Should I buy a mini-bus? Am I out of my mind?

[Zachary Hoyt]

I'll preface this by saying that I know this is a pretty odd question, but I figured that there are a lot of wise people on this forum who might have experience with this type of thing, or advice.

I bid a couple of weeks ago on a bus in an online auction. I was the back bidder, and today the winner's time to pay ran out, and I received an email from the company saying that I have till Friday to decide if I want to buy the bus for my max bid of $1500 or pass on it. I'll put in a link to the bus in question:
https://www.auctionsinternational.com/auction/27324/item/2006-chevy-express-blue-bird-bus-167996

I'd have to have it towed here, and then figure out the fuel leak that is mentioned. I have called my car insurance company and they don't seem sure, but I got a very approximate quote of $500 or so for a year, with the proviso that it might be a lot more than that, depending. Tomorrow I will email the insurance agent who is covering the house I am working on. She seems very knowledgable and eventually I will be switching all my insurance to her company, probably.

The reasons to buy this bus are:
1. I have been looking for a while for a cargo van or similar to use this spring and summer while I am working on the house, 120 miles away, and vehicle prices are high.
II. If I can fix the leak reasonably and insure it reasonably and if it doesn't break down I might be able to sell it for enough to cover some or all of the costs.
C. It would be handy to own a vehicle to haul building materials and to use when moving the shop and household goods. I have a Subaru and a 5x8 trailer now.

Reasons not to buy are:
A. It may be a money pit and/or break down and leave me in the lurch somewhere in the howling wilderness.
2. With all the other moving parts in my life now another project/complexity is not really what I need.
III. If I rent a van a few times to move what I need to it will cost $100 a day plus fuel and tax, and if it breaks down it will be somebody else's problem.

I will be grateful for any words of wisdom

[Jim Becker]

Poor condition inside and out and a fuel leak. 168+K miles. Not really set up well for getting stuff in and out because the rear door is narrow. I think you can see that for me, it would be a "no". I'll stick with my own Subaru Ascent and 5x8 trailer. :)

[Rick Potter]

Diesel or gas? If it is gas, it's just a big Chevy pickup, and fairly common to fix most problems. Diesel is more expensive to work on.

Pro...It's already stripped for work inside.

Con...Unknown fuel leak fixit cost.

Any chance you can get a mechanic to look at it by Friday? Or contact the other bidder to see why he bailed?

[Zachary Hoyt]

Thank you both very much for your advice. The Subaru and trailer are great, but I'm going to need to move a lot of 12-16 foot boards when workshop building time comes and while I've carried a few at a time on the roof rack it's not practical for a larger amount.

It's a gas 6.0 which is supposed to be fairly reliable from what I have read, though not great fuel economy. I'll try calling the seller's contact number tomorrow and see if they can tell me anything about the fuel leak. I don't know who the other bidder is, I just see their anonymous handle. I would guess they ran out of money, but they could have been concerned by something they saw instead.

[Mike Henderson]

When I read the title of your post, I thought it was an old Volkswagen bus. I would have grabbed that in a heartbeat for $1,500.

Mike

[Bill Dufour]

I do not think it has air brakes? Fuel leak seems odd on a fuel injected vehicle. I would think about buying a similar size trailer or even cutting off the nose and making it into a trailer.
Fuel leak I would guess a bad hose or something in the tank vent system. Leaky o-ring on injector pipe connections are common on some makes.
Bill D

[Jason Roehl]

12-16’ boards probably won’t fit well in that mini-bus, either—I bet you only have about 10’ behind the front doors. For me, the potential problems would be that it has spent 15 years in the snow belt, so the underside is going to be pretty rusty—that means you’re likely coming up on suspension repairs, and once you get heavier than a 1/2-ton pickup, those repairs get expensive. Just the parts are a lot more, and sometimes the tools needed are beyond what even home mechanics often have.

I’d consider delivery for whatever you can’t already haul.

[Lisa Starr]

I'd pass. It has too many issues and won't do the job well. You can save time and frustration by renting a van or arranging to have the bigger items delivered when the time comes.

[Keith Outten]

I would seriously consider buying the bus.
The gas line leak should be an easy fix.
The back door looks like it is more then four feet tall so plywood sheets should slide right in and stack/store against the interior wall.
Its long enough to make hauling 16 foot boards easy.
Your in New York, most New Yorker's are not concerned with rust, in fact Winter Rats as they call them are commonplace.
I would park the bus at the jobsite, purchase/haul materials locally and drive my car back and forth to the job.
It should be pretty handy as a kind of workshop and storage facility at some point.

My 2 cents.

[Zachary Hoyt]

Thank you all very much for your help. I think you're right, it will be wiser to just rent when needed. I am planning to schedule deliveries for sheet goods, insulation etc, but for lumber I want to be able to pick it myself, and that means I have to haul it too. I can rent a van just a few miles from Home Depot and Lowes, and then it's about 90 miles to where I'm going, and 90 back, so if I can get all the lumber in one run that will be simple enough, or if it takes two I can also go to another Lowes that is 55 miles from my house, but further away from where the van is rented.

edited to add: I hadn't seen Keith Outten's post when I wrote this, I will reconsider and will go ahead and write to my insurance agent to find out what insurance would cost. According to the wisdom of the Internet each window is around 30 inches long, so it should be about 12-1/2' behind the folding door, or 15 feet up to the front of it.

[Brian Elfert]

Just have a real lumberyard deliver your lumber. If you are buying a large quantity they will generally take back any bad pieces. I couldn't imagine the time it would take at a big box store to sort through enough 2x4s to build a garage/shop.

[Ole Anderson]

Dude, that bus had an 6.0 LS engine! Go for it!!!

