What should I get for my first hand plane?

[Dave Schreib]

I'm looking to buy my first hand plane. I've never owned or even used one before.

My first task will be to flatten a 27" by 48" 2x4 pine work bench top.

My second task will probably be to plane the end grain on hardwood boards that make up a new exterior porch screen door. I could also see needing to plane the edges of this door to fine tune its fit in the opening.

Can I do all three of those tasks with one plane or am I looking at three different planes?

Either way, I am a fan of buying used tools on Facebook marketplace but of course I have no idea what I am looking at. I dont know what planes are worth, what's junk, what's a jem in the rough, how to tune them up, etc. I also don't currently have the set up to sharpen a plane blade.

Any advice people want to provide would be greatly appreciated.

[Jimmy Harris]

Well, you can plane just about anything with just about any plane. It's really more about technique than tool. But using a plane that's made for the job does make the job easier. So it's kind of up to you if you want to just use one plane for all of that, or three separate planes.

Traditionally, you'd use a Jointer plane to flatten the workbench top. Probably a No. 7, as No. 8's are even more expensive and hard to find. But either would work well for that. Though, if you're careful, you could do with with a No. 3, 4, 5, or 6. The smaller the plane, the harder it will be to get to flat, but if you check your progress often, it's not too difficult. Just a lot of going back and forth between checking and planing.

As for the end grain, you usually want a bevel up plane for that. But again, a really sharp bevel down plane would work fine as well. Depending on the size of the end grain pieces you wish to plane, you could get away with something as small as a block plane. And depending on how you plan to hold the door while you plane it (and your stamina and strength), there's no reason a large jointer plane couldn't also do that. It just might get tiring if you're holding it at a funny angle.

The edges of the door are usually done with a block plane, but again, pretty much any plane can do that. Just some will be more awkward than others.

In other words, it's up to you as to whether you'd rather make it easier on yourself and spend more money, or make it a bit more difficult and save money. Personally, if I had to choose one plane for all of that, I'd probably go with a low angle, bevel up, jack plane. But really, I could make do with most any plane you give me. In fact, I'd probably, actually, pick a bevel down No. 5 jack plane, just because I like using them better than the larger bevel up planes, but knowing I'd need to be more careful with my sharpening. But I'd rather recommend the bevel up jack plane for someone else, as I think it would be easier for them. Jack planes are a good compromise between being long enough to flatten a board, but not too long as to make them unwieldy to use.

If I went with two planes, I'd probably want a No. 7 jointer plane and a No. 60-1/2 low angle, bevel up, block plane. Of course the numbers I listed are Stanley's convention, but really any brand of plane would work. But the jointer would do the table top and most of the side of the door, and the bevel up block plane would do the end grain and any tiny spots on the door's side.

If I went with three planes, I'd probably stick to the two I mentioned above, because those would work well enough and setting up a third plane would be more hassle than it would be worth, for me. And honestly, I wouldn't hesitate to do everything you've listed with any bench plane, No. 3 or larger.

[Cameron Wood]

IME, #7 jointer planes are rather common, gathering dust on shelves since they don't get used.

I suggest a Stanley #4 1/2 or #5 from a garage sale or wherever, and a low angle block plane- worth it to spend quite a lot for a good one, and a dive into the deep and swirling waters of sharpening. The bench planes are abundant and need not cost very much.

About eight hours on Youtube should get you up to speed.

A couple of old planes that I was given just recently took over an hour each to get to good working, if not cosmetic, order.

[Dave Schreib]

Thank you Jimmy and Cameron

What about this Stanley#5 Jack Plane? Does this look serviceable and a good place for me to get started?

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/283054388214400/

[steven c newman]

#5 Jack planes are usually a good place to start...plus, their 2" wide irons also fit into Stanley No. 4 smoothers...

These?
517522

[Cameron Wood]

Thank you Jimmy and Cameron

What about this Stanley#5 Jack Plane? Does this look serviceable and a good place for me to get started?

