Dangers of Shapers?

[Andrew More]

After the discussion about the most dangerous tool in the shop I'm a bit curious. Almost all of my tools feature some sort of motor which turns something at high speed with can turn fingers into mush, or fling projectiles at high speed.

Is there something about shapers that make them uniquely dangerous?
Is it that many of the DIY/prosumer models are underpowered?
Does using a power feeder address the biggest dangers, and is there something else that can be done to make them less dangerous?

[Kevin Jenness]

Probably the biggest dangers from shapers are from unguarded or poorly guarded hand fed operations and poorly understood or set up tooling. Whenever a power feeder can be used the danger can be lessened but they are often not suitable for curved work. The wide variety of tooling types and sizes, especially cutterheads with interchangeable knives, and the importance of setting them up properly and running them at the correct speed, can lead to safety issues. Most common woodworking machines have fewer variables to contend with. Routers and router tables can have similar issues but shapers involve a great deal more kinetic potential. No doubt there are many more tablesaw injuries but on an accident per man-hour basis I would guess shapers are near the top of the list.

[Jared Sankovich]

Generally if you don't stick your fingers into the spinny parts they don't cause too much trouble. Guards, feeders and limited tooling tend to promote safety, running without any of those increases the risk.

The size of the shaper is generally irrelevant to the safe use or non safe use of the machine.

[Mel Fulks]

Andrew, there are several ways shaper knives are held . The “smooth knives “ ( without corrugations )are considered the most dangerous as
they are held in only by pressure. The steel is pretty soft, and over tightening distorts the collars , thereby making them more dangerous.
The knife steel is sold in different heights but the sizes are nominal, so a piece from a bar bought last year will probably not pair up safely
with a piece off a new bar. Too many shops have let new guys use it just because they said “ I know how”. Most shop machines can only
hurt the operator, but a smooth knife that is not correctly seated and tightened can hit anybody, and that includes a customer -shop tourist.
Some injuries are just from sticking a finger into the sharp spinning knives.

[Mel Fulks]

Besides feeders a shaper needs some type of “spring hold- down”. I don’t know if you can even buy them now, years ago we had to have
them made if we bought a shaper without one. Short straight pieces can be run by lining them up face down and tacking a board on top.

[Jared Sankovich]

Good video on shapers https://youtu.be/4n6yTHMBX54

[Albert Lee]

After the discussion about the most dangerous tool in the shop I'm a bit curious. Almost all of my tools feature some sort of motor which turns something at high speed with can turn fingers into mush, or fling projectiles at high speed.

Is there something about shapers that make them uniquely dangerous?
Is it that many of the DIY/prosumer models are underpowered?
Does using a power feeder address the biggest dangers, and is there something else that can be done to make them less dangerous?


A lot of variables to check before you switch it on that shaper, different to other machines.

Feeder will address some issues but its not foolproof. I have made a mistake before where I simply forgotten to lock the feeder and I switched it on...

[Mike Cutler]

Andrew

There is no reason to be afraid of a shaper, or any machine. You need a healthy respect for any machine in the shop.
I first started using a shaper when I was probably 13 years old. I'm 63 now, and still have all of my digits. I don't use it as much as I used to, but when I want it, it's there.
Yes, a power feeder makes it "safer", but only because you can't get any part of your body within the rotation of the cutter. It's all blocked by the power feeder.
The video linked is a fairly good video for specific operations, but start out slow. Start with rabbets and edge joints, then progress from there. Don't go straight to shaping your own solid body guitar freehand. There are also cutters in that video that are no longer available for good reason, so just watch it to see the basic operations that can be perfomed
I personally would not want one less than 3hp, with a 1/2HP power feeder. There are tons of both all over Craigslist and Facebook Market place.
The shaper is a machine of thousandth's. It can be that accurate and repeatable. If you ever have the chance to edge treat a bunch of boards for a large panel glue up on a shaper, you'll never want to use anything else.
Get the right tooling for cabinet doors and you'll easily achieve great results.

[Richard Coers]

For me it's that large diameter cutter beating the air and creating one heck of a frightful sound. That and that big motor with so much power. Just perceived danger I know. A folk tail in my woodworking community about an old square head shaper in a vintage shop. One operator had a knife thrown, and it went through a little meat just about his waist. It went all the way through. After that, a plywood "sandwich board" with leather straps was worn over the gentleman for protection. That and he stooped under the table of the shaper upon starting the motor after a new setup.

[Mel Fulks]

Never walk away from a shaper that is partially set up. Something about that makes guys want to turn on the switch . Tourist family members
of shaper Captains also feel compelled to turn on stuff. Forward and Reverse needs to be read every time you get back from wherever you
went.

