Returning my Bessey K-Body Revo Junior clamps

[Bob Riefer]

For years I have been relying solely upon pipe clamps and some HF aluminum bar clamps (which I upgraded a bit by installed a wood core to stiffen them up). I had some budget set aside to add to the clamps arsenal, and after a lot of research, I settled upon the Revo Junior clamps. I was so excited when they arrived, and I setup a nice spot for them to hang on the wall.

As I was hanging them up the first time, I started to fiddle around with them... and fiddle and fiddle and fiddle some more. There was seemingly no rhyme or reason as to what allows the jaw to slide back and forth. It was very puzzling to me that I would have to "figure out" how to use clamps, but I was still committed to my new toys. I admired how nicely they hung on the wall, and looked at my pipe clamps with near-embarrassment in comparison.

Before my next shop excursion where I would put the clamps to use, I read articles and watched videos on how to use the clamps. I tested what I had learned a bit, and then proceeded to start my glue up of 10 panels for my current project. I knew it would take nearly every clamp (new and old) to do all these at one sitting, but I was ready to go.

You know how panel glue ups can be a bit stressful when the clock is ticking, and I was literally cursing how damn fiddly the Bessey clamps were. So much difficulty getting the jaws to slide when you wanted them to, and stay put when commanded to. I figured it was just continued learning curve (which seemed ridiculous to me... they're clamps for goodness sake), but then I kept coming across clamps that would not clamp. Out of 18 brand new Bessey clamps, 6 of them simply would not tighten down no matter what I tried.

Luckily, I was able to scrounge enough of my other clamps to finish the task at hand without issue, but I sure was frustrated.

After the session, I spent hours troubleshooting the 6 offending clamps. Adjusting set screws, following pointers on youtube videos, reading on Bessey's website etc. etc. etc. In the end, I never could get them to work.

After multiple calls and emails, Rockler relented and is allowing me to return the clamps for full credit (but they sure did put up a fight, and I have a fun task of boxing up awkward cargo) and I plan to buy Dubuque aluminum bar clamps and some more pipe clamps instead. I mostly glue up panels and furniture projects (not cabinets), so I think I can delay my need for parallel clamps for awhile longer.

Anyways, just wanted to post this in case anyone is considering buying in the near future... I had read so many reviews and thought I was making a good choice, and only learned of many negative reviews while researching the specific issues that I found.

(Note: For those that have these clamps and love them, I do not mean any harm whatsoever)

[Jim Becker]

Bob, find out if you can do the return at the Moorestown NJ brick and mortar store rather than boxing/shipping.

[Mike Henderson]

I've never used the Revo Junior clamps but have a bunch of the regular Revo clamps and like them very much.

I also have a bunch of the older K-body clamps but prefer the newer Revo clamps. One thing I like about them is that they have a 6mm socket in the end of the handle so I can use an Allen wrench to get them really snug.

Mike

[Rich Konopka]

I have the Bessey and Dubuque clamps and I prefer the Dubuques.

[Ron Selzer]

I went with Dubuque's some years back and don't regret it one bit.
I have not been happy with the Revo clamps I have used and very glad I bought two to try did not jump into those
Ron

[Myles Moran]

I have 4 old k-bodies (old enough that I'm coming out of the loop on the current offerings). I love them for what they are, but man do they weigh a ton, and one of them now has developed a crack - probably related to years of abuse relying on a clamp to make up for some fitment issues.

I now also have piles of harbor freight aluminum clamps and f clamps. And frankly for how little I paid for them they're amazing. I've put in a lot of work into developing my skills to the point my joints fit together how they should. I'm not cranking on the clamps, and having 2 dozen clamps i can use properly is a lot more useful for me than a smaller number of parallel clamps.
All these clamps are doing is keeping enough pressure on the joint that the properly cut wood fits together perfectly. Eventually I'll replace those k bodies, but for now I'm very happy with the cheap aluminum clamps.

[Alex Zeller]

I have an assortment of almost everything. Clamping is like sanding. Nothing beats the tool that can do the job best. With clamping time management is vital. I don't have any of the Jr's but do have a dozen Revos. I got them because I wanted a couple of 50" clamps that were more flexible than pipe clamps and Rockler had a 4 pack (2-24" and 2-50") sale. An internal part fell out and Bessey replaced it. They are a little tricky to use and if they give you any problems then I wouldn't have kept them either.

