SCMI Nova F410 jointer

[Tom Yaegle]

I bought a used F410 but it has no pork chop. No guard at all. Can some post a picture of theirs? The only guards I see are the European type.

[Tom Yaegle]

Sorry I should have Googled searched images first.

Owners with a parts diagram? Looking for guard # and bolt/springs to hold in place. Thanks

[Patrick Kane]

Hey Tom, I made a homemade euro bridge guard out of plywood and woodpeckers knobs. Quick build and it works well. On a 20" machine the bridge guard is not an ideal system, because it gets in the way. The suva and a few others solve this problem by adding a joint along the length of the bridge guard.

Search the forums for the segmented porkchop guard. I know Joe Calhoon linked a few euro sources for an excellent guard. Martin and a few other euro makers used this segmented porkchop. It folds down over the edge of the machine as it swings away from the cutterhead. I know Brian bought one of these, so you can ask him for details.

I found one of the threads. Segmented jointer guard (sawmillcreek.org) (https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?300365-Segmented-jointer-guard)

[Jim Becker]

I have a EURO (bridge) guard on my SCM Minimax J/P. I'd NEVER go back to a pork chop, especially on a wide machine.

[Warren Lake]

dont have guards but will work something out at some point. It wont be pork chop and it wont be euro if so some time of folding thing that is not in the way or.

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[Warren Lake]

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[Tom Yaegle]

Thanks guys, I had not thought of it being in the way. Probably why it is not there. Will the segmented ones spring return? Or will I have to move and return it?

[Robert LaPlaca]

Tom that is a nice jointer you bought. The segmented euro guard is a SUVAmatic, IIRC Martin sells it in the US. I just use a standard euro guard on my j/p, as the SUVA will bring on sticker shock

Here is a YouTube video of a vintage Oliver 166 with the SUVA guard being used https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=ft6MFmjmzhc It’s a really slick euro guard.

[Tom Yaegle]

Well I got it cleaned up......mostly.516465 Both halves are done. I have yet to power it up. My plan for it was to put a spiral head in it. It has the Tersa knives, is the a good set up? I am curious to see if it pulls the grain, if it does it is out of there.

[Brian Holcombe]

I like Tersa a lot, especially with carbide. Definitely wouldn’t spend to swap to a helical.

On the guard, I bought a segmented guard from Panhans. It has a gas spring for a return system, it works very well and is not in the way like the euro and pork chop.

I bought it from GL Trade in Germany, the sellers name is Norbert Gruber and he was very helpful. Cost about $600.

[Patrick Kane]

I agree with Brian on the cutterhead. That is a whole lotta time+money for very few appreciable differences in cut. The chip size off a helical head is nice and the carbide edges do last a long time, but $2500+ will buy you a lifetime of tersa knives. My jointer is tersa and i use the run of the mill hss knives. They produce an incredible surface when they are brand new. If surface quality is the reason you want to swap to a helical head, then i would simply throw out the knives the moment the edge begins to degrade. I get a year and a half or more out of each set of knives(2 sides), and if you halved that you still arent spending much money. I would spend the money on a nice guard, buy new knives for the current tersa head, and see what you think after a month or two. I think you will come to the same conclusion as the rest of the people with a tersa head machine.

My planer is a byrd head, for comparison.

[Tom Yaegle]

Thanks for all the feedback on the guard and the Tersa. I am impressed with the machine and hope to find a manual for it. Even the wiring they did well. I have it out to see about a phase convertor I do not want to run it on my rotary unit. I just want to push a button to start and stop. 516716 I am surprised the finish on the top has machine marks maybe so board does not stick down?

[Jim Becker]

Tom, the grind on the tables is indeed to keep wide things that are flat from sticking. Without it, it can get "darn hard" to push the material through for that last pass or three.

[Warren Lake]

some old SCM was ground lengthwise so the lines run in the same direction as the material.

[Tom Yaegle]

Well they did not grind this one length wise.516742The grind marks or what ever they are arc out each way from the cutter head.

[Warren Lake]

One SCM shaper is the same, both combos have the grooves running length ways. Not a thing to be concerned about. Id say it wears a bit faster than a flat top. The combos are about 60 years old with a ton of use before i got them. They are still likely more true than some new stuff.

[Rod Sheridan]

I have a jointer with a Euro bridge guard, I really like it.

To make edge jointing easier, I bought a second guard extrusion and cut it in half.

Regards, Rod

[Phil Gaudio]

I agree that the euro guard works well: much better than a 16" pork chop.

https://i.postimg.cc/fRqDWjwW/IMG-4132.jpg (https://postimg.cc/zyh90hb4)

[Warren Lake]

the only time that board would be exposed is the last few inches and id just use the heal of my hand or cause im typing on a forum my push thing on the heal. I like the one push things ive made for a jointer as its so comfortable to use.

Cant tell how long it is but its approaching support for in feed and outfeed.

