Shortening Sliding Tablesaw Carriage

[Drew Zembruski]

Hi all,

Does anyone have experience cutting down the sliding carriage length on a sliding table saw? I will be going from a rented shop space with plenty of room to a home shop in a converted 2 car garage that won't fit my existing slider (22' of travel total for a 10.5' carriage... I'll have 21' in my new shop wall to wall).

The cabinetmaker I rent shop space from has a rare (possibly even unique) Martin sliding table saw with a 92" carriage that he thinks was likely an aftermarket adjustment (as well as a few other oddities). He knows my saw well ('87 Martin T71) and mentioned my carriage is an extrusion and thus could be cut down, if I can find a way to deal with the stops on both ends of travel.

I will admit I am not overly mechanically inclined; I like to keep my tools in good shape so I don't have to deal with fixing them, as it is not at all my forte. However I would explore this option if it seems feasible with enough thought and work. I love my slider and would love to keep it forever.

Has anyone ever done something like this successfully?

Thanks for any and all advice (including sound-minded discouragement),
Drew

[Malcolm McLeod]

What if you simply moved the stop(s); limit the travel to space available..??

I'll be following along, as I have similar space/HP/mental constraints as I search for a slider.

[Drew Zembruski]

The problem is I need to get the backside of the carriage past the blade to change blades, and then on the load side of things I need to get the crosscut fence behind the blade to load material for cutting... if there was a way to change blades without being all the way forward, setting my own stops would work really well! On newer models of the saw I've seen, you change the blade with the table all the way back. If only...

[Kevin Jenness]

I'd build a bumpout on the garage before I hacked that Martin. How about positioning the saw diagonally in the space? If that doesn't work, how about setting it up so you can push the carriage all the way forward through the overhead door to change the blade? That should still allow for cutting a 4 x 8 with the door closed.

I operated a 1984 version of that saw for several years. Really excellent machine. For my money the only real improvements since then compared to a T60C are the left-side rip fence adjustment, fine adjustment on the crosscut stops and dro's. I wouldn't trade the hydraulic blade positioning for the electronic version.

I can't believe the same question came up twice in a month https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?294445-Anyone-cut-a-Felder-slider-down

[Phillip Mitchell]

Can you make a small hole in the wall (like a cat door) for the all the way forward / backward position to change blades or position the carriage so that one extreme end of the stroke is going out a doorway, whether overhead or whatever. I would explore all possible layout and shop modification scenarios before cutting down a Martin T71...

[Drew Zembruski]

Diagonally it pretty much becomes the entire shop, unfortunately... though that might be preferable. I don't have the zoning requirements to bump out at all also unfortunately. Though I can position it so one of my carriage doors swings out when I need to change the blade, potentially, as that'll be less frequent than being in the all-the-way-back position to load and cut.

Thanks for linking to this other thread, I searched a few combinations and didn't find anything to refer back to.

[Drew Zembruski]

I'm going to think more seriously about positioning so it just takes opening the carriage doors to change the blade... I can't make the shop any bigger due to zoning and setbacks unfortunately. I'd love to not cut it down, I'll see how creative I can get to make the saw work in the new space. Though moving the saw 300 miles may end up making it a necessary sale anyway... though I'm reading all the threads about moving sliders obsessively trying to find a good solution for my situation.

[Kevin Jenness]

Don't worry about moving it. I moved the saw I mentioned from CT to VT on a flatbed trailer with a forklift on either end. Just make sure the slider is shimmed up and strapped down.

It doesn't seem as though a cat door like Philip suggested (or a window) would trigger a zoning issue. Another option is to mount the extension table farther back on the carriage so you don't have to retract it all the way to load the saw (although you might not be able to lock the table there).

If you can find an equivalent saw with a 2.5m or 3m table that would be a good solution. I would hate to trade down in quality though. Have you checked with Ed Papa at Simantech?

[Drew Zembruski]

Small world - I'll be going from CT to Maine... I was considering a drop deck utility trailer. I'd love not to have to open a window, cat flap, or door in the winter up there...

My shopmate suggested I get in touch with Ed as well. I'll be reaching out to him. I'd hate to trade down in quality, but would probably prefer a downgrade in the saw and not eating up 50% of my shop for the saw, since I couldn't have much going on fore or aft of the saw. I'm transitioning from full cabinetmaking back to some combination of carpentry/restoration and cabinetmaking, so I won't be running the saw as constantly as I have been the last few years. I may not need the tank that is my Martin.

[Jim Becker]

This question was actually asked recently and in general, the comments were "not a great idea".

[Albert Lee]

my panel saw's carriage is 150 inches and total travel is 300+ inches. problem is my shop is only 240 inches long, and I never used the front half of the panel saw.

I have always contemplated utilising the long carriage such as router table sled or similar.

In the end I decided to let go of my long slider and downsize to a smaller panel saw due to the size of my shop.

[Drew Zembruski]

Thanks very much all for the sound advice. It looks like I’ll be exploring selling off the Martin and either adding a smaller slider or other methods of handling sheet goods. I could add a cat flap or open my carriage doors for blade changes but I think for my situation (and in my climate) I’d rather minimize envelope penetrations. I’m doing a fair bit of work to winterize the garage for efficient heating and cooling and year round comfort. Someone else will get better use out of the saw than I will in a 21x21 garage.