[Richard Coers]

It doesn't require magic or skill to use a Revo bar clamp. You just have to apply a little force to the handle to make it grab the bar. Simple. But I wouldn't use the Jr. for clamping up panels. The bar is too light and will bow the panel.

[Bob Riefer]

Richard... I agree... with some minor modifications:


It seemingly requires magic or skill to use a Revo bar clamp. You would think that you just have to apply a little force to the handle to make it grab the bar. But, not so simple with 6 out of 18 from this Revo Jr. batch that I received.


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As for bowing panels, I'm curious on that part as I would like to avoid bowing of course... When making panels, I use cauls, alternate my clamps above and below the piece, and I tighten for even squeeze out (but not to death grip level of pressure). This has always produced flat panels with tight joints, but I would gladly take additional tips if there's more to know.


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@Jim B. - Rockler is paying for the return shipping

[Frederick Skelly]

I have Revo Jrs and don't have the issues you describe. I'd be unhappy too, if I did.

I also have 10 of the Dubuques. Best clamp money I have spent. You will love them.

[Bob Riefer]

Rockler fulfilled their promise and refunded me for the clamps. I ended up being out $28 for packing material, and the purchase of some wall mount clamp racks that may be less of a perfect fit now. I'll find a use for them.

Then, I hit send just now on my order for a 10-pack of Dubuque 36" Aluminum Bar Clamps and another 10-pack of their 48" model. I rarely go beyond 48" so I'll continue to leverage pipe clamps for those situations. I'll report back once the clamps arrive. :)

[Peter Schussheim]

rockler is great with customer service. I had similar issues with a few bessey kre (not junior) and would probably not buy them again. They are now being made in china and are noticeably lower quality than the next most recent iteration which were "assembled in USA".

I have many Dubuque clamps also and I like them but they are not at all a lifetime purchase unless you are very careful with the force applied when clamping. More specifically, if you aren't careful, you can very easily over-tighten the screws to the point that the joint connecting the aluminum bar to the clamp screw fixture fails, this has happened on multiple clamps for me. Granted, I likely used too much force but it is something to be aware of.

[Frederick Skelly]

I have many Dubuque clamps also and I like them but they are not at all a lifetime purchase unless you are very careful with the force applied when clamping. More specifically, if you aren't careful, you can very easily over-tighten the screws to the point that the joint connecting the aluminum bar to the clamp screw fixture fails, this has happened on multiple clamps for me. Granted, I likely used too much force but it is something to be aware of.

Yeah, this might be your technique. Not sure. But I havent had this problem with mine and I dont recall hearing others raise it.

[glenn bradley]

Sometimes things just aren't a good fit. I have a lot of K-body clamps and they are my go-to. Folks raved about the Jets so I bought a bunch during a Christmas sale. They are the most nefarious beasts ever. I only use them when I run out of others. Glad Rockler took care of you and hope the Dubuques will be more friendly to you.

[Phillip Mitchell]

Dubuque’s are nice in their own right, but it’s very easy to bow the 48” lengths being that long and light aluminum.

The only clamps I’ve used at that length that don’t really bow under moderate pressure are the older Jorgensen I beam style (model 72, I think) or even older Hargrave style bar clamps. Both are pretty thick steel I beam style bars and pretty heavy clamps. Even K body Bessey’s will bow a bit at 48” lengths or more if you aren’t careful/gentle.

[andrew whicker]

The Dubuque's look like a square pipe clamp..

What's the difference that everyone likes about them vs a regular old pipe clamp?

[Phillip Mitchell]

They are much, much lighter and “cleaner” as there’s not a chance of black iron pipe smudge transferring onto something like a panel glue up. I like good old pipe clamps as well.

I find almost all styles of clamps to be useful in different situations. The Dubuque’s are nice, though I wish the jaws were a bit deeper sometimes.

