Cryptocurrency---

[Kev Williams]

from coinbase.com, an explanation:

At its core, cryptocurrency is typically decentralized digital money designed to be used over the internet. Bitcoin, which launched in 2008, was the first cryptocurrency, and it remains by far the biggest, most influential, and best-known. In the decade since, Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies like Ethereum have grown as digital alternatives to money issued by governments.

The most popular cryptocurrencies, by market capitalization, are Bitcoin, Ethereum, Bitcoin Cash and Litecoin. Other well-known cryptocurrencies include Tezos, EOS, and ZCash. Some are similar to Bitcoin. Others are based on different technologies, or have new features that allow them to do more than transfer value.

Crypto makes it possible to transfer value online without the need for a middleman like a bank or payment processor, allowing value to transfer globally, near-instantly, 24/7, for low fees.

Cryptocurrencies are usually not issued or controlled by any government or other central authority. They’re managed by peer-to-peer networks of computers running free, open-source software. Generally, anyone who wants to participate is able to.

If a bank or government isn’t involved, how is crypto secure? It’s secure because all transactions are vetted by a technology called a blockchain.

A cryptocurrency blockchain is similar to a bank’s balance sheet or ledger. Each currency has its own blockchain, which is an ongoing, constantly re-verified record of every single transaction ever made using that currency.

Unlike a bank’s ledger, a crypto blockchain is distributed across participants of the digital currency’s entire network

No company, country, or third party is in control of it; and anyone can participate. A blockchain is a breakthrough technology only recently made possible through decades of computer science and mathematical innovations. Most importantly, cryptocurrencies allow individuals to take complete control over their assets

Funny how they left off the 'allow thieves to take complete control over OTHER PEOPLES assets' part...

Am I the only one who's getting sick and tired of internet thieves with their ransomware attacks getting rich while threatening the global supply chain-last month it was the pipeline, this month (so far :mad: ) it's the beef industry - and knowing they can't get caught because THERE'S NO WAY TO FOLLOW THE DAMN MONEY! Of course Swiss bank accounts and such make hiding money easy, but what good is 'every single transaction ever made is verified' if there's absolutely no deterrent for stealing other people's money? I doubt anyone can convince me crytocurrency is actually a GOOD thing...

And speaking of ransomware, don't these big companies have software to find it? I mean, my bottom-of-the-barrel Windows Defender found it on MY computer awhile back-
458818

Vent post :)

[Mel Fulks]

I don’t have any interest in using it ,but I know people who use it and occasionally comment on it. They understand all the angles and
know how to use it “safely”. Some who prefer “real” paper money might also eschew gold as “garish, heavy, and too soft for every day use”

[Jim Koepke]

And speaking of ransomware, don't these big companies have software to find it? I mean, my bottom-of-the-barrel Windows Defender found it on MY computer awhile back

The problem is these companies have people using corporate computers who have no awareness of the online threat. Some of my former coworkers would spend more time surfing the internet at work than actually doing their job.

When the internet is crashed by ransomeware pirates, all hoards of bitcoins will likely vanish in to the ether.

jtk

[Doug Dawson]

If you accepted Bitcoin for some random transactions back in the early days, you probably would have had no idea what to do with it, and probably held on to it. In retrospect, this was a good bet. DAMHIKT.

The new joke one, DoggyCoin? (That was how it was originally pronounced.) Oh, that’s good.

[Mike Soaper]

From what I've heard the bad guys are doing background research to find specific victims within a company before sending them comprised/infected emails/attachments that appear to be from legitimate business partners. ex: as in "payment for invoice #0397648" sent to someone specific in accounts payable.

There is cyber insurance but it can be expensive. I know of one large entity that could not afford it so they joined with others in the same business to make a self insured partnership/co-op.

That said I suspect that some companies just consider ransomware as a cost of doing business rather than increasing their security posture

[Jim Koepke]

One person made a claim saying the more layers of security a system uses, the higher the chance for one of the layers being vulnerable.

