Lee Valley/Veritas tools

[Bob Jones 5443]

Rob Lee is coming clean again about the supply nightmares he's still facing (email today). We all owe it to him to keep him with a steady stream of orders, even though we probably won't receive them for months. We don't want his business to wither away! Weigh in if you agree.

[Jim Koepke]

My latest order arrived a couple days ago.

It wasn't a big order but it filled a hole in my selection of forestner bits and brad point bits. Plus a lifetime supply (hopefully) of the inexpensive brushes that are great on the bench for cleaning shavings from planes and applying finish. They are often considered throw away brushes but mine often get cleaned.

466449

https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/supplies/finishing/brushes/20045-disposable-natural-bristle-brushes?item=56Z9930

At less than 80¢ each these are not only less expensive than the ones often seen in the big box stores the handles have a better feel than the roughness of the others.

Oops! I was looking at the Canadian site. The brushes work out to 60¢ each, that is about half the price for the small ones (1/2") that Lowes & HD used to charge but no longer carry.

Fill the holes in your drill bit selections and toss a bag of brushes on top of your order.

jtk

[Frederick Skelly]

Thanks for the heads up - that email went to my spam folder for some reason and I missed it.

I think it's accurate to say that buying things that are in stock now will help a company I value stay afloat. Bear in mind that placing orders that we wont receive for months isnt going to help LV's cash flow though - they are a reputable company and dont charge my card until they ship.

I will go see what's in stock and try to help a little.

Fred

[Mark Rainey]

I agree! I am going to avoid Amazon for a while. I will place an order with Lee Valley. They are a fine business and deserve our support!

[William Fretwell]

Reached the same conclusion a couple of weeks ago and ordered a few measuring instruments and small Japanese tools that are far better than the ones I have now at less than half the price. They will all be very hard to get for some time and then more expensive. Look at any gaps in your tool chest now.

[Scott Winners]

I am finally trying the Lie-Nielsen scissors. I am a closet scissor fiend, I bet they are pretty good. Placed an everything in stock order at Lee Valley too, finally trying the wee little 1.5 inch speed square among other things.

One product I highly highly reccomend from Lee Valley is the tweezers, the "Sliver Gripper Tweezers." They are $9.50 each, in stock, and they absolutely kick butt. I ordered 8-10 pair a few years ago for stocking stuffers, I keep one pair in my shop, one pair in my truck and one pair in my field pack.

[Anuj Prateek]

Rob Lee is coming clean again about the supply nightmares he's still facing (email today). We all owe it to him to keep him with a steady stream of orders, even though we probably won't receive them for months. We don't want his business to wither away! Weigh in if you agree.

LV store is few minutes from my home. I am at the store almost every weekend. Store is open till 6:00PM otherwise I would be there weekdays as well.

Here, LV is probably the best store in terms of customer service and kind of curated product selection. KMS Tools is the only other tools store I love visiting. Add to that LV has one of the most generous return policy.

One thing I highly appreciate about LV is that during this tough time, I have not noticed any reduction in number of employees. And, interacting with them, one can tell that they are happy and love what they are doing.

Most of the items I need are in stock there so did not get effected by the stock problem. I was actually surprised that they had Sawstop in stock, ready to deliver.

I digressed.

I agree, orders should keep flowing. Will add that buy what's in stock.

[Tom M King]

I doubt they're to the point that we need to start a GoFundMe page yet, but any excuse to buy tools is a good one.

[Mark Rainey]

I doubt they're to the point that we need to start a GoFundMe page yet, but any excuse to buy tools is a good one.

Good point Tom. I do not have calipers and am looking at Lee Valley. As a Neanderthal I feel like I should start with the basic vernier caliper, but the digital ( blind man ) caliper looks convenient. My vision is still pretty good, but at 63 I am not getting any younger. Is the digital significantly easier that I should forego the vernier?

[Tyler Bancroft]

If you're anything like me, the Veritas manufacturing seconds sale in October is your main tool-buying event of the year...

[Stephen Rosenthal]

Is the digital significantly easier that I should forego the vernier?

I’m 72. Had and used a dial caliper for years, then I picked up a Mitutoyo digital caliper at an estate sale filled with machinist’s tools. The dial caliper was sold on Craigslist within a week.