[andrew whicker]

Fair. I spent a lot of time cleaning the pipes before using them and by now they are pretty darn clean. They are heavy, but I refuse to become an old man that can't lift a pipe clamp. : )

I will say the Dubuque's look like they may be sensitive to glue droppings... I like that I can just run my carpenter's knife down the pipe clamps to get off old glue.

I like pipe clamps and K body's (parallel) and sliding C clamps (J clamps?). Those are my go to's.

Those K body Jrs look like a marketing scheme. The screws on those look like they can put down way more stress than the backbone can handle. Like those silly bar clamps that we all have. They do work pretty well, but you can't actually use the screw power or else you'll bend the backbone.

I don't think every woodworking project requires a million pounds of force anyway.

[Bob Riefer]

Thanks for the inputs!


Around the 'keeping clean' topic, the only experience I have thus far is with the harbor freight version of this sort of clamp... I have abused those clamps for years now, and have never once cleaned or protected them... And they're totally fine still. For the nicer Dubuque's that are on the way, I plan to take a bit more care of course, but feel like the previous experience gives me some confidence that glue build up isn't a prevalent issue.


On pipe clamps... I love my pipe clamps and plan to continue to use those for many projects. I inherited my pipes from a retiring woodworker that sold them to me for a really good price many years ago. They are galvanized (I think?) rather than black pipe, so the mess issue has never been a problem. And even with black pipe, I've heard (like Andrew mentions) that cleaning the pipes at the start does a world of good.


Bowing pipes... I've bowed some pipe clamps before when connecting them together to make really long setups, but otherwise they haven't flexed much during projects. The HF aluminum bar clamps are easy to bow, but I have inserted wood cores into them and that helps a lot. For the Dubuque clamps that are on the way, I plan to add a core to them as well because it's so easy/fast to do, and it doesn't seem it could possibly hurt.


All in, I try to build carefully so that enormous amounts of clamping pressure aren't required. I dry fit (including practicing clamps placement) on anything that is even remotely more complicated than a basic panel setup, and find this helps a lot. So I'm very optimistic that the Dubuque clamps will be a welcomed upgrade to my pipe clamps & harbor freight clamps.

[Bob Riefer]

I'm a few weeks in with the Dubuques and am very happy with their performance for my needs. Some first impressions:

Comparing to HF knock offs:

- The close spacing of the indents that catch the sliding stop is very useful to quickly get snug before tightening down
- The butterfly shaped handle is much less fiddly, and gives your hands a very natural spot to apply good twisting pressure
- That handle is positioned such that it doesn't touch your assembly table when you're tightening (i.e., you don't have to leave the end of the clamp hanging off edge of your work table)
- The fit and finish is very satisfying... it's clear that you have a nice tool as soon as you pick one of these clamps up
- Out of the box, Dubuques are much stiffer in all directions than my HF equivalents... and my HF clamps have been outfitted with a wood core and are still nowhere near as strong

And in general:

- Plenty of power for my typical projects at this stage of my learning curve. Panels are no problem, and furniture assembly is a breeze.
- I knew the weight would be easy to handle... and it is.
- 20 high quality clamps for the price paid feels very fair
- The miter / corner clamp attachment is a cool accessory
- Easy to hang/store with some shop-made clamp racks


I hope this thread is helpful to some future reader. I had been a little lost in analysis mode and thought "strongest clamping pressure" was my primary need... what I realized is that slightly less power is still more than adequate. When coupled with ease of use and price point, the Dubuques are a great option to consider in my opinion.

Here's half of the new additions hanging near my assembly table.

490437

[Brian Holcombe]

Bessey clamps are ok, they have advantages for certain things but overall I think a steel or aluminum bar clamp is much better for glue ups. Bessey’s can sit on the foot of the clamp, so when I’m gluing up doors I find that helpful since I can leave them on edge. They bend, so I have to balance them on either side of the assembly.

Bar clamps like the Dubuque are a lot stiffer, so they are better for panels in my opinion.

Bessey makes some nice clamps for odd operations which are handy, like deep reach clamps which are still made in Germany and are nice quality.

