What angle block plane?

[John Bailey]

I've always used a small "apron" plane for my projects. It is much smaller than a normal block plane. My next plane up is an old Bailey-Stanley #4 that works very well. Recently, I've felt the need for a regular sized block plan. I've decided on a Lee Valley, if I buy new, or an old Bailey-Stanley if I buy used. My question is, should I start off with a low angle block plane, or a regular angle block plane. I know some will say buy both, but I'd like to get one, use it for general work, then have more information before I get another. What would you choose, and what do you folks use each of the these planes for.

Thanks, John

[tod evans]

john, i only keep two planes in my bench for quick go to use, both are old stanleys. the block plane is a 60 1/2 low angle, i use it to fit doors, trim tennon cheeks, break edges, fit miters, etc. the other is a 92, this is used to finish cleaning tennons and to clean up sloppy rabbits......02 tod

[Alan Turner]

John
I have the low angle LN, and also a low angle Stanley 60 1/2. I have held, but not used, the LV block plane. I like a low angle as it does end grain somewhat easier than a standard angle plane.

[Michael Gabbay]

I have the LN 60 1/2 R. It is a very versitle plane. I can trim tennons and other tight areas. It does a great job on end grain. I think the low angle bed gives you a little more versitility, you can always add a second blade at a higher angle.

[Brad Schmid]

Like Alan, I have both a LN and Stanley 60 1/2. By far, I prefer the LN for it's heavier iron and adjustment mechanism. It is the tool of choice for trimming end grain, and I prefer it over the 60 1/2R or the 102 because of the adjustable mouth, and the fact that I already have a Veritas medium shoulder plane (which btw is another great tool). I have never touched the LV LA block, so can't comment specifically there.

Brad

[Bruce Branson]

I use a LN 102 and A Mujingfang short plane that is only 4" long.You do not need a adjustable mouth for end grain.The Muji has a A2 blade and I use it for side and face grain.

[Bob Smalser]

You don't need anything fancy at all in a simple block plane. I find the low-angle planes are the handiest for end grain, but they all work, and I wouldn't get hung up about it.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/2594266/48396786.jpg

Mine came out of my uncle's scrap bin when I was a teenager. After a new throat insert....see the solder used as a shim to bring it flush....and a salvaged adjustment wheel....it served me for 30 years and is now in the shop of my oldest son. I replaced it with a Stanley 18, which turns out to be huge in comparison. Now I'm looking for an aluminum model for the pocket, as the 18 is too big. Shoulda left well enuf alone.

Funny, I never felt under equipped at all til I started reading these tool collector forums.

[Jim Becker]

I happen to love my low-angle block plane and it suits my needs. (Happens to be a LN) There is something to be said for having multiple formats of these little guys over time...there is no one-best-tool for all situations.

[Mike Henderson]

I have owned a number of block planes. I think the low angle is the best one to get if you're only getting one.

The recent vintage 60 1/2 Stanley I owned was not a very good plane. I couldn't get a good edge on the blade and it wouldn't hold the edge. Also, the support for the blade is quite small.

The Lee Valley and Lie-Nielsen are both excellent planes. Both are good designs with lots of blade support and excellent steel in the blades - they take and hold a good edge. I like the set screws on the Lee Valley that hold the blade in position - it makes it quicker and easier to set up the plane for use. However, the Lie-Nielsen 60 1/2 fits my hand better - it's a bit narrower than the Lee Valley.

I would not recommend attempting to substituting the Lie-Nielsen 60 1/2R (rabbet) plane for the standard low angle block plane because the R plane does not have an adjustable mouth - it's set up with a very tight mouth for fine trimming. I use a block plane for a lot of applications including hogging a small amount of wood - and that needs an open mouth which you can't do with the R.

Try to hold and use both the Lee Valley and the Lie-Nielsen and choose the one that feels best to you. Also consider the set up time advantage of the set screws in the Lee Valley.

Good luck and let us know what you decide.

Mike

[Maurice Metzger]

I'd have to agree with Sr. Smalser, I use an old low-angle Craftsman made by Sargent:

31490

One of these just went the distance on that well-known auction site with no takers at $9.99. I was tempted to get it just for a spare blade... (No connection to site or seller.)

BTW John that signature is great.

- Maurice

[Ed Kowaski]

John, I'd say get the low angle. You can grind different bevel angles just like the LV bevel up plane series. So the low angle can be a standard block but reverse is not true. I think you'll find you mostly use it as a low angle anyway.

Ed

[John Bailey]

Thanks for all the advice. Sounds like most like the low angle. That's what I'll go a lookin' for.

John

[Gary Herrmann]

John, I've had the LV low angle block for a few years now and have been very pleased with it. I think you will be too.

[Mark Singer]

I have the 102 , low angle LN and a few others...those are great!

[Derek Cohen]

John

A short story.

I have some really terrific block planes, not as many as some, but more than I really need. These include a low angle Stanley #65 knucklejoint (with Hock blade), which is perhaps the very best user of the lot; a Stanley #18 knucklejoint (honed at 62 degrees), which is used as a mini smoother on very difficult grain; a low angle LN 60 1/2, which is now my go-to block plane since it just fits my hand so well (it is smaller than the #65, which is a large block plane).

But the first serious block plane I bought was the little bronze LN. I used this for some years, always marvelling that it could do everything so well. Even though it had a fixed mouth it was capable of the finest of shavings. It cut end grain extremely well - not as easily as the #65, but close. It was a pleasure to use, very comfortable to hold and, inspite of its smallness, carried great heft and momentum when it cut.

