wide belt sander with planer head

[Albert Lee]

Does anyone have experience with planer head in a wide belt sander?

I have sold my SCM Sandya 5 wide belt sander, will be replacing it with something modern, only looking at SCM SD30 or SD60 - I am very happy with SCM service here in NZ. Sandya 5 has been replaced with SD60, with SD60 you can replace one of the head with HPL planer head.

Just wondering how effective it is with planer head in a WBS? I know there are limitation such as you can't take off more than 3mm or 1/8 inch, and will need very good extraction (I have updated my extractor from 4kw baghouse to 7.5kw baghouse)

Again, typical SCM, there isnt a lot of info online about this feature.
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[Rick Fisher]

Hello Albert, I'm not aware of the SCM but had a friend who had a Timesavers with a planer head, 43 " if my memory serves. he said it was extremely capable, but required lots and lots of dust collection. More than a normal planer. My thoughts where that the conveyor would more likely be susceptible to damage from Planing than as a normal sander.

[Joe Calhoon]

Albert, no personal experience with one of these but I looked at them 18 years ago when upgrading from a single head wbs. My take was if doing a lot of laminated products like table tops, butcher blocks, a lot of solid wood door panels or live edge tops it could be worthwhile. At the time we were doing doors, windows and millwork, mostly frame products that would not utilize the planer head for finish sanding. I ended up going with a 3 head wbs. This was before we upgraded from straight knife planers and jointers to All Tersa head machines. In hindsight because the Tersa was more accurate and tear out free a 2 head single motor would have been a more cost effective sander.
also as Rick mentioned the dust collection will have to be up to it.

[Jim Becker]

A maker I follow on the 'Tube takes his big slab tables to a larger shop who uses a combined planer/sander to surface material. It's pretty impressive, but I couldn't speak to the specifications.

[Albert Lee]

Hello Albert, I'm not aware of the SCM but had a friend who had a Timesavers with a planer head, 43 " if my memory serves. he said it was extremely capable, but required lots and lots of dust collection. More than a normal planer. My thoughts where that the conveyor would more likely be susceptible to damage from Planing than as a normal sander.


Thanks Rick, I had that thought too...

[Albert Lee]

Albert, no personal experience with one of these but I looked at them 18 years ago when upgrading from a single head wbs. My take was if doing a lot of laminated products like table tops, butcher blocks, a lot of solid wood door panels or live edge tops it could be worthwhile. At the time we were doing doors, windows and millwork, mostly frame products that would not utilize the planer head for finish sanding. I ended up going with a 3 head wbs. This was before we upgraded from straight knife planers and jointers to All Tersa head machines. In hindsight because the Tersa was more accurate and tear out free a 2 head single motor would have been a more cost effective sander.
also as Rick mentioned the dust collection will have to be up to it.

thanks Joe. valid points as always!
I am going to pickup my new extractor this week. I am hoping the 7.5kw upgrade from 4kw will have significant improvement of the extraction...

I will see how my SCM agent comes back to me, sounds like 2 belt system with first roller being larger diameter will suffice.

[Rick Fisher]

I have a 24" wide planer.. its actually 24.8" .. its a T-45 .. 2 days ago I was asked to plane a 24" wide D-Fir slab about 8 feet long. My DC is a Felder 4hp RL-160. I had hoped to take extremely shallow passes, not because the planer won't cut it but because of the chip volume. Anyway.. I clogged the 6" Norfab 50 % of the way to the DC. i'm guessing that to operate the planer at Capacity i would actually need 7.5 hp of DC. Maybe I'm still low.. My norm is to plane little stuff, I never have a DC problem but this is not the first time I've done this. I thought of this post when I was cleaning out the ducting last night.

[Rick Fisher]

Albert if my memory serves, don't you have a huge Felder RL-250 or RL 300 ? I seem to remember a post some years ago. I'm betting that would work with a really wide planer. Not to Hijack, I have my DC in the basement with an elevator used to lift the bags up to the main floor. The ceiling height is only 8 feet. I would upgrade the DC but don't have the height for a cyclone and the elevator isn't big enough for anything wider than an RL160.

These are first world problems .. lol.

[Albert Lee]

Albert if my memory serves, don't you have a huge Felder RL-250 or RL 300 ? I seem to remember a post some years ago. I'm betting that would work with a really wide planer. Not to Hijack, I have my DC in the basement with an elevator used to lift the bags up to the main floor. The ceiling height is only 8 feet. I would upgrade the DC but don't have the height for a cyclone and the elevator isn't big enough for anything wider than an RL160.

These are first world problems .. lol.


Rick I almost got myself a Felder RL300/350 unit but couldnt justify the cost of them over other baghouse unit. I recently upgraded to a Nederman S750. It is a baghouse unit with 7.5kw motor, made in Denmark, cost is 1/4 of RL350, more chip volume, 7000m3/hr at 2800 pa at 20m/s. area of the filter is only 23m2 therefore the air to cloth ratio is quite high compare to RL350 (filter area 71m2). I think its ok as I dont operate my extractor constantly.

