Shopsmith Mark V vs. Separate Power Tools

[David Hall]

Hello,

This is my first posting on SC since a family friend turned me onto it around Chistmas time. We are finally moving into our own home and I am being granted half of the two car garage plus about an extra five feet for my woodshop. I have had the garage wired with several extra 110 outlets and could possibly add a couple of 220 outlets if necessary.

I am trying to decide if I should buy the Shopsmith Mark V to conserve space in my garage or if I should buy the standard woodshop power tools and put the larger ones (such as the table saw) on casters. The lathe with the Mark V seems to be a bonus, but I know that I will still have to buy a planer and a router if I go that route. I have been in the military for the past 9 years and have been living off the tools of friends and family.

I would like to build toys, furniture, and have the ability to evolve to different things. Which route would the majority of you go? If you could only have 5 power tools in the shop, what would they be? Thank you for your help.

V/R
Dave

[Jon Farley]

If you could only have 5 power tools in the shop, what would they be? Thank you for your help.

V/R
Dave

1) Table Saw
2) Jointer
3) Planer
4) Dust Collector
5) Table-mounted Router

Also, welcome to SMC

[Don Baer]

Hi david,
Yo're question has been answered in your previous post.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=31295

[Dan Zenger]

Hi Dave,

I have have a shopsmith and was granted half of the garage to use it. I was lucky to find a used one. I find that it requires constant checking whenever you change modes from drilling to table saw to make sure everything is square and true. It is also a little akward when working with plywood the table isn't as deep as I would like. I have used it to build my son's crib and a couple other small furniture pieces. If I were to do it again I would probably wouldn't buy one again. It's hard to make a multi function machine that excels at each operation. For example if you want to use the lathe for larger turnings you have to purchase a speed reducer because the standard headstock is too fast. I hope this helps...

-Dan

[Lee Schierer]

I faced the same question while I was in the service and wanted to get power tools. The Shopsmith is certainly attractive and seems to be a nice machine when they do their demos. What I did observe is that unless you plan out your project extremely well, you could easily spend half your shop time converting the shopsmith from one mode to another and back again. Also, I felt that combination anythings don't excell at any single operation. I don't regret buying my fixed base equipment. Now that mobile bases are more easily obtained, I see no reason not to buy fixed base equipment in a shop that has to be put away from time to time. I have mobile bases on some of the equipment in my dedicated shop just in case I need to move it.

[Paul B. Cresti]

Dave,
I do not know where you are on what you are willing to spend but if you are truly challenged on space, want the the portibility of moving the machine out of the way when needed and still have high quality machines...then consider looking into a full European combo. I can think of one particular brand ;) . Most of these machines offer 5 full functions: sliding saw, shaper, joiner, planer and horizontal mortiser.

[Michael Ballent]

I asked this very question many years ago and it pretty much boiled down to having to replicate something after you switch from one function to another... Say that you are drilling a board that you just ripped and you goofed the drilling and you need to rip another board. Well you have to change over back to TS function and re-rip the board, get it re-aligned rip the board and now go back the DP function and you have to try to repeat the whole setup so you can re-drill the piece that you just ripped.

If you have individual tools, odds are that your fence on the TS is still set from the previous rip so you just run the board through. And since you did not have to rip apart the set up of the drill press you can move along with your drilling operation. I think that the SS is in the $3k territory for a brand new one, and they depreciate quickly on the resale market.. I have seen complete setups with the band saw, planer, jointer attachments along with the main machine for $1000-1500 and I know that they spent WAY more on the new machine and the accessories.

One other item is that there is not real easy way to collect dust on the machine. It probably can be done, but man do you really want to muck with a machine or woodwork. And I will not even start to talk about the tilting table to make beveled cuts. That sounds like a recipe for disaster since you have to fight gravity as you make the cut. YIKES.

You do not need to get really large machines since you are still in the service and you will probably be moving around a few more times, but get high quality tools as you need them and pay cash for what ever tool you want. If you need to wait a few more paychecks so be it. To paraphrase Jim Becker "The most expensive tool is the one that you have to replace"

If you were planning on buying a new SS then you probably already have the cash to buy some nice tools. On your first trip to the WW store buy a high quality table saw and pick up a dust collector. If you cannot afford to buy both then wait. You lungs will appreciate you waiting to but both of these items at the some time. :D

Best of luck on your decision.

[Michael Ballent]

Paul, I know how much you love the MM tools, but he said that he was in the military so he needs to be able to move around, so the large combo machine would be great, but not really a good fit for him in his situation. I mean those beasts have to be at least 1,000lbs right. Try to get that into a Bekins truck ;)


Dave,
I do not know where you are on what you are willing to spend but if you are truly challenged on space, want the the portibility of moving the machine out of the way when needed and still have high quality machines...then consider looking into a full European combo. I can think of one particular brand ;) . Most of these machines offer 5 full functions: sliding saw, shaper, joiner, planer and horizontal mortiser.

[David Hall]

Sorry. My computer froze and I wasn't sure if the other message posted. Thank you for pointing it out.

