I need to build a new shooting board. And I need to go 'big.'

[Scott Winners]

My benchtop measures 24 inches front to rear. For my next project I have a plank of American Beech 14 1/8 inches wide, but I am going to have to joint both edges. I do not want to rip the board, run it through my electric planer and then glue it back together, I want to use it full width.

My current shooting board can handle stock up to about 6 inches wide max.

The biggest piece I will need to shoot should be around 14 inches wide by 51 inches long. So some kind of bench hook to help hold the board level on the shooting board?

I do also have some glued up panels of similar size on my build list for future projects, so I just want to go big and be done.

Is there a shooting board design online you particularly like? How many clamps is enough? I am done trying to hold a piece of stock down with one hand while shooting with the other hand. I am going to be using some clamps.

Thanks

511216

[George Yetka]

Once you get to that size it may be easier to attach a jig to the board itself, referencing the flat edge and shooting from there. Instead of making a big stationary shooting board and having to find support for the board itself. Kind of like the circular saw and large square trick

[Eric Brown]

Once you get to that size it may be easier to attach a jig to the board itself, referencing the flat edge and shooting from there. Instead of making a big stationary shooting board and having to find support for the board itself. Kind of like the circular saw and large square trick

You can also raise the slab off the bench with some plywood strips and use the bench itself as the board. It's probably not worth the effort building a very large shooting board unless you plan on using it a lot.

[Derek Cohen]

Jointing 1/4" thick panels ....

https://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/OneStepBack_html_m801f75.jpg

Use the bench as the shooting board ..

A second piece of MDF was layed on top, and then weighted down with bricks (to ensure the edge was flat and parallel to the bench top ..


https://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/OneStepBack_html_3607e799.jpg


A jointer plane was now about to shoot the edge square ..


https://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/OneStepBack_html_m15577872.jpg

https://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/OneStepBack_html_m34b74f22.jpg


Or .... a Giant Shooting Board :)



https://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/PowerHandTogether1_html_m4239290a.jpg

Shooting case mitres ...

https://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/PowerHandTogether1_html_m36aed45a.jpg

https://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/PowerHandTogether1_html_m1b0f1fdf.jpg

https://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/PowerHandTogether1_html_b7346e3.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Kent A Bathurst]

6' [or bigger] x 24" 1/2" ply - I'd go BB to ensure flatness - and 1/4" BB 6' x 20". Screw and/or glue together to make base of the "shooting board", with "ledge" for plane. Its actually a jointing board, if you want to be picky.

Imbed T-track spaced every so often - 16"? - in main field

Make a square stick out of oak, hard maple, something tough. Say 1" x 1" x 60", or maybe 1-1/2" square. Drill thru-holes for T-track bolts and add threaded knobs. Add an end stop at one end.

Now you have a 72" x 18" shooting board with an adjustable rear fence for alignment. You need to measure the work piece to keep width consistent as you joint the edges. I use shims to make minor adjsutments as needed, rather than dink around with the stop knobs.


I use mine to joint for glue-up, and also to get parallel edges. The LV shooting plane is marvelous at this task - the skewed blade and sheer mass make it easy. I have 2 blades for my plane - The factory primary grind is 23*. I have one plane with 25* 2dary for end grain, and one at 40* for edge/long grain. 37* & 52* included angle, respectively

Stand it up in some out-of-the-way corner when not in use.

[Jim Koepke]

Here is an old post with information on shooting boards > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?92355

The third post is by Harry Strasil (RIP). One of his boards is for shooting long pieces. It can be made to be disassembled if it is only needed a few times.

The tricky part will be putting a good straight edge on the platform piece. That isn't hard with a good jointer and a bit of care.

jtk

[Eric Brown]

Here is an old post with information on shooting boards > https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?92355

The third post is by Harry Strasil (RIP). One of his boards is for shooting long pieces. It can be made to be disassembled if it is only needed a few times.

The tricky part will be putting a good straight edge on the platform piece. That isn't hard with a good jointer and a bit of care.

jtk

I miss Jr. Still use his holdfasts before any others.

[Reed Gray]

Derek, talk about "Deja Vu all over again", I have envisioned building some thing like you show here for a while. Dangerous to plant ideas in my mind....

robo hippy

[Scott Winners]

Appreciate the responses. I think I have the shooting board for wide stock figured out, thanks to you guys.

