Does Festool have package prices?

[Leigh Betsch]

I'm looking to upgrade my dust extraction but before I order a vacuum extractor I thought I'd see if anyone knows of any Festool "packages" that might help spread the sticker shock a bit.
I'm leaning toward a CT 36 with a boom package and the Festool cyclone as an integrated vacuum system but If I could find the extractor packaged with a router or sander and package price maybe I'd go that route.

Also, do the Festool extractors work well as general shop/floor vacuums?

[Jim Becker]

I could be wrong, but I do not believe that they do the packaging anymore...I "think" it was stopped some time ago, too.

The performance should generally be better than a standard shop vac, but I've chosen not to use my Festool extractor for general cleanup. I keep an inexpensive Ridgid vac for that kind of thing. In that way, I'm not filling up the Festool bags with general debris. Only sanding, sawing and "Dominoing" dust go into the bag and they last a much longer time. That's my personal preference. One other thing...keep in mind that the only real difference between the CT36 and the steps down from that is physical storage capacity for what gets sent to the bag. Therefore, you can consider a smaller unit at lower cost that gives the same extraction performance, leaving more money for the additions you want to put with it.

[Jeff Monson]

I bought quite a few tools from Bob Marino before he retired. As I recall I purchased a sander, router and ct36 vacuum and got a few dollars off when combined. I did a quick look on Beaver tools, they recommend putting a few tools together but when adding the prices, there is no savings. Its too bad they cant or dont offer some type of incentive when buying multiple tools, one would think it would be to Festools benefit to do so......I'd guess they dont care, they will get your money one way or the other.

[Leigh Betsch]

I think to get the overhead boom set up I need to go to at least a ct26. But I didn’t find that one in stock so I started to think of the 36.
I also have a Ridgid so that’s an option for floor work.

[Rob Sack]

Depending on your application, you might want to consider the Ridgid WD 7000 which is back in stock at Home Depot. It has 203 CFM vs. Festool's 130 CFM. It also runs about $325.00 vs Festool's much higher pricing. It comes complete with hose and accessories along with on board storage. I tried it to use on my Kapex and it has made the saw virtually dust free at a fraction of the price of any of the Festool Dust Extractors. And it comes with a lifetime warranty.

[Greg Quenneville]

Festool never discounts prices on the tools. Occasionally we see consumables marked down a little.

Two things: First- When I buy a Festool I try to combine it with something else that the dealer can offer discounts on. I have gotten DeWalt tools for half price when combined with an expensive Festool purchase.

Second, I have the Festool long life bag for my vacuum. I think it costs about the same as 20 of the regular paper bags, but I have emptied it 100+ times.
Before I had the reusable bag I would suck out the full paper bags with the shop dust extractor and get 5 or 6 cycles out of each bag.

Greg.

[Leigh Betsch]

The CT 36E and Festool cyclone is now in my shop waiting for dust to happen. My local (85 miles away) dealer didn’t have the boom arm so I’ll have to mail order that. And a few hose end accessories. I’d like to get a good floor sweep. We’ll, and a router and sander but I dunno about spending that much. I’ve been retired for a few years but I get called to consult quite often so I do get some mad money once in a while…..

[Alan Lightstone]

Depending on your application, you might want to consider the Ridgid WD 7000 which is back in stock at Home Depot. It has 203 CFM vs. Festool's 130 CFM. It also runs about $325.00 vs Festool's much higher pricing. It comes complete with hose and accessories along with on board storage. I tried it to use on my Kapex and it has made the saw virtually dust free at a fraction of the price of any of the Festool Dust Extractors. And it comes with a lifetime warranty.

Is that 203CFM real, or just manufacturer bluster? The largest Festool vac at almost 3 times the price doesn't move that much air. I'm wondering if anyone has actually tested it.

[Rob Sack]

Is that 203CFM real, or just manufacturer bluster? The largest Festool vac at almost 3 times the price doesn't move that much air. I'm wondering if anyone has actually tested it.

