Radial Arm Saw

[Ron Hampe]

I'm looking for a decent 12" radial arm saw and considering the ones made by the Original Saw Company.
Are they worth the money and if I were to buy one used are there any known issues that I should I be looking for?

Thanks

[Michael Schuch]

The rails that the saw carriage ride on are cut into the cast iron arm on these Dewalt designed saws. I have seen some of these saws that have been transported without supporting the carriage which chip these bearing surfaces. It is obvious when this happens as you can feel the imperfection in the bearing surface when pulling the carriage forwards. Most of the time the damage happens with the carriage in the back most position. If you find this problem I would recommend a hard pass on the saw.

If you do buy and transport any RAS I recommend putting a 4" x 4" block under the motor and lowering the arm to take the weight of the motor off of the arm / rails.

As long as there are no cracked castings most other imperfections or alignment issues can usually be adjusted out relatively easily.

Personally I prefer the Delta / Rockwell turret arm radial arm saws. On these Delta RAS's the tracks the carriage ride on are metal rods that can be rotated to compensate for any wear. But the Dewalt style RAS's are well respected quality saws too, as long as the rails have not been damaged.

I consider the Northfield Unipoint radial arm saws the top of the line of Radial arm saws... if you happen to come across one. Comet, Walker Turner and others make a ram type design RAS where the whole ram moves in and out instead of a carriage riding on a track. These are good accurate saws BUT require a lot of space behind the saw for the ram to travel backwards which makes them harder to integrate into a shop space wise.

Radial arm saws have fallen out of favor. Personally I believe this is due to the low quality Craftsman radial arm saws and that few people have ever been trained on how to use a RAS properly. Growing up my father had one stationary saw and it was a 10" Delta turret arm RAS. This is what I learned wood working on and I am very comfortable with RAS's. A 1947 Redstar 16" turret arm RAS has been the most used saw in my shop for the past 30 years. I think it is safe to say I am the exception in my love of RAS's though. I recently picked up a 16" Delta long arm turret arm RAS for a hundred dollars that was purchased, turned on once then shoved in the corner for 20 years because everyone in the shop was afraid of it.

Proper alignment of a RAS is key to safety and good accurate cuts. A good cast iron Dewalt (Original Saw Co), Delta / Rockwell / Redstar, Comet, Walker Turner, Unipoint saw will keep its alignment for years! My first RAS, an older Craftsman, constantly required adjustment to keep it aligned. The last time I adjusted my 16" Redstar was 20 years ago after a move mainly because I replaced the table at that time. Personally I have no problems making highly accurate cuts on my RAS and it returns to zero very reliably after making a miter cut.

I could see paying a couple to a few thousand dollars for a Northfield Unipoint Radial arm saw. I can't see paying over $1000 for a perfect Original Saw Co. RAS. A local shop that was going out of business had a 16" Original Saw Co. RAS advertised for $400 in excellent shape in the middle of the COVID shutdown, I passed on it and later picked up the 16" Long arm Delta RAS.

How do you plan to use a RAS? This will most likely determine how much one might be worth to you.

[Ron Hampe]

Thanks for the advice. There is a 20+ year old 3 phase 12" Original saw not far from me and another single phase 12" that looks newer 4 hours away.

My first RAS was a 10" Craftsman that I bought new 42 years ago and I had it for 35 years in the basement, but ran out of room and replaced it with a Bosch Glide.
Now that I have a much larger shop and a 23' long miter saw bench I'd like to put an RAS in the middle of it instead.

I'm 69 and our daughter wants to expand her craft business. She's 29 and with an eye on inheriting this place wants me to teach her how to use everything which I will gladly do.
My biggest fear is if she gets hurt, her mom will kill me so thinking that I should buy something will a full blade guard, etc.

[Michael Schuch]

Thanks for the advice. There is a 20+ year old 3 phase 12" Original saw not far from me and another single phase 12" that looks newer 4 hours away.

My first RAS was a 10" Craftsman that I bought new 42 years ago and I had it for 35 years in the basement, but ran out of room and replaced it with a Bosch Glide.
Now that I have a much larger shop and a 23' long miter saw bench I'd like to put an RAS in the middle of it instead.

I'm 69 and our daughter wants to expand her craft business. She's 29 and with an eye on inheriting this place wants me to teach her how to use everything which I will gladly do.
My biggest fear is if she gets hurt, her mom will kill me so thinking that I should buy something will a full blade guard, etc.


