Are battery powered brad and finish nailers now better than the pneumatic ones?

[Joel Gelman]

A friend came over with his Milwaukee battery powered pin nailer. It was used in the shop where I have piped compressed air, so not problem having an air supply. Still, nice to be free of the air hose. As for using air tools in a home (brad, finish etc.), that seems where battery powered would really shine. No more noisy compressor to lug around and hear. No more moving it to different locations to the air hose will reach and having long hoses in the way.

Unless I am missing something, seems like this has not been discussed in the last several years, and perhaps people now have more experience with the newer tools. The friend who loves his Milwaukee pin nailer did not have any particular feedback for me on something like this:

https://www.acehardware.com/departments/tools/air-compressors-and-tools/nailers/2006423?gclid=CjwKCAiAyfybBhBKEiwAgtB7foMmVj2Gpv1H RCcvP5s0fVYOzylg4LQ2rxJfrFnP3X53RxevSIVYlRoCUmgQAv D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

I currently use the 18v Milwaukee batteries on my hydraulic driver, and so having the same brand would be nice. However, I am not married to the brand. My current brad and finish nailers are very old Sencos.

Anyone make the switch and have feedback to offer?

[Brian Holcombe]

Im on the hunt for one but would really prefer one from a brand that is part of the CAS. Tired of buying new battery systems, I have Festool and CAS (Metabo Germany and Mafell) as well as Milwaukee. Prebena (part of cas) makes a cordless nailer but a cordless Brad nailer. I haul a lot of stuff to job sites, so a universal battery system is appealing.

One downside to the battery powered nailer is that it is significantly heavier than the air powered one, so for doing overhead work it’s not great.

[Jim Dwight]

I used my Ryobi 18V 18 gauge brad nailer to put up most of the trim in my house. I used a 15 gauge pneumatic on the stools for windows and a 23 gauge pin nailer for the returns on the casing. But the crown and base and casing were put up with the Ryobi. I use a DeWalt 18 gauge brad nailer some volunteering at church. I do not see a lot of difference between them. They both work fine. I have a 18 gauge pneumatic and it is lighter but it just a lot handier to to grab a nailer and pop in some nails as opposed to dragging out a compressor. I have a quiet little Senco and a battery operated Ryobi and a older bigger Bostitch but if the 18 gauge is OK for the task I use it. On the other hand, as a hobbiest I can't justify getting all cordless nailers. Pneumatic are just a whole lot less expensive and also work fine. I have 16, 15, 23, several staplers, a flooring nailer, and a framing nailer that are pneumatic. They all get used occasionally but the 18 gauge brad nailer gets used the most. The holes it makes in trim are easier to fill than the 16 or 15 gauge nailers and the pull out strength is a lot better than the 23 gauge. But they all have their place.

I do not see a functional benefit in terms of driving the nails between a pneumatic and a cordless. The big factors are price versus how handy they are. Weight of the cordless is far higher but it's never been a big issue for me, even doing crown. It's heavier but not to heavy to hang off my belt until I am ready for it and it doesn't feel heavy driving the brads. Dealing with a compressor and it's hose are more annoying than the weight.

[Jim Becker]

Battery operated is quickly becoming the norm in the construction world, for sure. For in-shop, I think there are trade-offs, including the weight as mentioned and being tied to "someone's" battery system. Your need "might" not be able to be satisfied with one brand, depending on what they are since the options are not necessarily complete yet. For in-shop use, I honestly feel pneumatic is more cost effective still, but that might change over time. It is indeed nice to be "tail-less" when doing things, however. For example, I hate my screw gun which is corded and used my Festool CXS with a "Dimpler" driver to do my shop drywall this week and it was awesome not being tied to a cord. OTOH, my Grex pinner is really lightweight and small...it gets into tight spaces. A battery operated version necessarily is much larger and that can come into play in the kind of work we do in our shops a lot more than on a construction site.

[johnny means]

No.

Obligatory characters.

[Joel Gelman]

I was mostly wondering if something in the battery powered world stands out as the best (eg. reliably driving the nails the desired depth). Back in the day, it was Senco. I was under the impression perhaps for the brad nailer battery powered, maybe the new Milwaukee.

[Bradley Gray]

No.

Hey Johnny - could you make that a little clearer? :)

[Warren Lake]

I have old senco, some over 40 years old that look Art Deco. They are great quality. I have newer stuff from auctions and half of them are broken because they did the change that so many did. I paid big bucks for the original Senco but so what when im still using it. You can make your nailer nicer to use by two things. get a very light air line or smaller and put a swivel fitting on.