[Jim Becker]

Thank you both very much for your advice. The Subaru and trailer are great, but I'm going to need to move a lot of 12-16 foot boards when workshop building time comes and while I've carried a few at a time on the roof rack it's not practical for a larger amount

I've carried 16' boards on the centerline of my 5x8 utility trailer. 10-12 footers are a piece of cake. (My trailer is open, flat bed, but even if I put on the sides I made, I created it so that the bottom board of the front piece can be removed by spinning two wing nuts and long material can go under it) If your trailer can't do that, I'll suggest to you that even a new flat trailer that permits it would likely cost you a lot less than that bus will cost to obtain and fix up enough to be road worthy. But that's an opinion from afar, of course.

I would NEVER use a roof rack for lumber. I did that exactly once many years ago with Professor Dr. SWMBO's first Forester. It was a disaster. If I could have ordered our current vehicles without roof racks, I would have done so!

[Kev Williams]

These days $1500 for anything with aired up tires and an engine that starts is a pretty good deal... ;)

Fuel leak is no big thing. Did the seller mention WHERE it's leaking? Front, middle, out back?

My concern with that chassis and 160k miles would be steering and other various suspension parts. And that's not really a big deal...

IF I had a need for such a vehicle, for that price I'd be on it like red on a fire truck....

[Ron Selzer]

Looks like that bus was used as a maintenance vehicle after it was taken out of service as a bus for kids.
At least have a mechanic look it over before buying it, fairly certain you will find more than just a gas leak.

[Zachary Hoyt]

My current car insurance company doesn't cover this type of vehicle for personal use, so my helpful house insurance agent is looking into it. I was planning to inquire about switching the car to her agency anyway, in March when the current policy runs out. I have not been able to reach the seller by phone yet, but plan to keep trying. I don't think I can get a mechanic to look at it, I don't know any mechanics who travel and don't trust the ones I don't know, (nor the majority of the ones I do know, actually).

I perhaps shouldn't admit this, but last fall I carried 6 16' and 2 12' 2x10 KD joists about 6 miles on the roof rack without incident. I have 3,000 and 10,000# rated straps, and drove cautiously. In years past I carried one of those palletized 275 gallon plastic tanks 7 miles on an Outback roof rack, and also a 12" x20' plastic culvert 35 miles or so. Both of them were light, but too big to go inside the car, and I didn't have a trailer when I bought the tank. I just carried a 30x84 solid oak interior door about 40 miles on the roof, and it didn't move at all. I used a 3,000# strap on that. Even once I'm through with all of this house repair craziness I'll want a roof rack to carry canoes on the occasions when I don't want to pull them with my bicycle, so I wouldn't want to be without one on my daily driver.

[Lee Schierer]

For $1500 plus $500 for insurance you can rent a 6 x12 trailer from Uhaul for about $30 per day. That is at least 60 rentals with no problems with fitting your loads.

[Zachary Hoyt]

That is true, I will add that to the list of possibilities. The Outback 4 cylinder is supposed to be rated for 2700# with trailer brakes, which I see the U-Hauls have in the bigger sizes.

[Ronald Blue]

The gas leak could be the fuel tank as well. I don't know if the tank is steel or not. The 6.0 engine is as good as they get. I know of them with over 400K on them for mileage. They are as bullet proof as you can ask for. It's unfortunate that you didn't look at it in advance. That being said it's scrap metal value is easily at least half the cost. If a fuel leak is the only issue that needs immediate attention it seems like a good deal. Convenience is a key factor. If you rent a trailer it has to happen during Uhaul or whoever's hours and it has to be available when you need it. You can't leave it loaded overnight without incurring additional costs. The old bus can be used as storage/unload at your leisure instead of having to get it off that day. It's a 1 ton chassis so you can load it up far heavier than a trailer you will tow with your car. It's safe to say that at least the majority of it's life it was a bus and I hope maintained correctly. You can build some structure in there to handle your materials safely. I don't think you can go wrong here if it's as it appears.

[Zachary Hoyt]

Well, the die is cast, for good or ill. I've gotten a reasonable insurance quote from the helpful agent and have spoken with my friendly local low truck driver who is going to bring it here, so that saves trying to diagnose the fuel leak in the school parking lot. The person at the school thought it was leaking from the top of the sending unit but couldn't remember for sure. If that's the case it should be a reasonably easy fix. I changed the fuel pump in a pickup when I was 17 and even more clueless than I am now. I don't plan to start using the bus till the snow melts, sometime in March or April depending how the spring goes, so that will give me time to look it over and see what it might need.

[Zachary Hoyt]

Ronald Blue, I missed your post as I was typing my last one. What kind of structure would you recommend building to hold things inside? I have no experience with that job. I can imagine that having some tiedowns anchored to the floor along the sides would be good, and maybe I can use the seat bolt holes to bolt down a plate with a ring or something. The bus was fleet maintained as part of the school bus program, and the inspection sticker is supposed to be current, though of course I'll have to have it done again after I buy it.

[Ted Calver]

Over the last twenty years, my artist son has purchased two similar (maybe in better shape) bus type vehicles from public transportation auctions to carry his large format art work to shows and make deliveries . He guts them and removes the wheel chair lift and then creates interior racks for his stuff. He also builds a bunk in them for overnights. IIRC they also cost in the neighborhood of $1500 and have been well worth the money, with few high dollar maintenance issues. Not a bad return on investment.

[Kev Williams]

... The person at the school thought it was leaking from the top of the sending unit but couldn't remember for sure...
The top of the sending unit is part of the fuel pump assembly, which includes the outgoing and return fuel line connections, pump 12v line and sending unit wire... Likely just a new $150-ish fuel pump assembly will solve the problem...

[Zachary Hoyt]

Ted Calver, that's good to know. It sounds like he was keeping them for a longer term, so it's nice to hear that they worked out for him. I think in a more normal economic time it would be possible to get a nicer bus for $1500, but everything has gone up a lot lately.