[Mark Rainey]

I’m 72. Had and used a dial caliper for years, then I picked up a Mitutoyo digital caliper at an estate sale filled with machinist’s tools. The dial caliper was sold on Craigslist within a week.

Good enough for me Stephen, digital it is.

[David Bassett]

... Is the digital significantly easier that I should forego the vernier?

Yes! But... check on the type of battery and the shutoff mode of whatever you get. I'm not a big user and it's really frustrating to find your calipers dead every time you dig them out for use. And it's infuriating to find they use some obscure, hard to find, and expensive battery.

For most word working tasks I find the simple non-battery non-vernier calipers have enough accuracy for my needs. (Wood will move, make the parts match and don't worry about the last 0.001" :) )

[Ron Selzer]

I’m 72. Had and used a dial caliper for years, then I picked up a Mitutoyo digital caliper at an estate sale filled with machinist’s tools. The dial caliper was sold on Craigslist within a week.


67 and went the other way. bought a dial caliber and the digital doesn't get used. too damn hard to figure out what size it is when it reads out in 128ths of an inch. much easier to see that it is 5/8's close enough majority of the time
Now have multiple dial calibers at home and one at work
Ron

[Jim Koepke]

My dial caliper is my friend. At 71 years the dial is still easy to read. One of my fears is of spending money on a digital caliper since so many of my electronical things have died over the years. It would be an inconvenience to get it out to find the battery is dead since the nearest place to by batteries is about an hour and a couple gallons of fuel round trip.

My Lufkin caliper reads in 32nds one scale and 64ths on another. The 64ths scale is often hard to see without a magnifier. The 32nds is easy and can usually extrapolate 64ths +/- by were the line falls between the 32nds markings.

It doesn't take much brain work to figure if and what numbered drill size is needed or if the fractional box of bits needs to be used.

jtk

[Curt Putnam]

I Agree! Just to lend unnecessary credence to Rob's email, my son ruefully asserts that he has no shortage of customers willing to pay $10K for a generators, he just cannot get the parts with which to make them.

[Luke Dupont]

I actually went recently looking to buy their O1 chisels only to find them out of stock, along with just about everything else...

Had no idea of the cause until I saw this thread.

I do not know if buying things that are out of stock will help, but purchasing in stock items may be a good way to show support.

[Tyler Bancroft]

I actually went recently looking to buy their O1 chisels only to find them out of stock, along with just about everything else...

Had no idea of the cause until I saw this thread.

I do not know if buying things that are out of stock will help, but purchasing in stock items may be a good way to show support.

I could be wrong, but didn't they discontinue the O1 chisels?

[Jim Koepke]

I could be wrong, but didn't they discontinue the O1 chisels?

The Lee Valley branded chisels are still made of "high carbon steel." They come with plastic handles, some folks are fine with plastic, some folks prefer wood.

jtk

[Bruce Mack]

My latest order arrived a couple days ago.

It wasn't a big order but it filled a hole in my selection of forestner bits and brad point bits. Plus a lifetime supply (hopefully) of the inexpensive brushes that are great on the bench for cleaning shavings from planes and applying finish. They are often considered throw away brushes but mine often get cleaned.

466449

https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/supplies/finishing/brushes/20045-disposable-natural-bristle-brushes?item=56Z9930

At less than 80¢ each these are not only less expensive than the ones often seen in the big box stores the handles have a better feel than the roughness of the others.

Oops! I was looking at the Canadian site. The brushes work out to 60¢ each, that is about half the price for the small ones (1/2") that Lowes & HD used to charge but no longer carry.

Fill the holes in your drill bit selections and toss a bag of brushes on top of your order.

jtk

Sorry Jim. You can dislike me for my reply, but animal bristle brushes from China are sourced cruelly. I'd rather use a vegan or a foam brush. Also, shame on you, Rob Lee.

https://www.peta.org/living/humane-home/animal-friendly-paintbrush-fur-free/?v2=1

[Jim Koepke]

animal bristle brushes from China are sourced cruelly

These brushes are not from China.

Though they may be sourced the same way. Thanks for bringing this to my attention.

