Is there a wide belt sander out there, geared for the small shop?

[Dee Dee Martin]

I create a fair amount of thin boards. 1/8", 3/16, and 1/4".
My drumsander is way to slow.
And even tho my planer will plane that thin, I get tear out.

Is there a wide belt sander on the market, geared for the small workshop guy?

[tod evans]

dee dee, by geared to the small shop, i take it that you mean single phase, small footprint and relatively inexpensive? the taiwan/china importers offer an open-ended design starting at about 3k same neighborhood as the import drums. some of these units are odd sized and you`ll be at the manufacturers mercy when you need belts so pay attention! if you have the power and bucks the 37x60 single head has been the small shop standard for lotsa years and supplies are readly available from several sources. if you have the time and inclination these units can be found used for close to the money you`d spend on an open-end design. there`s a usa company that makes a pretty good drum sander for around 3k, woodmaster out of kc mo. just remember build quality and speed of cut are directly influanced by price........02 tod

[lou sansone]

I agree with Tod on this, and will add that there are some 24" Wide belts out there on the used market that are probably fine for certain things, just not face frames for base kitchen cabinets.

Lou

[Steve Rowe]

Dee Dee,
You may want to check out: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/17inchWidebeltSanders/
There are several users of the Northstate sander by Leneave that appear to be very satisfied with their machines. I am considering one of these as well but before I pull the trigger, I want to see one.
Steve

[Dee Dee Martin]

So Todd, and Lou, are you saying that a sander like the Shop Fox 15" uses propritary belts, and is a piece of junk?

http://tinyurl.com/l8a7z

[Dee Dee Martin]

Steve, I find it odd that performing a Google search on:
Northgate widebelt sander

gets zero hits.
Same with:

northgate wide belt sander leneave

Do they have any kind of web presence?

[Dee Dee Martin]

Any of you familar with the Grizzly 15"?

http://www.grizzly.com/products/G9983

[Allen Grimes]

So Todd, and Lou, are you saying that a sander like the Shop Fox 15" uses propritary belts, and is a piece of junk?

http://tinyurl.com/l8a7z Wow, I don't know how you came to that conclusion. All I got from what Tod and Lou said was to be cautious and make sure you know what you are buying.

As for Tod's recommendation about Woodmaster, If I was on the market for a drum sander (read, if I had the money to buy one), I would definately take a really good look at their machines. The 38" double drum http://woodmastertools.com/s/price1.cfm specificly. I have looked around, a little, at other comparable (size, specs) sanders, and the price here seems to be very competetive.

I have no affiliation with Woodmaster.

Hope this helps.

[Bob Justin]

Dee Dee

I recently picked up a PerformaX 22-44 Drum Sander and am very happy with it right out of the box. The manufactures $100.00 rebate didn't hurt either.:)

My plan is to surface plane to "close" and finish to final thickness with the drum sander for my thin work.

I have the option of buying ready made belts or simply trimming the ends from standard 3" abrasive stock.

Factory alignment of the drum head was very close and a simple mod improves the locking bolt to help keep things in alignment.

With 3 sizes, one may very well fill your needs and fit within your budget.

[tod evans]

dee dee, i would never intentionally slander a tool importer on a public forum and i think i`m safe in saying that lou wouldn`t either... i`ve never driven the shop-fox sander or the griz (one in the same i think?) but i have had occasion to use powermatics open ended sander that looks quite similar and the fellow who owned it tried his darnedest to get me to buy it from him so he could get a 37" model... after driving his i bought the 37" and left him to lament his discision... will one of these sanders work for you????? i have no idea. can you find readily available belts/parts?? again, i have no idea... should you speak to folks who have used both styles of sanders?? yes by all means! .....02 tod

[Robert Waddell]

Dee Dee,
It's "Northstate" not "Northgate". Try your search again with the right brand. Leneave is right here in my hometown, Charlotte, NC.

Rob

[lou sansone]

I won't speak for tod... but I was not saying that the shop fox was a piece of junk. I went round and round on this issue before buying my wide belt timesavers. I called a bunch of guys who had different machines and came up with the same answer over and over again when it came to wide belt sanders. If you have the room, power and can support the load of the machine ( I have an older timesavers ( 37" x 75" with the 12 1/2" contact drum ) that was really heavy - close to 3000 lbs ) , get a 37" machine. I say get a 37" machine if you plan on using it for all of the regular types of furniture and such that will come through your shop over the years.

If you are doing some special stuff and never plan of sanding face frames, table tops or what have you, then maybe these little open ended jobs would be ok for you.

In the end I looked for a timesavers because they are pretty much the original and one of the main players in this industry. I could call them up and give them my machine serial # and I could hear them pull out a file cabinet drawer, grab the original build folder and say ... oh yea this machine was bought by so and so and has all of the following options..... it needed a particular part in 1992 and then they ordered another part for the machine in 1998 and so on .. BTW check out the weight of a modern import and compare it to the older machines, and they have not switched to aluminum to save weight.

You could try to call china and see if they can help you years later with a machine from there, my guess is :( probably not

best wishes in the sander hunt

Lou

[Dee Dee Martin]

Allen, I agree. I did misinterpret what they wrote.

Bob, I'm looking for a widebelt, not a drum sander. I already have the Performax 22/44, and it's just way too slow. I've got hundreds of linear feet of 1/8" material to sand, every week.

I'd love to resaw my material about 1/16" over, and then take it right to the sander to finish by taking 1/32 off each side.

Todd, are you talking about the Powermatic 1791250, model 1632 16" ?
I think it's about $1,300 more than the Grizzly. Powermatic 37", is over 11 grand, right? Waaaay too much for my budget.

This is for creating 1/8" and 1/4" material for scroll sawing.

