Helping a friend with plumbing

[Lee Schierer]

A friend asked me to help him with a plumbing problem. The copper drain line from the kitchen sink into the basement was leaking a a fitting up in the joist space along an outside wall. I was able to remove the piece of piping in question, but had to cut the horizontal drain pipe in the basement. We decided to use 1-1/2" pvc from the trap to the basement to clean up the convoluted plumbing under the sink. The problem we ran into with this plan is the copper pipe is 1-5/8 OD. We can't find a fitting that will connect the pvc to the copper. I'm open to suggestions on how make a reliable long lived connection.

1-1/2" pvc compression fittings won't accept the 1-5/8 copper.

[Brian Runau]

A friend asked me to help him with a plumbing problem. The copper drain line from the kitchen sink into the basement was leaking a a fitting up in the joist space along an outside wall. I was able to remove the piece of piping in question, but had to cut the horizontal drain pipe in the basement. We decided to use 1-1/2" pvc from the trap to the basement to clean up the convoluted plumbing under the sink. The problem we ran into with this plan is the copper pipe is 1-5/8 OD. We can't find a fitting that will connect the pvc to the copper. I'm open to suggestions on how make a reliable long lived connection.

1-1/2" pvc compression fittings won't accept the

Is there a rubber band clamp fitting you can use to transition? Brian

[Doug Garson]

I think your 1 5/8" OD copper is actually nominal 1 1/2" copper pipe so you might be able to use a 1 1/2" copper to 1 1/2" PVC rubber connector as Brian suggested. Best bet is to go to a plumbing supply store rather than a big box store to get advice on the correct fitting. The fact it is a drain is in your favor, a pressurized pipe connection would be more likely to fail if not perfect. If it was smaller a Sharkbite fitting would be the way to go but I don't think they come that big.

[roger wiegand]

Fernco has got to make something that will work! Take your two pieces of pipe to real plumbing supply store (eg not the Borg) and ask them for an appropriate coupler.

[Tom M King]

1-1/2” copper female threaded adapter to male PVC adapter. I don’t use female plastic threads for anything.

[Tom M King]

https://www.supplyhouse.com/Bluefin-NHTCB150-1-1-2-x-1-1-2-No-Hub-Transition-Coupling-Cast-Iron-PVC-Steel-to-Copper

[Jason Roehl]

I second the two suggestions above. Either sweat on a copper female threaded adapter to the existing copper, then screw in a male PVC adapter, (more work), or use a Fernco of appropriate size (much less work).

And don’t think that Fernco is somehow a “shortcut” or “less permanent solution.” They’re used all the time in commercial settings for sewer line repairs, and water supply line repairs (under pressure).

[George Yetka]

I think the fernco is the best option. Its easy.
How far does the copper go and does it transition into something else? cast/pvc/ etc? if it goes a little farther and transtions into something else I would take the pvc all the way there.

You can definitely transition to thread to make the connection. But thats extra joints and threads have a greater chance of leaking over the fernco
You can use one of these but youd have to be gentle soldering the fitting
https://www.supplyhouse.com/Sioux-Chief-685-P6-1-1-2-PVC-x-1-1-2-Male-CTS-MetalHead-Press-Fit-Adapter

[Cameron Wood]

https://www.homedepot.com/p/The-Plumber-s-Choice-Shielded-1-1-2-in-Transition-Coupling-Connects-Cast-Iron-Plastic-or-Steel-to-1-1-2-in-Copper-or-1-1-4-in-Plastic-H-38337/319313709

[Ken Fitzgerald]

I have been pleased with Fernco products I have purchased and used.

[Bill George]

I have been pleased with Fernco products I have purchased and used.

Ditto. And plastic threads, my Mom had a house piped with CPVC, threaded plastic to metal faucets and They All leaked. I spent my visits replacing with copper to PVC fittings, Teflon tape of course.

[Lee Schierer]

Well, we purchased the Fernco and the fittings we needed for the PVC portion. We hooked it all up to day and had a leak on the first test right at the Fernco fitting on the copper side of the joint. Upon close examination, we noted The walls that the tubing had a fold originating under the Fernco. The copper is too thin along its entire link to support even mild pressure from the Fernco. The walls of the copper are less than 0.026 thick, so it either buckles or cracks. This piping has been in use since 1963.

Plan B will be tried tomorrow. We will remove all the copper and sweat in a new copper pipe stub in the side of the 4" stack fitting. There is not sufficient metal for the Fernco to grip the 45 degree angled side inlet to the 4" copper stack. The top of the angled inlet fitting is only 3/8" long.
507873

[Doug Garson]

The only thing more fun than plumbing is fixing old plumbing.:cool: Good luck.

[Bill Dufour]

It is not code to hide a fernco inside a wall. they must be visible so any leaks can be seen easily.
Bill D

[Lee Schierer]

It is not code to hide a fernco inside a wall. they must be visible so any leaks can be seen easily.
Bill D

As you can see in the photo in my update post, the Fernco fitting will be visible as it will be very close to the 4" sewer pipe.

[Bill George]

It is not code to hide a fernco inside a wall. they must be visible so any leaks can be seen easily.
Bill D

https://www.fernco.com/downloads/installation-instructions/fernco-flexible-coupling-in-ground-installation

[Cameron Wood]

It is not code to hide a fernco inside a wall. they must be visible so any leaks can be seen easily.
Bill D

I've done that endless times, never had an inspector take issue.

[Tom M King]

I recently gutted a little four bathroom building on our point. We're changing the layout to two larger bathrooms in anticipation of getting the point ready to start renting it for weddings. All the interior walls were completely removed. The building was built in 1962 just before the lake was flooded, or so I'm told.

Every ABS pipe that was stubbed up through the slab floor was buried inside an interior wall. I think there were 8 such pipes stubbed up. Every one had been connected, not even remotely meticulously for alignment, with a Fernco to the pipe coming down from above.

Not one showed any sign of leaking. The framing lumber still looked as clean as it probably did when they built the walls.

I know this was only a small sample size of eight 60 year old connections, but it certainly did away with any worry that I have about them.

[Bill Dufour]

The code may have changed. I think the metal sleeved ones are more allowed. I have never seen more then 2" copper drains. everthing bigger was cast iron or clay, now it is plastic.
Bill D

[Tom M King]

I know of some houses built in 1934 that the whole DWV system is copper, including 4” main lines that connect to city sewer.

[Bill George]

I've done that endless times, never had an inspector take issue. It is not code to hide a fernco inside a wall. they must be visible so any leaks can be seen easily.
Bill D

Cameron yes Correct its just DWV and its tested before its covered up, the requirement that I know of is it all has to be stainless steel including the clamps if its underground.

[Lee Schierer]

The job has been completed. When we cut the 45 degree angle piece we found that the copper walls were at least twice as thick as the horizontal pipe that was splitting. We decided not to try to remove the stub for fear of loosening a joint in the 4" line. The drain is now connected with 1-1/2" pvc into a 6 inch stub of copper using a copper to pvc Fernso fitting. We tested the piping with lots of hot water to check for leaks.

Thanks everyone for you suggestions.

[Clint Baxter]

Where we’re located you have to use shielded Fernco’s when placed underground. Otherwise an unshielded connector is allowed for all DWV connections. Always best to talk to AHJ to ensure it meets code.

Clint

[Bill George]

Correct always check with local Code enforcement, not someone online. PS If you look at the Fernco website they have lots and lots of alternative like the Y 1 1/2 to 4 inch they might have used?