Kev Williams, yes indeed. Having done a fuel pump before (even though it was 19 years ago) makes it seem like it should be pretty easy now. My recollection on that truck was that the hard part was getting the rusted bolts and nuts cut that held the tank strap ends up, since there was no way to unscrew them anymore and they were way up in there. I've never looked at the underside of a bus, but I imagine there's a little more room to reach around things, maybe.

[Ronald Blue]

Ronald Blue, I missed your post as I was typing my last one. What kind of structure would you recommend building to hold things inside? I have no experience with that job. I can imagine that having some tiedowns anchored to the floor along the sides would be good, and maybe I can use the seat bolt holes to bolt down a plate with a ring or something. The bus was fleet maintained as part of the school bus program, and the inspection sticker is supposed to be current, though of course I'll have to have it done again after I buy it.

The main thing would be a bulk head of some sort to keep your load from ending up in the drivers seat. With the width of the body you could get some of the load control bars that they use in semi van trailers. They telescope out against the sides with a cam style lever. It looks like you have already given some thought to load management. Look forward to seeing and reading how it all falls in place.

If you do need to drop the fuel tank look into new straps and just cutting the old. I know that would be a simpler option possibly if replacement straps are readily available.

[Jim Becker]

That is true, I will add that to the list of possibilities. The Outback 4 cylinder is supposed to be rated for 2700# with trailer brakes, which I see the U-Hauls have in the bigger sizes.
You may not be able to rent the 6x12 with the Outback, but you can test it on their site. The process requires indicating the make, model, trim, etc., of the vehicle you have and they match that up with the published specifications for that tow vehicle. I was able to rent one with my Ascent recently to move my Kubota, but I have a 5000 lb limit with 500 lbs of tongue weight available. I was close to that with the trailer and the tractor with FEL and BH. The other issue with the UHaul 6x12 is that the front of the trailer is closed, so all extra length has to go out the back. Harder to balance the load front to back that way.

[Zachary Hoyt]

Ronald Blue, the bulkhead idea is very smart. I've seen those things they use in dry vans that you talked about, or I may be able to make something from stuff I have around here. I'll have to find out how much of the body is steel and how much is aluminum, and how strong either one is. I might be able to bolt on brackets to the inside of the walls or the floor and ceiling behind the driver's seat and put some kind of plywood panel there. I'm not even sure from the pictures if the back of the seat is already somewhat protected by the wooden shelf unit and such.

Jim Becker, I tried the onsite test thing back in the afternoon, and it seemed that they were saying that I could rent a 6x12 with the Outback but would be limited to about 1000 pounds payload as I recall, because the trailer itself is so heavy. My Outback is a 4 cylinder and a 6 can tow 300 more pounds. It's a great all-around car for this climate, and has done well towing some heavyish loads in my 5x8 trailer but I think it will work better to do most of the heavy hauling from here on in with the bus since it is built more for that kind of thing and has a much beefier engine and transmission.

[Kris Cook]

Jim Becker, I tried the onsite test thing back in the afternoon, and it seemed that they were saying that I could rent a 6x12 with the Outback but would be limited to about 1000 pounds payload as I recall, because the trailer itself is so heavy. My Outback is a 4 cylinder and a 6 can tow 300 more pounds. It's a great all-around car for this climate, and has done well towing some heavyish loads in my 5x8 trailer but I think it will work better to do most of the heavy hauling from here on in with the bus since it is built more for that kind of thing and has a much beefier engine and transmission.

I think you made the right choice. Trying to haul anything on a trailer where you have to calculate the load to convince yourself it can be done is generally a bad idea. Not much room for the unexpected and/or error.

[Rick Potter]

Three years ago I got a commercial Lowes credit card. I didn't think I would qualify, but I told them I have rentals I repair, and they said no problem. Apparently they will give one to almost anyone.

The best thing about it is that they deliver local loads for $20, instead of their regular $85, if that card is used. At the time I got about 30-40 4X12 sheets of 5/8 drywall on a clearance for real cheap, and they delivered it to my house for $20. I also bought sheathing OSB, and L/P siding for the same addition at home, as well as some Trex for a porch, all delivered for $20.

At the time I had a Ford Super Duty pickup, but imagine the number of loads that would have been...not to mention loading and unloading.

Best deal of that year.

I don't know how far it is to your local Lowes, but it might be worth looking into.

[Jim Becker]

That's actually a good point, Rick. Delivery can be pretty cost effective in many cases, A lot of locally owned building materials suppliers offer reasonable delivery and remember, those folks unload it, too. Saves time and saves your back. (I use delivery for my sheet goods for the same reason...it's essentially free with a minimum $300 order which is pretty easy to do, even for a small project)

[Zachary Hoyt]

Rick Potter, thanks for the tip. I have never had a credit card so I doubt I can apply for the first 3 but the preload card should be doable, if they consider me enough of a business to get it, and would provide the cheaper shipping. I looked it up and I am only 45 miles from the nearest Lowes so I am well within their regular delivery area. I'll have to ask next time I'm there if I can get that card.

Jim Becker, the local lumberyard is only 6 miles away, and offers free delivery within 15 miles. So far I've only done cash and carry there as I was in a hurry to get the things I needed, but in the spring it will be easier to plan further ahead. I'm not planning to buy most of what I need there since they were about 20% higher on average than Lowes or HD for framing lumber and CDX plywood, but when I needed things fast it was nice to have them right there.

[Keith Outten]

Should you have to work on the top of the gas tank you might consider cutting a square patch in the floor just over top of the tank. This would make it easy to repair without have to crawl underneath the bus and work overhead. After the repair is done cover the hole with a piece of sheet metal and use a few sheet metal screws.

