Attaching door jamb to old brick, how?

[Scott Clausen]

Not sure if this is posting in the correct place but here it goes.

I have constructed a new, mostly hand tool, frame and panel door to replace an existing door. I am trying to find a good way to secure the jamb to the brick. Tap-cons are out, I did a test fit and the brick won't hold the threads. I bought some threaded bolts that can expand the tale end but am having second thoughts. With uneven brick sides I need some flexibility to adjust and shim the sides. Once the bolt goes in I have no depth adjustment and worse, if I need to move or remove the jamb I will need to cut all the bolts. I am now toying with two possible ways to do this now.

1) Drill a recessed hole in the jamb that can allow a large washer to move around a bit in a larger hole. Drill a smaller hole the size of the anchor to mark the location of the anchor and drill the brick. follow that with a larger jamb hole if adjustment is needed.

2) Drill 3/4" holes in the brick and clean hole with air hose. Epoxy in some oak dowels and cut flush. Mark locations on jamb and drill and screw jamb in place & use shims. This method will give me a little larger target to hit.

I am open to all thoughts or ideas. This will rear its ugly head again when I add railing to the front porch too.

[Ron Selzer]

old school was to drill a hole in the brick and fill the hole with a piece of wood, then drive screw thru jamb into the wood. No pilot hole for screw. The wood would expand from the screw and hold the jamb in place. Could square hole up with a chisel if worried about wood turning in hole
newer would be to use lead anchors in the brick, otherwise same installation.
would not use expanding bolts as too hard to get back out
epoxy should work ok
Interested in seeing what answers you get
Ron

[Alex Zeller]

I've always used plastic anchors like these (https://www.homedepot.com/p/Everbilt-12-14-tpi-x-1-1-2-in-Blue-Plastic-Plug-8-Pack-804042/204813464). Just drill a 1/4" hole, use a utility knife to make one end kind of pointed, tap them into place. You can drill the hole through the door jamb and then countersink the hole. They do make smaller size ones.

[Scott Clausen]

Thanks Ron, I have seen in old building where they would make "wooden bricks" and mortar them into the wall where they knew they would need to have an anchor point. They do make lead sleeves that both expand and screw can be backed out. The problem is they are depth dependent which means I will need multiple length screws to take up the slack.

[Paul F Franklin]

When I've done this, I generally mount 1x stock (treated is best if you can find dry enough stock, or untreated with flashing tape on it to prevent moisture absorption) to the brick or block using whatever anchors work. Then the real door jambs mount to that using shims as usual to get everything plumb and aligned. But you probably don't have room to do that if you've already made the door to just fit in the opening. Then the trim covers everything up.

[Scott Clausen]

Thanks Paul, I have made the door and jamb close enough to shim already. Not sure if that two inch reduction would ever be an issue when it is time to replace the furnace. I guess I am leaning toward the dowel and epoxy method unless the bricks blow up, 3/4" is pretty big.

[Lisa Starr]

Our home is very old brick. When we need to anchor to it, you drill a hole, roll some sheet lead into a cylinder and drive it in the hole. Then just run your screw into the lead. Nothing to rot and the screw can be removed/adjusted. This is how commercial roofers fasten to masonry all the time.

[Scott Clausen]

very interesting, seems like it would be very forgiving if the screw is not dead center, off to lookup sheet lead.

Thanks to amazon, lead sheet ordered. Thank you Lisa!

[Alex Zeller]

I wouldn't use lead in a house on anything. While it's not lead based paint it still could cause you headaches if you sell the house. Lead anchors are increasing hard to find because lead is a toxic metal. Not too long ago every hardware store sold them but now, if they have something that's not plastic it'll be a zinc aluminum mixture. Those plastic ones I posted a link to will do the same thing and hold much better. I know of nobody doing commercial work who uses lead.

[Tom M King]

Greenlee makes a tool that sets lead anchors flush with the surface. The tools weren't cheap 30 years ago, so I expect they may be more than you want to invest in for one job. They're what I would, and have used, in such cases. I also clean the bricks well, and ask construction adhesive for some extra help.

You can see pictures of those Greenlee Caulk-In anchors, and tools if you scroll down on my chimney flashing page. They come in larger sizes too. I'd use 3/8's for a door jamb.

http://historic-house-restoration.com/chimneyflashing.html

When you get ready to caulk, and paint, use Lexcel caulking against the brick, let it cure, and cut in a line that looks good with the casing, but leaves the crystal clear stuff next to the brick, and it won't show up as much as irregular lines in colored caulk. I've done that plenty of times too, and Lexcel keeps a bond Way longer than silicone, as well as being paintable.

[Tom M King]

I checked. Yes, they're expensive. The kind you pound into the bottom of the hole neither hold as well, nor give you any margin for error with hole depth. These let you drill the hole deep enough to get the bottom of the hole out of the way, and the threaded insert is left flush with the surface.

https://www.amazon.com/Greenlee-870-Anchor-Expander-Caulking/dp/B001SMN7E0

Read the reviews. I didn't, but if they say great things about them, the reviews are legit.

[Scott Clausen]

This is a exterior door to a basement that has a dirt floor and used to house a coal furnace. Toxic stuff all around down there so I won't sweat the lead in a hole in the brick.

