I Saw it on the Internet… Blackburn Tools Shipped

[Jim Koepke]

I need to open a new email account. Currently it seems there is a lot of items coming my way from web sites I vaguely recall visiting. I tend to not give my email freely, somehow they got itk.

This one showed up in an aggregated listing this morning:

517654

https://www.reddit.com/r/handtools/comments/1bqb0f6/blackburn_tools_actually_shipped/

Looks like the wait time is two years, hopefully it's worth the wait.

I'm getting to the age where while shopping yesterday I passed on the bananas because they were green. I can enjoy a banana that is a little green, but these were fully engulfed in green.

jtk

[Rafael Herrera]

I don't understand the hoopla about these saws. If that plate is simply flat spring steel stock, cut and then run through a teeth cutting machine, there's nothing special about this kit.

[mike stenson]

you got a tooth cutting machine? You can fill the market!

[Rafael Herrera]

No.
I took a saw making class with Tom Calisto a couple of years ago. He brought his machine along. Teeth were cut in a couple of minutes, then sharpened for rip cuts in five minutes. Alternatively, one could cut the teeth by hand, which I suppose is also doable by anyone with the drive to make their own saws.

[mike stenson]

No.
I took a saw making class with Tom Calisto a couple of years ago. He brought his machine along. Teeth were cut in a couple of minutes, then sharpened for rip cuts in five minutes. Alternatively, one could cut the teeth by hand, which I suppose is also doable by anyone with the drive to make their own saws.

Yea, I've done it. It's not exactly my idea of 'fun'... FWIW, the kits were not unreasonably priced, I suspect that was part of it. Dealing with Isaac, however...

[Edward Weber]

No.
I took a saw making class with Tom Calisto a couple of years ago. He brought his machine along. Teeth were cut in a couple of minutes, then sharpened for rip cuts in five minutes. Alternatively, one could cut the teeth by hand, which I suppose is also doable by anyone with the drive to make their own saws.

Not everyone who can, actually has the time, machinery or inclination to make something that they can purchase ready made.
I enjoy making useful things like tools but it's just not always practical.
These are the definition of a niche product for woodworkers, I don't get the hoopla either.

[Jimmy Harris]

I've cut my own saw teeth before. While it's not the most fun I've ever had, it's definitely less difficult than waiting two years. And I'm a pretty patient person.

As for the brass spine and nuts, yeah, I'd have to order them. So I'd probably be waiting two years either way.

Oh, and I LOVE green bananas. I always get a little disappointed when they start turning yellow. I also love orange and lemon peels, so yeah, I've got weird tastes.

[Jim Koepke]

I've cut my own saw teeth before. While it's not the most fun I've ever had, it's definitely less difficult than waiting two years. And I'm a pretty patient person.

As for the brass spine and nuts, yeah, I'd have to order them. So I'd probably be waiting two years either way.

Oh, and I LOVE green bananas. I always get a little disappointed when they start turning yellow. I also love orange and lemon peels, so yeah, I've got weird tastes.

I've cut my own teeth on a couple of saws with a file. It's not a lot of fun, but it can save some money and an old saw plate.

Jimmy, have you ever tried a kumquat? They are like tiny pear shaped oranges that are eaten skin and all. I enjoy them when I can. I had a tree when living in California. I have a tree now that has had a couple of crops but isn't doing real well in my greenhouse. Will likely plant it outdoors this year and see if it does any better.

Give them a Google.

jtk

[Tony Zaffuto]

No.
I took a saw making class with Tom Calisto a couple of years ago. He brought his machine along. Teeth were cut in a couple of minutes, then sharpened for rip cuts in five minutes. Alternatively, one could cut the teeth by hand, which I suppose is also doable by anyone with the drive to make their own saws.

Come up to DuBois, I have the machine and carrier bars.

[Rafael Herrera]

Come up to DuBois, I have the machine and carrier bars.

That's tempting. Can your machine do 4 or 4 1/2 TPI?
A frame saw would be nice to add to the shop.

Let me know when you are in Pittsburgh, we could try to invade David Weaver's shop.

[Tony Zaffuto]

That's tempting. Can your machine do 4 or 4 1/2 TPI?
A frame saw would be nice to add to the shop.

Let me know when you are in Pittsburgh, we could try to invade David Weaver's shop.

I was there yesterday! Actually in David's neighborhood (wife was shopping at Ross Park Mall).