On some tools I run pneumatic air lines that are 1/4" outside diameter more or less. My air supply is decreased so for a dynabrade i up the pressure. In the case of a nailer its only bursts of air so dont think an issue. I still use a full size line on the framing nailer but light and flexible and the swivel fitting makes using it night and day. Half the grief form an air line is how they restrict your movement as it hangs off the tool, when the air line can pivot off it itsi nicer to use.

[Bill Dufour]

I have a seldom used belted tank air supply system. It is a standard one pound? CO2 paint ball gun tank, regulator and short hose with a belt clip.
Bill D

[Steve Rozmiarek]

I was mostly wondering if something in the battery powered world stands out as the best (eg. reliably driving the nails the desired depth). Back in the day, it was Senco. I was under the impression perhaps for the brad nailer battery powered, maybe the new Milwaukee.

Yes, the newer generation Milwaukee are as good as or better than air. They are the ONLY battery or gas powered nailer I will say that about. Milwaukee's guns are the only ones out there right now with firing rates as good as air guns, zero ramp up time, consistent power regardless of rate of fire, and bump fire option. We see 500-700 plus rounds on a 5aH battery from the framers, 16g is probably 800-900, and 18g is not something I've ever figured out, but 1000+. Because they use a widely available battery tech, the Milwaukee guns are also future proofed to some extent. I'd call our companies use requirements rather extreme. I don't know off hand how many guns are on the rack, dozens though, from huge framers to pinners, most all of the available common brands and techs are represented or have been there at one time, mostly air guns but increasing numbers of red battery power guns. The Milwaukee battery guns are always first to go to the field. I've had several of the framers repaired, Milwaukee's service is good. One had an issue with the firing nitrogen spring IIRK, the other was because of a dropped gun. No charge for either, quick turn around. Actually they sent a new gun for the one that had the firing issue.

Not having a compressor in the field is great for obvious reasons. It's a little less of a difference in the shop, but still saves time and hassle for most things. I do still use air guns predominantly in the shop, mainly because I still have a fleet of them and there isn't much reason to change them out while they are working. Will replace them with battery guns as they pass on, if I outlive them.

[George Yetka]

In my shop I had a noisy pancake so I stepped away from the pneumatic Grex guns I have and bought a Gas Grex. Then I didnt have to deal with noisy compressor I had to deal with taking the gas cylinder and AAA batteries out because both drained when they sat, I also had to deal with the extra weight. Neither were a huge deal. I ended up getting a California Air tools compressor and the thing is so quiet and doesnt leak so now im using the pneumatics again. The thing I dont like the Battery nailers is the size compared to 18/23 gauge pneumatics. Hoses are not a drag if your set up right with them.

I actually had this conversation yesterday talking about cordless tools in general. They are nice, but I dont mind cords and im certainly not going out of my way to replace the ones I have at this point. When my palm router dies, maybe. Same with jig saw etc.

[Brian Holcombe]

A lot of my tools have a vacuum attached, so the cord is fine. I have a cordless router but frankly hate the weight of it and it runs an 18v battery down rapidly.

Cordless Drills and drivers I really like, I can’t see going back to corded ones. I have a Metabo LTX that is impressive as heck, I use it for wood owl augers and large forstners without issue. Doesn’t slow down at all. The Festool drills and drivers are really nice too, I’ve been very happy with them.

[Jim Dwight]

I've never used the Milwaukee brad nailer, only Ryobi and DeWalt. Neither have issues sinking 2 inch brads into softwood including MDF trim which is a bit harder. I don't remember using them in hardwood. I have a Milwaukee cordless framing nailer and I am impressed with it's adjustment for depth. If they have something similar on the finish nailers it is a plus. But I don't see it as a big plus unless you often try to nail really soft or really hard things with it. I haven't wanted to adjust depth putting up trim with my Ryobi. I also would be hesitant to use in really hard materials because the brads bend pretty easily. That is a problem sometimes (like nailing into a knot or with wild grain) but I doubt that it varies between nailers. I keep diagonal cutting pliers handy and a nail set to drive errant brads below the surface where they can be puttied over. Using a 16 or 15 gauge would help with this but it would also mean a lot of big voids to fill with filler. I prefer to just deal with the occasional wandering brad. I use the bigger finish nailers when I need 2.5 inch length or for something like the starter rows putting in hardwood flooring where it takes a stout nail to deal with the flooring's tendency to refuse to be straight.