[tod evans]

dee dee, as far as i know powermatic only offers one open ended sander? i`m not going number hunting.....in sanding accuracy is paramount, closed end units are stiffer than open end ones...horsepower=speed, the more you have the faster you sand. fast and accurate cost bucks, period. when you start cutting corners you give up something, the choices are yours to make. only you can decide how much lumber you need to run and how accurate the results need to be, from that point you`ll have narrowed the field then you need to make sure you`ll be able to keep your investment running at a cost that doesn`t break the bank. .02 tod

[Steve Rowe]

Dee Dee,
Its Northstate. The website for Leneave is; http://www.leneavesupply.com/
Hope this helps.
Steve

[David Klear]

Dee Dee
The Grizzly, Powermatic are just copies of one that Sunhill has been selling for over 15 years. Yorkcraft (Wilke) in PA sells a similiar one. I've have a lot of time on and older SUnhill and its an excellent machine. If its set up right you can sand 30 in playwood with little if any noticeable difference in the middle. Any of the good sanding belt suppliers will supply belts for about 25.00 a peice. They last a lot longer than the drum types. i would call Sunhill or Wilke and talk to them they are nice people. Some of the machines can be had with platens on them. Some like them some don't. FOr my money they are a better deal than the drums. unfortunatley I bought the delta drum for home till I can save the money for the 15/30.

My 02

[Chris Giles]

SCMI makes a wide belt that's called UNO (or UNI) that is made for the small production shop market. I don't know if they still make it, but used ones are very popular in this region and can be had with a bit of scrounging. I looked at one a month ago and was very impressed. 37" wide with a single platen head, it was surprisingly compact and was about $8000 refurbished. I believe it was 15hp, so was too big for my rotary converter. For me it would require a larger RC and more powerful dust collection. If I were in the market, this is what I would look for.

[tod evans]

chris, is this the unit you speak of? tod

32783

[lou sansone]

looks like a nice compact machine
lou

[Mike Hollingsworth]

DeeDee

I have the open ended Powermatic after having three Performax Units.
It is a joy. It does not flex.
I wish the thickness setting wheel was higher. It is bad on my back. Even better, if it were motorized.
My machine looks identical to the North State. These are the only units that claim to be 16". Sandpaper is easy to get. $5 a pop.

Mike

[Mike Hollingsworth]

There's a shop fox 15" open ended on eBay.
at $2800 a pretty good buy.

Mike

[Steven Wilson]

Yes there is a widebelt sander for smaller shops. Check out http://www.speedsander.com/ which is a 37" widebelt by Timesaver. IIRC it comes with a 10hp 3 phase or 7.5 hp single phase.

[Chris Giles]

Tod, I think that is the modern version of the UNO. The Uno is dark green two-tone paint and actually says "UNO" where yours says Sandya. It looks like the same machine- a real beauty. I'm green with envy!

[Tom Jones III]

There might be a different way to tackle this problem ... can't you work on the planer so that it can accomplish the same task? I've only done a little bit down to 1/8" in my planer, but with sharp knives and careful setting of the knives I've had good luck with my little planer. I would imagine that a spiral cutter head would help if you are doing tough grain.

[Dee Dee Martin]

Steven, at a price of over $7G, I'm not so sure I'd call that a sander for the "small shop".

Tom, that's a good point. I've tried this, and it does work. My Dewalt does go down to 1/8". Here's the problem.

I resaw, about 4/64ths over my final 1/8".
I then run it thru my planer, and take off one or two 64ths from one side.
Now my board is getting pretty thin.
When I start cleaning up the other side, if I take off a 64th per pass, too often I'll get major chip-out at the end. So, I have to barly skim the surface, in 3 or 4 passes. Very time consuming.

With a widebelt, I'd probably be done in 2 passes total, with zero chipout.

There's lots of drum sanders out there, for about a grand, or less, and I was just hoping there was such an animal in the widebelt camp.

My local milling shop charges $1.50 per min. to use theres.

[tod evans]

dee dee, 1.50 min = no cash outlay, no up-keep, mo mess....only you can decide if you sell enough to justify the money to own a widebelt....02 tod

[Mike Elo]

http://moritzdesigns.com/sander/sander.html

[Tom Sontag]

Well Dee Dee, if you are happy with every aspect of the drum sander except speed, why not buy another one or two? Less money than a big wide belt and except for the footprint issue, it should work. It's not too hard to feed two at once.

Re Mike's build-your-own: Anyone ever hand feed a wide belt or drum sander? How would that work pushing on a 1/16" veneer piece??

[J.R. Rutter]

I've seen at least one used 10HP 1PH Timesavers for sale over the years, but they are rare. You might try to get in touch with some used equipment dealers. They are the guys who are tapped into who is upgrading and getting rid of equipment. Try looking at the Woodquip site, and search by state. Some dealers list here and you can figure out who they are by requesting info on several machines. Don't remeber if you mentioned - do you have 3 Ph, or a converter? Those old SCMI/Sandya UNOs do have a good reputation.

[Doug Jones from Oregon]

Dee Dee...I have that sander and I'm quite happy with it. I purchase my belts from Klingspor for what I feel are very reasonable prices or if in a pinch, the local tool supply store carries them.

I frequently load the entire width of the table with frame molding and sand away....all day long sometimes. Just need to be carefull and remember it is a sander, not a planer and not try to go to deep. I have few occassions to need a wider sanding area but have found the open end option to work well and have been happy with the eveness of the flipping process.

I have owned both the Grizzly 24" drum sanders and a Performax and found neither of them to be a quick or consistant as the shop fox/grizzley 15/30, nor as nice to deal with when it came to changing grits. Just open a door, flip a switch and swap belts. No wrapping, no silly clamps to fuss with.

Also, good dust collection is a must as is a constant air supply.

Doug