[Frank Necaise]

Paul Sellers has a nice Dubuque clamp improvement that I used and really like. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyKiGmRq3wY

[Frederick Skelly]

Paul Sellers has a nice Dubuque clamp improvement that I used and really like. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyKiGmRq3wY

What Mr. Sellars is showing looks like a hack I've seen used on Harbor Freight and other knockoffs.

I might be missing something, but the clamps in Sellars video don't look like the Dubuque Clamps (https://www.leevalley.com/en-us/shop/tools/hand-tools/clamps/bar/70618-dubuque-aluminum-bar-clamps?item=03F0624&utm_source=free_google_shopping&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=shopping_feed&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI1Lyu-qDH-wIVMhTUAR0nTQUMEAQYAiABEgI1z_D_BwE) that I own.

Are yours actually Dubuque or some other brand? I ask because I've had mine 3-4 years and never saw a need to stiffen them or to take them apart and polish-up a rough edge. In my experience, they're an excellent product right out of the box. (Now, they aren't the universal answer to all clamping needs - I have many other types. But they have been a good product for me.)

I'm a little surprised you needed to beef them up.

[Ron Selzer]

Paul Sellers has a nice Dubuque clamp improvement that I used and really like. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AyKiGmRq3wY

those are NOT Dubuque, just a cheap imitation.
Dubuque don't need what he shows, and the handles are much better.

Ron

[Bob Riefer]

Agreed that Paul's vid is about how to strengthen knock-off aluminum bar clamps. I followed this exact video with my dozen harbor freight clamps of this style, and it definitely improves their performance a lot.

As noted above, the Dubuque's withOUT that improvement are FAR more sturdy compared to the HF's WITH that improvement... truly a dramatic difference. (Note... I may install cores in my Dubuque's anyways... such a simple modification, why not?)


Also, while this isn't intended to be a this vs. that thread (more of a 'typical woodworker learning journey about clamps' discussion) I will say that if budget limitations are a factor, the HF clamps served me very well for nearly a decade already, and will remain in my shop indefinitely. I will not reach for them first at this point, but totally suitable for many operations, and they were able to fit my wallet years ago. Same thing with pipe clamps - they work great and I will keep those around too.

[Dave Sabo]

Dubuque’s are nice in their own right, but it’s very easy to bow the 48” lengths being that long and light aluminum.


My experience has been that if my clamps (any type) are bowing on woodworking projects - my joinery just isn't good enough/ doesn't fit well. They're really just there to keep stuff from moving around , not muscle stuff into submission. I often use tape as a clamp with excellent results.

[Phillip Mitchell]

My experience has been that if my clamps (any type) are bowing on woodworking projects - my joinery just isn't good enough/ doesn't fit well. They're really just there to keep stuff from moving around , not muscle stuff into submission. I often use tape as a clamp with excellent results.

That is one use case - keeping stuff from moving around. There are so many different jobs within the scope of woodworking that could be asked of a clamp and some of them require more force than tape.

I was mainly referencing something like a wider solid panel glue up or the like, and how surprisingly easy it is to bow most clamps in wider width glue ups, including Dubuque’s and Bessey Kbody approaching that length. Solid panel glue ups with PVA glue is one application where I typically use a lot of pressure and am also very concerned with keeping the clamps from bowing and keeping the panel as flat as possible...way more pressure than pulling joinery together and holding it tight, which is a totally different kettle of fish.

It takes all types of clamps in my experience, if you do a wide range of work and want to use the ones optimal for each application. This is obviously a matter of preference and opinion to some degree.

[Kevin Jenness]

The Dubuque's look like a square pipe clamp..

What's the difference that everyone likes about them vs a regular old pipe clamp?

They're light and stiff. Pipe clamps have their place for extra long reach but I don't use mine unless I have to - my old Ponies like to roll and tip on the bench, the head and tailpieces roll around the bar when I want them to stay put, and they stain acidic woods. I do have some 2 1/2" throat Pony pipe fixtures that come in handy at times, but my go-tos for panel work are a mix of Jorgensen and Dubuque aluminum bar clamps with Jorgie I-bars for backup when I need the extra screw length and stiffness to really put the squeeze on. When I'm doing multiple assemblies, moving panels and doors from bench to floor and back, the lighter clamps are a real back-saver.