[Cary Falk]

I bought a battery powered DeWalt to put up trim in the house. It made it nice with no hose or compressor in the house, but I still prefer to use air powered in the shop. My air power ones are lighter, smaller, cheaper, and more powerful.

[Joel Gelman]

"My air power ones are lighter, smaller, cheaper, and more powerful."

Appreciate all of the input. Certainly people have preferences --- dealing with an attached hose and the noice of a compressor vs the weight of a battery and the need to charge, and there are issues of money if you already own pneumatic.

My concern was that I would not want to buy a Milwaukee and have it not be as powerful. Perhaps the Milwaukee is a better gun than the DeWalt that you did not find as powerful as your shop pneumatic guns?

For me it is simple. I want to pull the trigger and have the nail drive every time, not most of the time. I want no double fire. I want the nail to go into the wood, including hardwoods to the depth I desire. I want reliability. If the new Milwaukee does that as well or better than the old Secco's, then for me, that works. I am about to work on trim and if and only if the new Milwaukee works as well or better than the old Senco, I am in.

[Jim Becker]

Based on Steve's comments above, Milwaukee's system seems to work well.

[Warren Lake]

good info steve and that you have a volume of them. ive been switching from Makita to Milwaukee to have just one battery type.

I stepped on an air line doing my roof putting my foot back behind me. It rolled and I went down. Good thing I had my own mcgiver harness set up so I just went down on the roof and no where else. Worst thing was that maybe a neighbour saw me but I popped back up like Kramer and just kept going. Those particular lines that are great in my shop are lousey in cold weather so had to get some of the super flexible ones for cold weather work. Be nice even more than other places to have fewer lines of any kind while roofing.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

I've never used the Milwaukee brad nailer, only Ryobi and DeWalt. Neither have issues sinking 2 inch brads into softwood including MDF trim which is a bit harder. I don't remember using them in hardwood. I have a Milwaukee cordless framing nailer and I am impressed with it's adjustment for depth. If they have something similar on the finish nailers it is a plus. But I don't see it as a big plus unless you often try to nail really soft or really hard things with it. I haven't wanted to adjust depth putting up trim with my Ryobi. I also would be hesitant to use in really hard materials because the brads bend pretty easily. That is a problem sometimes (like nailing into a knot or with wild grain) but I doubt that it varies between nailers. I keep diagonal cutting pliers handy and a nail set to drive errant brads below the surface where they can be puttied over. Using a 16 or 15 gauge would help with this but it would also mean a lot of big voids to fill with filler. I prefer to just deal with the occasional wandering brad. I use the bigger finish nailers when I need 2.5 inch length or for something like the starter rows putting in hardwood flooring where it takes a stout nail to deal with the flooring's tendency to refuse to be straight.

The brad nailer has the same depth control, just a little smaller. Works well! 18g brads still behave silly sometimes, don't get rid of the side cutters, but you will be pleasantly surprised at the consistent power. You know how a air brad gun on a long, small hose lags a little as its recharging, or short drives if you fire it before it's up to pressure, probably an elapsed time of half a second? The milwaukee doesn't do that.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

"My air power ones are lighter, smaller, cheaper, and more powerful."

Appreciate all of the input. Certainly people have preferences --- dealing with an attached hose and the noice of a compressor vs the weight of a battery and the need to charge, and there are issues of money if you already own pneumatic.

My concern was that I would not want to buy a Milwaukee and have it not be as powerful. Perhaps the Milwaukee is a better gun than the DeWalt that you did not find as powerful as your shop pneumatic guns?

For me it is simple. I want to pull the trigger and have the nail drive every time, not most of the time. I want no double fire. I want the nail to go into the wood, including hardwoods to the depth I desire. I want reliability. If the new Milwaukee does that as well or better than the old Secco's, then for me, that works. I am about to work on trim and if and only if the new Milwaukee works as well or better than the old Senco, I am in.

The Milwaukee and Dewalt are different generation tech. I like Dewalt tools generally, but I gave away the dewalt nailers we tried. They are fine for someone I suppose, but too slow, huge ramp up, not as powerful, heavier, basically can't compete on any level except battery tech. Dewalt has better batteries than Milwaukee, but not nailers.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

good info steve and that you have a volume of them. ive been switching from Makita to Milwaukee to have just one battery type.

