A rack

[Jack Dover]

Crossposting a little rack I've built over a weekend a week ago. Originally it was called a spoon rack (I have failed to even imagine such a spoon), but it seems it's better suited for coffee/tea/spices storage. This rack was designed by Richard McGuire, the English Woodworker, so if anyone wants specific build instructions - check out his website, he is a really, really good presenter. Photos were taken with a rotten avocado, so colors are off, it's somewhat less yellow.


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Next time I would do better molding and will try not forget to stain the front before gluing up. A better handle would also be.. umm, better.

[Jim Koepke]

Looks nice Jack but it wouldn't work in my kitchen. There are two shelves in a cupboard that barely hold all of my herbs and spices. Some of my seasonings are in larger size bottles a la Costco.

Some great drawer handles here > https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/clearance-event/hardware/knobs-and-pulls

jtk

[Jack Dover]

It's probably ain't gonna work in mine either, I just really wanted to build it. The drawer is tall enough to accommodate those spice shakers, I think 8 or 10 could fit into a drawer and some bigger ones could go on a shelf. But then I have never seen a spice rack design that works, all of them are annoying in some aspect. Maybe spice racks were meant for locking expensive spices, rather than a convenient organizer?

The original design used a bail pull handle, it does look better than this one. Well, next time maybe.

[James Pallas]

Great work on that rack. About ten years ago I tried challenging the inevitable. I built the pictured rack. Was I successful, nope. Space for 48 standard containers, no repeats. Still have spices in two shelves of an upper cabinet, LOL.
Jim

[Jack Dover]

Well this type might have worked for me if there would be a space for it in my kitchen. And I like that it doesn't look like a spice or a rack, I think that sometimes a piece with a clearly defined purpose could put a strong stress into an interior. I.e. a blanket chest — no matter how nicely made it feels out of place in a living room or in a hall. Or a liquor cabinet that shows what's inside or has hangers for glasses — immediately draws all the attention to itself. Yours can blend with the rest of the cabinets, in fact it looks like it was made by hand, and to match the existing ones?

Also, did you drawbore the frames or just pinned them?

[James Pallas]

Well this type might have worked for me if there would be a space for it in my kitchen. And I like that it doesn't look like a spice or a rack, I think that sometimes a piece with a clearly defined purpose could put a strong stress into an interior. I.e. a blanket chest — no matter how nicely made it feels out of place in a living room or in a hall. Or a liquor cabinet that shows what's inside or has hangers for glasses — immediately draws all the attention to itself. Yours can blend with the rest of the cabinets, in fact it looks like it was made by hand, and to match the existing ones?

Also, did you drawbore the frames or just pinned them?
Space was a problem for me also. If you notice those two cabinets are behind the swing of the door, a 5” space. Yes they are draw bored, just the spice cabinet. Very light, offsetting about a 64th. Don’t know if that works or not but 40 years or so of doing it seems to work okay for light work. I use more offset for heavy work.
Jim

[Jack Dover]

So I was dismantling some drawbored m&t joints I made, idk, maybe 10 years ago. Decided to saw the joint apart to see what happens to a drawbore pin, ended up with 6 or 8 joint samples.

As we know in cabinetmaking offset can't be too heavy, about 1/64' or 1/32" tops or one might get a really, really nasty surprise when a pin doesn't engage into the last opening and instead pierces a wall right next to it. It's ugly to say the least. Or a pin could seize and never go through, no matter how hard you pound it, it will just break and that will be it.

What seems to be known is that anything round made of wood doesn't stay round for long. Let me refer everyone reading this to the Hoadley's book where he explains the science behind it (and also why you shouldn't hoard dowel stock). Basically a pin or a dowel will shrink along one axis and its cross section will be elliptical.

You have probably already guessed where I'm going with this. More than half of the pins shrunk in the direction of the offset. Shrinkage was equal or bigger than the offset, so there wasn't any tension from a drawbore pin, all what's left was glue strength. I should add that drawbore pins were made with a dowelling plate, so according to the modern theory the pin should have been compressed and should have expanded, not contracted. Well, if there was any expansion it probably happened right when it was driven, since in some of the cases a distance between a pin and a hole wall was enough to put a tip of a knife.

Contrary to my beliefs none of the shoulder lines were open. I could chalk it up to spruce being stable wood, but a couple of them were in read oak. And red oak shrinks faster than USA middle class. So probably PVA is good enough to address a concern of M&T not staying together.

There was one joint where offset was too heavy. I wish I could take pictures. The pin was pretty much in Z shape. Still held everything together, I wouldn't believe it if it weren't right in front of me.

Given all this I decided drawboring isn't worth the hassle. If I can clamp a joint I'll just pin it and that's it, drawboring is better reserved for timberframing.

[James Pallas]

Jack I agree. The biggest reason I pin (drawbore?) is to take the work out of clamps and continue work. Been successful so far 40 years. Can I guarantee it works, nope. Timber framing is another thing, no glue sometimes. 100 years old and shoulders not touching, many times.
Jim

[Chuck Hill]

For fun, here is the same plan re-purposed into a saw til:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/857101454366905/permalink/4704540382956307

[Jim Koepke]

For fun, here is the same plan re-purposed into a saw til:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/857101454366905/permalink/4704540382956307

The link appears to be a private page.

So far draw boring has worked well for me. Of course my articulated gate is only five years old but still working well without any glue.

jtk

[James Pallas]

The link appears to be a private page.

So far draw boring has worked well for me. Of course my articulated gate is only five years old but still working well without any glue.

jtk
Jim,Your gate will probably survive the test. Well cut joints and good material. Come back in 50 years and we can check to see🙂
Jim

[Jack Dover]

Well of course it works. I just wanted to say it probably isn't worth the hassle in cabinetmaking. I drawbored my gates as well, since they're outside in elements I didn't even bother using glue, still going strong after... some years, haha, forgot when they were made. They look like they were unearthed at Herculanum, since I haven't finished them (they're gates to a little garden) but they're still together and still square.

With cabinet doors though, I just glue, clamp as tight as I can, drill straight and put a pin, they can be unclamped immediately.