[Zachary Hoyt]

That's a great idea. I'd just have to think of a way to cut the floor without making sparks or accidentally cutting into the top of the tank.

[Kev Williams]

Should you have to work on the top of the gas tank you might consider cutting a square patch in the floor just over top of the tank. This would make it easy to repair without have to crawl underneath the bus and work overhead. After the repair is done cover the hole with a piece of sheet metal and use a few sheet metal screws.


That's a great idea. I'd just have to think of a way to cut the floor without making sparks or accidentally cutting into the top of the tank.

Since that's a 'specialty' vehicle, whoever built it as a bus may have already made access to the fuel pump-- if you're lucky! :)

[Zachary Hoyt]

I can but hope. It would certainly be nice.

[Bill Dufour]

2000 ford ranger I had to replace the fuel pump. I did not quite get the pump mount in correct. It would spill a little fuel if I filled it all the way. I suppose splash water may get into the tank the same way as well. I took off the bed to fix it a few years later. I bought the big wrench the second time instead of hammer and punch to tighten it down.
They sell a small piece of shaped bed floor to cover a hole you cut to do the pump. I suppose you could cut one out at the wrecking yard with a cordless angle grinder and a cutoff disk. For some reason they wanted me to drill holes under the seat to remove the tank straps. Instead I dropped them to the ground.
1985 truck one of the nylon? vent lines from engine to gas tank melted from exhaust heat causing tank to suck air loudly when gas cap was opened.
Bill D

[Keith Outten]

That's a great idea. I'd just have to think of a way to cut the floor without making sparks or accidentally cutting into the top of the tank.


You may be able to slide a piece of sheet metal or thin plywood onto the top of the tank so you could cut the floor with an angle grinder. I have also been able in the past to drill a large hole and use an electric shear to cut metal flooring which does not not produce sparks. Check the distance between the floor and the tank top before you decide the best technique that you feel comfortable using.

[Zachary Hoyt]

Thanks, those are great ideas. I am pretty experienced at cutting with an angle grinder, and the plywood sounds smart. I've never used a shear, but have heard that they're very handy. I was also pondering cutting with a sawzall and a short metal blade, if there's enough clearance between the tank top and the floor. I was able to cut a 275 gallon oil tank in half with one last fall in only 5 minutes or so, so I have become a believer in them for sheet metal cuts where the angle grinder blade is more likely to get pinched or wander off the line.

[Bill Dufour]

How about an oscillating tool? like a Fein. Maybe a diamond grit blade to get through the undercoating. Wet tile saw would douse the sparks
Bill D

[Jim Becker]

Jim Becker, the local lumberyard is only 6 miles away, and offers free delivery within 15 miles. So far I've only done cash and carry there as I was in a hurry to get the things I needed, but in the spring it will be easier to plan further ahead. I'm not planning to buy most of what I need there since they were about 20% higher on average than Lowes or HD for framing lumber and CDX plywood, but when I needed things fast it was nice to have them right there.

Perhaps you can set yourself up as a cash contractor account with them and get contractor pricing to save a bit...I did that years ago with one of the local, family run building products/home center businesses. Their prices are indeed higher than the 'borg, but for "real" construction projects, the quality is also several notches higher, too. You may also be able to negotiate a package for your building that further cuts the material costs. You have time so figure out all the angles. "Good material" makes things go together easier and with less waste, IMHO.

[Zachary Hoyt]

Bill Dufour, I've never used an oscillating multi tool, but have heard of them. This may be a job that makes a good reason to buy another tool, I suppose.

Jim Becker, it's an interesting idea. I don't think I would be able to get a discount from this place. They seem a bit more on the hard-nosed end of things, as one doubtless has to be to survive in business in a small town which has had some economic troubles.

[Keith Outten]

This is the metal cutting shear I was recommending (https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200711933_200711933?cm_mmc=Bing-pla&utm_source=Bing_PLA&utm_medium=Power%20Tools%20%3E%20Cutters%20%26%20S hears%20%2B%20Nibblers&utm_campaign=Ironton&utm_content=61535&cmpid=361680776&agid=1180876404544488&tgtid=pla-4577404349989286&prdid=61535&msclkid=d13a807b1cd61e376e63e18e6b5933d9&gclid=d13a807b1cd61e376e63e18e6b5933d9&gclsrc=3p.ds). Not this particular brand exactly, you should shop to find the brand you feel that is best for your situation. This tool will cut thin sheet metal straight or curved like butter, quick and easy. For the floor you would start by drilling a large hole , possibly in each corner, and the shear will do the rest. I bought a cheap model because I rarely have the need but it is a great tool to have in your arsenal. If you run into a seam that is too thick for the shear use a half hack saw for the thicker area.

I do a lot of metal work, mostly making sign hangers. Welding, bending, twisting and cutting are often weekly tasks and my options are variable including a plasma torch and bolt cutters with three foot long handles :)

[Zachary Hoyt]

Thank you for the link, that looks like a handy thing. It sounds like you are fully equipped for all of that kind of work. I have a set of those 36" bolt cutters but one tooth is chipped so they don't work too well anymore. I got them for $10 at an auction when I was about 16.

I do occasional steel work when required, but it's generally been repairing farm machinery so it's been 1/8 to 1/2" thick material, working with an angle grinder and an old Lincoln AC stick welder. Does a shear work well for metal roofing or do the corrugations cause a problem? That's the other thing I'd be likely to use one for. I can cut 4" C channel with a thin cut off wheel in the angle grinder and get it pretty clean and square, but when I try to cut metal roofing with the angle grinder I tend to abrade the disc away too fast to be efficient, and I don't get as clean of a cut. I work with brass round and rectangle bar weekly or so, but it's much easier to cut and shape.

