Question about cleaning tools

[Kevin Adams]

Hi all,

Hope you’re staying cool out there!

Probably a dumb question here, but I recently picked up a nice Will-Burt vise and was wondering what’s the best way to clean off the grime and grease? WD-40 and fine scotch pad? It appears to be in very good shape and I’ve been looking for a nice one for a while.

Thanks for any advice.
Kevin

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[Rob Luter]

I've always taken tools apart to the greatest degree practical, then scrubbed with hot soapy water, dried everything, then followed up with WD40 or wax as appropriate for the tool and final use. ScotchBrite pads work very well, but a stiff bristle brush and Dawn dishwashing detergent will knock off most of the grime.

[Richard Coers]

A friend of mine restores and collects vises. He used to put them in a tub and use electrolysis, now he bead blasts them.
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[Rob Luter]

Bead blasters are the schnizzle.

[Tom M King]

Brake cleaner here. It will wash the gunk right off. I did an old one I found here a couple of weeks ago that wouldn't even close the jaws all the way together. I used a can of brake cleaner, lubed the screw, and it works as good as any new one now-smooth all the way from closed tight to all the way out.

Bead Blasting is great if you're going to completely redo it, but I just need for them to work, and don't care what they look like.

I buy brake cleaner by the case for the mechanic shop.

[Stew Denton]

Kevin,

I would try odorless mineral spirits. You may have to look around a bit for it, but I looked on the net, and both of the Big Box stores I looked at had it.

It is slightly less aggressive than some solvents due to a couple of factors, but both of those factors also make it much less toxic than some of the more aggressive solvents. For one, the boiling range of mineral spirits is higher than that of ordinary paint thinner, and than means the concentration of the vapors in the air will be lower than for lower boiling materials used as solvents like paint thinner, gasoline, toluene, etc.

The second factor that makes it safer is that a lot of the odorless mineral spirits are made by taking a boiling range cut at a refinery and aggressively treating it at high pressure and temperature, using a catalyst, with hydrogen. This hydrogenates double bonded compounds, and if aggressive enough conditions and a good enough catalyst are used, it also hydrogenates a very high percentage of the aromatic compounds that are present, however even less aggressive hydrogenation will reduce the aromatics significantly. Double bonded hydrocarbons are very odorous, and aromatics can also be so, but aromatic compounds tend to be somewhat toxic, the worst of these being benzene but others like naphthalene and toluene are not bargains either. There are other routes to odorless mineral spirits that involve different organic chemistry, but they are more expensive, and the hydrotreating route of ordinary mixed refinery streams is the cheapest route, and therefore most commonly used. They all should have much reduced aromatic compounds when compared to mineral spirits which are not specified as Odorless or Low-Odor.

So, in my view the best compromise between non-toxicity and effectiveness is odorless mineral spirits.

Things that will work better, but are toxic enough that I use them only when absolutely necessary, include things like toluene and xylenes. There are other materials that work even better, but now are basically not available to the general public, primarily due to being pretty toxic or being carcinogenic. Some folks use gasoline but gasoline can have up to a percent or two of benzene, gasoline is toxic enough and flammable enough that I would never use it.

I would get the OMS, and a parts washer type brush, probably a small steel wire brush, and wear the solvent resistant green gloves that you can get at hardware stores, big box stores, etc. Get the ones that are the thick wall ones, not the disposable ones.

Work outside in the shade, hopefully with a mild breeze blowing from your left to right or vise versa, so that the small amount of solvent vapors will be carried away from you. Put a couple of inches of the OMS and the part in a metal tray and scrub away on the part with the parts brush and/or small steel wire brush.

I have a lot of experience with various solvents, worked for 30+ years as an applied research chemist for a company, in a plant product development lab, that makes solvents among many other products. Over the years I developed some of the solvents that we sold. I also worked with our specialty fuels group on some occasions as a consultant, so know about refinery processes and the resulting refinery streams, and many of these make up most of the solvent volumes sold in the world.

As a part of that work I tested and analyzed many solvents, refinery streams, etc., for our company. One of the concerns of that type work was always evaluating safety and health issues of the materials, and I read a few hundred SDS (safety data sheets) over the years, and also helped write a few.