I can only quote the manufacturer's claims. The Ridgid comes with 1 7/8 in. diameter hose, the Festool uses a 35 or 36 mm hose. I tried the Festool Dust Extractor hooked up to a Kapex at the last AWFS Show this summer. When cutting from front to back very slowly, it was virtually dust free. As near as I can tell, the Ridgid works almost as well with the Kapex as did the Festool. Perhaps a narrower hose closer to 35 mm might help. However, considering the cost savings and the lifetime warranty, for me, the Ridgid was the wise choice.

By the way, if choosing one of the Festool Dust Extractors, make sure it comes with the optimal Festool hose for the Kapex. If I remember correctly, one or more of the models comes with a different hose. The extractor I looked at at AWFS did not have the optimal hose for the Kapex and I would have had to put together a package that included an optional hose. The package total with tax was over $900.00. Also, the replacement filters are quite expensive.

The Ridgid is a wet/dry vac that comes with a variety of nozzles and a hose, so it can be used for a variety of tasks, including shop cleanup.

As a side note, in the interest of transparency, I am not a fan of Festool's customer service. My Kapex came with a manufacturing defect that was easily remedied. Festool Customer Service put me through the ringer. This combined with the various Sawstop complaints regarding current Sawstop Customer Service, I am thinking twice about further Festool purchases since Festool now owns Sawstop. I have been a Sawstop owner for about 10 years. While I did have a few issues when I first bought the saw, dealing with the original Sawstop Customer Service was a breeze and actually a pleasure. It appears that under the current ownership, the Customer Service has become more "corporate".

[Jim Becker]

I am thinking twice about further Festool purchases since Festool now owns Sawstop. I

Tooltechnic owns Festool, Sawstop, Shaper Origin, Tanos and a whole bunch of other companies. Festool does not own Sawstop...they are parallel entities with a common corporate owner. That said, you have to go with your gut around what's best for you and if you have concerns from your personal experience, it makes sense to make other choices.

[Rob Sack]

Tooltechnic owns Festool, Sawstop, Shaper Origin, Tanos and a whole bunch of other companies. Festool does not own Sawstop...they are parallel entities with a common corporate owner. That said, you have to go with your gut around what's best for you and if you have concerns from your personal experience, it makes sense to make other choices.

I stand corrected. However, since Sawstop joined the Festool, aka Tooltechnic "family", customer service does not seem to be the same.

[derek labian]

I'm looking to upgrade my dust extraction but before I order a vacuum extractor I thought I'd see if anyone knows of any Festool "packages" that might help spread the sticker shock a bit.
I'm leaning toward a CT 36 with a boom package and the Festool cyclone as an integrated vacuum system but If I could find the extractor packaged with a router or sander and package price maybe I'd go that route.

Also, do the Festool extractors work well as general shop/floor vacuums?

I know your not looking for an opinion but I thought I might offer one anyway based on my research. I have a CT36, and I looked at and read various reviews and comments on the CT Cyclone. I wanted to use the CT Cyclone to avoid the cost of replacing bags. I also looked at the Oneida addon. Generally speaking the Oneida had much better reviews due to the cyclone shape. I only considered the CT after that due to it's stickability. Someone told me the bags last far longer then you would expect, so I ended up being neither. The bags do last a very long time, I don't plan to add a cyclone.

What do you plan to use the CT36 with? If its mostly power tools, you might consider trying it out without the cyclone and see how it goes. You can always spend the $300 at any time and add on.

[Leigh Betsch]

Thanks Derik. I bought ct36 and the ct cyclone. I like the idea that it’s all integrated from the factory. It’s really the reason I went with Festool. I just want stuff that works and works together. I’m not saying there aren’t better and less expensive options but I like the idea that I don’t have to work at the stuff working together.