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/283054388214400/



Yes, that looks good. I would spend some time flattening the sole with sandpaper on a flat surface, but others don't seem to care.

[David Carroll]

If I were starting out, like you are, I would get a No. 5 Jack Plane as you and others have suggested, and I would get a second iron. On that second iron I would grind it in such a way that the middle inch is flat (the way it came) but the outer edges have a pretty significant radius, back a full 1/16th-inch at least. This allows squaring a narrow edge essentially flat, but with the radiused edges you can take a deep cut like a traditional jack plane to flatten and thickness quickly. The other iron I would reserve for smoothing so just break the corners, ever so slightly, so it doesn't leave tracks. This will work as a smoother, and can work on a shooting board as well.

There are other planes that can do these jobs better than this, and you will soon grow tired of adjusting the frog and chipbreaker for this or that and swapping the irons, but this will get you started.

After that, invest in some sharpening equipment, (more important than the specific plane you wind up with, IMO) and a good straightedge. You can make a longer straightedge, squares, and various other tools you will need, but this will get you started.

DC

[Dave Schreib]

If I were starting out, like you are, I would get a No. 5 Jack Plane as you and others have suggested, and I would get a second iron. On that second iron I would grind it in such a way that the middle inch is flat (the way it came) but the outer edges have a pretty significant radius, back a full 1/16th-inch at least. This allows squaring a narrow edge essentially flat, but with the radiused edges you can take a deep cut like a traditional jack plane to flatten and thickness quickly. The other iron I would reserve for smoothing so just break the corners, ever so slightly, so it doesn't leave tracks. This will work as a smoother, and can work on a shooting board as well.

There are other planes that can do these jobs better than this, and you will soon grow tired of adjusting the frog and chipbreaker for this or that and swapping the irons, but this will get you started.

After that, invest in some sharpening equipment, (more important than the specific plane you wind up with, IMO) and a good straightedge. You can make a longer straightedge, squares, and various other tools you will need, but this will get you started.

DC

Thanks. Where does one buy a second iron? And can you link me to a good sharpening video? I would need both materials and technique.

[Jim Koepke]

Thank you Jimmy and Cameron

What about this Stanley#5 Jack Plane? Does this look serviceable and a good place for me to get started?

A #5 is a good all around size to start with in building a working set of planes.

This plane looks promising, not much to tell by two pictures. It looks like a type 16, built from 1933-1941.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/283054388214400/


Yes, that looks good. I would spend some time flattening the sole with sandpaper on a flat surface, but others don't seem to care.

Don't try fixing a problem when there may not be a problem to fix. The sole looks a little rough, clean it with some mineral spirits, rub some wax on it and see how it does before trying to flatten the sole. It is easier to mess up a good enough sole than it is to fix any unknown problem.

Save the sandpaper and look into > scary sharp < until you settle on a sharpening set up. You might try to look for other woodworkers in your area and hopefully find someone willing to be a mentor.


Thanks. Where does one buy a second iron? And can you link me to a good sharpening video? I would need both materials and technique.

I've bought many irons via ebay. They are also available from most woodworking supply houses. Lee Valley carries Hock blades. A new one with a chip breaker will cost more than the plane you linked earlier.

Lie-Nielsen has some good sharpening videos. At Youtube search > lie nielsen sharpening < There are less expensive sharpening guides. For some, it is easier to just learn freehand sharpening.

jtk

[mike stenson]

Rob Cosman's got a good freehand sharpening video, something like 36 seconds to sharp (I think was the name of it) as well.

there's also How to restore a hand plane by mortise & tenon magazine.. Which stays simple, which I like.

[steven c newman]

For the price of shipping one to you $19...I can send a No. 5 Stanley Jack plane to your address...sharpened and ready to go.

Better yet, just PM your Mailing Address...and I will send it out tomorrow's Mail.

[David Carroll]

Thanks. Where does one buy a second iron? And can you link me to a good sharpening video? I would need both materials and technique.

