Fresh cedar turning questions

[Bernie Kopfer]

I just obtained a 30” L X 15” dia freshly cut Western Red Cedar log. Thought I would turn a large bowl or two. But I don’t find much information about turning green cedar. Should I treat it like any green wood and twice turn it? Does it turn well when green or is it prone to cracking on the lathe? Any special drying precautions? Would like to minimize making it into firewood. Thanks

[Robert Hayward]

I have turned Eastern Red Cedar while green. I found it to be very stable with no cracking. It also dries quickly, even here in humid Florida.

[John K Jordan]

I’ve turned a lot of cedar but I always cut it into slabs or blanks of various sizes and dry it first. Based on my drying experience ERC dries quickly and is in fact quite stable. But whether it will warp even a little may depend on the thickness, the orientation of the piece in the log, and even the tree itself and how it grew. (most of any size grow straight but occasionally find one leaning which might have internal stresses.) Wide slabs 2” and even 4” flatsawn usually dry without warping but I have seen occasional slight cupping. I also saw 4x4 and larger beams/posts and occasionally, but rarely, I’ve seen slight warping or twisting which may be a warning. (never as bad as other species!)

Without knowing more about the size and orientation of your piece in the log and more experience with other things made from that particular log and if I hoped to end with a perfectly round bowl or one with a lid that must fit perfectly I would err on the on side of caution and twice turn the piece to close to final thickness then let it dry/stabilize for at least a few days before finish turning.

Two things from my experience: the piece will be unlikely to develop cracks more than are what exist when you start. And when sanding cedar, at least some may be susceptible to heat checking from aggressive sanding with the sandpaper held firmly enough against the wood by hand to generate heat by friction. May not be as much a problem with power sanding but I never use that. These heat checks in cedar are what got me started on using curved hand scrapers instead of sandpaper for smoothing about 20 years ago and were so successful I use scrapers and very little sanding on all face turning now.

JKJ

[Bernie Kopfer]

Thank you Robert and John. Cedar is wood and will act like wood if given the opportunity. Twice turning is probably always a safe way to go. That said I was surprised at the paucity of information about turning green cedar.

[Robert Hayward]

That said I was surprised at the paucity of information about turning green cedar.
While our ERC is readily available, moderately priced and very pretty when finished it is very soft. At least our ERC is soft. Dents very easily. I believe that is why so few work with it for turning. Sure does fill the shop with that fresh cedar smell though.

[John K Jordan]

... our ERC is soft. Dents very easily. I believe that is why so few work with it for turning. ...

Yes, it's pretty soft. May not be as useful as cherry, maple, walnut or some exotics for functional things that may get beat up with use. However, I have some cedar things that have been in use for years. For example this piece we use often for cookies, cheese, etc. Finished with beeswax. The cedar one is at the top and left.

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The stability of cedar makes it nice for lidded things. It finishes nicely, this has several coats of spray lacquer:

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And I like to get cedar with some variegated color, red and white for interest:

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The last one is the first "real" bowl I turned. That's the one where I learned that sanding as I was told, holding sandpaper against the rotating piece, could create a bunch of heat checks which got me started on using hand scrapers (which had the benefit of reducing the sanding needed to only find grits and mostly by hand.)

When I get an interesting log I saw into slabs and make turning blanks after they dry. Some friends have made large platters from some of these, a lot were cut up into smaller blanks:

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For drying 4/4 I usually don't sticker - if the weather is sunny I lay out the boards on a trailer in the sun for a few hours. When they start to cup I flip them over. I continue to flip them as needed and the wood is usually well dry in less than a day. I'd dried 100s of board feet this way.

A big cedar log often has damage and ants in the center but there is almost always enough good wood to make sawing it fun.

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Bernie, let us know about your experience turning a larger bowl from green cedar, how much it warps, if it cracks, if you turned it end grain or face turning. I just tool a look at the Wood Database article (https://www.wood-database.com/aromatic-red-cedar/) and it does list the T/R ratio as 1.5, indicating you could expect some out-of-round warping if turned wet in the face mode instead of the end grain mode.

Also note that some people are sensitive to the wood, especially fine dust. I didn't consider myself particularly sensitive have no detectable skin or respiratory reactions until one day I was wearing a watch and got fine cedar dust under the watch. At the end of the day I had a skin rash under the watch.

JKJ

[Bernie Kopfer]

I’m hoping today or tomorrow to cut the piece up and round the blanks on the bandsaw. Coat it and give it a first turn this week too. Im really experimenting with this log to learn how cedar handles, turns, and dries. Always fun to learn a new wood.