Used Felder Ad941

[David Less]

Hi,
Can anyone give me a rough estimate on a used Felder Ad941 16” jointer planer?
Machine was purchased in 2018 and barely used in a hobby shop.
I think typically 50% from purchase price but in this case since it’s barely used, I don’t know.
I believe purchase price back then was around $12,500 with the spiral cutter and electric table lift, oh and it’s single phase.

thanks for any info or opinions

david

[Stewart Lang]

In a normal market I'd say yes 50%. 6-7k. But the market right now is hot. Lots of back orders with new machines, and so forth, so used machinery is up and selling fast. I wouldn't be surprised if it sells for 7-9k, especially if it's in excellent condition.

If you can get it for 6k that'd be a steal.

[Jacques Gagnon]

Various people will have various perspectives about a "fair" price for a used machine. Among the many factors at play are :

- condition of the machine
- "fit" of the machine with regards to your needs/desires
- efforts and costs related to moving the machine to your shop
- availability and condition of similar used machines in your area

...and, in the current environment, value of the immediate availability of the machine you want compared to the frequent 8+ month delivery time for some new equipment (depending on type of machine and manufacturer).

At the end of the day you will be left with a couple of questions: did I miss / seize an opportunity on a machine I wanted? and, am I happy with my decision? From my perspective the rest is irrelevant.

Free advice worth every penny.

Regards,

J.

[John P Clark]

I do not think European machines devalue the same as other imports - if it is like new, less than 2 years old and I was trying to sell it, I would have it around 75 to 80% of new, depending on condition - Talk to Felder and see what a new one would cost and the time to get it - that alone would make me buy the used on. Have a shop full of Felder and Martin equipment and enjoy using them every time I go into my shop

[David Less]

The machine is still on the pallet and never used except for powering up, the tables still have the paper on them, my problem is I’m beginning to think 9 grand is a bit much. All he will let me do is run it without any wood going through, I’ve heard of warped tables and other warranty problems, felder parts can be expensive. It’s not like it’s been running in a shop producing accurate machining so it’s another chance I’m taking.
maybe I’m being too picky, but it’s still a lot of money w/o warranty.

david

[John Lanciani]

I wont go into detail out of respect for the member here who bought it, but I recently sold a 15 year old Italian machine for more than I paid for it new. The premise of using a percentage of purchase price is foolish. If the machine in question was mine to sell I'd be looking for $10k in my location based on your description.

[Jeff Monson]

$9000 and its local? I'd consider it a great deal being its new, never used and you dont have to wait a year to get it. You're buying a Felder, I'd say warped tables or any quality issue are nil to none. The Felder machinery I own is top notch. I'd love to upgrade from my AD741 to a 941 with a spiral head. If you decide to pass please let me know the details on it.

[Jacques Gagnon]

The machine is still on the pallet and never used except for powering up, the tables still have the paper on them, my problem is I’m beginning to think 9 grand is a bit much. All he will let me do is run it without any wood going through, I’ve heard of warped tables and other warranty problems, felder parts can be expensive. It’s not like it’s been running in a shop producing accurate machining so it’s another chance I’m taking.
maybe I’m being too picky, but it’s still a lot of money w/o warranty.

david

I understand being cautious with a purchase of significance such as this. Buying something out of warranty always poses some level of risk. Your decision will depend on your tolerance to risk.

One way to look at this is you could probably spend 4,000$ in repairs and still end up paying less than a new machine…whenever it would arrive in your shop (if I understand well your description this is as close to a new machine as you can get). As for tables, a visit with the proper measuring tools should provide you with the additional information you need to feel more comfortable.

Problematic machines exist, but based on what is found on internet the frequency of such events does not appear to be high. Given that people generally have a tendency to complain about something more often than they will praise successful products, the low frequency of negative reports is an indicator of performance that should be included in the decision making equation.

[Jim Becker]

I'll agree with the others that the $9K number, especially now knowing it's still on the original pallet and with very limited use, is a darn good price. He could easily sell it for more in the current market in most geographies, even without a warranty.

[John Lanciani]

At $9k I'd seriously consider buying it to flip. Feel free to share the location...

[Jacob Mac]

You're always going to hear stories on here about how someone got a new Sawstop ICS for $100 and the seller gave them a used drum sander to sweeten the deal. But those tales notwithstanding....

That jointer is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it. In today's environment, 9k seems like a good deal. Bring a nice, long straight edge and some feeler gauges and you should be able to get an idea of what you are getting into.

[David Less]

Here’s problem I’m having with the seller…
When I told him I wanted to come over to further inspect and see what’s involved in moving it, he says he wants a $3000 deposit. I told him I’d give him 250 and my good faith handshake and pick it up as soon as Saturday, but he refuses.
I told him it would cost me the deposit and then some to hire an attorney if he decided to not honor the agreement, a receipt is just a pc of paper, lol

Any opinions on this? Never had someone request a large deposit on something I was picking up in a few days, plus I live 20 minutes away.

I feel like this is more stress than it’s worth

help

[Michael W. Clark]

It’s a sellers market, the deposit ask sounds odd to me.

Are you asking them to hold it? If so maybe, but has some risk.

I would not pay anything until you go there, see it, and meet the seller so they know that you know where they live.

