Saw Stop vs. Harvey

[Matt McGill]

Hi,

I'm looking to get a nice table saw. I've narrowed my search to Saw Stop's Cabinet saw and a similar model from Harvey. I've seen the Saw Stop in a couple stores ... but all I've really done is rely on reviews online. Anyone have any feedback? The safety of the saw stop is attractive, but I'd rather have solid, long-lasting construction ... any feedback is appreciated!

[Bryan Hall]

I've never had my hands on a Harvey, but I always liked the size of their table specs. I don't know of a brand with a larger table top.

Sawstop is probably the industry leader now? I had a bad experience with their ICS but I'd argue that is not the norm.

Now I have a short stroke slider. I'll never willingly own a cabinet saw again.

[Richard Coers]

No comparison in my book, Sawstop is the purchase to make. A statement from a 50 year woodworker with 9 3/4 fingers.

[Prashun Patel]

"but I'd rather have solid, long-lasting construction"

The Sawstop is solid, long-lasting construction. There was nothing about the fit and finish that I had issue with when I owned one.

There were only 2 issues:

I had 3 careless brake firings (because I got my aluminum miter gauge in the path of the blade) in the few years I owned mine. Each time that happens it was $70 for a new brake + the price of a new blade.

Also, a dado stack requires a special brake. The inconvenience of having to swap this was enough to make me stop using dado blades altogether.

But there was nothing in the quality of the saw that was lacking.

[Justin Rapp]

"but I'd rather have solid, long-lasting construction"

The Sawstop is solid, long-lasting construction. There was nothing about the fit and finish that I had issue with when I owned one.

There were only 2 issues:

I had 3 careless brake firings (because I got my aluminum miter gauge in the path of the blade) in the few years I owned mine. Each time that happens it was $70 for a new brake + the price of a new blade.

Also, a dado stack requires a special brake. The inconvenience of having to swap this was enough to make me stop using dado blades altogether.

But there was nothing in the quality of the saw that was lacking.



I agree it's a solid saw. I have a 3.0hp PCS model and I should have bought it 10 years prior when when I did. I however disagree with Prashun on the inconvenience of swapping the brake. It adds 30-45 seconds or so of a blade change, and setting up the dado stack to match the required cut is the time consuming event. With what I have been making the past few months it was a constant switch back and forth between dado and standard brakes and I don't find it an issue at all.

[Michelle Rich]

I'd bet either one would fit your needs. If you want the sawstop technology, then buy it. If you don't, then buy the harvey. I have a harvey and like it very much.

[Andrew Hughes]

I would pick the saw that doesn’t accidentally destroy a good cutting blade.

[Phil Gaudio]

I would pick the saw that doesn’t accidentally destroy my appendages.

[Jack Frederick]

I have the 3 hp PCS. Like Prashun I too screwed up and yes it costs a blade and a cartridge. Making those mistakes that cause the brake to trigger prove to me that I can be dumber than a post. They never should have happened. An oversight I tell myself, but at least I won’t have my fingers on the table when I screw up again. Also, are you going to be the sole user of the saw? If others will run it there are liability concerns. I like my PCS a lot.

[Matt McGill]

Lots of great feedback!

Yea, I’m the only user.

[Ron Selzer]

Never have seen a Harvey so no comment on it.
I have a SawStop ICS 5hp, 36" fence with all options available when I bought it in 2014.
Have yet to feel it needs more power, have not tripped it, have mounted the dado blade set numerous times, takes longer to set blade width than change cartridges.
Have talked with Tech support and was treated very well.
Could it be better, of course. Takes more money to buy then.
Very happy with it, to replace/upgrade would be almost $100,000 for ME. As it is tight in the basement and new slider would need way more space for how I want to use it. SWMBO would get a new addition on the house and the basement shop would grow twice or more. Not moving from here so no new outbuilding for shop. Probably closer to $150,000, time SWMBO got done furnishing new addition and the new 10' slider was down there.
Ron

[Doug Colombo]

I have the Harvey Alpha 4hp 52” fence saw and love it. No issues with it so far. I looked at Saw Stop but to get the larger table size to match the Alpha, you need to get the Saw Stop ICS. Both are great saws so it really comes down to if you want to spend the extra $ for the safety feature. After looking at the saws, I don’t see any difference in the fit and finish, and the Harvey comes with some nice standard items (great miter gage, over blade dust collection to name a few), and good customer support. But it doesn’t have the safety system.