[Dave Sabo]

I can only quote the manufacturer's claims. The Ridgid comes with 1 7/8 in. diameter hose, the Festool uses a 35 or 36 mm hose. I tried the Festool Dust Extractor hooked up to a Kapex at the last AWFS Show this summer. When cutting from front to back very slowly, it was virtually dust free. As near as I can tell, the Ridgid works almost as well with the Kapex as did the Festool. Perhaps a narrower hose closer to 35 mm might help. However, considering the cost savings and the lifetime warranty, for me, the Ridgid was the wise choice.

By the way, if choosing one of the Festool Dust Extractors, make sure it comes with the optimal Festool hose for the Kapex.


So, does that mean my craftsman saw really has 6 horsepower ??? That' what they're claiming. Someone could quote it - does that make it so ?

Narrower hoses are not the way to go on the Kapex or any other tool that needs lots of volume. In fact - in bone stock config. the ridgid would be much better at collection on a Kapex. None of the festool vacs come setup for the Kapex. You have to purchase the optimal hose separately.

However , I think we're talking about using a vac for hand tools like routers, sanders, ect....
And when it comes to usability with those , the ridgid starts to lose its advantage. First, there is no tool activated switching. Second, there is no variable speed, which is useful (arguably necessary) for sanding. Third, that short, large dia. hose that is an advantage on a kapex is a liability when using with a sander or small router. Fourth, the ridgid is much louder.

While the festool filter (all festool consumables) are very spendy - the disposable bags are pretty mcuh the same price. You will have to go through hundreds of bags before the filter needs changing. Re: Festool service. It's the best in the industry. Sure they have problems like everyone else and their practices often don't make sense to non Teutonics or the frugal minded. And it's practically inexcusable that the market's most expensive miter saw has problems out of the box - let alone had a defective motor which the company denied for the longest time. but that's for another time and place. What they do have - and you should have availed yourself to immediatly with a defective kapex is a 30 day no questions asked return. A few others have this now too, but they don't have a three year parts and labor warranty. Sawstop while owned by festool's parent's holding co. is still run out of Oregon and I can assure you they still have very good customer service on the whole. We were recently sent an entirely new starting switchbox gratis after 40 min. of trouble shooting with an engineer over a no start issue. Turned out the real issue was a wonky breaker in the main service panel.

n.b. We were not the orig. purchaser of the saw.

[Rob Sack]

So, does that mean my craftsman saw really has 6 horsepower ??? That' what they're claiming. Someone could quote it - does that make it so ?

Narrower hoses are not the way to go on the Kapex or any other tool that needs lots of volume. In fact - in bone stock config. the ridgid would be much better at collection on a Kapex. None of the festool vacs come setup for the Kapex. You have to purchase the optimal hose separately.

However , I think we're talking about using a vac for hand tools like routers, sanders, ect....
And when it comes to usability with those , the ridgid starts to lose its advantage. First, there is no tool activated switching. Second, there is no variable speed, which is useful (arguably necessary) for sanding. Third, that short, large dia. hose that is an advantage on a kapex is a liability when using with a sander or small router. Fourth, the ridgid is much louder.

While the festool filter (all festool consumables) are very spendy - the disposable bags are pretty mcuh the same price. You will have to go through hundreds of bags before the filter needs changing. Re: Festool service. It's the best in the industry. Sure they have problems like everyone else and their practices often don't make sense to non Teutonics or the frugal minded. And it's practically inexcusable that the market's most expensive miter saw has problems out of the box - let alone had a defective motor which the company denied for the longest time. but that's for another time and place. What they do have - and you should have availed yourself to immediatly with a defective kapex is a 30 day no questions asked return. A few others have this now too, but they don't have a three year parts and labor warranty. Sawstop while owned by festool's parent's holding co. is still run out of Oregon and I can assure you they still have very good customer service on the whole. We were recently sent an entirely new starting switchbox gratis after 40 min. of trouble shooting with an engineer over a no start issue. Turned out the real issue was a wonky breaker in the main service panel.

n.b. We were not the orig. purchaser of the saw.