[Alex Zeller]

I know someone who did something similar with an old bus. He ended up putting a bed that folded down if needed so he could register it as an RV. RVs seem to have their own classification and the insurance was cheap. As for cutting a hole in the floor to get to the gas leak, I wouldn't do anything that could cause a spark.

[Bill Dufour]

The little one hand reciprocating saws have half the stroke length of a full size one. So a little less exposed ends of the blade.
No reason not to have a garden hose fog nozzle on top of the tank while cutting the floor
Bill D

[Kev Williams]

I know someone who did something similar with an old bus. He ended up putting a bed that folded down if needed so he could register it as an RV. RVs seem to have their own classification and the insurance was cheap. As for cutting a hole in the floor to get to the gas leak, I wouldn't do anything that could cause a spark.

Just guessing, but if the 'bus' designation was changed to something like 'tool truck', seems the insurance may be cheaper too, lots less liability if it's not designed for hauling lots of humans around...

[Zachary Hoyt]

Alex Zeller, that's a good thought. If I recall correctly in NY there are 6 or 7 attributes of an RV that you have to have 4 of to register a conversion as an RV, or at least that's what I read online.

Bill Dufour, I have not tried a mini reciprocating saw but I have a jigsaw that I have used to cut aluminum plate, and it might work with the right blade.

Kev Williams, my insurance agent says that the insurance she signed me up for covers both business and personal use as a hauling vehicle. I told her there is only one seat, so I think that makes it clear to the insurance company that I don't plan to use it as a bus anymore.

[Kris Cook]

Reading back through this thread I see there is lots of advice on how to access the tank/fuel pump. Curious if you have found where the leak actually is. Maybe I missed it but I didn't see the leak was coming from that area necessarily. Don't know the configuration of the tank and frame in that rig but if it was in the top of the tank you could drop the tank. I did it in a suburban that had a full tank of gas, using a floor jack. It wasn't fun but not that bad.

Have you been able to diagnose anything?

On another note. I have a friend in Colorado that has a rafting company. They took a full size school bus and cut the body off several seats behind the driver's seat and flush with the floor. Billed as "the worlds largest pickup".

[Bill Dufour]

Sparks on top of a sealed gas tank is not really a safety hazard but... too much hot slag can melt a vapor hose. On mine the bad sender seal meant a little pool of gasoline sat on top of the tank in a small depression until it evaporated off in a few days. Maybe 1/2 cup or so.
Bill D

[Zachary Hoyt]

Kris, the seller said he thought the leak was at the sending unit, but I have not received the bus yet. It is supposed to be towed here this week, and then I'll be able to start looking into what it needs. I took the tank down in a pickup years ago and replaced the fuel pump as I said earlier in this thread, the hard part was getting the bolts off the straps because of the rust.

I'll be curious to see what the tank installation is like on a bus, and how hard it will be to remove it, or to cut the floor. I don't have an indoor space tall enough to bring the bus in, so I'll be working on it out in the snow. I'll blow an area clear first, to park the bus in where it will be out of the way during the rest of the winter.

[Jim Becker]

Working outside, despite the snowy cold, may be a good thing for a gasoline leak... :)

[Zachary Hoyt]

That's true, although I hope to avoid doing anything explosive.

[Bill Dufour]

City near where I grew up they tore down the dynamite plant and built a huge subdivision. City grew so big it incorporated with the slogan "The dynamic city".
Bill D

[Jim Becker]

That's true, although I hope to avoid doing anything explosive.

It's not even that...the fumes can be uncomfortable and unhealthy in a closed space even without going "bang". ;)

[Zachary Hoyt]

I used to part out dead tractors, and still do have to work on not-dead ones, so I am used to the fumes. The outbuildings here are not at all tight, and when I am working in them I leave the doors open anyway. It's just nicer to lie on a creeper and scoot across the concrete, rather than putting a piece of plywood down on the snow and trying to keep the tools from falling off the edges and getting lost.

[Jim Becker]

I agree that inside is easier and more pleasant in many ways, even if it's the same temperature. It sounds like you have enough ventilation if you can get that beast inside.

[Zachary Hoyt]

Unfortunately I didn't build the outbuildings with buses in mind, and according to the seller the bus is 124" high, so it won't fit through any of the doors. My tallest door is 10x10 and most are 7 to 8 feet high.

[Zachary Hoyt]

The bus arrived about 5 tonight, and it looks like it should be suitable. I was pleased to find that I can carry 16' material on the right side and down the center with the rear door closed. On the left there's a bit less room because of the driver's seat. I looked for a fuel leak but haven't found it yet. At first I was seeing a fast drip in the center of the vehicle, but that turned out to be water running out of a weep hole at the bottom of the muffler while the engine was running. There is a bit under 1/4 tank showing on the gas gauge, so I am wondering if it may be a leak that only appears when the tank is full to a certain level, or on hills or something. I was looking underneath tonight with a headlamp, and will try again in daylight.

The only disappointment so far is that the driver's seat doesn't go back as far as I had hoped, so I have to sort of fold up my left leg in order to be able to turn the steering wheel all the way around without my hand running into my leg. Maybe there's a way to tilt the steering wheel, but I haven't been able to find it if there is. All the fluid levels look good, and while the underside is rusty it's not too bad. The tires look like they will have enough tread to pass inspection, but I'll be able to tell better when they're not covered with snow. It even beeps nicely when backing up, and has a couple of first aid kits mounted on the walls. I've got more looking around to do underneath, but so far it seems good.

[Kev Williams]

Some 'trucks' like that, the whole steering column tilts, and/or can be raised or lowered- not sure what the unlocking mechanism would look like ?