[Phil Gaudio]

Warren: It was the only picture I had at hand of the euro guard. The slab is going to be the seat of a shaker bench: it's 8/4 cherry 6' long. I face joint it without supports but I do use roller supports when planing it. I did use the guard when face jointing this beast, but the guard does not get in the way, at least for me it's not an issue. I think its around 60 lbs: machining this has been lots of fun! Phil

[Warren Lake]

figured it was cherry but not the Pennsylvannia stuff I used to get as its not as pink but photos change colours as well. Thos Moser gets a whole whack of prime cherry. Good for using support then you can focus on the work and not be strained keeping stuff down. I cant judge the size or length there but looked like over 70" approx. When i checked my machine tables they show me that past owners often didnt use support often just from the leading edge wear, its very little but shows. Its irrelevant in operation and I looked just more out of interest. Dangerous to not have outfeed support on longer heavier stuff.

[Brian Holcombe]

What is the euro guard actually guarding? I think the folding pork chop is about as good as it gets for a jointer (all of the guards for jointers are not great) the euro guard has the same exposure but also provides a bunch of stuff to be in your way on the outfeed table. This puts the operators workspace directly over the cutter head.

[Larry Edgerton]

Agreed. I have had both and prefer the porkchop.

[Jim Becker]

Different strokes. :D

I love the bridge guard and despise the porkchop. Maybe I'd feel differently if I did a lot of edge jointing, but I don't. I flatten, thickness and then do the edges on the slider. The fence on the jointer is always all the way back and the bridge guard is never in my way.

[Larry Edgerton]

One SCM shaper is the same, both combos have the grooves running length ways. Not a thing to be concerned about. Id say it wears a bit faster than a flat top. The combos are about 60 years old with a ton of use before i got them. They are still likely more true than some new stuff.

My first SCM saw had a planed top. I was young and did not know much and ground it to look like my 66. Later I learned it was supposed to be that way/ Some of the SCM machines were made in the Polish factory that made Unitronix and all of their tops were planed.

[mike stenson]

What is the euro guard actually guarding? I think the folding pork chop is about as good as it gets for a jointer (all of the guards for jointers are not great) the euro guard has the same exposure but also provides a bunch of stuff to be in your way on the outfeed table. This puts the operators workspace directly over the cutter head.

What does the pork chop guard actually guard? As soon as you push anything into it, it's wide open.

Same-same.. different.

[Brian Holcombe]

It’s guarding against things falling onto the cutter head from above. With exception to the Suva guard, the Euro guards leave a huge exposure when set for large material and also remain in the way.

The Suva seems pretty decent, but there is still a big chunk of mechanism in the way that is not there with the folding pork chop style guard.

[Phil Gaudio]

On a 16" jointer, face jointing a 16" wide board, a pork chop becomes an obstruction as it sticks out enough to get in your way as you walk the work piece down the length of the machine. In addition, as others have mentioned, once the pork chop is swung away from the Cutterhead, there is no guard as the trailing edge of the workpiece passes over the blades. And on a big piece of timber (see pic above) you might just be tempted to hook your fingers over the back edge: putting them potentially in harms way. With the euro guard, this is far less likely as you are forced to lift your hand up and over the guard once you get to the trailing end of the cut. There is no guard that is foolproof, but in this case, I see only advantage to the euro guard and disadvantages to the pork chop, particularly on a wide jointer.

[Phil Gaudio]

Warren: it is indeed PA cherry: Groff & Groff in Quarryville. I ordered that slab on a Monday and it was in my shop on Tuesday. They went above and beyond in terms of helping to select the perfect board for my project: highly recommend them. Phil

[Patrick Kane]

I had pork chops on my 6", 8", and 12" machines. I agree that i think you want a folding porkchop once your machine exceeds 12" in width. I now have the DIY euro bridge guard, like i said before, and i think it is very safe and convenient design for edge jointing. I dont want to say 'impossible', but something really has to go wrong for you to injure yourself while edge jointing if you set the guard to within 1/8" the thickness of your workpiece. I agree with Brian that it leaves something to be desired when face jointing 2"+ thick material. When you go thicker, it is even more ineffective at guarding the cutterhead. They all minimize risk, but they require different techniques. A euro guard makes it difficult to use push blocks. This is why you always see promotional videos of guys doing a very pronounced motion of having their fingertips hit the euro guard and ride over the guard. A porkchop is very convenient/easy to use a pushblock(s) in conjunction with, because the block can remain in constant contact with your workpiece as you work move towards the outfeed table. With a pork chop, the final exit cut leaves the majority of the cutterhead exposed, which is why i would recommend a pushblock with this style of guard. I think we can all agree the greatest threat while jointing is the entry into the cut and the exit. It is why i like a pushblock with a shoe for finishing the face jointing of a board. The euro guard doesnt play nicely with this technique, because you need to lift and reposition the pushblock prior to hitting the euro guard. Personally, i always taught myself never to have my hands within 6-8" of the cutterhead. I always lift my hands 18-24" as i approach the cutterhead and reposition them on the outfeed table. On the finishing cut of my workpiece, im always pulling it through from the outfeed table. All of your pressure and reference should be on the outfeed table by that point in the cut.

[Tom Yaegle]

Well this has been some interesting reading. I am thinking of making my own folding pork chop. I have not moved the machine into my wood shop yet. I hope to make it spring loaded, time will tell if I can make it work like I want.

THANKS for all the input. Tom