Target EM8000 vs. EM2000

[Dennis Jarchow]

I have been searching the forum and the web and not coming up with much. In varnishes, Target coatings has both the EM8000cv conversion varnish and the EM2000wvx alkyd varnish. Their website doesn't do a great job of explaining the differences, other than the EM2000 can be used for exterior and that EM8000 may be a harder finish. I have used EM8000 before and liked it but seemed to have a harder time getting a good 'off the gun' finish spraying it compared to the EM6000 I had used previously. I have never tried the EM2000.

Has anyone tried both of these and can comment on both durability differences (for cabinet doors), color difference (in this case cherry), and sprayability (I have a Fuji Minimite 4 stage)?

Thanks for any info!

[Jim Becker]

When Target introduced what is now EM2000, the major point was that because it was an emulsified alkyd varnish, it had the very warm coloration that is typical of an oil based finish in a waterborne format. The EM6000 and its predecessors had a fairly "cold" hue which really didn't do justice to many species of wood. So what became EM2000 was to help folks move from an oil based finish to a waterborne without giving up the warmer color or requiring additional finishing steps like oil and wax free shellac to get an acceptable look. EM8000cv, while also having a little warmer color was created to offer a more durable clear finish for situations where that was a big benefit, especially when combined with the crosslinker which adds additional chemical resistance and some additional durability. Think "better for kitchens" while still being waterborne and not needing the considerable spray environment required for solvent based conversion varnishes. (EM9300 goes one step further being a polyester finish, albeit waterborne)

Hopefully, that will help you choose.

[Dennis Jarchow]

Jim,

As always, thanks for the reply. In old post (2010) you mentioned you had used EM2000 back in 2010. Did you spray it and if so, how did it lay down. I am going to order a quart of both the new formula EM8000 and the EM2000 to see which I like. Not sure whether to also order a quart of their sanding sealer or their WB shelac. I normally mix my own shellac.

Thanks again.

[Jim Becker]

I always spray Target products. Good idea to get some quarts to try...four fit in a shipping box and if you use a discount code (be sure you're on their mailing list to get those discount codes) it pretty much covers the shipping cost. I do use the sealer, sometimes in creative ways, such as for a toner with dye. To-date, I have not tried their waterborne shellac product. I guess I should. I really like the EM8000CV...

One thing to note...the EM2000 may take a little longer for recoat time and cure than the acrylics. That's the nature of any oil modified waterborne product, but it's still a fraction of the time for an oil based finish!

[Tom M King]

The EM8000 sands almost as easily as sanding sealer, so I can't think of an advantage in using sanding sealer. That's without the crosslinker. I'm not sure about how it would sand with the crosslinker.

[Dennis Jarchow]

Tom,

Thanks for the reply. I have used EM8000 before. For the cherry I am working with I want to warm it up quite a bit, and so considered the Target sealer or regular shellac possibly with some Transtint to add more color. That is also why I was considering the EM2000 as it seems to add more warmth than the EM8000.

[John TenEyck]

You probably meant to say EM-2000 being warmer than EM-8000, and I'm sure it is. I've never used EM-2000 but EM-8000 is yellow, nothing warm about it IMO. Yellow in the can and yellow on the wood. If you want warm I'd go with EM-2000. You also may wish to consider Minwax's Oil Modified Polyurethane. Very nice stuff.

John