Good luck with your decision.

[Richard Coers]

I would pick the saw that doesn’t accidentally destroy a good cutting blade.
I would gladly pay for saw blades over having 2 surgeries and a finger that aches in the cold weather and has a very high accuracy of predicting storms. Even a $200 saw blade is way cheaper than a month of pain.

[Andrew Hughes]

That’s a lot of money for a table saw that only spins a 10 inch blade.
I understand how some people can see themselves cutting off their fingers on a table saw.
The op should know about the reports of misfires that eat up good blades. I thought it was a fair comment I didn’t mention all the electronic problems.
5,000 for a 10 inch table saw that’s a lot cabbage

[Larry Frank]

The Sawstop is a solid saw with good fit and finish. I will gladly pay for an accidental trip for the added safety. I hear the Harvey is A good saw but no actual experience.

These threads like this have been repeated many times in this forum. There are those who are very happy with their Sawstop and those hate Sawstop.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Of the many SawStop reviews I have seen here at SMC, not being strong or long lasting was never mentioned, EVER!

[Tim Janssen]

I am an amateur wood worker and when I retired, now 22 years ago, got more seriouds about it and bought the Ryobi BT3000. Made many nice things with it and to the best of my memory never had an accident with it. Then 10 years later SawStop came along and despite the fact that it cost me 4 times the price of the BT3000 there was no argument in my mind, I wanted the SawStop and bought the PCS. I have never had the slightest regrets.
Cheers!

Tim

[Andrew Templeton]

To me it is a no-brainer to go with the SawStop. They are well built and the safety feature is something that you may think you do not need until you end up needing it. I like many know plenty of woodworkers who are missing portions of fingers, many of which now wish they had a SawStop when their accident happened.

[Justin Rapp]

Another factor to consider, even if overall the sawstop cost you a little more, forgetting the cost of medical attention, just the idea of missing part or all of a finger and everything it might prevent you from doing later in life is worth de-risking at any cost.

[Mark Gibney]

Timely thread. I'm considering getting a SawStop and retiring my Unisaw.
What is the usual way to go about buying one? - through a vendor like Woodcraft / / Rockler, or directly from a distributor?
I'm in Los Angeles if that affects the answer.
Thanks!

[glenn bradley]

I always give the same response. When looking at saws priced at that tier the Saw Stop was the choice regardless of safety feature. The flesh sensing tech was just a bonus.

[Justin Rapp]

Mark,

There are a bunch of ways to order a SawStop. My recommendation is to give the guys a call at WoodWerks. https://www.thisiswoodworking.com/. They are a mom & pop so giving them the business is better then giving it to the big box stores.

I got my sawstop from them and they were great to work with. It's the first time I ever ordered a machine where I was sent a photo of my pallet / boxes before they were picked up for shipping. It took a few days to get from Ohio to NJ. I suspect a few days longer to get to CA.

[Andrew Hughes]

Timely thread. I'm considering getting a SawStop and retiring my Unisaw.
What is the usual way to go about buying one? - through a vendor like Woodcraft / / Rockler, or directly from a distributor?
I'm in Los Angeles if that affects the answer.
Thanks!
My suggestion is Eagle tools in Glendale. It’s a well stock woodworking machine store. The guys there are great if you have any problems you’ll be in good hands.
http://www.eagle-tools.com/

[Dan Howell]

Just went through this process considering the same two saws. I ended up getting the Sawstop ICS. The safety feature is a huge bonus, but was not the deciding factor for me. My local Woodcraft store had the Sawstop in stock and I could touch and feel it before buying. Plus, they carry all of the accessories for the saw in the store. This is what put it over the top for me.

[Derek Cohen]

Hi,

I'm looking to get a nice table saw. I've narrowed my search to Saw Stop's Cabinet saw and a similar model from Harvey. I've seen the Saw Stop in a couple stores ... but all I've really done is rely on reviews online. Anyone have any feedback? The safety of the saw stop is attractive, but I'd rather have solid, long-lasting construction ... any feedback is appreciated!