I am not sure what all carrier bars I have, and I'll have to dig them out. I bought complete outfit nearly 20 years ago, re-toothed a couple of saws, but I didn't have time to fully learn it all!

[Eric Brown]

Not sure what is going on with Blackburn. He always seems to be behind. Then I saw where he was working with Union Manufacturing on getting their planes made, but now there is no mention of him. They are making a carbide tool for scrapers with his involvement. Not sure if they had a falling out.

[Patrick Baney]

I don't understand the hoopla about these saws. If that plate is simply flat spring steel stock, cut and then run through a teeth cutting machine, there's nothing special about this kit.

For me, it’s more the milled brass back that I’m after. I can get the stock, but I cannot slit a .02 slot in it. Know someone who can?

[Rafael Herrera]

For me, it’s more the milled brass back that I’m after. I can get the stock, but I cannot slit a .02 slot in it. Know someone who can?

I believe in the old days the back was folded. Nowadays I don't know who does that.

Tom Calisto makes his own backs and cuts the slits. I think he sells them, as well as other hardware. You'd have to reach out to him and find out.

Alternatively, recycling and old backsaw is another option.

[Tony Zaffuto]

I believe in the old days the back was folded. Nowadays I don't know who does that.

Tom Calisto makes his own backs and cuts the slits. I think he sells them, as well as other hardware. You'd have to reach out to him and find out.

Alternatively, recycling and old backsaw is another option.

I've seen laminated backs, but have not heard of any that have used them. I have equipment to both slot or fold, but I do not have any employees with experience with those processes.

[Tony Zaffuto]

If there was truly a market for folded backs, I do know of a company local to me, that could do them. In the scheme of things, my guess is the saw plate is the easiest part of saw making, next the handle and then the back. I'm also a traditionalist, and prefer a folded back over slotted (I have never tried laminated).

[Rafael Herrera]

In Tom's saw making class, he told us that he couldn't source brass folded backs. He has a machine and a thin cutter.

I think it's not quite the same, the folded back pinches the plate to keep it in place. How does a cut back do it? By the plate wedging into it? If the slot is too wide, the plate will be loose. Tom's solution was to use superglue in those cases.

[Rafael Herrera]

I think, from an esthetic point of view, the hardest thing to make is the handle. The right angle for the handle relative to the lenght of the saw, the shaping of the handle, the crisp intersection of the curved and the flat sides of the handle.

If one is going to invest the time in one of these projects, the handle is the part that requires the most care.

Check out these saws, https://www.shaneskelton.co.uk/, way fancier than I'm willing to consider, but really pretty saws.

[Jim Koepke]

I think, from an esthetic point of view, the hardest thing to make is the handle. The right angle for the handle relative to the lenght of the saw, the shaping of the handle, the crisp intersection of the curved and the flat sides of the handle.

If one is going to invest the time in one of these projects, the handle is the part that requires the most care.

Check out these saws, https://www.shaneskelton.co.uk/, way fancier than I'm willing to consider, but really pretty saws.

Those are some beautiful saws Rafael.

As to the "right angle for the handle relative to the length of the saw," my solution was to make a mock up handle of pine and attach a piece to mimic the saw plate. Then the handle could be adjusted for comfort at the height it would most likely be used. It also allowed for checking to make sure the lower horns wouldn't bump the work.

Making my first handle from scrap helped determine adjustments before making a handle for keeps.

jtk

[Eric Brown]

I'll just throw this idea out to you. There are saws made by Bishop and later by Disston that have an adjustable back. The back is really two pieces of steel that clamp on each side of the saw plate. You can adjust to position to turn the back into a depth stop. Another example is how glen Drake uses two brass backs that are bolted together. I have removed backs to re-tension before. The folded backs are not just a simple fold but are over folded to create a spring tension. Think of it also as a shock absorber. Absorbing shock, say from a dropped saw, might simply warp the plate, and removing the back would allow the plate to return to flat. On the backs where it is slit, an adhesive, like epoxy, glues the plate in. Heat can soften the epoxy for removal, but it ain't fun. Matt Cianci will soon have a book out by Lost Art Press. Might wait for it.

[Jim Koepke]

There are saws made by Bishop and later by Disston that have an adjustable back.

My Bishop #10 is my favored saw when doing a lot of repetitive cuts such as dados or dovetails:

517788

One edge is filed rip, the other is filed crosscut.

jtk