I just typed "replacement iron for Stanley No. 5 plane" on ebay, and found dozens, they range in price from 20-30 bucks for serviceable ones.

Sharpening... That's a whole other issue. I will tell you what I do now, and what I would do if I were starting out.

I now use diamond stones. I buy them from Sharpeningsupplies . com

I get the DMT brand, the dia-sharp kit. There are four stones from extra coarse to extra fine. They come in lengths of 6, 8, 10, and now 11-inch lengths. I got the 10-inch lengths 8-years ago and they're still going strong. I will likely add the new extra extra coarse 11-inch stone for heavy grinding, and get rid of my Tormek. Then strop with leather and some compound, choose the color you like, I've never seen that it makes a lot of difference.

If I was starting out today, I would get three thin diamond stones. Look at Amazon, they have Asian imports for less than $15.00 each. Then look up Paul Sellers: Edge sharpening for under £10. He has a method of using contact cement to glue the plates to plywood to make an inexpensive setup for less than $50.00. I think it's the best way to get up and running quickly. All you then need is a strop.

DC

[Jimmy Harris]

A Stanley No. 5 or equivalent would be a great starting point. That was my first hand plane (other than some nearly worthless block planes), and I did everything with it for a long time. They call it a jack plane, because it's the quintessential jack of all trades sized plane. It's still my most used plane.

As for how to set up and sharpen a plane, there are a million YouTube videos that go over that. There are also a million opinions, techniques, and styles that vary. Which is best is largely up to you. Just watch a few and see which ones look the easiest for you and give it a try.

I wouldn't mess with flattening the sole or buying a second iron. Those may be things you'll want to do later, but when you're just getting started out, keep it simple. Flattening soles and regrinding irons takes a bit of time, and if you're not careful, you can make things worse. I've bought a bunch of old hand planes, and while all of them "needed" the soles flattened, none of them needed it bad enough that they wouldn't do a fine job, as it came to me. Save that for when you have the free time and want to take it from "great" to "even better". And as for the second iron, you might find yourself like me where instead of getting a second iron, you just get a second plane. That saves you time from having to switch out and reset irons. And if you keep your eyes peeled, you will likely run across a few at prices too good to pass up. And this way, you'll have an excuse to buy them!

I don't collect planes. But I do own a bunch because they all have different uses. Which means for someone who doesn't collect them, I still have quite a collection!

[Eric Brown]

Thanks. Where does one buy a second iron? And can you link me to a good sharpening video? I would need both materials and technique.

A good book on sharpening is "Sharpen This" by Lost Art Press. https://lostartpress.com/collections/all-books-1/products/sharpen-this

It covers all the different ways to sharpen.

[glenn bradley]

Hard to go wrong with a No 5 or a low angle jack.

[Dave Schreib]

For the price of shipping one to you $19...I can send a No. 5 Stanley Jack plane to your address...sharpened and ready to go.

Better yet, just PM your Mailing Address...and I will send it out tomorrow's Mail.

That's outrageously generous. I'd like to venmo you $ for it. I really love the idea that someone who knows how a plane is supposed to work has used it and thinks that it works as it should. That takes a big variable out of this process for me.

Thank you so much!

[steven c newman]

It is called: Paying it Forward....and I tend to do quite a bit of it...just need an address to send this to...

[Dave Schreib]

PM sent. Thanks again.

[Luis Reyes]

I think you got some good advice already but one thing I learned the hard way is that I tried going cheap with my first two planes (one had a bent blade that I didn't even know wasn't supposed to be like that!). They were not fun to sharpen and I just couldn't get them to work properly. I almost gave up, however at the advice of an instructor I bought a #5 millers falls from a dealer and although I paid more for it than fb marketplace it was what I needed to fall in love with hand planes. It was ready to go straight away and it would sharpen relatively easily. I think you got an offer already for one here which is great as it'll work "out of the box".

Enjoy the journey!

[Cameron Wood]

Don't try fixing a problem when there may not be a problem to fix. The sole looks a little rough, clean it with some mineral spirits, rub some wax on it and see how it does before trying to flatten the sole. It is easier to mess up a good enough sole than it is to fix any unknown problem.