[Bill Dufour]

My first pickup I swapped a steering column from a car with tilt. Pretty easy job. Just need to find a column that will swap in. The trick I learned was not to disconnect all the wiring and risk breaking connectors off. Instead most of the switches can be dismounted with two screws each and mounted onto the new column. A power seat base may be easy enough. especially if you only need temporary power to set it and never move it again.
Bill D

[Jim Becker]

You also may be able to just move the seat tracks, depending on how things are setup.

[Bill Dufour]

I actually ended up buying the tilt column from ebay. It included the steering wheel with the cruise control switches and intermittent wipers switch/control box. later I bought the other criuise control stuff under the hood and connected it all up.
Bill D

Looked on ebay and I see chevy columns for $100-200 delivered. I have no idea what will fit.

[Bill Dufour]

Is the seat a factory stock seat or is it some special air ride commercial seat?
Bill D

[Zachary Hoyt]

I think the seat is factory. It just sits on a metal base, and slides back and forth manually. I might be able to move the whole base back a couple of inches, but I'm not sure yet. I need to look under there and see if there's anything that would be a problem. It's snowing today, but tomorrow is supposed to be above freezing and not snowing, so I'll probably dig deeper into it then.

[Bill Dufour]

Moved a seat years ago for a neighbor. Drilles four holes in the floor and underneath connected them front to rear with a hunk of heavy angle iron drilled to match.
Bill D

[Zachary Hoyt]

Sounds like a good plan, I'll just have to make sure there's nothing under there that I would hit when drilling. I forgot to check yesterday, so I looked today and found that the bus was inspected in December, and since it hasn't been driven much since then I imagine it should pass again pretty easily.

[Derek Meyer]

Zachary, thinking of you moving a seat in a vehicle makes me remember the scene from Police Academy where Hightower rips the front seat out of the car and uses the back seat to drive. Appropriate, because I think you are actually taller than Bubba Smith, who played Hightower.

[Zachary Hoyt]

I didn't see Police Academy, but I remember hearing on the radio a few years ago that some police organization in Germany had ordered a bunch of new cars only to find out that they were too small for most of the officers to fit in the front seat. I'm 7'1/2" tall last I knew, so most cars are a bit of a squeeze for me.

It looks like I can move the seat back, but I also spent some time trying to figure out how to fit myself in the existing scenario, and I can do it more or less. I think I will try driving it locally with the seat where it is now and see how uncomfortable that is, and then I can move the seat if necessary. I don't intend to keep the bus long term, so the less I have to change the better for future resale to normal persons.

[Jim Becker]

Well, if we ever do an SMC remake of Star Wars, we know who gets to be inside of the Wookie suit! :) :D. You are one tall dude, my friend!

[Zachary Hoyt]

I'll need a Wookie wig too, as most of my hair is taking the early retirement option.

[Jim Becker]

i'll need a wookie wig too, as most of my hair is taking the early retirement option.

roflol!!!!

[Bill Dufour]

How about swapping in a smaller steering wheel or the new Tesla steering thing that is not a wheel. More like a race car steering butterfly. Air bags in the wheel? Gold plated chain wheel perhaps.
Bill D

https://www.amazon.com/Alta-Bicycle-Steering-Multiple-Colors/dp/B07B6TB8T3/ref=asc_df_B07B6TB8T3/?tag=&linkCode=df0&hvadid=312094794167&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=2181727578885793027&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9032277&hvtargid=pla-613055230319&ref=&adgrpid=63784736042&th=1

[Zachary Hoyt]

I finally got around to replacing the broken glass pane in the passenger door today. I figured I would need to get it done before inspection. It got up around 50 in the afternoon and I had to go into town anyway for the blood drive, so I bought a piece of acrylic at the hardware store. The original was laminated glass, but I don't think it will matter for my purpose. The rubber gasket took a little prying and poking with a large blunt screwdriver, but finally everything is where it needs to be. I hadn't realized the pane was broken before I bought the bus, but it only cost $10 and less than an hour of work to replace it.

[Tom Bender]

'Not needing another project' says don't try to fix the driving position if you can get by with it as is. It's not your DD. You are going to need a cup holder and someplace to corral loose stuff like lunch, a coat and some tools for the trip. Screw a cardboard box to the floor and call it good. You have a shop to build.

[Zachary Hoyt]

Yes, I agree that it would be best not to do anything unnecessary to the bus. I'll have to see how I do driving it locally. If my leg goes to sleep in 15 minutes I'll need to do something, otherwise I should be fine. I don't intend to drive it back and forth more times than necessary, especially with gas prices what they are. There's a handy compartment in the wall above the driver's head that should be good for putting things like my computer that I want to have out of sight while in parking lots, and there are also some built in shelves behind the driver's seat that the school employees put in that are good for things like coats and small tools and such.

[Zachary Hoyt]

I registered the bus yesterday, which was a little complicated because the school district had modified it without notifying the state, but they gave me a 10 day extension to get the bus weighed and update the registration with the new number. I took it to the dump today, (they're closed Tuesdays and Thursdays) and got a weight slip, but the odd thing was that the original empty weight was 8372 and the new empty weight with no seats is 8200, with 1/8 tank of gas and no snow on the bus. I would have thought bus seats would weigh more than that, but perhaps the original weight was without any gas or other fluids, or something.

I've got an appointment to get it inspected next week, and I'm hoping it will pass. It drove fine for the 15 miles or so I had to travel, and i still could not find any sign of the gas leak. Maybe it will turn up when i put more gas in the tank, after the inspection. My legs didn't go to sleep, but my knees felt a bit battered from bumping into the hard plastic when going over the railroad tracks. I'll put some padding on the spots where my knees go, and then I'll be fine, I think.