[Mark Hennebury]

Agree with what's been said, Knowledge is your best defense! Analyze and develop a process and checklist. Know where you're fingers are and where they might be should something go wrong, best they are on the good side not the bad. Checking speed is matched to tooling should be on that list.

There was an accident report that I read years ago, not about a shaper, but a large industrial pin router. dual speed 10,000/20,000 rpm.
Apparently a worker was making rosettes on a drill press and thought that it would go faster on the pin router.
He put a rosette cutter in the pin router and turned it on, It was on the 20,000 rpm pulley.
So a cutter went straight through him, and he died.
This was a few years back and i believe the cutters were held by the friction of two screws.

[Rick Potter]

Adding to what Mel said about being partially set up..........

I have posted this before and it involved a jointer, but still applies. I inherited a Craftsman 6" jointer from my father. Never used it, as I had my own, so half a dozen years later I gave it to my son in law. He turned it on once getting home, and a loose blade took out a large size hole in the cast iron bed of the jointer. Fortunately he was not injured.

I can only speculate that perhaps dad was adjusting or changing blades when he got called away for dinner or whatever, never returning to finish the job, and the machine got put in a corner. He died at 87, and the last few years he was overwrought because of mom's Alzheimer disease. Who knows?

[Greg Funk]

For me it's that large diameter cutter beating the air and creating one heck of a frightful sound. That and that big motor with so much power. Just perceived danger I know. A folk tail in my woodworking community about an old square head shaper in a vintage shop. One operator had a knife thrown, and it went through a little meat just about his waist. It went all the way through. After that, a plywood "sandwich board" with leather straps was worn over the gentleman for protection. That and he stooped under the table of the shaper upon starting the motor after a new setup.I made a bunch of moldings for our house with this cutter. When it spins up you can feel it in your gut. I only ever used a power feeder but it's always a little unnerving when you make the first cut. After you've used it for a while, like anything else, you get used to it.489012

[Mark Hennebury]

Big tenon heads, can be on shapers, this set is on a tenon machine. 489024

[Kevin Jenness]

One shop I worked in had a rule for a time that shaper setups had to be checked by a second person before running. There are a lot of things that need to be done right. Some things to check:

Knives secured in the cutterhead
Spindle nut tight
Rpms correct for the cutterhead type and diameter
Spindle rotation direction correct
Fence and hold-downs secure
Powerfeed set correctly and all adjustments locked
Hand-guided jigs as safe as possible with solid handholds well away from cutters and good material clamping
Backstop in place if "dropping on" (non-through cut)
Guards in place where appropriate
Chip collection set up and on
In and outfeed support if needed
Nobody in the firing line

[Steve Rozmiarek]

I'll never forget that sound that a large tenon setup made that time that I neglected to check the speed on a new shaper. Don't know how fast it went, but it was terrifying. They give me the hebe jeebies just because of all that energy harnessed in that cutter. That one was clearly on the way to becoming a grenade if i wouldn't have hit the red button. Lots of ways to hurt yourself, shapers just allow you to do it in many more than usual. After all, pretty much every time you change cutters, you completely reset everything on the machine.

[Greg Funk]

Big tenon heads, can be on shapers, this set is on a tenon machine. 489024Looks like a medieval torture device :)

[Mike Kees]

For me the biggest 'danger' of shapers is smaller amount of material (books, etc.) to learn from if you do not have the chance to work in a shop with experienced teachers. This was my story. I learned by tracking down every book I could find and asking lots of questions here on this forum. Compared to a table saw or drill press or even bandsaws there is way less volume of information. Probably because the domain of a shaper is usually commercial shops building doors/windows and cabinets. Also if you are a complete novice it is hard to cut through the crap on youtube to get the solid info that is available online.

[Kevin Jenness]

The best book I know of https://www.amazon.com/Spindle-Moulder-Handbook-Eric-Stephenson/dp/0854421505#customerReviews

[brent stanley]

For me the biggest 'danger' of shapers is smaller amount of material (books, etc.) to learn from if you do not have the chance to work in a shop with experienced teachers. This was my story. I learned by tracking down every book I could find and asking lots of questions here on this forum. Compared to a table saw or drill press or even bandsaws there is way less volume of information. Probably because the domain of a shaper is usually commercial shops building doors/windows and cabinets. Also if you are a complete novice it is hard to cut through the crap on youtube to get the solid info that is available online.