Save the sandpaper and look into > scary sharp < until you settle on a sharpening set up. You might try to look for other woodworkers in your area and hopefully find someone willing to be a mentor.



I've bought many irons via ebay. They are also available from most woodworking supply houses. Lee Valley carries Hock blades. A new one with a chip breaker will cost more than the plane you linked earlier.

Lie-Nielsen has some good sharpening videos. At Youtube search > lie nielsen sharpening < There are less expensive sharpening guides. For some, it is easier to just learn freehand sharpening.

jtk



You could say the same thing about sharpening: Don't try fixing a problem when it might be OK. You could mess up the iron trying to sharpen it. Just rub some wax on it, it's good enough.:rolleyes:

[Jim Koepke]

You could say the same thing about sharpening: Don't try fixing a problem when it might be OK. You could mess up the iron trying to sharpen it. Just rub some wax on it, it's good enough.:rolleyes:

Sharpness is easy to test. Sometimes it is easy to see by eye.

Flatness can also be checked with tools and knowledgable examination.

It helps to know what problem needs to be fixed before starting to fix it.

jtk

[Charles Edward]

A No. 7, but with a spare blade that you've shaped to have a pretty profound curve to it. Some call it "camber" but whatever. Shape the end on a coarse oilstone, not at the grinder. If you don't know how to hone it won't matter what you buy because nothing will work as it should.

[steven c newman]

Box will get mailed today....there IS a little surprise inside..be careful when you open it....will PM a tracking number when I get one.

[Mark Rainey]

Steve comes up big again! Wow. What Generosity.

[Dave Schreib]

Steve comes up big again! Wow. What Generosity.

Agreed.

Now I have to actually make something with that plane that's worthy of the generosity. Not sure I'm up to that challenge!

[steven c newman]

Scheduled delivery is this coming Saturday's Mail..

[Dave Schreib]

Thank you Steve!

[John C Cox]

Very nice and awesome generosity from Steve. If nothing had turned up, I was going to suggest a Woodcraft Woodriver brand plane. They come in good out of the box and use a normal, high carbon steel iron that is easy to keep sharp.

Best of luck with your new toy.

[steven c newman]

Was marked as delivered, today.....Let me know how it went.

[Dave Schreib]

517689517690517688

Look what the Easter Bunny brought me!

Not one but two hand planes. A number 5 and a number 4.

I was working on this pine workbench when they were delivered and they went to work immediately. I took down some high spots on the table top and I planned the ends to remove some ugly saw marks. I've never used a hand plane before but I fiddled with the various adjustments and I was able to take shavings almost immediately. There's going to be a learning curve but I can see how these tools are invaluable for certain tasks.

I am ordering the "scary sharp" deluxe sharpening system from Taylor Tools and I'll watch some videos on how to set these up and use them. But of course Steve had them razor sharp when they arrived.

Thanks to Steve for his generosity. I will look for an opportunity to to keep the generosity train going.

Steve, do you know anything about the history of these tools and how old they might be?

[steven c newman]

The Jack is post WW2 era....the smoother is ( I think..) a Type 12

Can't remember the exact years, for either plane...both are older than I am (70)...

[Jim Koepke]

The Jack is post WW2 era....the smoother is ( I think..) a Type 12

...

From what can be seen in the images, the smoother looks to be a type 10, only two patent dates, short knob & small adjuster. That would date it from 1907 to 1909.

jtk

[Dave Schreib]

From what can be seen in the images, the smoother looks to be a type 10, only two patent dates, short knob & small adjuster. That would date it from 1907 to 1909.

jtk

I think that's really cool. I can see why people collect old planes. Most antiques are decorative. These antiques are still useable and not obsolete. How would you rate these planes compared to current offerings by major manufacturers? Are they comparable? Better? Worse? Thanks

[Eric Brown]

I think that's really cool. I can see why people collect old planes. Most antiques are decorative. These antiques are still useable and not obsolete. How would you rate these planes compared to current offerings by major manufacturers? Are they comparable? Better? Worse? Thanks

Really depends on situation. If I was looking to do woodworking full time, I would first consider the new ones. The new ones from Lie-Nielsen and Veritas typically have better machining and thicker blades. However, the old ones can be a joy to use too. Main thing is keeping them sharp.