[Zachary Hoyt]

The bus passed inspection yesterday with no work needed, other than that window I replaced with acrylic for $9.99. I guess that one person's idea of poor condition is not the same as another's. After it passed I said to the garage man said that I had bought it in an online auction and didn't know anything about it, and he said it looked to be in quite good shape to him and that I wouldn't have any problem selling it.

I took a load to the dump today with it and put in $40 worth of gas on the way home(9.09 gallons at this morning's price). I looked underneath while it was filling and didn't see any leaks around the filler neck, and looked again after driving home. It's only got 3/8 of a tankful now, so maybe it would leak if I filled it up all the way, or maybe the people at the bus garage got it mixed up with another bus that does have a leak. I'll buy a 10# fire extinguisher next time I get to Lowes and keep it in the bus just in case. I'll want one for the new workshop building anyway, in the fall.

It's not an ideal time to be driving around a lot in a vehicle this big, but that's the way it goes sometimes. I've got a tentative plan, pending approval of the building inspector next Monday, to buy about 4600 board feet of pine and hemlock from a local Amish farm. It will take me three trips at 120 miles each way to get it all up there, but it's still a lot cheaper than buying the lumber at the local lumberyard or from Lowes.

I'm very thankful for all the help with reaching a decision about buying the bus. It's worked out even better than I had hoped.

[Derek Meyer]

Zachary, this is the scene I was thinking about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjNpA-fy1r0

Derek

[Zachary Hoyt]

Derek, thanks for posting the link. I feel his pain.

[Zachary Hoyt]

Since you all were so helpful about my bus question last winter I figured I would add the end of the story in case anyone was still interested. I sold the bus today for $2700, after about a month of advertising it starting at $3500. It carried 12 loads up here between April 3 and August 26, and made a few other trips to fetch things at either end, and covered just over 3500 miles. My total cost of ownership including purchase, repairs, registration and insurance came to $3690 and I spent another $1,386 on gas. Unfortunately the time I was driving the bus coincided almost exactly with the time when gas was over $4 a gallon here, and sometimes even over $5.

I blew a tire and had a shop put on two new ones, and I replaced the oil cooler lines myself after they began to leak from rust where there's a bracket that holds sand against them, but other than that I had no mechanical problems and the bus never let me down when I was traveling back and forth. I was delayed by the tire, but was able to drive slowly on the surviving tire on that side after taking off the other wheel.

Overall the bus was a huge help to me and made the process of building the shop, repairing the house, and moving the contents of both buildings up here much easier than it would have otherwise been. I could have rented a bigger truck and made fewer trips, but I think it still would have cost more, and having the bus always there when I needed it was a great convenience. I'm glad now to have it sold so I have more room in the yard, especially with winter coming on.

[Jim Koepke]

Zachary, the cost of gas is a wash since you would have had to pay for gas if you rented a truck.

It looks like it cost you $990 to "rent" the bus or $82.50 per load. That is likely less (and more convenient) than renting a truck.

jtk

[Jim Becker]

Sounds like a relatively happy ending. I was a little "skeered" when you original went this route, but clearly, that was unwarranted. :)

Going forward, if you want to retain some utility for hauling materials, etc., a small utility trailer can be a great way to accomplish that and it doesn't require a big pick-em-up truck, either.

[Zachary Hoyt]

I'm fully in agreement on the utility trailer. I've had one for about 10 years now, first a 4x8 Harbor Freight and now a 5x8 from Tractor Supply. I've been driving middle aged Outbacks for that whole time and they have done fine with it. Payload is a bit more limited at 1600 vs 3800 for the bus, but I don't intend to have to haul really big loads around for a while now.

[Jim Becker]

Mine is a 5x8 and it's been a very functional size for me. I can carry sticks that are much longer close to the center line, too. My Ascent has a 5000 lb towing limit, but my trailer can't go above about 2500 lbs of cargo and I wouldn't do that because it doesn't have brake. I don't have a hitch receiver on the Forester, but it would have similar capacities to your Outback if it was so equipped. I'm actually debating right now the pros and cons of picking up the material I need for my shop interior stuff vs having it delivered for an $80 charge. I'm not fond of paying for a service like that, but then again, a Moffett bringing it all right to the shop door without me having to lift it multiple times is pretty attractive. LOL

[Zachary Hoyt]

I've been debating the pickup vs delivery thing a bit this summer too. In the spring when I was hauling all the lumber from the Amish sawmill up here to build the workshop and the woodshed I had to bring it myself, but when I ordered the drywall for the house I had it delivered for $80 from Lowe's. The truck driver set it in the yard with a forklift and it took me a couple of hours to move 86 sheets of drywall into the house since each sheet was 75# and the temperature was in the 80s. When I built the addition I had that lumber delivered from a yard 30 miles away that has a $50 flat rate for deliveries. Now that I know about them I'll buy from them in future, because they delivered nice lumber. I have heard stories of people having lumber delivered from box stores that was really bad. I figured I was safe with drywall, and I didn't want to have to handle it the extra times at the store, nor to try to get it in and out through the bus door. I am not at all fond of working with drywall since it's so heavy and soft and weak. Can you get all you need in one trip yourself, and is it far to go?

[Mel Fulks]

In 1970, something ,I bought a used VW “camp mobile “. Great fun , but really slow. Took several friends on a mountain trip and when we
got to the first steep stretch, you could have walked along side! We were leading a long procession of faster vehicles, but none of my
“followers “ got impatient and angry. I swear that’s true….but it’s even hard for me to believe.

[Ronald Blue]

I think even though in the end you had a "net" cost the thing that is hard to put dollars on is the convenience. You could make trips when it fit your schedule. You didn't have to have it back by closing time or pay another day in rental. You didn't have to unload that evening when you already had a full day in. That's the luxury of it being yours to use as you pleased when you pleased. Rentals aren't always available when needed or the size you want. So in the end it was a happy ending. It did what you needed it to and you are now back to "normal" whatever that is for you.