About a year ago I acquired the LN 60 1/2, its big brother. I sat them down alongside one another on the bench top, admiring their lines, when it struck me that the angle of the blades was not the same. The blade on the bronze LN did not lie at the same angle as the low angle 60 1/2, in fact it resembled a standard angle! For the first time since purchasing it I looked closely at the #number imprinted on the plane... 103 .... 103! .... I thought I had bought a 102!

There it was. For years I had marvelled how well this little LN sliced end grain and reasoned that it did so because it was a low angle plane, the #102. And in fact it turns ouyt that I had the standard angle 103 all the time!

So, choosing a low- or a standard angle is not critical. Personally, your choices are wider with a low angle since you could (and should) add a second high angle blade as well.

Pine endgrain planed with the #103

<div><img src="http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Woodworking/Bevel1.jpg" border="0" alt="" /> <br />

Regards from Perth

Derek

[David Abel]

John

A short story.

I have some really terrific block planes, not as many as some, but more than I really need. These include a low angle Stanley #65 knucklejoint (with Hock blade), which is perhaps the very best user of the lot; a Stanley #18 knucklejoint (honed at 62 degrees), which is used as a mini smoother on very difficult grain; a low angle LN 60 1/2, which is now my go-to block plane since it just fits my hand so well (it is smaller than the #65, which is a large block plane).

But the first serious block plane I bought was the little bronze LN. I used this for some years, always marvelling that it could do everything so well. Even though it had a fixed mouth it was capable of the finest of shavings. It cut end grain extremely well - not as easily as the #65, but close. It was a pleasure to use, very comfortable to hold and, inspite of its smallness, carried great heft and momentum when it cut.

About a year ago I acquired the LN 60 1/2, its big brother. I sat them down alongside one another on the bench top, admiring their lines, when it struck me that the angle of the blades was not the same. The blade on the bronze LN did not lie at the same angle as the low angle 60 1/2, in fact it resembled a standard angle! For the first time since purchasing it I looked closely at the #number imprinted on the plane... 103 .... 103! .... I thought I had bought a 102!

There it was. For years I had marvelled how well this little LN sliced end grain and reasoned that it did so because it was a low angle plane, the #102. And in fact it turns ouyt that I had the standard angle 103 all the time!

So, choosing a low- or a standard angle is not critical. Personally, your choices are wider with a low angle since you could (and should) add a second high angle blade as well.

Pine endgrain planed with the #103

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Woodworking/Bevel1.jpg


Regards from Perth

Derek

while I will hardly be presumptious enough to dispute your findings about the std block plane performing the same great job on end grain as a LA plane, I WILL state that I have both the std and LA block planes from LV and while either will cut endgrain, the results and ease with which the LA one cuts is superior. I wouldn't for a minute choose to own only one or the other. When I need to reduce tear out, I use the std angle and for end grain I use the LA. Not to say that I couldn't manage to cut end grain with the higher angle, but I PREFER to use the LA as it's somewhat better suited to the task.

Just my .02 worth...I'm hardly an "expert" on the subject of planing; just offering my observations.

[Derek Cohen]

Hi David

Mm .. I can see how it appears that I say that there is little difference between a low angle- and a standard angle block plane on end grain. This is certainly not what I was attempting to say. What I was saying is that a good (= thicker blade, securely bedded, more heft) standard angle block plane (bedded at 20 degrees) can do a very good job on end grain, so much so that you would be very satified with its performance. In this context, the choice between the two configurations is not life-or-death. For purely end grain planing, the low angle (bedded at 12 degrees) is my firm recommendation (particularly on the shooting board). Its downside is that it will be less happy on face grain that a standard angle version. As an allrounder, a good standard angle block plane is the better recommendation if you are only going to use one blade (such as one might expect from an apron plane, one that lives in your pocket). Since we know that the bevel up configuration permits changes of cutting angle by just changing the blade, if you are prepared to go to a two-blade or two-plane (one of each) so that you can dedicate a low angle set up for end grain, then a low angle block plane makes more sense. As I noted in the previous post, I have several block planes with differing set ups that are within easy reach on a shelf. I hope this clarifies matters.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[David Abel]

Hi David

Mm .. I can see how it appears that I say that there is little difference between a low angle- and a standard angle block plane on end grain. This is certainly not what I was attempting to say. What I was saying is that a good (= thicker blade, securely bedded, more heft) standard angle block plane (bedded at 20 degrees) can do a very good job on end grain, so much so that you would be very satified with its performance. In this context, the choice between the two configurations is not life-or-death. For purely end grain planing, the low angle (bedded at 12 degrees) is my firm recommendation (particularly on the shooting board). Its downside is that it will be less happy on face grain that a standard angle version. As an allrounder, a good standard angle block plane is the better recommendation if you are only going to use one blade (such as one might expect from an apron plane, one that lives in your pocket). Since we know that the bevel up configuration permits changes of cutting angle by just changing the blade, if you are prepared to go to a two-blade or two-plane (one of each) so that you can dedicate a low angle set up for end grain, then a low angle block plane makes more sense. As I noted in the previous post, I have several block planes with differing set ups that are within easy reach on a shelf. I hope this clarifies matters.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Hi Derek,

I have to agree with you, now that you added further comments regarding the role of the std block plane. It WILL cut endgrain well enough for most needs. When one has both planes, we agree that the LA plane would be the top choice, but it isn't a MUST.

Dave