Planer advise needed

[Todd Schwenk]

Hello all,

I am looking for some input from anyone who has had a bigger planer. I just sold my 13" Dewalt and want to upgrade and I have been looking at a few different planers. 1 is the 20" Grizzly which I am sure could do the job and is probably an OK planer but I am a little disappointed on some of the reviews I have seen. 2nd is the Powermatic 20" that I am quite sure is more than a good machine. 3rd is the new Laguna LX/20 that appears to be very nice but I am not sure about the reputation of Laguna and their longevity?
I am looking at the 20" 5hp for power and I like the fact of using multiple sides of the bed to reduce a ton of wear on the bits in just 1 location BUT with that said I am wondering if I could get by with a 5hp 15" planer that has plenty of power and is $1K less. Does anyone have a 20" and feel it's just to big or is it just right?
I just purchased almost 15K board foot of Oak and my intentions are to plane 4-15" board for the most part (more in the 7") but I could "possibly" see 20" but I do have an open-ended 52" drum sander as well. Just looking for some input that might sway me to do or not to do:) Hope this makes sense.

[Jim Becker]

I've only seen the Laguna in a few videos, but it seems like a pretty nice, modern machine, and the 20" capacity certainly offers a lot of flexibility. There is no such thing as "too big" as long as you can physically fit it in your shop and your wallet. :D But a typical 15" thicknesser could do what you want to do, I believe. Keep in mind that 15K board feet is a "production level event" so a quality machine is a good idea regardless. In some respects, a 3 phase machine might handle that better, but that does mean accommodating it's eating habits with appropriate power provisions.

[Richard Verwoest]

I would also recommend a model that the head moves up and down. Not the table.

Richard

[Todd Schwenk]

Thanks for the input.


I would also recommend a model that the head moves up and down. Not the table.

This is a great point. Is there a specific reason? I would "think" Languna would have control on this as most machines I have seen from earlier models the head moves and not the bed. Are there accuracy issues this way?

[andrew whicker]

Some tools fall into the category of "bigger really is better" and planers are one.

I have an 18" and there are times when I wish it was wider.

But then eventually I'll have a wide belt sander and that will help satisfy those times to a degree.

The other thing to specify is whether you have interest in investing time and effort into a used machine. They can be a bargain financially if you are willing to do some refurb.

Segmented rollers are really nice when you go wider as well. Feeding multiple pieces at once let's you use more of the bed and is obviously more efficient

[Todd Schwenk]

Some tools fall into the category of "bigger really is better" and planers are one.

Thankyou. This is the kind of info I am looking for to sway me and in my mind make the right decision. $6k is not a cheap tool especially when you're trying to lie to your wife about it I MEAN CONVINCE:)

Now I need to figure out this table movement issue or if that is a long time ago issue? I have heard not to purchase a planer where the table moves before but I have to believe Laguna has a handle on this and if you look at this table the 4 corner move from what I see just like a Dewalt 13". I also like the fact they offer a 2yr warranty but I am positive Powermatic is also a top-notch machine but you do pay for that.

[Terry Therneau]

The advantage of a moving top is that you can set an outfeed helper once and leave it there, a roller or whatever. On the other hand, the heavier industrial planers all have moving tables, because it gives them a more solid mount/casting for the business portion. I have no trouble with the moving table on my 16" SCMI jointer/planer: the table is large enough that for a longer board I can start if from one end and have plenty of time to walk to the other and catch it. (Look at a Buss or Newman planer at vintagemachinery.org for the ultimate in "stout"; the tables move, but a > 2000 lbs the planer doesn't :-)

[Izzy Camire]

Todd, a year ago I bought a 15" Oliver that I like very much. It is a solid well built machine (Taiwan built). They have a 20" 5hp planer that might interest you. I have called the company a couple of times and they pick up by the 3rd ring and you get a human. The office is on the west coast. I am very happy with the machine and their support.

https://olivermachinery.net/20-planer-5hp-1ph-with-helical-cutterhead

[Bill Dufour]

I paid just over $400 for my 18" powermatic with 7.5Hp. Paid more then half that for a vfd and trailer rental. About the same for the grinder, It came with grinder bar setup. I see them used for 1,500-4,000 all the time. You need a lot of dust collector to keep up.
The same basic machine came in 12, 18, 20, 24 inch size