[Jim Becker]

Yea, if I was going a stick built type project, I'd be buying from the more local, independent yard because they do indeed provide much nicer lumber. But for my interior horizontal girts, which are not "structural", I can get away with the $3.75 2x4s as long as they are not bowed. I really would have liked to do 16'-ers, but they would be 1.5-2 times the cost of using the 8' material. I need about 70 of them, so that's where the pickup vs delivery comes into play. If I pick up, I may need to lift them at least one extra time, if not two. LOL

[Zachary Hoyt]

Convenience is a huge benefit, and it was a happy ending for me. The time required to load and unload everything by myself would have added to the rental time on some loads. When I had the bus full of lumber or insulation it was pretty quick to fill and empty, but when I moved the shop it took me a total of four hours to untangle and unload everything and get it into the building.

I bought 2x4s from Lowe's for the addition but bought everything else from the smaller yard. I needed 50 2x4x8s and they were $4 at that time vs $6 at the other place. All the other lumber was pretty comparable and OSB was actually cheaper from the independent business. It took close to half an hour to dig through the 2x4 pile and find 50 that were good enough to use, but I figured it was worth it to save $100, and they fit easily on the trailer to come home. I am happy to carry up to 12' boards on the trailer, and 14 is not too bad, but I don't like to carry 16s even with a flag on the back, since they stick out so far.

[Rick Potter]

About that delivery charge...When I built a new building about three years ago, I found some great deals at Lowes on drywall and LP siding. They said that if I had a Lowes "Business" card, deliveries would be $20, rather than $80. They were pretty loose on "Business", and since I had a rental they said no problem and signed me up. Over the next year, I bought a lot of stuff there, and got 6% off along with $20 delivery.

One delivery was enough 10' long sheets of 5/8" drywall to do a 1650 s/f building plus ceilings. It was laid down inside the building by forklift for me, for $20. I cannot imagine picking this up myself. Then there was the insulation, and LP siding for the same deal. That card saved me a bunch.

[Derek Meyer]

Interesting. Our store does open account billing (Net 10, due by the 10th of the month following the charges) and does a 6% discount for most projects, or 13% for contractors who do high volume. Delivery charges vary by distance, but if it in town the standard charge is $30. This will include forklift or material handler to place materials where you want them.

[Zachary Hoyt]

I applied for one of those cards but was turned down because I have very little or no credit history. I've never had a credit card or any kind of debt, and I guess their computer didn't like it. Every time I go they still ask me if I want to sign up for it.

[Brian Elfert]

Zachary, the cost of gas is a wash since you would have had to pay for gas if you rented a truck.

It looks like it cost you $990 to "rent" the bus or $82.50 per load. That is likely less (and more convenient) than renting a truck.


I own a trailer that doesn't get used all that much. It would be cheaper to rent a trailer when needed, but that is a hassle. You're talking close to two hours of time to rent with going to get the trailer and bringing it back. I like to be able to use my trailer on a moment's notice with no planning required.

Also, rental trailers tend to be very heavy. My trailer is an aluminum trailer that is weighs 500 pounds or less.

[Zachary Hoyt]

I think that over time it's cheaper for me to own a trailer than rent it, based on how much I use it. Registration is something like $30 a year here, and the trailer cost me $600 plus tax 6 years ago, so my cost is about $130 per year plus maintenance, so far. I sometimes use the trailer a lot, and sometimes it sits for a month or two. In my new life I will probably use it less, and at some point I suppose rental might be smarter, but it's nice to have it handy to use any time as you said.

[andrew whicker]

Dude! Craigslist in your area searching for "box truck":

https://syracuse.craigslist.org/cto/d/syracuse-1999-chevy-3500-box-truck/7541232889.html

Get this instead!

Or this

https://albany.craigslist.org/cto/d/schenectady-2001-ford-f550-box-truck/7536047658.html

I have one of the essential car guy friends and I'm betting these transmissions are a junkyard replacement? I'd have to ask him.





-- Original response.. searching for dump trucks ---


https://hartford.craigslist.org/hvo/d/southington-1989-ford-9000/7541650491.html

Things like this exist.. especially for your "use it and then re-sell it" concept this may not be bad. Make sure it's below the CDL weight limit and you have yourself something way more capable than a bus.

Medium duty trucks are pretty good on capability vs dollar. Much better than light duty trucks. Obviously the bus is cheap for the reason that no one wants them, but I'd rather have a dump truck than a bus. The bus would be awesome if you were willing to put the time in to modify it (doesn't need to be pretty) to give yourself a big back door.

have you looked into old USPS box vans?

[andrew whicker]

Lol, I just realized how old this thread is.

haha. Why did it re-surface.

[Mel Fulks]

Just to come up for air !

[Jim Becker]

Lol, I just realized how old this thread is.

haha. Why did it re-surface.
Because the OP posted an update...7 October 2022

[Jim Koepke]

Lol, I just realized how old this thread is.

haha. Why did it re-surface.

Many much older threads have resurfaced as Zombie threads.

Especially those where someone asked how to or where to questions five or more years ago and someone reading through the site from the beginning and forgets what they are reading and has a great answer.

Then others start to chime in until someone posts how old the original post is or the person who originally asked no longer visits SMC.

jtk

[Bill Dufour]

have you looked into old USPS box vans?
UPS does not sell their home delivery trucks. they get crushed, even the electric ones. They may do the same with other trucks?
Bill D

[Jim Becker]

This is not a "zombie thread", folks...the OP updated it a few days ago.

[Zachary Hoyt]

Maybe I'm a zombie and just hadn't noticed till now. That could explain how tired I seem to be feeling these last few months....

[Jim Becker]

Even though it's the season for zombies, I don't believe you are one, Zachary! :)