I stepped on an air line doing my roof putting my foot back behind me. It rolled and I went down. Good thing I had my own mcgiver harness set up so I just went down on the roof and no where else. Worst thing was that maybe a neighbour saw me but I popped back up like Kramer and just kept going. Those particular lines that are great in my shop are lousey in cold weather so had to get some of the super flexible ones for cold weather work. Be nice even more than other places to have fewer lines of any kind while roofing.

Yikes Warren!! I've personally never taken that ride, but I suspect when I do, an airhose will be involved too. I'm hoping to see a Milwaukee roofing gun someday, no luck yet...

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Based on Steve's comments above, Milwaukee's system seems to work well.

Hi Jim, this is a good opportunity to campaign for like buttons :)

[Warren Lake]

Steve it was okay, I had more and more trouble with heights as i got older. I made my own way which was the proper roofer rope grab and ran that belt through my blaakladder pants. I ran with basically no slack. It would slow a roofer down too much but it took away the panic feel i had and then just do the work. To walk needing slack I just held the rope grab open. Roofers would laugh as both I did bungalows this one 5/12 pitch. with that I could work right at the edge of the roof and be fine.

I wanted a particular roofing nailer and could not get it anymore Think SNF40 Senco funnel tip. I had to settle for Senco offshore but in talking to a guy at Senco US I later got an email him saying he found me the one I had wanted to buy. I said its too late I already had to settle for this new one, I said they told me the funnel tip had issues so what they sold me was better. I guess he must have called them and torn strips off them. They took it back and rolled out the red carpet treatment wise. I ordered the one from the US and landed it was 30 percent cheaper??? Amazing what a level of service, I had no idea he was going to do that but thankful always when I use it. Some old school guys will only hand nail, this gun is almost fool proof in how well it works.

[Rod Wolfy]

For most tasks in my shop, pulling out the cordless Brad nailer for a few shots works great. A lot less cumbersome than dealing with air lines, compressor, etc. However, yesterday I was working on putting wine shelves inside a hutch. The cordless was too big to get in the case. But the light/short/nimble corded bread nailer worked great.

[Jim Becker]

Hi Jim, this is a good opportunity to campaign for like buttons :)

Yea...need a bit of a software change for that! LOL

[Malcolm Schweizer]

The Milwaukee is great. I think dragging an air hose around is going to soon be a thing of the past, but to be fair, you can’t fire off as many in series with a battery powered gun as you can with an air powered gun. I still would much rather use battery. Just an hour ago I was on a lift 16’ up nailing stud walls in place and was thinking what a pain it would be with an air hose hanging down.

[Joel Gelman]

490623

What got my attention before I started this thread was that a friend brought over his Milwaukee battery powered pin nailer, but commented several times he was not happy with this finish nailer. He never said why. I was at his shop today, and he showed me why. He showed me a board where his old pin nailer drove in nails below the surface but the Milwaukee 2742-20 16 ga finish nailer with a fresh battery at max setting was a bit proud. See attached.

I did some reading, and perhaps that was a Gen 1. Seems like the Gen 2 nailers are way better. I just ordered a 2841-21CTR M18 Fuel 16 Gauge gun. Hope it works out well. My Senco is a 15 gauge. Not sure if Senco nails will work with the Milwaukee if I get a 15 Gauge also or a brad nailer, but either way, I will need to get nails in 16 guage now.

[Bill Dufour]

https://www.amazon.com/J-6901-91-Portable-Compressed-Pneumatic-Regulator/dp/B000QF7I7W/ref=sr_1_2?crid=2NAR76MPJQVIB&keywords=jacpac&qid=1669524745&sprefix=jacpac%2Caps%2C434&sr=8-2

[Brian Tymchak]

I wanted a 23 ga pin nailer and opted for the Ryobi battery powered since I had recently moved to Ryobi drills. I used it for the first time a couple days ago to assemble some walnut decorative brackets. I was mostly satisfied with not having to manage an air hose, the main reason I went with battery powered. However, one thing that I found was that there seems to no nail depth adjustment like the pneumatic nailers I have. I would have liked to sink the pins just a tad deeper. Wish I had realized that before I bought it.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

490623

What got my attention before I started this thread was that a friend brought over his Milwaukee battery powered pin nailer, but commented several times he was not happy with this finish nailer. He never said why. I was at his shop today, and he showed me why. He showed me a board where his old pin nailer drove in nails below the surface but the Milwaukee 2742-20 16 ga finish nailer with a fresh battery at max setting was a bit proud. See attached.