I am sure that the Brake Cleaner Tom mentions would be very effective, based on Tom's experience, but I looked at the SDS of a few, and at least one I looked at, base on the composition, had serious health and safety issues, IMHO. Thus my tendency to go with something much safer like OMS.

Thus, I would recommend the odorless mineral spirits. Again, not the very most effective, but it has good effectiveness, and is a lot safer health wise than most other choices.

One other thought, if you have access to a steam blaster, that is very effective. We had such many places at the plant, but very few people have access to such. If you do, however, it will work great.

Regards,

Stew

[Kevin Adams]

Thank you all for the advice. I’m not looking to restore it to new, just clean it up so I don’t get grease on me every time I use it. It seems to work fine and will be even better with a good lube. I’ll try the MOS first with a light scrub and I’m sure it will clean up nicely. Using the Dawn detergent sounds good, as well, and I have that, just wondering if the water will cause any issues? Or if I oil it well after that, I’ll be fine?

Thanks again, I can’t wait to put this to use. I really like the long jaws (will pad with leather) and ability to be used in different positions.

Kevin

[Rob Luter]

Thank you all for the advice. I’m not looking to restore it to new, just clean it up so I don’t get grease on me every time I use it. It seems to work fine and will be even better with a good lube. I’ll try the MOS first with a light scrub and I’m sure it will clean up nicely. Using the Dawn detergent sounds good, as well, and I have that, just wondering if the water will cause any issues? Or if I oil it well after that, I’ll be fine?

Thanks again, I can’t wait to put this to use. I really like the long jaws (will pad with leather) and ability to be used in different positions.

Kevin

I had the same concern with soap and water initially. What I found was that the parts heated up from the hot water and as a result dried rapidly. A speedy application of WD40, wax, or other rust inhibitor protected any bare metal prone to corrosion.

[Stew Denton]

Kevin,

I agree with Rob about the hot water heating up the metal and thus rapidly drying the metal parts after you complete the parts washing in the soapy water. I would go a step further and rinse the parts in clean boiling water when finished to clean off any residual soap and to help the metal dry faster. I have also used his approach some. If you go that route wait until the metal is thoroughly dry before applying the oil, WD40, etc.

I also like his bead blaster approach. I had access to bead blasters at the plant and used them to clean rust off the beds of planes, etc., I restored, and also for lab equipment I worked on as a part of my work at the plant. They do an amazing job. I have never used one to clean off old hardened grease and dirt, but believe that such would work well based on using bead blasting on rust. I taped up the sides, bottoms, and other nice surfaces of the planes with duck tape to protect them from the beads. If you don't do such the surfaces you hit will have a frosted appearance and will lose the nice smooth appearance, as the beads are pretty aggressive but not as aggressive as sand blasting.

Craftsmen at the plant used the bead blasters to clean up all kinds of equipment that they were working on, and I have no doubt that getting off hardened dirt/grease was one thing that the bead blasters were used for on small parts, although the steam blasters were used much more for such especially on larger parts. Getting much old hard dirt and grease on the beads will ruin them for better service, and the beads will then have to be replaced.

Stew

[Ben Ellenberger]

Dawn dish soap and hot water is my go-to for cleaning just about everything. I agree with what has been said above about doing a thorough rinse and drying everything well afterwards before oiling or greasing what needs it. Pick a sunny day and let it sit in the sun all afternoon to dry thoroughly if there are little corners you can’t get at to dry with a rag.

[Jim Koepke]

My theory is to start with the least aggressive method and/or mild cleansers then work my way up. Dish washing soap (Dawn or most other brands) are formulated to remove grease whether it is soft or caked on without causing a reaction or harm to human skin. Sometimes my first choice is mineral oil. If the layer of grunge is dried oil often times the mineral oil will soften it enough to be taken off with a soft cloth or a scraper made of plastic. This is one of the reasons for saving the fake credit cards that are sent in the mail, though it has been awhile since any of those have been in my mail.

Even lightly abrasive cleaners like Bon Ami or Bar Keepers Friend may have a place in cleaning crud from equipment that has been used in an industrial setting. Sometimes the problem is the components of the grime have reacted with the original surface coating.