The difference between the SS and Harvey is essentially the protection supplied by the SS. That is not to suggest that they are built to the same standards, as I do not know (both come with glowing reputations), but I imagine that the main reason that 90% of SS buyers get one is the protection it offers.

That said, I have looked carefully at the quality offered by SS, and it is indeed excellent. It shared the top of my list about 5 years ago with the Hammer K3 slider. Both were comparable in build. But I wound up getting the short stroke K3 as it is the better saw in the same price range. This requires a shift in mindset. When the penny dropped how a slider differs from a traditional table saw, and you can come to terms with the insecurity of venturing into new territory, you will not look back. I have nil regrets about getting the K3 over a SS.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Aaron Inami]

SawStop is definitely a very nice cabinet saw and likely at the top of quality manufacturing (in addition to the safety thing of course).

I have taken a deep look at Harvey tool in the last few months. While they may not be the heaviest duty machines, I think they are re-inventing a lot on how the machines are made. If you look at SawStop, they are making the traditional table saw the same way everyone else is (i.e. Grizzly, South Bend, Jet, Powermatic). Harvey is looking at each part of the machine and sometimes re-designing the part to make it work better. For example, the SawStop fence is your traditional Beismeyer fence -- nothing wrong with it and it works. But Harvey has done a lot more when re-designing how their own fence works. Take a good look on their product details page for the table saw.

I have seen the same type of new innovations when I took a deep dive on their Harvey Alpha bandsaw.

That being said, if you want to go with a 5HP or 7.5HP machine, you have to go with one of the traditional cabinet saws (SawStop or Powermatic or Grizzly or Jet).

[Dan Rude]

I love my PCS with the 3 HP motor. I had a friend buy the Harvey Alpha, about a year ago. So far he is very happy with it. He also got the Bandsaw. I think it came down to avaiablility at the time. You would be happy with either. Dan

[Nick Lazz]

Did anyone end up buying a Harvey? I'm close... big sale they're having ends tonight at midnight PST I think...
I'm looking at the HW110S-36P $2549... says regular price $3599 but I'm pretty sure I saw it for $2999...either way it's significant.

Happy Holidays!

[Malcolm Schweizer]

I was looking on the Harvey site at their saw. It looks well thought out and well made. Today I was looking at a Saw Stop just because it was on display at a store, and I wasn’t as impressed with the fit and finish as I was with the Harvey. I once cut the tip of my thumb off with a table saw, but I am not rushing out to buy a saw stop. This thread is going to quickly deteriorate between those that think you HAVE to buy one just because it has a safety feature, and those like me that are looking more for a saw that doesn’t have the complicated brake system. Anyway, even without that, I was really impressed with the Harvey. If I didn’t already have two cabinet saws, I would likely go with Harvey.

[Phil Gaudio]

Get the SawStop: you will thank me when you are not sitting in the emergency room.

[Justin Rapp]

I was looking on the Harvey site at their saw. It looks well thought out and well made. Today I was looking at a Saw Stop just because it was on display at a store, and I wasn’t as impressed with the fit and finish as I was with the Harvey. I once cut the tip of my thumb off with a table saw, but I am not rushing out to buy a saw stop. This thread is going to quickly deteriorate between those that think you HAVE to buy one just because it has a safety feature, and those like me that are looking more for a saw that doesn’t have the complicated brake system. Anyway, even without that, I was really impressed with the Harvey. If I didn’t already have two cabinet saws, I would likely go with Harvey.

I am not so sure why so many people think the brake is complicated. It is just in there and stops the blade if there is a contact made. You change the brake, send your blade for replare or replace it and move on to the next cut in your project. It takes all of 2 minutes to change the brake or switch out to the dado. It is not complicated.

[John TenEyck]

This times 100. Blades are cheap compared to visits to the ER. The only new saws I'd consider would be a SawStop {or similar if and when available} or a slider.

John

[Doug Colombo]

Did anyone end up buying a Harvey? I'm close... big sale they're having ends tonight at midnight PST I think...
I'm looking at the HW110S-36P $2549... says regular price $3599 but I'm pretty sure I saw it for $2999...either way it's significant.