I have been looking at various new planes to be dedicated for shooting.

I see one fundamental problem with R or L handed shooting plane. The vast majority of my shooting is going to be on 4/4 stock, which pretty well commits me to leaving half of a 2 inch iron on my sharpening stones as swarf. Plus they are back ordered.

The Veritas Low Angle Jack looks like a more economical choice to me. I would be giving up some mass, and the blade in the LAJ is not skewed, but I should be able to use it ambidextrously someday if I can teach my body to do it; so I could, in theory, use both halves of the iron. And it is in stock.

Curious to know if the Veritas bevel up irons can be sharpened in Eclipse style jigs.

Am I overlooking anything major among shooting plane options? I have never yet seen a vintage shooting plane local, but the local stuff runs about 50/50 on usable irons anyway.

Thanks again.

[Warren Mickley]

I think that in the time it takes you to make a big shooting board you could learn to shoot edges in a vise.

[Dan Kraakenes]

Make a Skottbenk.
Mostly used to make floor tounge and Groove.. but Edge jointing is certainly possible.
511296


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uhX5DgjSOnQ


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=N97nZLCNhG4

[Robert Hazelwood]

I guess if this plank is very thin then it makes sense to rig up something to plane it on the side. But if it has any thickness at all it seems way more efficient to just plane the edge normally.

[Reed Gray]

Okay, I am still fairly new to hand planes. They do not have infeed and out feed tables like the mechanical jointers do. I thought this always resulted in a slight crown to the 'straight' edge, and to get it perfect, after taking your passes down to one continuous shaving, you then start in the middle and take that crown down a bit and work your way to the ends. Correct? Probably not an issue on short boards, but for sure an issue on longer boards like those flooring boards Dan linked to.

robo hippy

[Jim Koepke]

Okay, I am still fairly new to hand planes. They do not have infeed and out feed tables like the mechanical jointers do. I thought this always resulted in a slight crown to the 'straight' edge, and to get it perfect, after taking your passes down to one continuous shaving, you then start in the middle and take that crown down a bit and work your way to the ends. Correct? Probably not an issue on short boards, but for sure an issue on longer boards like those flooring boards Dan linked to.

robo hippy

The "slight crown" is a result of pressing down on the toe too hard at the beginning and to hard on the heel at the end of the stroke. Let the weight of the plane do the work and with a little care (and experience) it is not difficult to plane an edge straight.

jtk

[Derek Cohen]

The late, much missed, David Charlesworth emphasised first planing a hollow before planing the board flat (or with a fine hollow). There is always a hump in the centre if the ends do not close, and a plane will follow the curve ... the shorter the plane and the longer the board, the greater the chance of this occuring. This is the rationale behind long jointers - they are less likely to follow a curve.

Thee is a limit to the comfort factor when it comes to large jointers. This one gets little use, but when needed there is nothing to touch it ...

Alongside a #7 ...

https://i.postimg.cc/Fz5gMGVM/Coopers-Jointer-html-m36d2149a.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

For edges, best used with a fence as it is difficult to balance on its own ...

https://i.postimg.cc/rs1CMWhK/Coopers-Jointer-html-9acf06d.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

It was originally designed as a Cooper's Jointer ...

https://i.postimg.cc/RCKT75M4/Coopers-Jointer-html-m80db958.jpg (https://postimages.org/)

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Warren Mickley]

The late, much missed, David Charlesworth emphasised first planing a hollow before planing the board flat (or with a fine hollow). There is always a hump in the centre if the ends do not close, and a plane will follow the curve ... the shorter the plane and the longer the board, the greater the chance of this occuring. This is the rationale behind long jointers - they are less likely to follow a curve.



I don't think Charlesworth had much experience planing edges by hand. I watched a video in which he planes an edge and ends up .002 hollow and then says "I consider this straight" Really? Can you imagine trying to do a rub joint with two such "straight" boards?

Then he says "I think its a remarkable tolerance for a hand tool on timber". It is not remarkable; it is pitiful. It is reasonable to expect no light to be seen under a straight edge. There is no point in having a Starrett straight edge if you are not going to use it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqPP6-0jkws

[Eric Brown]

My benchtop measures 24 inches front to rear. For my next project I have a plank of American Beech 14 1/8 inches wide, but I am going to have to joint both edges. I do not want to rip the board, run it through my electric planer and then glue it back together, I want to use it full width.