With any cleaning detergent, powder or solvent always try a little bit first on a small area to determine its effectiveness. Some strong solvents may actually harden some types of caked on crud.

Good luck and please show your results, whether they be good, bad or ugly.

[Stephen Rosenthal]

I’m surprised no one has mentioned Simple Green. Inexpensive, non-toxic and works great. Additional cleaning equipment includes a brass wire brush, stiff and soft bristle toothbrushes,
Q-Tips, razor blade scraper, dental picks, paper towels and canned air (to blow out the moisture).

[John Erickson]

Go to your local GM dealer parts dept, get a couple cans of engine shampoo and penetrating fluid (WD40 or equivalent). Spray on engine shampoo, let soak and wash off with hot water. Use an air line blow dart to dry, then use penetrating fluid for protection.

[Richard Coers]

Brake cleaner here. It will wash the gunk right off. I did an old one I found here a couple of weeks ago that wouldn't even close the jaws all the way together. I used a can of brake cleaner, lubed the screw, and it works as good as any new one now-smooth all the way from closed tight to all the way out.

Bead Blasting is great if you're going to completely redo it, but I just need for them to work, and don't care what they look like.

I buy brake cleaner by the case for the mechanic shop.
Brake cleaner is basically expensively packaged acetone.

[Richard Coers]

I’m surprised no one has mentioned Simple Green. Inexpensive, non-toxic and works great. Additional cleaning equipment includes a brass wire brush, stiff and soft bristle toothbrushes,
Q-Tips, razor blade scraper, dental picks, paper towels and canned air (to blow out the moisture).
Canned air? If you can't afford a compressor, a drinking straw in your mouth will worked nearly as well as canned air. And much better ecologically.

[Tom M King]

I don't think brake cleaner is Acetone. I keep a gallon of Acetone for various jobs, and brake cleaner doesn't have the smell, or evaporate as quickly. Acetone will take some paints off, but brake cleaner won't. It's what about any auto mechanic uses for many things, including cleaning up drips on a concrete floor. It is non-flammable, and you don't want it on your skin, or in your eyes, but I looked at a can this morning, and can't tell what it is by anything written on the can.

I have a parts washer, but if a part is not too bad, like the vise I cleaned last week, it just gets blasted off with brake cleaner outside the shop. Make sure you get the straw with the can, and use it. It washes ages old gunked up grease right off, if it's not caked on too thick. If something is caked on, I lift the cover on the parts washer. The parts washer mostly uses Kerosene. It pumps the solvent over whatever you hold under the stream, and using long, thick gloves, the part is brushed with any of an assortment of brushes for the purpose.

I also keep Carb cleaner for small jobs that brake cleaner won't get, but it will take paint off too, so you have to be more careful what you spray it on.

[Rafael Herrera]

I don't think brake cleaner is Acetone. I keep a gallon of Acetone for various jobs, and brake cleaner doesn't have the smell, or evaporate as quickly....

Tom,

I did a quick internet search of the safety data sheet (SDS) of brake cleaner. Here's is one of them, this one is mostly acetone:

https://www.safety-kleen.com/sites/g/files/bdczcs371/files/2019-05/820076Brev12-16.pdf

This one is 100% Tetrachloroethylene, used as a degreaser and dry-cleaning fluid, non-flammable, sounds like what you use.

https://www.conncoll.edu/media/website-media/offices/ehs/envhealthdocs/Brakleen_Brake_Parts_Cleaner.pdf

It looks like there are several types of mixtures that are sold as brake cleaner, so the term is not specific.

Regarding Kevin's original question, the vise looks really good and I would have just wiped it with a rag and installed it on my bench.

[Stephen Rosenthal]

Canned air? If you can't afford a compressor, a drinking straw in your mouth will worked nearly as well as canned air. And much better ecologically.

I have a compressor and use it to blow the dust off of larger machinery, among other things. For smaller stuff, I prefer canned air.

[Scott T Smith]

That is a really nice looking vise! Good score!!!

Although I have a bead blast cabinet, the patina on that vise is so nice I would hesitate to use it. Instead I would opt for either Dawn or Simple Green in hot water, followed by the heated drying.