In my experience a 12" cast iron Dewalt style RAS will do everything that your Craftsman saw did but more accurately and with more confidence. Between my 10" Craftsman RAS and 16" Redstar RAS I had a 12" Dewalt RAS (with a chip in the rear most portion of the rail) that was previously abused quite badly. The one part of the Dewalt design that I didn't care for was the adjustment for rotating the arm for the stops for a miter cut. The wedge / lever for locking the arm into the 90 (or 45 degree) position after a miter cut didn't have near the accuracy of the eccentric / plunger design of my Redstar / Delta turret arm saws... but I have not heard others complain about this and my Dewalt 12" had a rough life before it got to me. There was always a little play when returning the arm to zero. I would always spend 20 seconds making sure the arm was square with a carpenters square then clamp down the arm which would keep it there very reliably until I made another miter cut and had to return the arm to 90 again. Tilting the saw blade instead of the arm for a miter cut on the Dewalt never had this same problem for me.

My 18yo scaredy cat daughter has been using my 16" Redstar RAS since she was 14, under my direct supervision. That big 16" blade is scary! I still remember my first cut on the saw and how intimidated I was. Now it is only small, light weight 10" RAS's that scare me. I believe that if properly trained a RAS need not be dangerous. Growing up my father and I would safely rip boards and sheet goods on his 10" Delta turret RAS. Since I got my first table saw I have never wanted to RIP on a RAS ever again though.

The shear mass of the motor and carriage on my 16" RAS makes takes a very smooth but sizeable pull to get that much mass moving. When I use my fathers 10" Delta (still at me mother's house) the comparatively lite weight motor and carriage (still considerably heavier than a Craftsman) makes me nervous because of how little force it takes it to start moving.

The only time I have had a problem with a RAS wanting to self feed was on a RAS (my Craftsman) that was considerably out of alignment. After I learned how to align the Craftsman (and all RAS's) properly I have never had one want to self feed again.

I have 3 miter saws (12" Dewalt, 10" Delta and 10" Ryobi) all swivel only, none sliding. For me my RAS is for wood working in the shop and the miter saws are for taking to the work whether that be laying flooring in the house or doing trim at a friends house.

My fingers (and arms) NEVER cross the path of the blade when making a cut. My left hand secures the stock against the fence on the left side of the blade and my right hand pulls the carriage on the right side of the blade. My fence always has only a blade width gap in it for safety and aligning cuts. If I make a dado cut (which I do frequently) I always push the two halves of my fence together and make a new blade width gap in the fence. My RAS is ALWAYS well aligned. I think these are three of the most important safety rules for a RAS... although I am sure I could think of others.

For a person untrained and uncomfortable with a RAS I think a miter saw is probably a safer option. I have never owned a sliding miter saw though.

[Ron Hampe]

I'm sure it will. I saw a decent price on that Original Saw and thought it might be nice to have, but I honestly don't need one.

I bought a Milwaukee panel saw last year and I have a 7' cast iron table on my unisaw with two HTC folding outfeed tables. Also have a 4' x 8' CNC that I need to get running soon.

My Dad had some tools though that still scare me just thinking about them, but neither of us lost any fingers using them.

[Steve Mathews]

Any opinions on the Rockwell/Delta 14-RAS? One is for sale near me and I was thinking of replacing my DeWalt 12" radial arm saw with it. The Rockwell seems more substantial and has a larger rip capacity.

[Jim Becker]

Any opinions on the Rockwell/Delta 14-RAS? One is for sale near me and I was thinking of replacing my DeWalt 12" radial arm saw with it. The Rockwell seems more substantial and has a larger rip capacity.
Honestly, you do not want to rip on these machines...that's been consistently the most dangerous operation on the RAS for "time immortal". They are great for wide crosscutting, however, especially for 90º cuts with a machine dialed in and never changed to any other angle.

---
Ron, if I "had to have" a RAS in my shop, I suspect I'd very much covet something like the Original SAW or it's DeWalt predecessor. Or the really big, heavy Delta like Norm used to use. They can be beasts for sure. This is one tool that I'd want to be pretty substantial in structure because of all that weight hanging out from a single arm.

[Ron Hampe]

I get so tired of hearing this and I ripped a lot of wood on my 10" Craftsman.
When used properly an RAS is no more dangerous than any other power tool in the shop.