Look, the Ridgid probably doesn't actually produce the 203 claimed cfm, your craftsman saw doesn't have 6 horsepower, and the Festool Dust Extractors may or may not actually produce the claimed 130 cfm. But I am assuming the Ridgid's 203 claimed cfm is going to be at least somewhat higher than Festool's claimed 130 cfm.

As far as Festool hoses are concerned, they recommend the 35 or 36 mm hose for the Kapex (I can't remember which it was), which some of their Extractors come with, and some don't. If you don't agree with this, take it up with Festool. All I can tell you is that the narrow hose with the Extractor connected to the Kapex was what Festool recommended and the combination produced virtually dust free cuts when I operated the saw at AWFS this past summer. And the Dust Extractor they recommended to me for my Kapex did not come with the recommended hose, which I then would have had to purchase separately.

As far as the warranty issue with my Kapex, I didn't say anything about the motor. My issue involved one of the sliding fence extensions being twisted. I didn't feel this warranted returning an otherwise perfectly acceptable saw. All I wanted was the fence extension replaced, which was ultimately accomplished after considerable effort, jumping through multiple hoops, and general aggravation over a period of way too much time.

Does the Ridgid have variable speed control? No. Does it have auto start? No, but a relatively inexpensive plug and play device can be purchased to make it auto start, which I will be purchasing. And by the way, it is not "much louder".

Does the Ridgid do everything the Festools do? No. But the Ridgid does do some things the Festools don't. But based on what I have observed and experienced, the Ridgid is almost as efficient in dust collection as the Festools at a greatly reduced cost and is a bit more versatile.

I am not suggesting anybody stop buying Festool Dust Extractors and start buying this particular model of Ridgid. Frankly I try to avoid at all costs doing any business with Home Depot, the only source for Ridgid vacs. Festool produces extremely high quality products. I only suggested this as an alternative.

If you don't mind spending up to three times the cost, have no problem with the replacement bags being considerably more expensive, and are fine with a three year vs. lifetime warranty, by all means buy Festool. For me, I think I made the right decision.

[Leigh Betsch]

Thanks for the help here Creeks. I got my answer and made my decision so what’s say we just kill this conversation before it turns into another manufacturer bashing.

[Dave Sabo]

have no problem with the replacement bags being considerably more expensive

really ?

Looks to me like the bags for that vac cost 10bucks each at the Depot. Same price as comparable sized Festool bags.



are fine with a three year vs. lifetime warranty

Have you tried to avail yourself of a warranty with ridgid vac ? Good luck. The FT is unconditional for 3 yrs - not defects. You’re gonna hit a wall of “normal wear and tear “ when you try and claim in five years on the Ridgid.

Ridgid are great vacs for the prices charged. They just aren’t in a league with premium vacs like festool , nilfisk, hilti, ect…. But not everyone needs/wants/can afford that level. Which is totally fine. There’s a product for everyone out there.

[Tim Ulmen]

Depending on your application, you might want to consider the Ridgid WD 7000 which is back in stock at Home Depot. It has 203 CFM vs. Festool's 130 CFM. It also runs about $325.00 vs Festool's much higher pricing. It comes complete with hose and accessories along with on board storage. I tried it to use on my Kapex and it has made the saw virtually dust free at a fraction of the price of any of the Festool Dust Extractors. And it comes with a lifetime warranty.

The festool pulls 96” of water column (Aka how hard it sucks).

The rigid doesn’t list this but typically cfm comes at a cost to static pressure.

For me static pressure (pull) is way more important because I’m using this kind of vac for sanders and routers…aka catching dust and chips.

For cleaning up the shop floor cfm is great (and I use an old Ridgid for that).

Just food for though.

[Paul Koenigs]

I'm looking to upgrade my dust extraction but before I order a vacuum extractor I thought I'd see if anyone knows of any Festool "packages" that might help spread the sticker shock a bit.
I'm leaning toward a CT 36 with a boom package and the Festool cyclone as an integrated vacuum system but If I could find the extractor packaged with a router or sander and package price maybe I'd go that route.