Then there is the question of spare/replacement parts. The old Stanley's win hands down here.

Then there is the question of specialty planes. A low angle 62 Stanley will cost as much as a new one from L-N or Veritas, but finding additional blade can be tricky. (I like having a toothed blade in my Veritas.)
Low angle block planes used you have to be careful of mouth breakage. New ones are made better. More blade choices.
Best thing to do is find ones that feel comfortable in the hand. I have small hands and some block planes are too large to be comfortable.
Another thing to consider is weight. I'm not a big person and I'm getting old. A #8 is just too much anymore.

[Jim Koepke]

I think that's really cool. I can see why people collect old planes. Most antiques are decorative. These antiques are still useable and not obsolete. How would you rate these planes compared to current offerings by major manufacturers? Are they comparable? Better? Worse? Thanks

With improvements in manufacturing technology, the planes made by Lee Valley and Lie-Nielsen do have some improvements.

When it comes down to being put to work, the antiques are just as reliable and the wood being worked and the resulting surface do not show or know any discernible difference.

As examples, Lee Valley's Veritas line of bench planes uses a different depth adjustment many users prefer. The Veritas planes also have set screws in the body at the business end of the blade to center the blade and reduce the need for lateral adjustment after removing the blade for honing.

The Lie-Nielsen planes are made with tighter tolerances than the antique planes ever had. LN also uses the Bedrock design that has the advantage of lessening vibrations and makes adjusting the frog easier. After years of using planes adjusting the frog isn't something done on my planes. Others may be more inclined to adjust their frog's position.

My main reason for purchasing LV or LN is to acquire planes that are rarely available or where the modern examples are decidedly superior.

First was an LN #1. At the time of buying this it was ~$250 versus the Stanley/Bailey version at $1,000. The LN #1 is starting to catch up to the Stanley/Baley model.

Next was an LN #62 to use as a shooing plane. This was for my comfort due to an old injury to my right shoulder. At the time the only shooting plane available was an antique Stanley. The Stanley, again, was a more expensive option which was often damaged. The LN is made better.

I purchased an LN #60-1/2 because of always getting outbid on the early Stanley #60-1/2 planes. Soon after two of the Stanley's became available at antique shops. The LN is a very nice plane but it is a bit heavy for my right hand due to an old injury. My Stanley #60-1/2s tend to get used instead of the LN.

Finally my last, serious, modern plane purchase was a Verutas shooting plane. It has a lower effective angle than an LN #62. It also has a lower effective angle than the LN #51 shooting plane.

This is only my opinion, 517711

jtk

[Mark Rainey]

Holy smokes! Two planes? Happy days!

[steven c newman]

Something about looking at a Gift Horse....

[Jim Koepke]

Really depends on situation. If I was looking to do woodworking full time, I would first consider the new ones. The new ones from Lie-Nielsen and Veritas typically have better machining and thicker blades. However, the old ones can be a joy to use too. Main thing is keeping them sharp.

Then there is the question of spare/replacement parts. The old Stanley's win hands down here.

If I were to start a professional shop I might buy a few of the newer planes for their being depreciable when filing taxes.

The abundance of Stanley parts is one reason almost all of my planes are Stanley planes.

The downside is Stanley used thread pitches that were not used a lot in manufacturing. Even the taps and dies needed to make one's own fasteners are not real easy to find.

jtk

[Dave Schreib]

Something about looking at a Gift Horse....

Please don't interpret my questions as an indication that I am not grateful for your generosity. I am new to planes and have no idea what I am looking at.