Happy Holidays!

I bought one earlier this year and love it. Once one of my son in laws saw it, he ordered one. Neither of us had any issues with assembly, although one of us put the fence tape measure on incorrectly (hint: it wasn’t my son in law]. Harvey customer service was great and sent out a new tape at no charge.

[Phil Gaudio]

FWIW:

Harvey: China
SawStop: Taiwan

[James Jayko]

I would pick the saw that doesn’t accidentally destroy a good cutting blade.

...fingers be damned!

[Larry Frank]

Always interesting responses any time Sawstop is mentioned. I recently had an Oops with mine and ruined a cartridge and Freud blade. I told my chief financial officer what happened and the cost to replace. She said no problem and happy I have that saw.

I could care less about the cost of a blade and will trade that for my safety. Others may feel differently and that is OK as safety is a personal issue.

[Greg Parrish]

Well, I converted to a sawstop earlier this year and have posted before that this appears to be the year of table saw accidents. I’ve seen more finger cut posts this year than any before that I can remember. in fact, on the small workshop page on facebook, someone posted a finger cut that would almost make you vomit and it was from that one time in 35 years that the table saw bit them. Anyway, as much as I liked my prior saws, I’m starting to feel pretty thankful for my sawstop and hope it does it’s job if I ever have a slip up.

[James Jayko]

I just cannot fathom why anyone would say, "Yeah, not cutting off your finger is cool and all, but its an extra $200." That $200 seems like money NOT well saved. Especially when someone explained to me that its almost always a pro who gets tired/sloppy at the end of the day...if it can happen to that guy who runs a table saw all day, it can DEFINITELY happen to me.

If its a complete non starter, get a Unisaw or whatever for $500. Don't spend $3000 on the one that's perfectly serviceable but definitely will cut your fingers off.

But then again, I'm a bit of a simpleton.

[Justin Rapp]

Always interesting responses any time Sawstop is mentioned. I recently had an Oops with mine and ruined a cartridge and Freud blade. I told my chief financial officer what happened and the cost to replace. She said no problem and happy I have that saw.

I could care less about the cost of a blade and will trade that for my safety. Others may feel differently and that is OK as safety is a personal issue.


I just cannot fathom why anyone would say, "Yeah, not cutting off your finger is cool and all, but its an extra $200." That $200 seems like money NOT well saved. Especially when someone explained to me that its almost always a pro who gets tired/sloppy at the end of the day...if it can happen to that guy who runs a table saw all day, it can DEFINITELY happen to me.

If its a complete non starter, get a Unisaw or whatever for $500. Don't spend $3000 on the one that's perfectly serviceable but definitely will cut your fingers off.

But then again, I'm a bit of a simpleton.

I had to lump these two together since there is a cost basis and safety in both posts. I also see so many posts on other WW msgs boards about table saw mishaps, and sometimes some bloody messy pictures OR 'thank god I have a sawstop, showing a tiny nick' I don't give two craps about the cost of a blade or cartridge. First off, the cartridge is replaced free by sawstop if it's a flesh contact (if I remember correctly). The blade, well, so I sent it back to ridge or forrest and see if it's repairable, or if it's a less costly blade, toss it. Even if it ends up costing me 150 bucks for a new blade, I didn't just spend a lifetime with a hand injury. And the potential money I save on medical bills, downtime and worse, if i can't do my job anymore.

I agree with what James says, money not well saved, and I will add on top of that, penny wise, pound foolish!

[Thomas Pender]

I was presiding in my Courtroom several years ago when the inventor of the Sawstop, Dr. Steve Glass, testified the table saw industry in the US was approximately worth $400 million, but the injuries caused by table saws caused $2 billion in injuries every year…. He was not cross examined on that, so the fact was admitted by the other party. That kind of statistic sure has stuck with me. (He also explained the science behind the saw and if anyone is interested - I remember what he said.)