My current shooting board can handle stock up to about 6 inches wide max.

The biggest piece I will need to shoot should be around 14 inches wide by 51 inches long. So some kind of bench hook to help hold the board level on the shooting board?

I do also have some glued up panels of similar size on my build list for future projects, so I just want to go big and be done.

Is there a shooting board design online you particularly like? How many clamps is enough? I am done trying to hold a piece of stock down with one hand while shooting with the other hand. I am going to be using some clamps.

Thanks

511216

OK, I have a solution for you. Take a interior door off somewhere and modify it into a shooting board. That way, when you are done using it, you can re-hang it and it will be out of the way. Too much?

[Kent A Bathurst]

OK, I have a solution for you. Take a interior door off somewhere and modify it into a shooting board. That way, when you are done using it, you can re-hang it and it will be out of the way. Too much?

Best post I've read this week. I like your style.

No. Not too much. In fact, you forgot a key detail: switch to pintle hinges for quick setup.

[Joshua Lucas]

I don't think Charlesworth had much experience planing edges by hand. I watched a video in which he planes an edge and ends up .002 hollow and then says "I consider this straight" Really? Can you imagine trying to do a rub joint with two such "straight" boards?

Then he says "I think its a remarkable tolerance for a hand tool on timber". It is not remarkable; it is pitiful. It is reasonable to expect no light to be seen under a straight edge. There is no point in having a Starrett straight edge if you are not going to use it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqPP6-0jkws

From my limited exposure to Charlesworth my impression is that he is rather overrated but I feel you're finding fault just to find fault. Two thousandths of an inch is a perfectly acceptable tolerance for practically anything made of wood. Between overnight variations in humidity, internal stresses, and the water in your glue you can count on the wood moving far more than two thou.

[mike stenson]

From my limited exposure to Charlesworth my impression is that he is rather overrated but I feel you're finding fault just to find fault. Two thousandths of an inch is a perfectly acceptable tolerance for practically anything made of wood. Between overnight variations in humidity, internal stresses, and the water in your glue you can count on the wood moving far more than two thou.

It's significantly tighter tolerances than the Hammer planer/thicknesser I just purchased.

[Derek Cohen]

I don't think Charlesworth had much experience planing edges by hand. I watched a video in which he planes an edge and ends up .002 hollow and then says "I consider this straight" Really? Can you imagine trying to do a rub joint with two such "straight" boards?

Then he says "I think its a remarkable tolerance for a hand tool on timber". It is not remarkable; it is pitiful. It is reasonable to expect no light to be seen under a straight edge. There is no point in having a Starrett straight edge if you are not going to use it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqPP6-0jkws

Well Warren, I wonder what David Charlesworth would say about your technique? ... Oh, that's right, we have never seen you planing anything! Anyway, he was a gentleman and would not acted as you do.

There are many ways to skin a cat. David argued that is was more reliable to make a slight spring joint than a straight rub joint - which is why he planed the hollow. He argued that it was possible to end up with a bump when attempting to plane flat .... as Tony appears to have done on his long edge joint ... and it was therefore preferable to plane a hollow. By hollow he refers to a 2/1000" over 20" (in the video to which you linked).

Good teacher, David was.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Tony Wilkins]

Well Warren, I wonder what David Charlesworth would say about your technique? ... Oh, that's right, we have never seen you planing anything! Anyway, he was a gentleman and would not acted as you do.

There are many ways to skin a cat. David argued that is was more reliable to make a slight spring joint than a straight rub joint - which is why he planed the hollow. He argued that it was possible to end up with a bump when attempting to plane flat .... as Tony appears to have done on his long edge joint ... and it was therefore preferable to plane a hollow. By hollow he refers to a 2/1000" over 20" (in the video to which you linked).

Good teacher, David was.

Regards from Perth

Derek
I generally follow David’s techniques and have had good luck. The 8 foot plus made me abandon them because I don’t have a plane long enough not to make too big a hollow. He was helpful to me personally through this forum and through email. He will be missed.