[Michael Schuch]

Any opinions on the Rockwell/Delta 14-RAS? One is for sale near me and I was thinking of replacing my DeWalt 12" radial arm saw with it. The Rockwell seems more substantial and has a larger rip capacity.

Do you mean rip capacity or cross cut capacity? The Dewalt and Delta should have pretty comparable cross cut capacities unless the Delta is a long arm which would have several inches more cross cut capacity.

I grew up learning on the Delta turret arm saws (a short upper arm and a second lower longer arm that pivots in the center). I like my Delta turret arm saw better than the Dewalt 12" I owned. If the Delta is a long arm saw I would definitely upgrade... but that is just me. A Delta 14" RAS should be a beast, especially if it is a long arm saw.

As far as returning to 90 after a miter it has been my experience that the Delta turret arm saws with their eccentric plunger do a better job at returning to 90 after a miter cut than the Dewalt RAS's do. Squaring up a Dewalt to 90 after a miter only takes 30 seconds after you get used to it and clamping the arm keeps it where it is set quite well. I don't check my Redstar (Bought out by Delta who adopted the Redstar turret design) for 90 after making a miter cut any more. It always returns to 90 and I would know after the 1st cut if it didn't by the kerf mark in the table top.

My abused Dewalt 12" RAS had a bit of bounce when the carriage was pulled all the way out. It was not really a problem for crosscuts because it was too small to be noticed or affect the cut. But it was a problem when cutting a really wide dado as the depth wasn't perfect across the length of the cut. The Delta turret arm saws which pivot in the middle of the lower arm that I have used have not had any blade bounce when the carriage is pulled all the way out. The bounce on my abused Dewalt might have just been due to the prior abuse but the design seemed more prone to this than the Delta saws to me.

As far as ripping on a RAS it definitely isn't as nice as ripping on a table saw. The above mounted blade spits all the saw dust into your face no matter how close to the stock you have the blade guard adjusted. Also on a narrow cut you have more blade to contend with when doing the final push through the blade with a push stick if you don't have someone helping you on the outfeed end. After many rip cuts on my father's 10" Delta RAS as a kid I still have all my fingers. A table saw is a much more pleasant experience in my opinion though.

I love a quality RAS, but not everyone is so comfortable with them. I do understand their apprehension with them.

P.S. Norm had a 12" Delta turret arm saw, which is beefier than the 9" and 10" models. The 14" and 16" Delta turret arm RAS's are even more beefier than the 12" models.

[Warren Lake]

only had a sears over 40 years ago so did all on it. No great thing but fine for the money. table saw safer the blade goes down into the table not turning up. The old guy said he only knew one cabinet maker who used a radial arm for all stuff. So that is one more than zero on real deal trained guys. Home hobby or carpenters sure different story.

The wadkin i have the bearing guides I think without looking are reversible so you flip them then have a new surface as the bottom becomes the top

Use the saw properly, no one does. Unless someone taught you to keep your arm straight when you pull the saw out you are not using it correctly. A bend elbow can buckle if it does they can climb, a straight arm will not. If it tries to feed you simply push against it and the blade is in an area where all the material is removed, it cant keep feeding. If your arm folds at the elbow it can.

Best to use a negative hook blade. Good radials are under 200.00 canadian and mostly three phase.

[Earl McLain]

Any opinions on the Rockwell/Delta 14-RAS? One is for sale near me and I was thinking of replacing my DeWalt 12" radial arm saw with it. The Rockwell seems more substantial and has a larger rip capacity.

In my totally biased opinion--if Rockwell/Delta 14 purchase means you'll be putting the 12" Dewalt up for sale...and it's within 3 or 4 hours of the southern tip of Lake Michigan...then i think the Rockwell 14 would be a great saw for you!! Seriously, i have a 1946 model 14" (?) Redstar and a 1957 Dewalt GWI already, either one will outlive me. Redstar was my Dad's, even has an old Redstar blade on it now (need to finish the restore, then i'll have some blades made for the 3/4" arbor--one of my retirement projects!!).
Good luck!!
earl

[Thomas McCurnin]

I've had three RASs in my experience. The first was, I believe, called a Comet, and was an 18" blade model powered with a 220v gas generator and towed behind a pickup. We did everything with this from cross cuts to rips. Yes, RASs are little goofy to rip on, but with the prong attachment properly fixed, it is safe. Yes, you have to be careful like any other machine. For home use, I started with a 10" Sears RAS and never ripped with it, because I had a Sears contractor saw. Worked great for crosscuts and dado work. Then I graduated to a 1950s 12" Rockwell which is deadly accurate and again, I use it for cross cuts and dado work. I've never ripped with it.