[Scott Clausen]

Looks good but I may try the lead roll first.

[Bill Dufour]

Are the bricks too soft for drop in anchors?
Bill D

[Scott Clausen]

I suppose not if they don't exert too much expansion force. They will get me back to the problem of having to hit that hole dead center. Between trying to wedge the jamb in place and drill holes that are dead center without the drill bit wondering on the brick surface I see lots of problems. With the lead sheets to fill the hole I am hoping to have enough adjustment room to hit anywhere in that hole. I need to see how tight I can roll the sheets to determine the final hole size but I am thinking 3/8, 1/2 or 5/8 at this point.

[Jim Becker]

Using the right kind of drill and bit should help with the wandering...a hammer drill, for example. You might also try to hit the grout line as that's easier to drill into than the actual brick for your anchors. A properly sized anchor and associated screw shouldn't cause an excessive force issue in the masonry.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

You can do this with anchor screws, if you get the right ones. GRK Caliburns are my go to, and Titans are ok. I suppose there are bricks out there that just won't cooperate, but I have yet to find one. I wouldn't recommend those blue tapcons for anything, especially this. Usually there is wood framing behind the bricks, just anchor to it if so. The lead tape is a good idea too.

[Scott Clausen]

I agree, if the anchor and screw/bolt are sized properly it shouldn't be a problem unless to close to an edge. Mortar joint is a no go as it is already almost powder now. I have a feeling it is going to take of trials to see what works and probably two or three trips to the big box store. Once I pull the old jamb out I will be committed to getting the new one in. Jamb is built and I and morticing the hinges in the evenings this week.

[Scott Clausen]

You can do this with anchor screws, if you get the right ones. GRK Caliburns are my go to, and Titans are ok. I suppose there are bricks out there that just won't cooperate, but I have yet to find one. I wouldn't recommend those blue tapcons for anything, especially this. Usually there is wood framing behind the bricks, just anchor to it if so. The lead tape is a good idea too.
Thanks for the Caliburns tip, I never had any luck with Tapcons. No wood behind brick, house is on columns with one brick thick wall in between. There is a wider brick frame around the doorway.

A little funny, the other day I was putting a shopping list of items to get into my phone (Google Keep) I entered TapCons and you should have seen my face in the hardware aisle when I tried to figure out how "Tampons" got there.

[Jim Becker]

Ah, the joys of AutoCorrect... :)

[Jim Dwight]

I would probably use plastic anchors and screws (you can drill a smaller hole for the screw first and then enlarge for the anchors so they are aligned). But regrardless of how you anchor the screw you may want to either use construction adhesive or expanding foam to help secure the jamb. Construction adhesive would secure it better but be harder to remove. Expanding foam is easing to cut if you need to remove and provides a surprising amount of additional support.

[Scott Clausen]

Expanding foam is easing to cut if you need to remove and provides a surprising amount of additional support.

This reminds me of years ago. I was working on a house about the time expanding foam sealer came out. The home owner was bragging that he was going to have the most energy efficient home on the planet as he foamed all the door and window jambs. The next day he went to open a window and it wouldn't budge. The foam had compressed the jambs against the windows.

I have made the jambs out of a 2"X6" so I may end up foaming it after I have it secured in place to "lock it in"

[Bill Cuthbertson]

Having a 100 year old house with solid exterior brick walls that are about a foot thick I have tried everything with varying degress of success. Hillman makes an anchor that has been my go to recently, rock solid and easy to use.

Hillman #10-12 x 1-9/16 in. DuoPower Contractor Strength Anchor (12-Pack)-376474 - The Home Depot (https://www.homedepot.com/p/Hillman-10-12-x-1-9-16-in-DuoPower-Contractor-Strength-Anchor-12-Pack-376474/302043757)

[Joe Jensen]

Our home is very old brick. When we need to anchor to it, you drill a hole, roll some sheet lead into a cylinder and drive it in the hole. Then just run your screw into the lead. Nothing to rot and the screw can be removed/adjusted. This is how commercial roofers fasten to masonry all the time.

Love this, thanks, I've done two doors now and as others have said, Tapcons are out. Last house had hollow block and we used toggle bolts.

[Scott Clausen]

Well, as usual I kind of over thought this. I ended up drilling 1/4" holes through the wood jamb and followed with 1/4" holes in the brick. I then realized after I after perfectly shimmed the jamb in place the likelihood of returning to that position was not going to be easy. I got a 1/4 oak dowel and placed in each hole and ran a #10 4" construction screw into it. It feels very solid and I am happy with the fit and action of the door. A door handset and a little trim is all I need to complete.
463094

[Bill Dufour]

I had the doorbell button fall off the wall. It had two woodscrews into the mortar. I though long and hard and chipped the holes clean and a little bigger. Filled with jb weld and painters tape to hold it in overnight while it dried. then drilled and tapped into the jb weld. Worked fine. Just remembered I used JB weld putty on the top hole.
For your door I would mount it in place and drill through the frame and into the brick. countersink or counterbore the wood holes. Fill the holes in the brick with anchor epoxy or. jb weld putty and install a waxed screw or bolt. Tape the screws so it stays down in place overnight.
Bill D