[Albert Lee]

Here’s problem I’m having with the seller…
When I told him I wanted to come over to further inspect and see what’s involved in moving it, he says he wants a $3000 deposit. I told him I’d give him 250 and my good faith handshake and pick it up as soon as Saturday, but he refuses.
I told him it would cost me the deposit and then some to hire an attorney if he decided to not honor the agreement, a receipt is just a pc of paper, lol

Any opinions on this? Never had someone request a large deposit on something I was picking up in a few days, plus I live 20 minutes away.

I feel like this is more stress than it’s worth

help

if so. and you are only 20 minutes away, just go today or next day with your trailer/truck, pay the guy, take it away. simple as that. I dont do deposit myself, either selling or buying.

[David Less]

It’s a sellers market, the deposit ask sounds odd to me.

Are you asking them to hold it? If so maybe, but has some risk.

I would not pay anything until you go there, see it, and meet the seller so they know that you know where they live.

I meet with him and we talked for an hour about stuff, at the time I didn’t check the machine that closely because he didn’t say he was selling it. The only reason I was there was to see one close rather than drive to Felder.
no, I’m not asking him to hold, a requested an inspection before I rented a drop deck trailer and other moving equipment which would be that saturday for pick up. He hasn’t even advertised it or has anyone else lined up. So he has no skin in the game as they say, Very strange IMO.

[John Lanciani]

Here’s problem I’m having with the seller…
When I told him I wanted to come over to further inspect and see what’s involved in moving it, he says he wants a $3000 deposit. I told him I’d give him 250 and my good faith handshake and pick it up as soon as Saturday, but he refuses.
I told him it would cost me the deposit and then some to hire an attorney if he decided to not honor the agreement, a receipt is just a pc of paper, lol


Any opinions on this? Never had someone request a large deposit on something I was picking up in a few days, plus I live 20 minutes away.

I feel like this is more stress than it’s worth

help

I buy and sell a lot of machines; when buying I offer $100 non refundable deposit and a handshake after I've met the seller if I need a few days to work out the details of moving a machine. If that's not enough I move on, the seller is going to be difficult to work with. When selling, if the buyer needs a few days and doesn't offer the same I tell them to call when they are ready to come and I'll let them know if it's still available. Works 100% of the time for me.

[John TenEyck]

Is this anywhere near Elmira NY? I talked with a guy a couple of years ago who had a whole shop full of brand new Felder machines he wanted to sell due to health reasons. He was one difficult guy to deal with. If that's him he's clearly in no hurry to sell.

John

[Patrick Kane]

I remember that guy and his shop too, JohnI think he was in Troy, PA south of Elmira.

To the OP, I love used machines, and this is probably the worst kind of used machine to buy, in my opinion. This seller is going to grind the market to squeeze every last penny out of his investment. As he should, I would do the same. And as everyone has mentioned, someone is going to buy it for $1,000 off list price just to save the wait time. Personally, I’d rather wait 8 months, have a warranty, and the thing delivered to my house fully insured for $1,000. Better still, I would find one that is 5 years old with some miles on it and buy it for $6,000. Good luck either way.

[David Less]

No it’s not, my seller actually contacted me, and just the opposite I’m in no hurry to buy

[David Less]

Lol, I agree, that’s probably why I’m not in a hurry to fork over 9 grand
plus him being very difficult to work with, sometimes not worth the stress of saving a few bucks

[Robert Mayer]

$3000 to hold a machine for a few days for a local? That's outrageous and risky. Felder isn't the greatest at stocking parts, expect 1-2 months if you need something and its not in stock.

[Jim Becker]

I meet with him and we talked for an hour about stuff, at the time I didn’t check the machine that closely because he didn’t say he was selling it. The only reason I was there was to see one close rather than drive to Felder.
no, I’m not asking him to hold, a requested an inspection before I rented a drop deck trailer and other moving equipment which would be that saturday for pick up. He hasn’t even advertised it or has anyone else lined up. So he has no skin in the game as they say, Very strange IMO.

Offer him a reasonable deposit on the spot if you are happy with the machine during the inspection and a specific day to pick up with the remainder of the payment in-hand. It's reasonable, IMHO, for you to have a few minutes up close with the prospective machine, given it's local. He has nothing to lose other than those few minutes with you being there. If he's not willing to do that, I wonder if he really wants to sell it...

[Mark e Kessler]

I have the ad941 and once dialed in I have had no issues, it’s a great machine and the only thing I pine for is separates…

9k is fair (slightly high) for what you describe if you were looking to buy new today - If you are looking for a screaming deal than this isn’t it… I don’t think anything is different than the new one you would buy today

I would have no concerns with table warpage, if you are that concerned i would bring a 4’ - 6’ precision straight edge and feeler gauges to take a quick few checks for dips… but if you are going to do that you need the Felder Specs to compare it to… should be this much or that is a different discussion… if you need the specs DM me and I will send what came with my machine….

You may not need to adjust the tables but I would plan on doing that to get it dialed to your expectations - both of mine required it , the first one the in-feed was 1/4”- 3/8” out on delivery…. The planer bed is pretty much dead nuts…

Felder support Is pretty good and I am pretty sure you can call them to assist with issues on a used machine - tip, if you do need to adjust tables do not touch the hinge side until all other options are attempted, Felder service can help you with this. There are a few quirks on this machine as far as adjusting the outfeed, without knowing this one may think the table needs further adjustment...

As far as the deposit, why not set up a time with him, reserve any equipment/personal needed go there and if you accept tell him you will be back in an hour with the trailer and the money, if he is being this difficult with the deposit he is being that way with everyone and it won’t be gone in that hour

[David Less]

Thanks for all the great reply's guys

I'll keep you posted on my decision

David