Oak desk "popped"

[Tom Spallone]

I made a nice red oak desk and the top is made of about 8, 1x4's joined with carpenter's glue and dowels. The center join has popped due to expansion and contraction. I can see through to daylight in some areas.

What's the best way to approach this fix? I've put putty from the bottom to at least close the visual gap but, I want the surface to be seamless again.

Should I fill with wood filler or putty or some other trick?

The gap is about a 1/16 to 2/16 thick.

Thanks for any suggestions.

[Rob Millard]

[Tom,
I would take the top off and saw it apart at the offending glue line, plane and glue it back together. I know this is not an attractive option, but any other solution will look poor or may be only a temporary fix. There is some underlying issue that caused the joint to fail. These can be, poorly fitted joints, that required too much clamping pressure, wood that was glazed from using dull tools to plane the joint ( this happens with power jointers), insufficient glue, or from the top being attached in such away that it can’t move freely, in response to changes in the weather. You didn’t say, but I’d be willing to bet that you used yellow glue. I know I’m in the minority, but I dislike yellow glue and won’t use it, instead I use white glue, or hide glue. Also, I find dowels to be unnecessary . As you found out, they add nothing to the strength of a joint.
These kind of setbacks happen all to frequently. Just recently I had to remake a tall case clock door, that I foolishly left too close a heat source, causing it to crack ( this really hurt as the door had extensive inlays), and I had to remake two drawers on another project, because the proportions were wrong.
Rob Millard

[Wes Bischel]

Tom,
I would agree - cut it and re-glue. I think most other fixes will look like just that - a fix. Also, to add to Rob's post, the question about the cause is important to answer before you repair the top. Otherwise it most likely will split again. One thought, how is the top fastened? Does the fastening system leave enough give for expansion/contraction of the wood? If not, it could be the culprit.

Good luck with the repairs,

Wes

[Tom Spallone]

I was hoping no one was going to suggest cutting and rejoining but, I guess I can't get anything by you guys.

I know that's probably the best way to do it or else it will keep happening, especially when it's about to change residences again.

I have to correct my first statement, it wasn't 8-1x4's but 10!

I have to admit that the primary offending culprit to this join failing is that I joined one 1x4 to another, then another 1x4 to it and again and again and again to total five 1x4's. I did that again separately. So, I was left with two pieces with five 1x4's in each. I then "attempted" to join both of those big pieces. Quick math will tell you that I'm joining two pieces which are approx. 5.5 feet in length and 21 inches wide. That equals a width of 42 inches I was trying to join.

My longest bar clamp didn't quite reach so, I kinda hooked one clamp around the other and hoped that I'd get enough compression. I guess not.

Anyone have any suggestions on how to join very wide pieces such as this?

[Matt Meiser]

Anyone have any suggestions on how to join very wide pieces such as this?

Harbor Freight makes some decent pipe clamps that are very cheap. Not something I'd want to use every day, but before I got my Bessey's, that was all I had and survived just fine.

[Dennis Peacock]

Tom,

You process for gluing up the top is just fine. That's what I do on kitchen table top and other wide tops. One thing to remember. If you "have" to "pull" the joints together with clamps to make the seam go way during glue up? You need to joint both surfaces again. You should only need enough clamping pressure to just "hold" the boards together while the glue dries.

Like Rob, I've all but stopped using yellow glue. It will "creap" on you weeks and months later. Lesson learned here. I now use white glue or using Liquid Hide Glue. I "really" like using LHG as it's easier to clean up and it doesn't stain the wood if you get a spot of glue where it shouldn't be. You can even clean up dried LHG by using warm to hot water and a rag. It'll clean right up with no problem.

Clamps? Go to the local Big Box Store and get you some Pony bar clamps. About $12 locally and then you'll need to buy some black iron pipe to put the head and tail parts of the clamp on to make it a complete clamp. This way, you can have 28" pipe for a 24" clamp, 54" pipe for a 48" clamp and yes...even a 10 foot pipe for a clamp that is over 9 feet of clamping capacity. The pipe is easy to store so little room is needed for several pieces of pipe. Just remember to put the center of the board on the center line of the clamp "screw" and the same height up from the pipe on the tail end of the clamp. This will apply a "straight" clamping pressure and will not force the wood down or up. Also remember to alternate the clamps. One under, one over, one under, one over and so forth until you get to the other end of the top.

Ok....I've rambled on enough here. I hope this helps a little and I didn't confuse you even more. :eek: :rolleyes: :D

[Mark Stutz]

Tom,
I agree with Dennis...I doubt if this is as much a problem with clamping technique as it is attachment of the top to the base. There are a number of options that allow for wood movent , but for a "retrofit" the figure 8 fasteners might be the easiest. I don't see how the number of boards involved in the glueup should make much difference. Good luck.

Mark

[Tom Spallone]

I now use white glue or using Liquid Hide Glue. I "really" like using LHG as it's easier to clean up and it doesn't stain the wood if you get a spot of glue where it shouldn't be. You can even clean up dried LHG by using warm to hot water and a rag. It'll clean right up with no problem.


Is this what Gorilla glue is?

[Mark Stutz]

Tom,
Not Dennis here, but....No, Liquid Hide Glue and Gorilla Glue are two different "animals", so to speak. Hide glue is just that...remeber the old saying about taking broken down horses to the glue factory? Well, maybe you're not old enough:eek: but it is a very old classic glue, and is repairable with warm water, i.e. comes apart, and cleans up with water as Dennis mentioned. Classically it came in granular form and was mixed with water to make is viscous, but has to be kept about 140 degrees in a glue pot of some kind. Kind of inconvenient for most, and it fell out of favor as modern glue technology evolved. It is now avialable in a bottle from Titebond just like yellow glue. I, too am switching over and find myself using this more and more. Gorilla glue is a polyurethand based product. Very strong but very messy, IMO. Foams out as it cures. Not my favorite.

Hope this helps.

Mark

[Tom Spallone]

Oh, 'cause I was going to say...... I just had an argument with my father over the phone about this over the weekend. HE'S the old timer but, all of a sudden LIKES Gorilla glue. :eek: I told him it KILLS my plane blade. Whatever! Thanks for the info.