Also, do the Festool extractors work well as general shop/floor vacuums?

They used to have "deals".. where if you bought a domino and vac together, you'd get something like $50 off. I'm almost positive I got 50 off when I got mine.
Maybe they did it with the track saw and vac too.
It was nice, but it's not as if it was a huge savings.
This was probably well over 10 years ago.

I would buy a regular shop vac for regular shop vac use. Sure, you could use the festool vac, but one of the nicest thing about the festool vac is that it has these bags to catch the dust and help keep the air cleaner.
Those bags are pretty expensvie.. IF you just use the vac on your domino, saw, and tools, the bags last a long time.
If you vac up your shop with the festool vac, you probably could easily fill up an entire bag .
Note, I remember a festool guy saying you can run the vac without the bag if you don't want to pay for bags, but that kind of defeats the entire purpose of keeping your lungs safe , and I am guessing if you ran the vac without
a bag, the lifetime of the air filter would be severely compromised.

I have a Rigid shop vac that I use for general cleanup. They used to go on sale every father's day.. not sure if that is still the case or not.. but in any event not very expensive.
Using your festool vac for everything will cost you more money in the longterm.

[Greg Quenneville]

Seriously, look into the longlife resealable bags available for your Festool vacuums. There are even aftermarket versions on Amazon. Both replace about 300 of the normal bags. I have one in my CT22 and think the bag might outlast the vacuum (which is 21 years old). My vac supports all of my tools and does shop and car clean up.

Greg

[Justin Rapp]

you guys realize you are responding to a post that is almost a year old?

[Michael Burnside]

I found the post before yours useful so IMHO the thread resurrection was useful.

[Dave Sabo]

They used to have "deals"
they used to be cheaper too - the days for both have long since passed.



festool vac is that it has these bags to catch the dust and help keep the air cleaner.
Those bags are pretty expensvie..

vac bags have exsisted long before fetool came to these shores. With regard to cost, festool's are very close in price to a similar sized bag as the ones you'd buy at the depot of lowes for a reg. ol' shop vac. SOmetimes cheaper.


I remember a festool guy saying you can run the vac without the bag

You can run it without a bag but as you say, you $100+ filter(s) are at risk. DOn't buy a car you cannot afford to put gas in.



Seriously, look into the longlife resealable bags available for your Festool vacuums.

This is generally not great advice. That bag is designed for chips / large shavings not fine dust generated by sanding , ect..... Performance is affected when those bags are packed and caked with fine dust.

[Greg Quenneville]

Dave…I have emptied my resealable bag more than 100 times. I might tap it against the side of the trash bin occasionally, but I haven’t experienced the loss of suction problem. My vac sees as much fine sanding dust as saw dust.

Greg

[Dave Sabo]

Dave…I have emptied my resealable bag more than 100 times. I might tap it against the side of the trash bin occasionally, but I haven’t experienced the loss of suction problem. My vac sees as much fine sanding dust as saw dust.
Greg


How do you know ? Did you measure the values when the bag was new and compared them with now ? I can say with certainty your cfm is less than when the bag was new.

Of couse it works, so does using my screwdriver as prybar and running the wrong oil in my engines. But like the bag, that's not what the orig. design mandate was. Folks make decesions everyday about whether to follow directions or not. Bottom line is , FT did not intend for the LLB to be used for fine dust applications. And one can find all kinds of discussions on the merits/drawbacks of the LLB vs. reg. bags round here and other forums. I'm firmly in the camp using disposable bags. If you're really into the economy aspect (and have the volume / don't need portability) a cyclone in a better choice for fines and chips. Don't you also find it ironic that you capture a bagfull of dust only to re-distribute some of it into the air when you empty the bag and bang it it out ?

People are free to pay their coin and use their tools anyway they see fit.