I'll note that most the home centers use the Original Saw Radial Arm Saws, so they have to be good, or they wouldn't stand the test of time.

[Bradley Gray]

I have a 14" turret saw but have never used it for ripping. I have seen a set-up with an extra fence on the front edge of the table that looks safer for a person wanting to use the saw for ripping - at least the operator's hands are not behind the blade.

[Ronald Blue]

There is a 16" Dewalt 5 HP for sale a few hours from me currently. 3 Phase of course. Only $200. When you only have one saw a RAS is what you use. I ripped on mine and as long as you used a little common sense and adjusted the guard and anti-kickback pawls it worked acceptably. Respect it like any machine.

[Ron Hampe]

While it would be nice to have, I don’t have room for a stand alone saw and after looking at the different models I think I’m going to stick with the miter saw and just use my panel saw to break down sheets. Thanks for the info though.

[Eugene Dixon]

I still remember my father going to Lazarus in Columbus Ohio to buy a DeWalt RAS in the late 50's. He built sloped front cabinets and a stylish wall of shelving with that saw in Ohio. We built a house in AL using it when we took over my grandfather's dairy farm. My BIL has that saw now.

I bought a used 12" Original RAS, 5 hp at GovDeals auction a few years ago. Much more substantial than the DeWalt and much longer arm. It was listed as 3 phase but turned out to be single phase when I picked it up. I was happy. I spent several hours building and leveling a replacement table using the outline in the RAS guy's book (sorry don't remember the exact name of the book - the author had passed and the family still published the book) - father of the Dewalt RAS I think he was called. I had access to a large, heavy layout table complete with clamping blocks at the university I was teaching at. Spent a Saturday and Sunday on campus on the glue up. I can find the name of the book if you are interested. PM me.

I took the saw apart far enough to clean the bearing runs on the arm. The carriage bearings seemed solid. The tilt indicator was out of calibration but I didn't worry too much about that until the last shop move. Overall, the saw was tight, i.e., no slop.

I don't use it frequently but have done cross cutting, ripping, and dados. It is, to me, ideal for cross cutting dados.

Glad I have it. But really don't use it enough to justify the floor space. It does remind me of that old DeWalt, however.

[Jim OConnor]

If you come across one, an OMGA radial arm saw is also a really solid industrial saw

[Earl McLain]

I still remember my father going to Lazarus in Columbus Ohio to buy a DeWalt RAS in the late 50's. He built sloped front cabinets and a stylish wall of shelving with that saw in Ohio. We built a house in AL using it when we took over my grandfather's dairy farm. My BIL has that saw now.

I bought a used 12" Original RAS, 5 hp at GovDeals auction a few years ago. Much more substantial than the DeWalt and much longer arm. It was listed as 3 phase but turned out to be single phase when I picked it up. I was happy. I spent several hours building and leveling a replacement table using the outline in the RAS guy's book (sorry don't remember the exact name of the book - the author had passed and the family still published the book) - father of the Dewalt RAS I think he was called. I had access to a large, heavy layout table complete with clamping blocks at the university I was teaching at. Spent a Saturday and Sunday on campus on the glue up. I can find the name of the book if you are interested. PM me.

I took the saw apart far enough to clean the bearing runs on the arm. The carriage bearings seemed solid. The tilt indicator was out of calibration but I didn't worry too much about that until the last shop move. Overall, the saw was tight, i.e., no slop.

I don't use it frequently but have done cross cutting, ripping, and dados. It is, to me, ideal for cross cutting dados.

Glad I have it. But really don't use it enough to justify the floor space. It does remind me of that old DeWalt, however.

Wally Kunkel was known as "Mr. Sawdust" and the book is "Mastering the Radial Arm Saw". Focused on the Dewalts (Mr. Kunkel was a rep), but most of the info is adaptable to good saws. My table for my 1957 GWI (Dewalt) is still flat 7 or 8 years later. The Kunkel family is good people, i felt good buying the book from them.

