quite functional. The guide rail system makes cutting dadoes and grooves a breeze and the rest of the Festool system only increases the versatility.

[joseph merz]

i own the festool 1400 .very smooth .i bought all the attachments also .i have an easy 1000$ spent on it .have others also to compare it to.
the bosch i recently picked up is also very smooth has hands down a better plunge and you can buy all the stuff to get the same level of dust collection .

[Paul Johnstone]

I hope Tom (the original poster) has made up his mind by now. It's been 4 years :D

[Dan Karachio]

I don't know guys, I have the OF 1400 too. Sure it's nice and a great router, but the price is out of line and routers at nearly half the price can, I think, offer just as much.