I'm not real big on having WD-40 in the wood shop due to the possibility of contaminating a finish, but that's just me.

At any rate, great score on the vise!

In lieu of mineral spirits, d-limonene is the key ingredient in citrus solvent and is a great alternative to paint thinner, mineral spirits or even turpentine. I buy mine off of e-bay.

[George Yetka]

A good degreaser to start, Rust killer second, Then recoat with a good protective barrier.
For my TS i use a firearm cleaning spray to pull up old finish, Rust free to remove surface rust, Glidecoat to reseal.

[Kevin Adams]

Regarding Kevin's original question, the vise looks really good and I would have just wiped it with a rag and installed it on my bench.

Wow, thanks everyone for the suggestions. I will go with Dawn and hot water tomorrow. It’s gonna be a hot, sunny day here so it should dry quickly. I’ll follow with a good penetrating lube that dries (my go-to is Starrett M1). I like the idea of starting with the most mild method. I’ll share pics when done. I’ve been looking for one of these vises ever since I used one in a woodworking class, the long jaws are very versatile.

And Raf, I knew you’d go with the wipe it off and just use it method!!

Thanks again, all.
Kevin

[Stew Denton]

Richard,

I looked up a small number of SDS on different brands of brake cleaner, and each of the small sample I looked at turned out to have different components. None were the same. The one I especially thought was hazardous had 20% to 40% each of both methanol and toluene, I believe, and a certain amount of acetone also. (I may be wrong on the amounts, but that is what I remember the listed components to be. At any rate that brand had a lot of both toluene and methanol in it and also a smaller amount of acetone, but the acetone content was also significant.)

Methanol is also known as wood alcohol and when folks drink very much of it they go blind. I remember an article in the newspaper from years ago that some inmates in prison thought that they could make it safe to drink by straining it through bread, and some went blind. (Any good chemist would have told them that straining it through bread would not change its toxicity one whit.) It has a boiling point that is low enough that you should avoid the vapors, and it is both flammable and toxic. You should avoid breathing the vapor and should not get it on your skin. I don't know about methanol, but some organic compounds can be absorbed right through your skin, so protective chemical handling glove should be worn when handling it.

Acetone is the least dangerous from the health perspective, but is has a low flash point, and is thus easy to set on fire. I buy and use it, but do handle it with care since it is highly flammable. (I have used literally hundreds of gallons of high purity acetone in my lab work over the years, and years ago we did not use very good safety practices like we do today.)

Toluene is bad for you, is somewhat toxic, etc., but is nothing like Benzene. It seems to have more short term adverse effects, but the symptoms seem mostly to disappear over a limited time period. It does have reproductive system bad effects. Again most symptoms seem to disappear with time, much like the symptoms disappear after a period of time when a person gets drunk. None the less, I would use it as a cleaner only with caution, because there are safer solvents to use.

One type of brake cleaner appeared to be primarily hydrocarbons.

In short, brake cleaners vary in composition from brand to brand, they are not all just acetone.

Regards,

Stew

[john jesseph]

Hi all,

Hope you’re staying cool out there!

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Hi Kevin, hope all is well.

The vise looks great! I have one just like it. I like it.

My two cents worth: I’d also use dish soap or simple green, and dry it with a heat gun. I’d consider slathering the whole thing with Fluid Film, letting it marinade a while, then wiping it down and using it. Maybe paste wax on the paint on occasion, although I would probably use microcrystalline wax like LV Conservator’s Wax for the light corrosion removal effect.

I like messing around with different waxes, solvents, etc, so I’m up for experimenting. I’ll try some of the other ideas in the thread. I’ve got a patternmakers vise that needs rejuvenation in the future…

[Kevin Adams]

Hey John!

Hope all is well. I used the vise in a class building a JA chair (I know, not a Windsor, but always wanted to try one!). Really like the vertical and horizontal positions and long jaws are awesome for giving access. I’m gonna use Dawn and give it a clean out in the sun. Let it dry and then lube it up and let that bake in. Will mount to a thick block that I can then mount in my front vise when I need it.

Really hot and humid these days, I suspect out your way too. We need rain desperately, too. Hope you’re getting in a little shop time. Take care.

Kevin