Much of my email goes unopened because the sender is either unrecognized or from a source that bombards me daily with an "IMPORTANT MESSAGE."

If it was really important they would find a reliable way to get it to me.

jtk

[Wade Lippman]

I have written my congressmen pleading with them to ban it. It's only real use is to sell drugs and pay ransoms. Do we really need to to take complete control over their assets?

Tesla has stopped allowing payment by bitcoin. That brilliant Musk realized that a Tesla bought with bitcoin has a much larger carbon footprint than a gasoline car bought with dollars. China does most of the bitcoin "mining" and objects to all the pollution it is causing; they are likely to ban it. Bitcoin uses 1.7% of the world's electricity. That might sound insane, 1.7% of the worlds electricity being used for something that is inherently harmful, but that is the truth.

[Wade Lippman]

If you accepted Bitcoin for some random transactions back in the early days, you probably would have had no idea what to do with it, and probably held on to it. In retrospect, this was a good bet. DAMHIKT.


There was Big Bang Theory about that. They lost their record of it, and so lost all their money.

[Mel Fulks]

Gold can be melted into new shapes, that makes it hard to trace. Crooks like gold. Governments like gold and want all they can get. They
use it wisely “only for good...never for evil “. Government has had to confiscate gold from greedy people. You don’t need gold, and gold
teeth are not real teeth ... if you stop buying gold teeth , people won’t know your teeth are fakes. This has been a public service tip.

[Jim Koepke]

One good thing about gold is if it all ever takes a ride in that proverbial hand basket, gold is easy to beat into crude utensils and can even be cast in to bullets for hunting.

jtk

[Bill Dufour]

"Mining" for ctypto currency reminds me of the philosophy of better vacuums. Crpto currency does not exist and has no value. As you buy a better, stronger vacuum you have to pay more for less and less until a perfect vacuum is absolutely nothing. Ever priced a Torr level vacuum pump or a difusion pump?
I am sure no one here worries about the bearing lube on their dust collector motor and uses vacuum safe grease instead of factory stuff. No one drills out the bolt heads for venting either do they.
Bill D

[Stephen Tashiro]

Bitcoin uses 1.7% of the world's electricity. That might sound insane, 1.7% of the worlds electricity being used for something that is inherently harmful, but that is the truth.

How is that number estimated? (And how does it compare to the amount of electricity used by people watching cute animal videos on YouTube?)

[Brian Elfert]

from coinbase.com, an explanation:


Funny how they left off the 'allow thieves to take complete control over OTHER PEOPLES assets' part...

Am I the only one who's getting sick and tired of internet thieves with their ransomware attacks getting rich while threatening the global supply chain-last month it was the pipeline, this month (so far :mad: ) it's the beef industry - and knowing they can't get caught because THERE'S NO WAY TO FOLLOW THE DAMN MONEY! Of course Swiss bank accounts and such make hiding money easy, but what good is 'every single transaction ever made is verified' if there's absolutely no deterrent for stealing other people's money? I doubt anyone can convince me crytocurrency is actually a GOOD thing...


Cryptocurrency has nothing to do with enabling ransomware. The criminals would just find another way to get paid if cryptocurrency didn't exist.

Businesses don't take cyber security serious enough because of money. It can cost millions to hundreds of millions to do proper cyber security. The thing is once an attack happens there is usually a blank check to spend on improving cyber security. Maersk spent somewhere around $500 million recovering from their ransomware attack. They essentially had to rebuild most of their computer systems from scratch.

[Doug Dawson]

I have written my congressmen pleading with them to ban it. It's only real use is to sell drugs and pay ransoms.
A big point of Bitcoin (and other cryptocurrencies) is that it’s beyond government control. And it’s a totally different concept from organized crime.