Caused me to buy a 3 hp PCS with the 52” fence. Well, my fit and finish was perfect, it was easy to put it together, and I bought an Incra 1000 SE Sled that makes it sing on cross cutting (with perfect angles - even good for making good picture frames), a Forest Blade that rip cuts as good as my jointer on edges, a Dewalt Dado set that allows me to be happy to make through tenons again (changing the brake is a cinch - harder to set the width of the cut). Guess what I am saying is this Sawstop is a wonderful and safe addition for me - its fence is an accurate joy and the long table enables me to accurately cut 3/4” 13 ply furniture grade plywood - cherry or oak. I should also add that its dust collection is pretty good hooked up to my Oneida Dust Gorilla - even at the end of the line.

[Justin Rapp]

I was presiding in my Courtroom several years ago when the inventor of the Sawstop, Dr. Steve Glass, testified the table saw industry in the US was approximately worth $400 million, but the injuries caused by table saws caused $2 billion in injuries every year…. He was not cross examined on that, so the fact was admitted by the other party. That kind of statistic sure has stuck with me. (He also explained the science behind the saw and if anyone is interested - I remember what he said.)

Caused me to buy a 3 hp PCS with the 52” fence. Well, my fit and finish was perfect, it was easy to put it together, and I bought an Incra 1000 SE Sled that makes it sing on cross cutting (with perfect angles - even good for making good picture frames), a Forest Blade that rip cuts as good as my jointer on edges, a Dewalt Dado set that allows me to be happy to make through tenons again (changing the brake is a cinch - harder to set the width of the cut). Guess what I am saying is this Sawstop is a wonderful and safe addition for me - its fence is an accurate joy and the long table enables me to accurately cut 3/4” 13 ply furniture grade plywood - cherry or oak. I should also add that its dust collection is pretty good hooked up to my Oneida Dust Gorilla - even at the end of the line.

Thomas,

If I didn't already have a 3hp pcs, this post would make me buy one. You should get some royalties from SawStop :)

[Doug Colombo]

One thing to keep in mind when you compare the Harvey vs Saw Stop - the Harvey has a 31” deep table, with approx 13” from the front of the table to the front of the blade. To get the deeper table, you have to get the ISC Saw Stop - the PSC has the standard 26” table depth. After using a deeper table on a saw (newer Delta Unisaw and Powermatic), I wouldn’t go back to a 26” depth top. Makes a huge difference. So if you are looking at going with SS, look at the ICS when comparing saws with the Harvey (or Powermatic).

[Justin Rapp]

One thing to keep in mind when you compare the Harvey vs Saw Stop - the Harvey has a 31” deep table, with approx 13” from the front of the table to the front of the blade. To get the deeper table, you have to get the ISC Saw Stop - the PSC has the standard 26” table depth. After using a deeper table on a saw (newer Delta Unisaw and Powermatic), I wouldn’t go back to a 26” depth top. Makes a huge difference. So if you are looking at going with SS, look at the ICS when comparing saws with the Harvey (or Powermatic).

Doug - this is really good info actually for a compare as not many people think about the blade position on the table right away, or ever. I built a small extension, only about 6 inches that I can easily attach to the front of my sawstop in front of my blade to give me a bit more run space before the blade, and also to help make sure my sled doesn't tip up when I pull it back for cross cutting wider boards. it is crude but works.

One other thing that also makes it hard to provide feedback / recommendations is when the question doesn't come with what a person plans to use the saw for. They might be making things that are many small parts, where the safety is more important than the size of the saw. On the flip side, maybe it's going to be a rip saw, mostly used for ripping down 8 foot long boards where a larger table surface is very useful. Of course the ICS solves both of these concerns so that was a good recommendation.

[Ronald Blue]