Another good solid reference is John Eakes' "Fine Tuning Your Radial Arm Saw". Not sure if that one is still available, so happy hunting!!
earl

[Warren Lake]

offered Omgas a few times and should have scooped at least one. 225.00 Can dinaros, a good blade can cost that much and he would have delivered as well.

[Earl McLain]

offered Omgas a few times and should have scooped at least one. 225.00 Can dinaros, a good blade can cost that much and he would have delivered as well.

Ouch!! I passed one up just prior to pandemic for $400 USD--and shouldn't have!! Might have saved my marriage though...

[Ron Hampe]

Can you recommend a decent saw with this type of frame?
Although there are 88 drawers in this 23' bench all are full now and the most that I would be willing to part with is 4.
I would prefer a 24" crosscut, but would settle for a 10" saw if none of the 12" ones have that type of frame.
Please excuse the mess, the new shop wasn't done when this photo was taken.


494163494164

[James Jayko]

I get so tired of hearing this and I ripped a lot of wood on my 10" Craftsman.
When used properly an RAS is no more dangerous than any other power tool in the shop.

This just isn't true. The design of the RAS is fundamentally flawed for ripping, and is much more prone to grabbing and throwing because of its physical design. Also, the way the saw pulls the work piece into the stop (part of what mades it good at cross cutting) seems to me to make it EVEN MORE likely that a mistake will lead to a serious de-fingering or worse. It CAN be done, but physics says "Just because you can does not mean you should."

My friend's dad is a micro surgeon, reattaches hands and fingers and whatnot. He has always said that radial arm saws put his kids through college.

[Ole Anderson]

As a teen I learned on my dad's 8" green Dewalt. When I started my own shop in my basement, I bought a Montgomery Ward 10" RAS with two spindles, one 20,000 rpm for router bits. Interesting concept and it got a lot of use. But I could never get it to keep a 90 degree cut. After I got my G1023 and a miter saw, needing the room I eventually gave it to my son who almost never used it. He sat it out for the trash one day.

[Jonathan Jung]

Whichever saw you get, either select one with a brake or put a VFD on it for braking. I've got an Omga with a mechanical brake that stops the blade in less than a second.

[Barry McFadden]

I get so tired of hearing this and I ripped a lot of wood on my 10" Craftsman.
When used properly an RAS is no more dangerous than any other power tool in the shop.

I agree with Ron. I've had a Sears Crafstman 12" RAS saw for about 40 years now , ripped tons of wood on it and never had as much as a kickback on it. As long as the kickback pawls are adjusted properly and you stand out of the line of a kickback should one occur they work great. I also switch the arm from 90 degrees to other angles when crosscutting and move it back to 90 degrees and there is no loss of accuracy.

[Eugene Dixon]

IIRC, that is about what I paid for mine. And 2 tanks of gas round trip to get it. Gas was cheaper then.

[Ron Hampe]

Just came across this 10" for $50. is it worth buying? Seller is supposed to send more pictures tomorrow and the model #.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/592807059000617/?referralSurface=messenger_lightspeed_banner&referralCode=messenger_banner

[Barry McFadden]

personally I'd pass on something like that.....

[Dave Roock]

Just came across this 10" for $50. is it worth buying? Seller is supposed to send more pictures tomorrow and the model #.

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/592807059000617/?referralSurface=messenger_lightspeed_banner&referralCode=messenger_banner

For $50 or less, not much of a gamble. If you replaced that table & cleaned it up, it would look just fine. I think you should buy it.

[Earl McLain]

Looks like a GWI--though could be an MBF. Late 1950's with that AMF badging. Also looks like the original table mounts are intact. The only reason i would not buy it (for $100 +/-) would be if the ways are worn to the point of the carriage being sloppy. RAS's used in production settings, making repeated short-stroke cuts, the ways in the arm tended to wear after a LOT of cuts. That saw doen't look like it was in a production setting--just based on the lack of paint wear on the handle. If it runs, and the arm is not excessively worn--may be an excellent buy. BUT...if you do, plan on new motor bearings (relatively inexpensive). Carriage bearings are usually okay--repack at worst. New table, and you may have a good working saw.

edit--looks like the dual voltage switch is missing from the motor...that's the empty hole on the back of the motor housing. Don't recall if that was specific to the 1.5 hp motor or if the 3/4 hp motors had it too. Just a toggle switch to flip between 120v and 240v (today's numbers) without having to change any motor connections. I have no idea how to check which voltage this would be defaulted to (low or high) in the absence of that switch.