[Rick Fisher]

Rick I almost got myself a Felder RL300/350 unit but couldnt justify the cost of them over other baghouse unit. I recently upgraded to a Nederman S750. It is a baghouse unit with 7.5kw motor, made in Denmark, cost is 1/4 of RL350, more chip volume, 7000m3/hr at 2800 pa at 20m/s. area of the filter is only 23m2 therefore the air to cloth ratio is quite high compare to RL350 (filter area 71m2). I think its ok as I dont operate my extractor constantly.

i've seen the Neiderman Bag house dust collectors .. I love them. If I could find a short one I would buy one .. lol

[Joe Calhoon]

We used the S500 at woodworking shows for Soukup window machines. Very capable dust collector. Picked up the tenoner very well running large disks. That’s always a tell. I think the 500 would handle a sander planer and for sure the 750 would.

[Albert Lee]

I picked up my unit today, they also gave me a number of used ducting - I have these in my shop already and they are not cheap if buy new.

Note the size of the 7.5kw motor..

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[Jonathan Jung]

It would seem that a planer head in a WBS would only supplement another planer or S4S, rather than replace it. Anyone know of anyone getting rid of their planer when getting a WBS with a planer head? For my 2 person shop, having some 40 or 50 grit heavy cloth belts on hand is a better use of my cash than a new WBS/planer combo. 40 grit can easily remove 1mm per pass.

[Jim Becker]

Jonathan, my impression is that the combo thicknesser/sander machines are a specialty item, such as for surfacing large and wide slabs.

[Dan Friedrichs]

That's quite a dust collector! Their website says they are "silent" - any idea what's special about them compared to any other bagger? Slower motor?

[Zachary Hoyt]

This thread makes me wonder about the people who say you shouldn't rout after sanding because there will be grit in the wood which will dull your bit. It seems like there would be a lot of grit in the wood in a machine that planes and sands in one pass. Do the knives in these planer heads get dull unusually fast?

[Albert Lee]

That's quite a dust collector! Their website says they are "silent" - any idea what's special about them compared to any other bagger? Slower motor?

I have no idea, I am yet to unload the machine and plug it in. replacing extractor is a mission because the workshop is cluttered...

the motor operates at 3000rpm. probably just the noise from the fan and material travelling through?

[Dave Roock]

Here is an awesome sander/planer : https://www.ironwoodmachinery.com/collections/wide-belt-sanders-1/products/ironwood-s134mrk-planer-sander
Should fit all work : > )

[Joe Calhoon]

Here is a Instagram link to Creative Woodwork in Portland that has a Costa planer- sander.they are a state of the art millwork shop. This particular feed talks about changing the inserts on it. If you read through the post they discuss what’s involved with the knife change and why he prefers straight Tersa knives in his jointer and planer.
https://www.instagram.com/p/B9VKjRUjwnM/?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=

[Joe Calhoon]

This thread makes me wonder about the people who say you shouldn't rout after sanding because there will be grit in the wood which will dull your bit. It seems like there would be a lot of grit in the wood in a machine that planes and sands in one pass. Do the knives in these planer heads get dull unusually fast?

In the case of these sanders the planer head is first so that would not be a issue. Myself I have never experienced problems with wide belt or other sanding grit affecting tooling. Abrasive planing with coarse grit belts will have a dulling effect on HSS planer and shaper knives. Ask anyone who has used abrasive planed alder.

[J.R. Rutter]

Abrasive planing with coarse grit belts will have a dulling effect on HSS planer and shaper knives. Ask anyone who has used abrasive planed alder.

For real! I wonder how much is from abrasive grit and how much is the dirt that seems to get vacuumed into the open grain seconds after it is exposed...

[Joe Calhoon]

All the euro beech I’ve used is also abrasive planed but have not run enough to see if it’s as bad.
what are your thoughts on the planer sanders JR? when Albert was asking I was thinking you might be one shop that could justify one.

[J.R. Rutter]

I would definitely benefit from a Planer/Sander/Sander configuration, but not enough to justify the expense. Seems perfect for processing solid door panels.

[Rick Fisher]

I would assume, and I don't know, does the planer head just get used separately from the sander ? I have a 37" Wide Belt and have never been one to make only one pass after running through the planer. It seems like you would either use it as a planer or a sander but doing both, would the sanding be sufficient ?

[Warren Lake]

Here is a canadian guy with his widebelt and story. He explained that model well. At the end he says hes trading it in and getting one with planing and sanding.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KtlGQgr7cc

[J.R. Rutter]

I would assume, and I don't know, does the planer head just get used separately from the sander ? I have a 37" Wide Belt and have never been one to make only one pass after running through the planer. It seems like you would either use it as a planer or a sander but doing both, would the sanding be sufficient ?

You could use it either way. The original post pic shows air actuated drums (the drum spindle/shaft is eccentricly mounted in the bearings), so you can engage/disengage each head independently. But I agree that it would not be a true finished surface coming out unless you are aiming for 120 grit or so.