You're right, there isn't much out there unfortunately. Things are easier in much of Europe as colleges etc teach according to modern rules and practices and often have courses available to the regular public where they can learn and at least get started properly. It's the wild west in North America. The Spindle Moulder Handbook is a tremendous eye opener and very valuable asset for folks over here though.

[Jeff Roltgen]

I just got done running about 60 raised panels on my 5hp Laguna shaper. 2 passes, as a 15/16 tongue beyond the profile was needed in order to accommodate 1/2" overlay of applied bolection molding for this assortment of cab doors and very large appliance panels. As the hours ticked by, I couldn't help thinking back to the days of using a router for raised panels. Now that was truly spooky, as the router motor was struggling, I'm trying to man-handle a board that just doesn't like having that much removed from it, so it's kicking while the router's struggling, burn marks/ tear-out...
Now that, my friends, is dangerous.
Any time you get into a fight with a machine, the human loses. Either wrecked workpieces or injured woodworker.
In this respect, the shaper is certainly safer, not to mention a time saver.

No previous commercial shop experience. As Mike says, not much literature out there, so it's tough to get started with confidence. I was fortunate to be steered to Alpine Workshops. Four day course that blew me away in terms of learning the capabilities, setups, safety and advanced operations. Transformed my shop to a safer, more efficient facility, with higher quality results (read: less sanding!)

Cost of a solid machine is nothing compared to high quality tooling. European machines and tooling geometry really stand out, as their safety and quality standards far exceed the regular Taiwanese board of fare. Entering the world of shapers, when done right and outfitted with proper safety/tooling and accessories, is really reserved for those with a high amount of disposable cash as a hobbyist, or full time operator with a solid workflow to justify. Too bad, because I'd argue it really is safer, once you've got some decent training and experience.

Most of those old horror stories of knives coming loose and maiming people are thankfully, a part of the past, due to evolution of safer cutter head technology.
Just resist the temptation to buy that $50 box full of old grandad's shaper-head assortment at the garage sale. ;)

jeff

[Jeff Roltgen]

Would hate to have to do all this on the router table again! Closeup is one straight off the shaper - no dressing yet, and very little needed at that. If you can do it, a shaper is worth the investment, for sure.


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[Kevin Jenness]

That ain't workin', that's the way you do it.

[Paul Haus]

Good info here. One thing worth restating is the need to 'hold it down' on the table against the fence or cutterhead. I've never had a feeder (wish I did) but I have a number of various hold-downs along with something called Board Buddies. You still have to handfeed your wood but Board Buddies will both hold the piece down and help hold it against the fence.
I learned to use a shaper in a shop class I took over 50 years ago and have had my own unit for probably 35-40 years. Things have improved imensely over the years IMO.
IMO a shaper is like most other power tools. Yes there is the potential for danger but if handled correctly and respected, it's a very useful machine and probably not much more dangerous that many other pieces of woodworking equipment.

[Greg Quenneville]

Regarding safety accessories for the shaper, Aigner make some high quality devices. They are expensive but, like a Sawstop, cheaper than an ER visit. (Which I had after a router table accident). Scott & Sergeant sell them among others.

I have only done power fed operations on my spindle moulder, but am soon going to do some more challenging work including free hand. Which makes me a bit nervous.

[Jared Sankovich]

For me the biggest 'danger' of shapers is smaller amount of material (books, etc.) to learn from if you do not have the chance to work in a shop with experienced teachers. This was my story. I learned by tracking down every book I could find and asking lots of questions here on this forum. Compared to a table saw or drill press or even bandsaws there is way less volume of information. Probably because the domain of a shaper is usually commercial shops building doors/windows and cabinets. Also if you are a complete novice it is hard to cut through the crap on youtube to get the solid info that is available online.

There is more shaper info in the archives here than most (or all) of the rest of the internet. The rest of the info is sparsely dispersed.

[Mike Wilkins]

I know a lot of folks poo-poo YouTube videos as a dangerous fad, but I have viewed a lot of videos demonstrating proper, safe use of a shaper (spindle moulder as its called across the pond). Many of these videos are by folks in production/pro shops and provide a lot of valuable advice on this machines' proper use. In my and many others opinions, the owners manuals are woefully lacking in how to use these machines.
Holding the work piece both against the fence and down to the table will make any operation much safer.

[Warren Lake]

They aren't expecting people to need a manual to use the machine. Maybe lawyer world told them say less even.

Older European makers had detailed stuff in their manuals besides the specs and machine details, some showed a number of set ups using featherboards and more.

[Randy Benway]

Agreed with much that has been said. It's about the set-up. Shapers can be set-up safely (cutter under the stock below the table) or not so much (cutter ABOVE the stock without proper feeding systems or guards).