[Warren Mickley]

Well Warren, I wonder what David Charlesworth would say about your technique?

David Charlesworth said that my techniques were irrelevant because they were not designed for beginners. I think he tended to reject any technique that could not be done on the first try by someone who sat at a desk for some decades.

One time he told me personally that if I planed an edge flat and then took five complete shavings the edge would develop a "bump" as he called it. That afternoon I happened to be joining two boards, so after getting them ready for gluing, I took five savings and they still matched. Ten more and they still matched. In all I took off 100 shavings, then I got tired of the game and glued them.

[Derek Cohen]

Warren, this is the kettle calling the pot black. You refer to David Charlesworth as rejecting other techniques, but you do this. He was geared towards developing skills in beginners, nevertheless his advice was considered sound by advanced woodworkers over decades. You offer criticisms of the technique of everyone who differs from yourself, but never offer actiual advice what to do instead. You just say, "find out for yourself".

Incidentally, I do not view David as rigid - witness his conversion to the closed chipbreaker when it was discussed a decade ago. At the time he was well-known adherent of a high backbevel. Contrast this with the stands taken by two other teachers, Sellers and Cosman, neither of whom accept this method.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Scott Winners]

I appreciate the "use a door" idea. I may choose to do something like that someday.

My current plan is to build a pair of essentially oversized bench hooks. I have a picture of a mock up:

511374

Foreground is a thing I have learned to call a bench hook. It has a down hanging bit at one end that hooks onto the front face of the bench, and an upwards protruding bit to push stock up against, especially handy for sawing pieces too small for my leg vise.

For the mockup I used to planks of 4/4 cherry as the foundation. Long enough to be clamped down to the bench at the back with the wooden handled clamps.

On top of the cherry boards I have some 1/4 inch poplar for the workpiece to rest on, with adequate runway space on each side to accommodate, in this mockup, two block planes.

The two red/ clear/ blue screwdriver handles are intended to be stand-ins for the eventual back fences to be installed perpendicular to the plane sole after the poplar has been "run in" with the wee rabbet.

Using 4/4 stock for the base plates allows (should allow) me to clamp two panels that are supposed to be identical length to each other (with three end grains already shot) and shoot the proud end to flush rather than measure.

I think I have enough 6mm/ one quarter inch BB plywood to replace the poplar, but I don't see any 3/4 inch BB ply on my scrap cart tonight.

For especially long panels I made need a scrap or two the same thickness as the shooting hooks to support the middles of the panels.

At the end of it, if it works, I should be able to hang two somewhat oversized but moderately light weight bench hooks on a nail somewhere and not have to wrestle with a door.

[mike stenson]

Thats essentially what I did when I made the cherry credenza. It worked well enough. Although, Derek's big board may be copied, once I'm done with yet another show reiteration.

[Rafael Herrera]

From my limited exposure to Charlesworth my impression is that he is rather overrated but I feel you're finding fault just to find fault. Two thousandths of an inch is a perfectly acceptable tolerance for practically anything made of wood. Between overnight variations in humidity, internal stresses, and the water in your glue you can count on the wood moving far more than two thou.

When joining two edges for a seamless joint using an array of clamps to close the gaps, two thousands might be ok. Doing better than that simplifies things, allowing you to do rubbed joints, for example.

It may require some practice, but it certainly is not an unattainable skill. It was done routinely in times past with less high tech equipment, we can at the very least reproduce it with the tools available.

Also, I don't think it is beeing suggested that one should build furniture to better than two thousand tolerance, that's absurd. Use accuracy where it counts and simplify your work.

[Jim Koepke]

Also, I don't think it is beeing suggested that one should build furniture to better than two thousand tolerance, that's absurd.

Do your boards edge join without light shining through?

Do your dovetails go together tight, without gaps?

Do your mortise and tenon joints go together without unsightly gaps?

Does your chewing gum lose its flavor on the bedpost over night? (okay, ignore this one, I couldn't resist)

All of the above? (except the last one) Then you may be working to tolerances of less than 0.002" without even knowing it.

jtk

[Rafael Herrera]

What I had in mind was that not all of the parts would be expected to be built to such small tolerances. That's why I said to achieve precision where it mattered.

Yeah, my jointed boards don't have gaps, but my dovetails and other joints? No, they're not that good.