Sander spindle well and truly stuck

[roger wiegand]

Seeking advice on getting a stuck sander spindle out. It is well and truly stuck.

My son, after 30 years of disinterest in the shop, has become captivated by building electric guitars. I'm delighted to have him in the shop, though am learning that I've grown even more curmudgeonly about sharing my space. Anyway, I didn't show him, and he didn't ask, about changing sanding spindles in my State T5 spindle sander.

It seems he tightened the drawbar in the spindle with a wrench, to the point where the collar that enables the releasing mechanism at the bottom sheared off when he tried to remove the spindle. So it now has a severely stuck morse taper.

We have tried every form of tapping, twisting, and pulling I can imagine. I got a set of wedges intended for removing Jacobs chucks from drill presses and couldn't budge it. Hit the end of the wedge hard enough to break it at the end. None of my usual tricks for un-sticking a morse taper are helping me here. Haven't figured out how to best apply heat/cold to the parts I can reach; I'm nervous about applying a torch to the spindle. Your thoughts are welcome.

Here's the stuck spindle in situ:

471125

This is what the end of the spindle is supposed to look like, with a collar pinned on ant the bottom that enables an auto-eject operation

471126

The drawbar from the stuck spindle. The roll pin that held the collar has been sheared off.

471127

[Kevin Jenness]

Can you put the quill with spindle in the freezer, then heat the outside of the quill?

[roger wiegand]

I don't know how hard it is to disassemble this thing, I guess I can start trying to take it apart.

[Steve Demuth]

Can you find a machine shop in your area that uses liquid nitrogen for shrinking interference fit item? Seems like it would be possible to spoon the liquid into the spindle hole and super cool the taper, which might well permit it to release.

[Ronald Blue]

Do you have reasonably unimpeded access to the bottom of the spindle? If I am seeing things clearly the nut on the bottom draws the spindle into the taper. If you have clear access put the nut on until the end is just shy of flush and strike with a preferably brass hammer. (Less chance of damaging the nut). The beauty of any locking taper is if they move they come loose. That looks like a small taper maybe a #1. Correct me if I am wrong. Maybe show some photo's if feasible of the bottom end and the obstacles there. Maybe someone else here has experienced this specific issue. Good luck.

[Bill Dufour]

I think you have to remove the spindle and tap it out with a punch from the bottom.
Bill D

[Mark Bolton]

Can you find a machine shop in your area that uses liquid nitrogen for shrinking interference fit item? Seems like it would be possible to spoon the liquid into the spindle hole and super cool the taper, which might well permit it to release.

Or take a piece of PVC pipe, glue an end cap on one end, bore a hole in the endcap the size of the flange or spindle shaft, slide it over the spindle, and fill the pvc pipe with crushed dry ice. Freeze the shaft and hopefully a few sharp pecks on the bottom with some vertical lift and it pops out.

[Richard Coers]

We had a Jet spindle sander at work that froze like that. In a business it was easier to buy a new sander and get back to work than invest more hours trying to remove it. We gave the sander to a part time guy and he ended up selling it for scrap. The spindle would not come out!

[Bill Dufour]

My little mill/drill uses mt3 spindle drive. I have to use a 3lb sledge and some force to knock it loose. I let it drop 6-10 inches with gravity which is often not enough force.This is with a almost perfect down ward lineup. No up side down in a cramped cabinet.
Bill D

[Kris Cook]

Not sure I completely understand the issue but a slide hammer comes to mind.

[roger wiegand]

Not sure I completely understand the issue but a slide hammer comes to mind.

I like that! I have to see what I can find that has some mass and a hole in the middle.

I'm not looking forward to trying to disassemble this thing. Clearly if the spindle is hollow then knocking it out from the back side is a good idea. It would also make it easier to do the various temperature manipulations.

[Bill Dufour]

Any weight lifters around. A single unmatched weight plate can be had for cheap. Or brake rotors.
Bill D

[John K Jordan]

I like that! I have to see what I can find that has some mass and a hole in the middle. ...

I also am not sure I completely understand the situation, but if you think a slide hammer might work (I assume you mean by applying upwards force against a nut threaded on the top of the shaft) then it might be easier to devise a puller instead. Perhaps a thick block of wood (or stack of boards) with a through hole, tighten the nut to press against a large, strong washer to create a steady pulling force? Or press against a piece of pipe slipped over the shaft, if there's anything sturdy enough at the bottom to press against?

Also, where I couldn't use heat on the outside part I have used the dry ice method on the inside part, when I could find it at the grocery store.

A large tapered shaft (maybe 2" diameter) on my old skid steer was so stuck that I couldn't get it to budge even with repeated blows with all the muscle I could put into a large sledge hammer. I eventually got it loose by rigging a puller. There were no threads to tighten a nut against but I used a hydraulic chain puller with my 10 ton PortaPower, smacking the other end with the sledge while pulling. I had imagined it was stuck from corrosion or something but when I got it off the mating surfaces were smooth and clean.

[Derek Arita]

Heat. I've used a butane torch to loosen many stuck, friction fit parts. Let us know what happens.

[roger wiegand]

Got it! The slide hammer idea worked. Nearly cracked myself in the forehead when it came out (Duh!) but missed, and now all is well. Note to self, wear hard hat and face shield when propelling semi-pointy metal object towards my face.

[Wes Grass]

Nice. I was gonna add if it's got ball bearings in it, may as well take it apart if you're going to hammer on it. Good chance they'll need replacing anyway. But might last another lifetime anyway.

I'm curious, are the 'spindles' (arbor in my mind, I'm a metal guy) a straight shaft with a separate taper piece retained by the collars?

[John K Jordan]

Fantastic!

[Bill Dufour]

This is why they make hydraulic cylinders with a hole through the piston rod. If you do not have dry ice handy a CO2 fire extinguisher can be handy to have.
Bill D.

[Wes Grass]

This is why they make hydraulic cylinders with a hole through the piston rod. If you do not have dry ice handy a CO2 fire extinguisher can be handy to have.
Bill D.


Knew a guy who made custom hydraulic systems to punch holes for switches for telecom systems. They were double acting, one piston opposed by another so there'd be no shock as the metal sheared to trip the switches that were in use as they added more. Sharp guy, former toolmaker at Peenemunde ... not that I have anything remotely resembling fond memories of him ...

[Richard Coers]

I'm really happy you got that spindle out. Maybe my memory is off, but I thought on the floor model we had at work, that the spindle was held in with threads below the taper and there was no way to get the spindle out without it being turned. Could it be you had a bench top and the floor model design is different? No way a slide hammer would work on our machine.

[roger wiegand]

Yes, your memory is correct, normally the spindle is held in by a threaded drawbar, when you unscrew it it will eject the spindle. My son wrenched on the drawbar while installing it getting it stuck, and then broke off the collar that the bottom of the taper rests on when trying to get it out by unscrewing it, so the threaded drawbar was unscrewed from the nut in the bottom and completely pulled out, leaving the hollow MT spindle behind.

You can see both the intact and broken drawbars in my first post.