Bill D
https://www.ebay.com/itm/126329437258?itmmeta=01HSW3W5BYMM7EM279XBN56TFQ&hash=item1d69d23c4a:g:3YAAAOSwtLtlyrfb&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAAA0EIlKUobBPRx5CRHhGz978awU3d7Y lJ%2BIIN1fRTm4LI6jydoNVZe0lZg7fdskju1y%2BngpeIO7RK K8bdvMQW2lsBonwfVfPmWZIGVRLzdFo6Z%2BSK20NeL36gqcwn 6rASpq2F8fm8DV9PO4Jtm0yes4MHiGSYapU0x7vZtatHwEixB1 IFBP2YKQVgufbfNQwKeepapT3M5hXgTQgmKkCl0SOVVNNHGxhI e1SLWngOgjyt5bVJR0OnCOnwUyy78IhT70XZLQac4ltowj0gms c4ET3c%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR4TW8IPPYw
https://www.ebay.com/itm/363903864260?itmmeta=01HSW3W5BY2KMNKHDJ70KP6KSB&hash=item54ba5c4dc4:g:0f0AAOSwzaJX-i~6&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAAA8G8N%2BTXopUCMoDjbUcPnr%2BeLb S7eu92NwmudvVlX5RTbEv9fJ06O%2FI8f5a268diDrRQJsz53c A%2BvEc6cHZcj7%2FiF0WWwc%2B9DvwhYDD9kh%2BbLHxgEOUx kPcKXuCq98aExQmNrZloCLNg3oOmDGkq8RR6Y7ozf13wh7w2kR LnTAadGne1iBBEoUYssio37k50c7%2F6rv4MHOWliCOgA0cj0o kekQ%2BhyNahDeX4PDnJgCdtGBnSdTRys4vPqvcVFSnIGaGHpK eWh9%2B%2BrHpSKGg7lD7ZoZCaWH3lewfuPh8UzSxJctHGLtFJ oQi9KqX3ug0ftZQ%3D%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR4TW8IPPYw

[Todd Schwenk]

This is great input.
I have not heard a lot about the Oliver but it looks solid.
I believe I understand better about the movable table not being a perfect setup. I think I could get around that but it would take a bit more money and time.
I just purchased the Grizzly 2000cfm dust collector that will literally suck the hair off your head and I have it hooked up and ready:) I just need to build a hydraulic wood chip compressor to heat and I will be set to go.

You guys have given me some good info to look at. I am now starting to shy from the Laguna especially since I just found out that Powermatic offers a 5yr warranty on their product. I am narrowing them down:)

[Richard Coers]

I'm a big fan on old iron for a thickness planer. Back in the day I bought a 24" Yates American machine. You could take 1/4" cuts on 12" wide boards with no hesitation. New machines are not in the same league as these old machines. Oh yeah, I paid $1,200 for that machine. Sold it to my great friend years ago for the same price. That's because I can still use it in his shop. There is one on eBay for $4,000. https://www.ebay.com/itm/315087850601?itmmeta=01HSWGXH839TWKNTNMGP76VYJ5&hash=item495cb30c69:g:zFEAAOSwxN1jCudx&itmprp=enc%3AAQAJAAAA0O5N8c%2FvQgU4pA5ZSlG0X2IqIVu Ol9mnPpc2VqelK53lAn0uzxMWxWKouR8WLEbsRZKlv9NmUcf7S QPwR5wM6VtK4Q72G8KL%2F9R9yuAxjRBMCeN7O2mXneil1xLKW XNTtpKNhjbXhKQipVIJ0OpJjRvqnyWhOcqCjgl4mPKJB9Y6ZPA %2FpRoC%2B3URghDJpz097eYgfI2QpnL8sy3%2BhIy6uS2j%2B %2BqdEHB9PmAlCp7ZCwSnZSvyXy2jIS0wVVF14sciP1MehlzQg ymTbNOg2E%2FaYMQ%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR5yU9pDPYw

[Michael Schuch]

I have been pleased with my 15" moving table Sunhill planer for the past 25 years. About 6 months ago it was getting a little "long in the tooth" and I started looking around. I ended up putting a new set of blades in it and now feel comfortable it will be good for another 25 years. When I bought it 25 years ago it came out of a shop that made spiral staircases. It has had a very easy retirement in my hobby shop. Even though I use it a lot it doesn't get a chance to even work up a sweat any more.

About 6 months ago my brother in law bought a Jet 15" planer from Grizzley with a helical head. It is a NICE planer and left me with more than a bit a planer envy. While I was shopping around, before replacing the blades, I looked at a 20" Powermatic wedge bed. I love old machines and it was a dandy... but it would have taken up half my shop with its side mounted direct drive motor and really wouldn't have given me much more practical capabilities for the work that I do.

If you have your heart set on a 20" planer you would be best off buying a 20" planer. A wide drum sander IS NOT A PLANER and is not a substitute for a planer. If you have a supply of greater than 15" wide boards get a 20" planer. In my neck of the woods, Oregon, 15"+ wide boards (in any species that I might want to use) are not all that common and go for a huge premium when available. Truth be told I am pretty much limited to 8" wide boards, the width of my jointer. Any glue-ups that I do where a >15" planer would be nice would also need a >20" planer to handle. I usually do wider glue ups in two sections giving me a 30" width. A 20" planer would extend that to a 40" width for a 2 piece join. If I had a 52" wide drum sander 2 or 3 piece wide glue-ups would be a LOT easier than hand planning, hand scraping and hand sanding.

[Jim Becker]

This is a great point. Is there a specific reason? I would "think" Languna would have control on this as most machines I have seen from earlier models the head moves and not the bed. Are there accuracy issues this way?
A fixed table planer allows you to use work support for infeed and/or outfeed that you don't have to adjust height with every pass. This is particularly helpful when you are processing longer or very heavy material.