I did some reading, and perhaps that was a Gen 1. Seems like the Gen 2 nailers are way better. I just ordered a 2841-21CTR M18 Fuel 16 Gauge gun. Hope it works out well. My Senco is a 15 gauge. Not sure if Senco nails will work with the Milwaukee if I get a 15 Gauge also or a brad nailer, but either way, I will need to get nails in 16 guage now.

His gun needs Milwaukee service, they will fix that.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

The Milwaukee is great. I think dragging an air hose around is going to soon be a thing of the past, but to be fair, you can’t fire off as many in series with a battery powered gun as you can with an air powered gun. I still would much rather use battery. Just an hour ago I was on a lift 16’ up nailing stud walls in place and was thinking what a pain it would be with an air hose hanging down.

I don't think there is any practical speed difference on rapid bump firing. Maybe if you were to just blast away on a board to race or something, but on a normal 3 nail plate to stud situation that requires the gun to be positioned appropriately, there is no difference in speed between an air gun and the Milwaukee in my experience. What is that, something like three nails in a couple seconds for either? And no hose tangling up. Put the air framer on a lightweight hose and the Milwaukee is easily faster. The fact that we're comparing the two techs is a huge milestone for battery guns, this is a huge deal for battery guns to compete with air so favorably.

[John Goodin]

It sounds like Milwaukee has a good cordless nailer. As far as adopting a battery platform if I were to buy new set of cordless tools Milwaukee would be the first brand I would research. They make tools that can handle everyday use and have a very wide tool selection.

[Larry Little]

I try to keep the same brand because at times a sale on bare tools come up, plus I already have seven 4ah batteries.

[Dan Rude]

Ok, I started out in the Cordless market eith the M12 T-50 stapler. Love it, I then picked up the M12 Pin Nailer, it did not disappoint. I then picked up a Rigid 18v Brad nailer. It was heavier then my Air nailers. It worked great then not so great. Took it in for repair under the LSA, Ridgid replaced it with the new model it works very well. Converting my other air Nailers to either Milwaukee or Ridgid would have been pricey. So I went with the Milwaukee M18 Air compressor, it works very well for finish Nailers and Brad nailers. I have not tried to use it with my Framing Nailer yet. It is very quiet though and was about the price of a M18 Finish Nailer.

[Joel Gelman]

Was going to give an update on my new 16ga finish nailer, but not sure if I have the right one. I got the Milwaukee 16ga angled finish nailer online. It did not come with nails. Stopped by my local store (Ganahl) and the guy said they do not carry the nails for that because everyone uses the 2741-20 16 ga straight finish nailer and angled only for the 15ga gun. Huh. Not sure if I should try to return it can get the straight gun or just order the nails for my new unused gun online. Interesting that they did not carry nails, but they did sell the angled 16ga gun!

[Jim Becker]

Interesting. I've only ever seen 16 gage guns with straight nails ("brad" head format) with the heavier 15 gage getting the angled fasteners with regular nail heads. You may very well need to order the correct angled 16 gage fasteners online.

[Joel Gelman]

Looking more as Milwaukee is closed for the weekend. Now I am seeing this

https://www.protoolreviews.com/milwaukee-m18-fuel-cordless-16-gauge-finish-nailer-review-2841/

Seems like maybe the newer better version of the 16ga is the 2841 and the older one is the 2741. However, interesting that this would be angled and the older version would be straight. Maybe I never the newer model that takes different nails. Confusing.

[Myk Rian]

I haven't seen anyone suggest butane guns.
How do battery units compare to them?

[glenn bradley]

Hi Jim, this is a good opportunity to campaign for like buttons :)

Uh . . . yeah. We've been waiting on that software upgrade for how many years? :)

[Steve Rozmiarek]

I haven't seen anyone suggest butane guns.
How do battery units compare to them?

My experience with gas guns is a Paslode framer. You are supposed to be able to get 1200 rounds per cartridge and way more out of the battery. Never worked that way for me, always out of one or the other it seemed like. The fuel cartridge cost is added expense per shot, a battery gun doesn't have that ongoing cost. Paslode apparently really wants you to buy their nails, so they package a cartridge and and 1000 nails in packs, which is generally the only way you can find the cartridges if you run out and are needing something local, quickly. It's also far more expensive to buy expendables that way, and 1000 nails goes really quickly. The biggest deal breaker for that gun is the lack of bump fire, and the slower recharge time between shots. Oh, and you have to disassemble and clean it regularly. Pass.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Uh . . . yeah. We've been waiting on that software upgrade for how many years? :)

A perfect opportunity for a like button! LOL!