Except that you _do_ have to integrate it into your tax structure as an investor. Not that I think it’s a good retirement investment, it’s too volatile. So you get into these totally wild tax obligations if you ride it short-term. Ugh. If you never want to pay taxes, try real estate. :^)

I’ll add that one good “investment strategy” for Bitcoin is to invest in it from within a Roth IRA and then when it gets up to the point where it’s making you physically ill, switch it over to an index fund. That may or may not be a good strategy _now_. Like the local tv weather forecasters sign off with, “Your guess is as good as mine.” I don’t give investment advice. :^)

[Wade Lippman]

A big point of Bitcoin (and other cryptocurrencies) is that it’s beyond government control. And it’s a totally different concept from organized crime.

Except that you _do_ have to integrate it into your tax structure as an investor. Not that I think it’s a good retirement investment, it’s too volatile. So you get into these totally wild tax obligations if you ride it short-term. Ugh. If you never want to pay taxes, try real estate. :^)

I’ll add that one good “investment strategy” for Bitcoin is to invest in it from within a Roth IRA and then when it gets up to the point where it’s making you physically ill, switch it over to an index fund. That may or may not be a good strategy _now_. Like the local tv weather forecasters sign off with, “Your guess is as good as mine.” I don’t give investment advice. :^)

It certainly is not beyond government control. You simply make owning and mining illegal. That won't stop it anymore than making heroin illegal stops heroin, but investors won't buy it and victims won't be able to make payment in it. Hopefully the rest of the world will follow (China's lead). Since it has no intrinsic value, it is not hard to see serious restrictions driving it's price to zero.

Sure, criminals will find other ways. The two popular ways now to get money from victims is bitcoin and gift cards. I don't see paying a $1M ransom in gift cards.

Just today from the Biden administration...
“We are looking at crypto as a means of illicit finance,” the official said, “but by no means are these new steps limited to new technologies like crypto.”


The official also said the effort would likely involve updates to the Bank Secrecy Act, the primary means by which law enforcement can track how money moves through financial institutions.


“We’ll be looking for ideas of how to modernize these systems to respond to new technologies,” the official said. The memo does not name individual countries, specific currencies or particular kinds of assets.

[Mel Fulks]

We have had gov. involvement in money for a long time. It’s for the treasury not us. When govs confiscate gold people just refuse to accept
Its worthless paper and trade in goods ...or the gold ....they forgot to turn in. Our gov tried all the crooked stuff ,then finally relented and quit hogging all the gold. I don’t think it will try to get rid of bit coin.

[Kev Williams]

Cryptocurrency has nothing to do with enabling ransomware. The criminals would just find another way to get paid if cryptocurrency didn't exist.

NOTHING? The fact that CC is THEE preferred, and pretty much ONLY ransom payment method used by hackers, I'm convinced it has EVERYTHING to do with it. If they'll just find another way, I say LET THEM.

[Bill Dufour]

I have read that almost 100% of crypto mining is in China on coal fired electric plants and/or in Iran to get around sanctions running on oil fired generators.
Bill D

[Doug Dawson]

I have read that almost 100% of crypto mining is in China on coal fired electric plants and/or in Iran to get around sanctions running on oil fired generators.
Bill D
That’s IMO the biggest problem with cryptocurrencies, it is extremely unfriendly to the climate, it is so resource intensive. So it shouldn’t go on forever, obviously. Maybe that’s a natural limit to it’s role in our civilization. Take that, Satoshi and all your trendy bandwidth-hogging sandal-nibbling friends! :^)

[Bill Dufour]

I suppose they could convert to running on solar power in the Sahara desert during the day only.
Bill D

[Thomas McCurnin]

I have little to add except to say that I am 100% dependent on my 401k and there is no frigging way I am going to invest in anything this volatile. Perhaps some have got lucky, but I am unwilling to take these kinds of risks.

[Ron Citerone]

I have little to add except to say that I am 100% dependent on my 401k and there is no frigging way I am going to invest in anything this volatile. Perhaps some have got lucky, but I am unwilling to take these kinds of risks.

Amen! Jack Bogle is whispering the same thing in my ear.

