Router Templates - using filler for accuracy

[andrew whicker]

I came across this video (Yacht Shop Creations) while looking for Soss hinge template ideas. He's a yacht guy, so he always has chemicals that go along with that. He used APF 7 Polyester filler to fill the gaps around the Soss hinge to make a router template.

Have you tried anything like this? Different filler?

Seems like a good idea.

https://youtu.be/fyb23ixAcR8

[Tom M King]

I always have some West Systems stuff on hand. https://www.wholesalemarine.com/west-system-404-high-density-filler/?gclid=CjwKCAjwrPCGBhALEiwAUl9X09OphHWhbcoVmj3iY5C zFNx-EqCOPoIH3kuZIBS43Br_zEp5BPkg7hoCYHkQAvD_BwE

I remember making templates. Some are still in use decades later. When I messed one up, I used that one to make another one, staying away from the too deep area.

[Bill Dufour]

I made a small knick in the plastic router guide finger in my first dovetail jig. Lifted router a little bit before it stopped spinning. JB weld and some fine files took care of that.
Bill D

[Thomas McCurnin]

I watched both videos. How he uses the filler is interesting. He drills holes at each end of the template to match the diameter of the hinge, but as we all know, that diameter is not exact and lining up the holes even with center lines is not exact. He then takes a dumb jig saw and connects the two holes, again, not a very exact cut is it? No worries ....

He wraps the hinge in three layers of painters tape and adds three coats of wax mold relief to the outside of this paper tape mess.

Then inserts the hinge which may have some slop in it due to the inherent errors in cutting, described above.

Then he adds the filler, smooshing it in between the paper tape wax mess and the template. When dry, removes the hinge and voila! A perfectly sized template.

[andrew whicker]

I always have some West Systems stuff on hand. https://www.wholesalemarine.com/west-system-404-high-density-filler/?gclid=CjwKCAjwrPCGBhALEiwAUl9X09OphHWhbcoVmj3iY5C zFNx-EqCOPoIH3kuZIBS43Br_zEp5BPkg7hoCYHkQAvD_BwE

I remember making templates. Some are still in use decades later. When I messed one up, I used that one to make another one, staying away from the too deep area.


What resin do you use with this filler? The webpage mentions 105 resin and 206 slow hardener. Also, does wax mold release work with this product (i.e. allow you to remove the hardware)?

cheers,

[Tom M King]

Those are what I use most of the time, but I don't think it requires a special resin, or hardener. I expect any filler with work. It just thickens the mix.

The only time I have used mold release wax is for something where gelcoat is the outer surface of the piece being molded. Those molds are Very smooth. I'm not sure about a specific piece of hardware being smooth enough to work with mold release wax.

I just use wood files to refine templates. The Iwasaki x-fines leave a smooth surface, and don't take much off at the time.

Three layers of tape sounds like it would build it up too much. I just mark around the piece with a very sharp no. 4 pencil, get close to the line, try it, and file a little off where it needs it. It's not hard to do, just take your time. If you screw one up, or it doesn't come out like you want it, use that one to make the next one, with any changes needed.

[Ed Mitchell]

The difference between the filler mentioned by the OP and the West Systems is the type of resin for which they're intended.

The AP fillers are for polyester resin, the West System filler is for epoxy resin. They're generic enough that you could swap them, but if you were pushing the limits of (eg) an epoxy resin, and you used a polyester filler, it likely would not be as durable a result. For something like door hinges, the poly resin and filler are more than enough, but if you have some serious loads (e.g., a cleat on a yacht, getting yanked by a line which ties the yacht to a dock) then you'd want the extra cyclic strength of the epoxy resin and filler intended for epoxy.

With both types, you can add carbon fibers or milled glass fibers to the filler to enhance certain properties.

[Dave Winters]

Bondo works good for this sort of thing, too.

[andrew whicker]

Bondo works good for this sort of thing, too.

I saw that / thought of this. I'm going to try that (less hassle) first.

Thanks much

[andrew whicker]

Those are what I use most of the time, but I don't think it requires a special resin, or hardener. I expect any filler with work. It just thickens the mix.

The only time I have used mold release wax is for something where gelcoat is the outer surface of the piece being molded. Those molds are Very smooth. I'm not sure about a specific piece of hardware being smooth enough to work with mold release wax.

I just use wood files to refine templates. The Iwasaki x-fines leave a smooth surface, and don't take much off at the time.

Three layers of tape sounds like it would build it up too much. I just mark around the piece with a very sharp no. 4 pencil, get close to the line, try it, and file a little off where it needs it. It's not hard to do, just take your time. If you screw one up, or it doesn't come out like you want it, use that one to make the next one, with any changes needed.

Awesome. Thanks much. Always learning new things... new files to check out. : )

[Tom M King]

https://www.highlandwoodworking.com/iwasaki-8-flat-extreme-fine-cut-carving-file-handle.aspx

I use that one for fine tuning tenons building reproduction sash, that we don't use glue for. Only pegged tenons instead of glue, like the old ones, so you can replace individual parts in a couple of hundred years.

That one, and the little round one get most of the use.