[Robert London]

Hey Todd, I just upgraded to a Grizzly's South Bend 20" helical. Very nice machine. There are few if any other machines in this price range that have a variable speed feed down to ~10 fpm. One of the main reasons I bought it. 5hp, heavy ~800 lbs. It's made in Taiwan. It's a copy of Grizzly's extreme 20" helical with a few extra upgrades.

In todays machinery market, there's not much difference in most brands 20" planers. They all have the same basic bones and often made in the same plants with different paint. Most all of the better ones are made in Taiwan.

[glenn bradley]

I'll just toss in that the fixed table / movable head is a good thing if the machine is able to keep the movable head stable and aligned. This should go without saying. However, if one looks at a lot of the reviews of moveable head machines (planers and drum sanders) it becomes pretty obvious that not too many folks can pull this off in a home shop price range. If you do a lot of long stock (I don't, I make furniture parts) extra infeed and outfeed support is a boon. If I did a lot of that I would pony up for a quality fixed table machine.

[Bill Dufour]

I looked at a 20" Powermatic wedge bed. I love old machines and it was a dandy...

I do not think Powermatic made a wedge bed planner. Yates made several sizes then they were bought out and sold with the Delta/Rockwell name on them.
Bill D

[Patrick Kane]

I own a powermatic 209 with a byrd head. As someone else said, there is a bit more to it other than 2hp and 5" of width. Most 20" machines have additional features like a pressure bar and segmented infeed rollers. It is also nice to have additional mass. Not that 500lbs is light, but you might have to worry about long and heavy material leveraging on the smaller machine. I dont know the price difference between the 15" and 20", but I do think the 20" machine is a different class--whether it is Grizzly, Laguna, Powermatic, Jet--and something you would appreciate for that quantity of material. For what it's worth, ive bogged down the 5hp PM before on feeding multiple boards/wide glueups. If you take a 1/8"+/- pass on something wide, then the machine definitely slows down. That might be a factor of the byrd head too. All in all, i am not totally enamored with the machine. I would give it a 3.5/5. The oil gearbox has leaked from day one. I reached out to powermatic on the warranty, and never had it resolved. They basically told me, "it happens, oh well. grab a rag". It isnt a constant flow of oil, but it drips occasionally and makes a mess of the side of the machine when mixed with sawdust. Over the last 6+/- years ive probably put about 15,000-20,000 bdft through it, and it has proven to be a workhorse.

[Warren Lake]

Michael you dont have room but you need a stroke sander. It can do more than a wide belt. you will never flush a glued up drawer on a wide belt and more. Good to have both but if only one I choose the one that can do more.

[Holmes Anderson]

As Patrick Kane points out, the difference between a 15" planer and a 20" planer is more than just 5" of width. Pressure bars and segmented rollers are also differences you may find but those features are not necessarily on every 20" planer. I didn't think that segmented rollers were typically found on four-post planers of any size. If the OP doesn't need to plane glued-up panels and gang-plane, and isn't obsessed with eliminating snipe without finessing boards by hand, then he could save some money by buying the 15" machine or, better still, a J-P combo machine because he isn't getting a pressure bar or segmented rollers either way. Keep in mind that upgrades like helical cutterheads are much more costly in the 20" size than the 15". Anyway, the OP will want to know all the features on the planers he's considering and decide which features he needs for the work he's doing.

[Warren Lake]

tersa head for 24" is 6k canadian more or less

[George Yetka]

Im not sure Ive heard anyone say "I wish I went smaller" The cost to upgrade later will be a lot more than the $1000 today.

[Michael Schuch]

Michael you dont have room but you need a stroke sander. It can do more than a wide belt. you will never flush a glued up drawer on a wide belt and more. Good to have both but if only one I choose the one that can do more.

I have often wondered how useful stroke sanders are. I don't think a stroke sander, wide belt sander or wide drum sander is in my future.

My adaptation is to use my horizontal boring machine for dowels to keep the pieces of a glue up aligned. Then strip the squeeze out off the boards while the glue is still a bit soft. I learned my lesson long ago not to put dowels too close to the edge of a glue up that will become a raised panel... I only had to make that mistake once. If I do a good job on the glue up there isn't that much work sanding the panel after the glue up.

[Terry Therneau]

You didn't say where you are. Out of curiousity I looked at the local craigslist: a 20" powermatic in Minneapolis, with grinder. This is an older, large, solid as a brick version.

[Mike O'Keefe]

Hello ! Have you looked at Woodmaster planers ? There made in Kansas City. I have there 18'' model and have been very satisfied. If you have a chance to purchase a old Oliver or Powermatic etc I would definitely do so. Mike O'Keefe

[Bill Dufour]

If you find the crescent/rockwell or yates/powermatic for sale under the old name they tend to cost a little less, since not as many recognize those names. Of course that means the machine is over 70 years old since they changed the names around 1950.
Bill D

[Warren Lake]

I have a woodmaster moulder, modified it and its good. Planer is a different story id pass on their stuff and go to heavy. Every time I replace a machine with heavier its better. Light and heavy get the work done but its nicer to work on a heavy machine.