[Don Baer]

Sorry. My computer froze and I wasn't sure if the other message posted. Thank you for pointing it out.

No problem David, Since you are new here I didn't know if you saw the original post and it had moved down on the forum. By the way welcome to the creek.

What branch of the military are you in and where are you stationed. My Son is a Corpsmen stationed at Camp LeJuene

[Jim Davenport]

David;
If you're still in the military, a shopsmith might be your best bet. I had one while I was in the Navy. It made a trip from central California to the San Francisco Bay Area. It went to Illinois, and Back to the Bay area. Then finally to Florida.
The Shopsmith is at best a compromise. It does a lot of things, but not a lot of things real good.
When I retired, I started buying seperate tools.
But saying that I made a lot of things on my Shopsmith, and had a lot of fun with it. Probably the biggest project was about 10 built in book cases, and a podium for the Legal Office, when I was Stationed At NAS Lemoore Ca during the 70's. This was right after I bought the Shopsmith.

[Steven Wilson]

I learned on a Shopsmith, it almost killed me twice, put me off of woodworking for 20 years. It's an OK drill press, good variable speed disk sander, overpriced lathe, and the worst table saw in the history of mankind. Either go for individual tools or a European combination machine. If you're on a tight budget, the smaller, lighter, quite decent MiniMax Lab300 would be a nice machine in a compact package.

[Rob Will]

I can see individual tools.
A 3hp Delta Unisaw with Beismeyer fence on a mobile base in the middle of the floor. Build a work table that does double duty as an outfeed table for the TS.
Install electric outlets at all four corners under the rim of the work table. Put most other tools along the wall. Position all tools in such a way as to utilize the open garage door for really long pieces.
Don't buy a radial arm saw, get a nice compound miter saw.
Also:
Band saw
Router table
Bench top drill press
Bench top planer
Lathe
Air compressor
Brad & finish nailers

Build storage cabinets with large drawers under the bench top tools.
I'm just rambling off ideas.....good luck!

Rob

[Sam Chambers]

David:

Welcome to the Creek!

I started out with a Shopsmith. It's OK at a number of chores - a multi-tasker for sure - but a master of none. Mine would never stay in alginment, and the changeovers from one mode to another were a hassle. It really pays to plan your work flow carefully. But it is certainly possible to produce good work on a Shopsmith.

The only place you can get accessories is from Shopsmith, except for precision fence systems from Jointech and Incra, so they're expensive. As others have mentioned, there is a thriving used market out there, and I'd recommend that route if you decide to go with a Shopsmith.

A new Mark V Model 520 retails for $3,400. Add the bandsaw for $500, the jointer for $445, the planer for $850 and the belt sander for $380, and you're at $5,575. For that money you could buy a shop full of very nice dedicated machines that would do the job better.

I sold my Shopsmith 510 with the jointer, bandsaw, and other stuff and got enough $$$ to buy a Delta contractor's saw, Powermatic jointer, Jet bandsaw and Grizzly drill press. I haven't regretted the change.

Bottom line - Given your situation, a Shopsmith might be the way to go, since you'd only have to move one big machine instead of several. However, if you buy it new, with the necessary accessories like a bandsaw, jointer, planer, etc., it'll break the bank. For the same money, you could buy a bunch of very nice dedicated tools.

[Michael Gibbons]

David, First welcome to the Creek. You will never regret buying full size machinery unless of course you buy junk. A tablesaw with a few accessories and a great fence will do wonders in a shop. It can rip, crosscut, dadoe, rabbet, and with jigs, tenon, bevel and taper. With a mobile base you can store it out of the way, and a router can be attached to a wing saving more space. I believe the TS is the most important tool in the shop.

[john lawson]

David:

The Shopsmith is a good machine, not a great one but a good one. And, I believe it is a very good machine for someone starting out, and restricted in space. Don't worry about all the hype about changeovers on a Shopsmith. What people say is true, you have to change over for every function; and it does take a few minutes. The important thing to do is plan your work so you don't have to go back to a setup that was tough to get right. If you buy high end single machines and lose or remove your setup and have to go back to it that is also tough to do and time consuming.

The Shopsmith is very economical. Buy one used, preferably a 520 and you will be very pleased. Most people will "grow out of the Shopsmith" over time. Most of us want dedicated machines. As budgets and space for machines grow, you will probably want to buy other equipment. Add it a piece at a time and you wont be disappointed.

You could also buy an older Shopsmith 10ER like mine. I have owned it for 20 years and would not part with it. It is heavier, made of cast iron, than the Mark V, simpler to operate, and my experiece it is a better machine in all but the table saw mode. As a drill press or lathe it is excellent. I put a DC motor on mine to make it variable speed and call it the "FrankenSmith" I have a Shop full of equipment, some of it very expensive, but I find that I always use my 10ER, and it is a pleasure to use.

[tod evans]

welcome david! i`m an advocate of seperate machines.....02 tod

[David Hall]

I have traded in my nine years of activeduty for a life in the Reserves. I just moved from Fort Belvoir, DC to Nashville, TN. I am in the Air Force and spent most of my time doing Intelligence type work. My prayers are with your son. Please thank him for his service.