[steven c newman]

Was more directed at Jim K. and the remarks about NEW planes...those 2 planes you have were once very good ,everyday users. And, when they were sold, they were the top of the line.

You're fine, enjoy those planes.

I currently have a #3 and a #5-1/4 to get cleaned up and ready for work...

[Jim Koepke]

Was more directed at Jim K. and the remarks about NEW planes...those 2 planes you have were once very good ,everyday users. And, when they were sold, they were the top of the line.
...


With improvements in manufacturing technology, the planes made by Lee Valley and Lie-Nielsen do have some improvements.

When it comes down to being put to work, the antiques are just as reliable and the wood being worked and the resulting surface do not show or know any discernible difference.

…

My main reason for purchasing LV or LN is to acquire planes that are rarely available or where the modern examples are decidedly superior.

…

I purchased an LN #60-1/2 because of always getting outbid on the early Stanley #60-1/2 planes. Soon after two of the Stanley's became available at antique shops. The LN is a very nice plane but it is a bit heavy for my right hand due to an old injury. My Stanley #60-1/2s tend to get used instead of the LN.

This is only my opinion, 517711

jtk

Of course comments like mine are so over the top. Imagine a century old plane found at an estate sale being able to do just as good a job as a modern one that costs twenty times as much.

Then imagine my commenting about a new LN #60-1/2, costing about six times as much as an old Stanley #60-1/2, I have the audacity to prefer the Stanley block planes over a little matter of comfort.

I haven't been looking into any horse's mouths lately, but you often make me wonder who kicked your cat.

jtk

[steven c newman]

And turned a nice act of Paying it Forward into an argument...again? Never fails...

BTW: I do have a pair of Stanley No. 60-1/2 in the shop...both get used when the job fits..wasn't enough room in the shipping box, or he would have had one of them..

[Jim Koepke]

I'm sorry Steven, Dave asked questions and somehow my responding to give him answers has offended you.

May God help us if that is an argument.

jtk

[Warren Mickley]

I think that's really cool. I can see why people collect old planes. Most antiques are decorative. These antiques are still useable and not obsolete. How would you rate these planes compared to current offerings by major manufacturers? Are they comparable? Better? Worse? Thanks


I am a professional woodworker. I rate the early 20th century planes higher than current offerings. Nicer steel for the irons, nicer cap irons, lighter weight, nicer handles. If something were to happen to my present planes,I would pay a premium to replace them with vintage planes.

[Jim Koepke]

I think that's really cool. I can see why people collect old planes. Most antiques are decorative. These antiques are still useable and not obsolete. How would you rate these planes compared to current offerings by major manufacturers? Are they comparable? Better? Worse? Thanks

Before the 20th century many of Stanley's planes were adorned with decorative embellishments:

517784

The Stanley #45 was one of the most common examples. For more > http://www.supertool.com/ < Click on "Patrick's Blood & Gore, read the note, accept and then bookmark the next page for pictures and commentary on planes made by Stanley.

Mr. Leach's site has kept me up late many times.


I am a professional woodworker. I rate the early 20th century planes higher than current offerings. Nicer steel for the irons, nicer cap irons, lighter weight, nicer handles. If something were to happen to my present planes,I would pay a premium to replace them with vintage planes.

I am not a professional, but I do prefer pre-WW II planes. One example is for years two type 6 #4 smoothers were my users. One of them had repaired tote threads. They finally gave out after 10 years of use. Even though now my financial situation is better than it was in my early years of woodworking and new planes could be afforded they were replaced with two type 11 #4s.

Warren, we agree on a lot about the earlier planes having more appealing features. A1 steel is not my favorite material for blades. For some reason "heavier is better" seems to be a mantra for some plane users. As mentioned in an earlier post, too much weight can be a disadvantage in many situations. Pushing around a few extra pounds on a #7 or #8 all day can be tiring.

Though in my case, I'm too much of a rust hunter to willingly pay a premium for an older plane. Of course being retired allows extra time for hunting, removing rust and taking care of other problems a professional may not have time to do.

jtk