At one time my diet was vegetarian. My, currently visiting, grandson is vegetarian and enjoys my meatless cooking and has been learning some of my recipes and cooking techniques.

Just this morning an early Christmas gift was purchased for my grandson, a Veritas 14ppi Dovetail Saw. Hopefully there is no animal issues with the saw other than the cruel way animals became extinct a million years ago to create the deposits now used to make plastics.

jtk

[Bruce Mack]

Thanks for your reply, Jim. I recently got a plastic-spined gents saw from Lee Valley. My wife introduced a vegetarian diet ~30 years ago because of her love for animals. Though I quickly joined her, it took me a while to emotionally accept a meatless diet. It's easier now with the range of frozen and non frozen dishes at stores. As a byproduct of my choice and an inability to tolerate oral iron supplements, I became iron-deficient and need occasional outpatient iron infusions. Fortunately, my doctor doesn't berate me for causing my own medical problem.

[Tyler Bancroft]

The Lee Valley branded chisels are still made of "high carbon steel." They come with plastic handles, some folks are fine with plastic, some folks prefer wood.

jtk


I assumed he meant the Veritas Bench Chisels, which were available in O1 up until recently. Those plastic-handled LV chisels are a good deal, though, if you can tolerate the handles – the steel is better than the similarly priced Narex, in my opinion. I'd happily pay what they cost to buy only the chisel blade so I can handle them without having to remove the plastic handle first.

[john zulu]

I saw the new prices..... Some of the planes are up to 100 from the time I bought it. Difficult times. LV has always been careful with their price increase until now........... It is bad. Supply chain and all. If you have bought a new PC you know what I mean.

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

Better make sure it isn't made from real dovetails!

while I think that bringing up animal cruelty issues in industry is a valid and important issue, I don't see how berating anyone is. That's a never ending rabbit hole...

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

I will say one thing about Lee Valley, I don't consider there customer support to be that great because what they do goes so far beyond good customer support that I can't even compare it.

They absolutely value their customers (not just their customers dollars).
It isn't a cheap store by any means, and shipping to Israel is so expensive I can't possible consider switching from Amazon for generic products. But between the customer service and the quality of the tools I am completely sold on the company. I hope to be able to let them wreak havoc on my bank account for many years.

[john zulu]

I will say one thing about Lee Valley, I don't consider there customer support to be that great because what they do goes so far beyond good customer support that I can't even compare it.

They absolutely value their customers (not just their customers dollars).
It isn't a cheap store by any means, and shipping to Israel is so expensive I can't possible consider switching from Amazon for generic products. But between the customer service and the quality of the tools I am completely sold on the company. I hope to be able to let them wreak havoc on my bank account for many years.

They did wreck havoc for many years and at times do.

[Erich Weidner]

Sorry Jim. You can dislike me for my reply, but animal bristle brushes from China are sourced cruelly. I'd rather use a vegan or a foam brush. Also, shame on you, Rob Lee.


As someone who has (very) strong opinions on various things I understand the urge to post things like this. But I would strongly suggest leaving this sort of activism out of these forums. Folks come here to enjoy and learn about our shared woodworking interest.

And the problem with posting things like this is that some people will dislike you for it. There is enough of this on social media, let's leave it off of The Creek.


Trashing Lee Valley for carrying animal products is not cool in my not so humble opinion.

[Rob Lee]

Sorry Jim. You can dislike me for my reply, but animal bristle brushes from China are sourced cruelly. I'd rather use a vegan or a foam brush. Also, shame on you, Rob Lee.

https://www.peta.org/living/humane-home/animal-friendly-paintbrush-fur-free/?v2=1


Bruce -

The brushes well sell use pig bristle - not boar bristle - there is a big difference. Our brushes are made in Indonesia (not China) - and the bristles may actually be sourced from India, though I am not certain - as the manufacturer may source from more than one supplier. I have been told that the bristles are a byproduct of hog processing for meat - and would otherwise be animal waste. I certainly find this credible - as the prices of the brushes would certainly not support being produced from any other source.

Just want to make sure you are making fact based decisions.