Check out the shapers making 1930's production Packard car bodies (@ 4:40 min). Even without sound this is a 10 on the 'butt-pucker' meter!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkxuZZlPjsI

[David Sochar]

Kevin J has some solid advice. I had the advantage of learning about shapers from some old hands (some were a few digits short) back in the 1970's. We used a Tegle and Sonner shaper, with a 150 lb flywheel, so even a major accident did not slow it a bit.

Most of our cutters were notch edge 'shaper' steel knives that fit into grooves in the upper and lower discs - one had Allen screws for adjusting knives in or our, and one collar had a bearing that the stock could ride against. All these knives were hand ground, using the squint and spark method, so profiles were not matched, even if you could adjust them as close as you could.

The best advice I ever got was to 'hold it on 3 sides" - table, fences (or bearing) and feeder (or pressure bar). This kept you on track and if during a set up you realized you did not have 3 means of support, you could stop and re figure, adding that third side. The big shaper had an overarm hold down that was firm but had some give, so you could adjust for a really firm hold down, or something light and hardly holding it down at all. This overarm had a block of wood screwed into it, so you could even run it into a running cutter to get good coverage. The block was between you and the cutter, about 2" thick, 3" wide and 10 -12" long. It was to be placed so that the stock was well under the block/hold down before the cutter, and same on exit.

When we finally got a 3 wheel feeder, it replaced the overarm, but the function was the same. 52 years in the shop, and I have never had nor seen a shaper accident involving blood.

One thing we use a lot of is pressure bars. A 1'' x 2" pc of hardwood, the length of the table or fences, with blocks at each end. The blocks hold the 1x2 away from the fence but close to the cutter, parallel to the table, same thickness as the stock. Clamping the end blocks to the wooden fences allows for increasing or decreasing pressure on the parts. Adjust until the parts are firmly held, but can be pushed under the bar. Wax may be employed. Starting out, it seems an easy push, but after a whole day, you will discover muscles you never knew you had. The pressure bars are great for slight curved to heavily curved parts - like arch top raised panels where the tongue rides on the bearing and the pressure bar holds it all down.

Another shop made item that comes in handy is a feather board. Shop made for length and strength as needed, these are clamped to the shaper table to hold stock up to the fences or shaper bearing. Often paired, one holds to the fore table, and a second holds against the aft fence. Again, adjustability is the key. But all that holding has a price. It can be exhausting pushing lumber all day. Gawd love the power feeder.

Kevin mentioned a power feeder was not much good on curved parts. We take off wheels to make it a one or two wheel feeder, and then we can wrestle the parts thru the machine. A commercial feeder maker has a one wheel curve feeder with a larger, spongier wheel that allows the wood to be manipulated as it goes forward. With our 3 or 4 wheel feeders, we do two wheels for lay down or stand up curve profiling - one before the cutter and one after. Curve brick mold at an 18" radius going thru in stand up mode with two wheels on the shaper works fine. But the complex set-up is time consuming (an hour to set up, 10 minutes or less to run), so it is best if we have several jobs to run while the machine and accessories are up and running.

And finally, at my first World Machinery Fair in 1973 in Louisville, KY, I met a machinery sales rep at a lunch counter, and we spent about 3 hours talking. Being off our feet and enjoying the food were part of it, but he talked about safety manuals and machines, lawyers and legal departments. He claimed that no machine maker would ever illustrate what the machine could do, since that would terrify a jury. The best machine designers could do was to state that all safety equipment, hold downs, and warnings should be strictly adhered to at all times. Of course, back then, advanced shop classes were common as were shops that would take the time to find talent and train from there.

[Joe Calhoon]

If you are new to shapers you definitely want to approach them carefully. Start with some small profiles, simple groovers and rebate cutters. Modern tooling and newer versions of Euro shapers have done a lot to improve the safety of these machines. You still have to use your head and be totally focused though. A lot of it is knowing what will happen when the workpiece meets the cutter. Power feeders are great but sometimes small pieces call for hand feeding. This can be safely done using shop made jigs and Aigner type accessories.
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Feeders are great for curve work. Tip it up on the nose and use one wheel or remove wheels if it doesn’t tip. Wheel positioned slightly off center to the infeed side of cutter. Here are some IG feeds showing curve work of large door and window segments. https://www.instagram.com/p/CAcv9C_D86W/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
https://www.instagram.com/p/CCjYlW8jyW5/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
https://www.instagram.com/p/CBtp68wD4DS/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=

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Small work pieces are not possible with the feeder and require jigs.
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