I make far more plywood carcass cabinets (kitchens, built ins, vanities) than furniture so even in my new small space I’d like to be optimized for cabinets, if malleable enough for the 3-4 pieces of furniture I make a year.

My old SawStop PCS has been my dedicated dado saw since I added the slider, so time to comb through the archives to read others’ thoughts on the SawStop after market sliding attachments. I see there are 2 and will look into which would serve me better.

Thanks again all.

[Jim Becker]

Drew, I recently let go my larger slider because I didn't have the space for it here at our new property, at least in the temporary shop in the "garage". I miss it dearly, although I'm "making do" with a SS PCS I was able to purchase for a very attractive price from a friend. I will tell you that adding an aftermarket sliding table (SS or otherwise), while convenient for handling large panels through a cut can be helpful, they do not and will not replace a true sliding table saw due to their physical nature of being far removed from the blade and the necessary work to keep them true. I've reverted to sleds for crosscutting but really, really, really miss the ability to straight line rip on the wagon, etc. When I have a building, I'll be back to a true slider for sure. It will likely be a short stroke which more than fits my needs, but it will be a slider.

So "my opinion" which isn't necessarily important would be to consider selling the large saw and acquire a more compact version that will fit comfortably in your new space. Use the SS PCS for the interim if there's a need due to availability of what you want...it's a great tool. It's just different.

[Drew Zembruski]

This is really great perspective to read, thanks Jim. I suspect I’d feel similarly. I have a few months of overlap with the old shop while I set up the new shop (insulated floor and walls, new power, etc) so I can hold on to my Martin in the short term and start looking for a slider that fits my needs.

[Bobby Robbinett]

If you were closer to Arkansas I would either buy your Martin or trade you a Grizzly compact slider that I recently picked up. I got the Grizzly on a trade and have not bothered to set it up because I use my Griggio slider for sheet goods and it has a 126” of travel both forward and backwards in addition to 126” of cross cut capacity. Don’t know much about the Grizzly compact sliders though.

I would consider the 10” or 12” Grizzly compact series to replace your Martin if a short stroke Felder or MiniMax isn’t in your budget. I think you can get a brand new Grizz with 60” (?) of cross cut capacity for under $3,500. It likely won’t be as nice as your Martin but properly setup when tuned it will do anything a similar more expensive saw will do.

[Jim Becker]

Both Felder and SCM have ~8''' sliding saws available. The latter requires about 19' for full wagon travel and I would imagine the former is similar in specifications. That makes them still usable for ripping most sheet stock...it's a little more cumbersome than with a ten footer, but certainly workable when space requires it.

[Tom Bender]

Ok an easy question for those with experience. Why is a slider so much better than an ordinary TS plus a track saw?

[Mike King]

Ok an easy question for those with experience. Why is a slider so much better than an ordinary TS plus a track saw?

Accuracy and safety.

[Kevin Jenness]

Accurate straightline and square crosscuts on one machine. More power/ heavier arbor/less deflection/less bogging on heavy cuts than a tracksaw. Adaptability to jigs. Safer cutting of small parts.

A tracksaw certainly has benefits, especially for really large and heavy pieces that are impractical to load on a slider or larger than its capacity. A slider is a versatile tool for panel processing but it is also very useful for furnituremaking and small work if set up properly. With room for only one dimension saw I would never go back to a cabinet saw.That would not be true for everyone.

[Jim Becker]

Ok an easy question for those with experience. Why is a slider so much better than an ordinary TS plus a track saw?

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but "in general" and succinctly, what Mr. King said. There's been a lot of discussion about this over time and those of us who have owned sliders...the highest percentage...would never go back to a cabinet saw given the choice. (I'm "stuck" with a cabinet saw right now in my temporary shop due to space concerns and I truly hate standing behind that blade as is necessary, rather than off to the side with my hands nowhere near the blade) A lot of things are subjective, of course, and there is also human nature...embracing a slider means learning to work differently. That and the tendency for the cost of a true slide to be above even the fanciest cabinet saw available are unfortunate barriers to many woodworkers.

Track saw does provide accuracy, however, as well as the ability to cut larger panels more easily than slinging them onto a cabinet saw. And honestly, there were times when I pulled the track saw out, despite having the slider, simply because I didn't have help to lift a very heavy sheet of something onto the big saw. So I don't feel they compete...they are complimentary, regardless of table saw format.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Ok an easy question for those with experience. Why is a slider so much better than an ordinary TS plus a track saw?

Tom it's about being able to repeatably make cuts, quickly, and have complete control of the stock while you do. I make mitered newel posts often. I can take one stock board, one saw setup, and end up with a four part, glu up ready, mitered post in seconds of cutting and setup. It can be done with a traditional saw, but you are making a jig to keep the long newells under control and you will still probably have something move and need to visit the jointer and re-rip everything to a smaller width. You will be spending most of the day doing it with a track saw, if you can find one with the cutting depth to pull it off.