Rob
(not ashamed)

[Bruce Mack]

Bruce -

The brushes well sell use pig bristle - not boar bristle - there is a big difference. Our brushes are made in Indonesia (not China) - and the bristles may actually be sourced from India, though I am not certain - as the manufacturer may source from more than one supplier. I have been told that the bristles are a byproduct of hog processing for meat - and would otherwise be animal waste. I certainly find this credible - as the prices of the brushes would certainly not support being produced from any other source.


Just want to make sure you are making fact based decisions.

Rob
(not ashamed)

Thank you, Rob. I'm brittle about animal cruelty. I apologize for my uninformed attack.

[Jason White]

Absolutely! I just received my new 5-1/2 Veritas custom plane that I didn't expect to receive until February! Pretty sure I won't see my new 4-1/2 smoother until next year at the earliest.


Rob Lee is coming clean again about the supply nightmares he's still facing (email today). We all owe it to him to keep him with a steady stream of orders, even though we probably won't receive them for months. We don't want his business to wither away! Weigh in if you agree.

[Rob Lee]

Hi Bruce -

No worries. I'm one of those guys that stops to usher snakes and turtles off the road....

Cheers -

Rob

[Rob Lee]

Absolutely! I just received my new 5-1/2 Veritas custom plane that I didn't expect to receive until February! Pretty sure I won't see my new 4-1/2 smoother until next year at the earliest.

We're cranking up production as quickly as we can....two CNC lathes, two CNC grinders, a Vertical Mill, two Horizontal mills with a pallet pool, and a CNC router all ordered/installed in the past 12 months.

Today - had a meeting about configuring our first robotic arm cell ...

We're done yet...

Cheers -

Rob

[Jason White]

Go Rob, go!! 😊

[Scott Winners]

I placed two "all products in stock" orders because of this thread.

My L-N order got here yesterday. The scissors are fantastic, I got two pairs. Clauss brand, it says made in Italy on one pair. Jeez Louise. The little pair that I am keeping would be "pointy-pointy" in Registered Nursing parlance. I am going to use them in my outdoor kitchen for opening vacuum packed meats, but these would be fabulous bandage scissors were my employer willing to pay this much for bandage scissors. They aren't going to spend this much for bandage scissors, but the 8" cloth shears are going to one of the active seamstresses on my Christmas list this year.

And I got the brush, the dusting brush. I have looked at it a few times. It is under workbenches/ bench accessories. The bad news is the description says "made of Chinese boar bristles", though I can say I ordered it before the side discussion. The good news is it works. With this brush I was able to get around the tote and into the inside corner where the frog meets the body on all my planes (#3 up to #8) and brush all the dust out of that area on every plane. I don't know what the animal friendly answer is, but this is a handy tool.

I expect to be able to echo the "higher standard of customer service" for Lee Valley shortly based on the tracking numbers in my email. Leupold, the optics people, is my current high water mark, but Leupold is about to be second place I think.

It has been lovely to place a couple online orders and have shipment notification emails within 24 hours. Whether or not Rob or Tom needed the money, this has been money well spent for me. Thank you OP.

[Jason White]

Me, too. In fact, I just did all of my Xmas shopping for the wife at LV! She loves the cooking gadgets and and I love eating whatever she makes!


I placed two "all products in stock" orders because of this thread.

My L-N order got here yesterday. The scissors are fantastic, I got two pairs. Clauss brand, it says made in Italy on one pair. Jeez Louise. The little pair that I am keeping would be "pointy-pointy" in Registered Nursing parlance. I am going to use them in my outdoor kitchen for opening vacuum packed meats, but these would be fabulous bandage scissors were my employer willing to pay this much for bandage scissors. They aren't going to spend this much for bandage scissors, but the 8" cloth shears are going to one of the active seamstresses on my Christmas list this year.

And I got the brush, the dusting brush. I have looked at it a few times. It is under workbenches/ bench accessories. The bad news is the description says "made of Chinese boar bristles", though I can say I ordered it before the side discussion. The good news is it works. With this brush I was able to get around the tote and into the inside corner where the frog meets the body on all my planes (#3 up to #8) and brush all the dust out of that area on every plane. I don't know what the animal friendly answer is, but this is a handy tool.

I expect to be able to echo the "higher standard of customer service" for Lee Valley shortly based on the tracking numbers in my email. Leupold, the optics people, is my current high water mark, but Leupold is about to be second place I think.