I now have a SawStop 3 HP PCS. It popped up on FB marketplace a few weeks ago and I jumped on it. It wasn't the steal of the century but it was a good value. SS sliding crosscut table and folding outfeed table. I went through the setup just like I was assembling for the first time. Leveling the wings and then squaring the table and fence to the blade. After all it just completed a 180 mile ride on the back of a 2 wheel trailer. The ease of the squaring up with the jack screws is so convenient. I never used any other cabinet saw so I can't compare to any others. I despise the way they tried to force their product on us. That said I always considered the safety feature to be significant. So I felt that one day I would have one as well. Fit and finish are very good. I've not used it a lot yet but every time I turn it on I have that (ahhhhh) feeling. Smooth and quiet and dust collection is exceptional. Cross cutting nothing seems to escape. Ripping has a little lost above the blade. The original owner did set up the blade guard dust collection which if I will be doing a lot of ripping I will use. I have never saw the Harvey but most people like them. I can also tell you I wouldn't have scrambled to put a wad of cash together on a Sunday afternoon and drove 180 miles to get the Harvey. It's just not anything special and I've saw plenty of cabinet saws within 3-4 hours that I passed on. I also figure there will be times my grandkids will be in my shop and maybe even want to build something. I don't want to worry about the potential of any of them ever being injured or maimed for life over a couple thousand dollars. I can also tell you that I still use caution any time my hands or fingers are remotely close to the blade. I don't want to be the guy that the system failed on. So my vote is for the safety feature and you get a great saw with it. I still detest the way they tried to force them on everyone. A good idea sells itself.

[Patrick Varley]

I do enjoy my SawStop, and like others said, it just comes down to whether the added piece of mind is worth the price premium. Still a great saw without the brake feature, but not necessarily at where it's priced.

All that being said, I just tripped my own with a boneheaded move yesterday. Only time in the five years I've had it happen. Switched out to the Dado stack, and didn't adjust the (aluminum) fence on my miter gauge to account for the wider blade. 3/4 of the way through the first cut...BAM! Expensive mistake, but one I'm willing to live with. However, it is pretty amazing to see the thing in action. No damage to the gauge itself and certainly gives me some reassurance should that have been a hand.

[Rod Wolfy]

I now have a SawStop 3 HP PCS. It popped up on FB marketplace a few weeks ago and I jumped on it. It wasn't the steal of the century but it was a good value. SS sliding crosscut table and folding outfeed table...

I don't want to worry about the potential of any of them ever being injured or maimed for life over a couple thousand dollars. I can also tell you that I still use caution any time my hands or fingers are remotely close to the blade. I don't want to be the guy that the system failed on. So my vote is for the safety feature and you get a great saw with it. I still detest the way they tried to force them on everyone. A good idea sells itself.

I felt the same way about how Gauss went about the marketing, but I also understand the industry "giants" at the time were not really willing to barter with him over royalties.

That being said it sounds like you got quite the deal on your saw; definite gloat. I waited 4 years to find one on CL in Seattle. One came up new in to the box, as a guy had bought two for his business and then had a change of plans. I saved the sales tax. Love the saw and after getting hurt in several accidents over the years, I didn't want to spend my retirement worrying about a table saw injury for myself or my friends that come over to learn from me. My chop saw is way more dangerous than my table saw is now.

Congrats Ron!

[Dennis Jarchow]

Earlier this year when I started thinking about replacing my Ridgid R4511 saw I looked at both Harvey and Sawstop. I liked the cheaper price and some of the features on the Harvey's but the almost universal praise for the Sawstop was also a draw. As I was getting my Ridgid cleaned up and ready to sell, I noticed my bevel adjust wheel was cracked. Since I had a lifetime warranty on the saw, I called Ridgid and was told that despite the warranty, that part was no longer available. Turns out a lot of the replacement parts were no longer available. Thankfully Ebay had one; but that got me thinking. You frequently hear about people on the forum fixing older saws, Powermatic, Delta, etc. that are decades old. What about these new (or relatively new) brands?

I emailed Sawstop and asked them about replacement parts and they said they said they still had parts available for their first saws from 2004 and would continue to have them. I emailed Harvey and didn't get a response. I don't know if Harvey's lack of response was actually an answer, or just poor customer service. In the end, Sawstop's response, the positive feedback on the web, along with being able to actually see and play with the saw at multiple dealers, helped make my decision. I was also able to use the safety feature of the SS as a selling point to my wife, though that was secondary in my decision.

[Nick Lazz]

I went with the Harvey. Couldn't pass it up. Plus, the added safety in what I know about me simply wasn't worth it. All saws are inherently dangerous and my table saw isn't the worst offender.
I can't imagine how many brakes and blades I would go through either. I don't know how many times I've hit hidden staples, or nicked a jig... I would set that thing off probably once a month 🤣.