It has been lovely to place a couple online orders and have shipment notification emails within 24 hours. Whether or not Rob or Tom needed the money, this has been money well spent for me. Thank you OP.

[Tom Bain]

I would think gift cards (always on my Christmas list) are also positive for their business since they get the cash upfront and don’t have to deliver goods until ordered later.

[Jim Koepke]

I would think gift cards (always on my Christmas list) are also positive for their business since they get the cash upfront and don’t have to deliver goods until ordered later.

Not sure if they have immediate use of those funds or if they have to be held in escrow.

Someone who knows more about this might be able to explain.

Even if in escrow it may still be 'on book' for business purposes like bridge loans and such.

jtk

[Tom Bain]

I’m not an accountant, but my understanding is they cannot count gift card sales as revenue per se until it is ultimately used, but the cash is there and available for use.

[Rob Lee]

Hi -

Gift card sales do not count as "sales" - they are carried on the books indefinitely as a future liability. They certainly can help with cash on hand though - and reduce the line of credit due the bank at this time of year. So - the net benefit to us is the interest savings on the same amount borrowed at an applicable finance rate.

As most of you know - we don't have sales. Our discounted card is our way of letting customers book the "sale" they want in advance. Of course, the benefit to us is the future sale - but at reduced margin.

Our policy is also to refund gift cards in cash - whenever you want. We refund what you paid for it - so the discounted cards are NOT refunded at face value - but at the value you paid for it.

If you lose a gift card you have purchased - we can re-issue them - we track the liability at the individual purchaser level, and will replace any lost card at any time.

Cheers -

Rob

[glenn bradley]

67 and went the other way. bought a dial caliber and the digital doesn't get used. too damn hard to figure out what size it is when it reads out in 128ths of an inch.

@Mark Rainey - My 1/128" digital caliper is likewise in the drawer. My 1/64" one lasted longer but, went in the drawer too. I work in imperial and have a few imperial dial calipers around the shop that read in 64ths. They work better for me. Not necessarily true for you.

Where I agree that my small purchase will not keep Rob afloat, this thread did remind me to buy the things I had setting in my cart :)

[Phil Mueller]

Your practices are outstanding, Rob. Gift Cards are an interesting “product”. I have a small business - far smaller than yours - and we do count gift cards as sales, however, we deduct the avg margin COGs and keep that on the books. So our liability is just the product cost. In our case, the gift card is only redeemable for product. I find your refund policy very generous!

[Rob Lee]

Your practices are outstanding, Rob. Gift Cards are an interesting “product”. I have a small business - far smaller than yours - and we do count gift cards as sales, however, we deduct the avg margin COGs and keep that on the books. So our liability is just the product cost. In our case, the gift card is only redeemable for product. I find your refund policy very generous!

Phil -

The goal is to sleep well at night....

Cheers -

Rob

[Charles Guest]

Rob, do you have an ETA on when your Preston-style beading tool will be back in stock?

TIA

[Rob Lee]

Rob, do you have an ETA on when your Preston-style beading tool will be back in stock?

TIA

Hi Charles -

Took a bit of time to track down the answer - but they are staged in assembly now, and should be back in stock 1-2 weeks.

Our system date shows the 11th.... so will be close to that!

Cheers -

Rob

[Charles Guest]

Hi Charles -

Took a bit of time to track down the answer - but they are staged in assembly now, and should be back in stock 1-2 weeks.

Our system date shows the 11th.... so will be close to that!

Cheers -

Rob

Wonderful! Thanks...

[Ben Ellenberger]

Just another Lee Valley story. I managed to break the lens on my task lamp. They don’t list the replacement lens as a regular item. But, their customer service people tracked it down as a special order and quoted me a price that guarantees they will lose money on it. So, I can keep a perfectly good lamp out of a landfill.

I put a lot of value on that and really appreciate their customer service.

[James Pallas]

The Lee’s must be part of the family at my house. Go to the shop, traces of Lee’s, to the garden, traces of Lee’s, some traces right here in the living room. The things I see around me everyday make me happy. Getting close to Christmas. I know family members will be sending gift cards, yippee. Thank you Rob.
Jim

[Jim R Edwards]

I just purchased a RH shooting board. Arrived very quick.