[Stan Calow]

NOTHING? The fact that CC is THEE preferred, and pretty much ONLY ransom payment method used by hackers, I'm convinced it has EVERYTHING to do with it.

I've heard that same statement repeated several times by public and private security experts in the last couple of weeks.

[Edwin Santos]

Cryptocurrency has nothing to do with enabling ransomware. The criminals would just find another way to get paid if cryptocurrency didn't exist.




NOTHING? The fact that CC is THEE preferred, and pretty much ONLY ransom payment method used by hackers, I'm convinced it has EVERYTHING to do with it. If they'll just find another way, I say LET THEM.

In all fairness, yes crypto and blockchain tech have features that are attractive to criminals and bad actors. But they also have potential applications and features attractive to legitimate investors, businesses and consumers.

Think of the early internet days when many people associated the internet with porn simply because the porn industry was an early adopter. Or how there was a time when a young eBay was almost exclusively associated with beanie babies and collectible tchotchkes but not much else.

It just remains to be seen how crypto will evolve and where it will go. It's a highly speculative investment at this point IMO.
Personally I wouldn't gamble any more money on it that I wasn't prepared to lose. At least at this point.

But on the other hand, crypto doesn't seem to represent any kind of threat to my life, so I'm just watching it with mild interest but without strong objection.

[Kev Williams]

OK, so I'll concede that CC doesn't have EVERYTHING to do with ransomware/cyber-crime. But Chris Krebs does back me up, at least somewhat...

-sorry it's sideways, played right on my computer before I uploaded it. I hate stupid smart phones...


https://youtu.be/mKGzxDR1GCI

[Edwin Santos]

OK, so I'll concede that CC doesn't have EVERYTHING to do with ransomware/cyber-crime. But Chris Krebs does back me up, at least somewhat...

-sorry it's sideways, played right on my computer before I uploaded it. I hate stupid smart phones...



Kev,
I hope I didn't sound argumentative. Chris Krebs is a totally impressive guy. He has a valid point and so do you.
But as he says, the rise of crypto has coincided with ransomware attacks, he didn't go so far as to say it is the source or cause of them.

Changing subjects a bit, the whole area of cybercrime is exploding. There is a recent book called The Perfect Weapon that talks about state sponsored and private cybercrime and the destruction it is capable of wreaking. A hair raising read for sure. I think HBO made a documentary based on the book too.

If we end up in a cybercrime driven crisis (heaven forbid), and if cryptocurrency is linked as an enabler, yes, I could see governments taking action. But if by that time, crypto has continued to grow in a legitimate market involving thousands or even millions of honest investors, big and small, it may be an issue as to how to penalize the criminals and not inflict collateral damage on the innocent.
There are already a few mainstream traded ETF-like crypto funds that have broad market presence. Supposedly more ETFs are on the way.
I think it's fair to expect the retail investor base to only grow.

Edwin

[Thomas McCurnin]

As a happy ex-lawyer, now a woodworker, I defended dozens of computer takeovers and fraudulent wire transfers and ACHs. One commondenominator was the cheerful giving of personal information by the victim to the fraudster, like DOB, SSN, phone numbers. More common was opening up an email from somebody you didn't know and clicking on a link which was a keystroke monitor, which enabled Russians (oops, they are our friends now, right?) to literally see everything you type for several weeks, including getting your web sites and passwords.

The larger banks have agreements with other large banks to freeze the accounts of fraudsters, called hold harmless agreements, and we got a lot of money back from fraudsters, although anything over 50 cents on the dollar was a huge a victory.

Bottom Line: Don't share personal information, Don't open emails from people you don't know, and Don't click on embedded links in emails.

[Mel Fulks]

Agree with Edwin. And it took the government many years to stop the “cereal box top” exchange. That was a weak currency that had to be
propped up by taped on dimes and quarters.

[Kev Williams]

I was happy to see that the feds were able to hack the hackers and got $2.3mil of the $4.4mil pipeline ransom back. Wonder if the trail may lead to some humans that could use a rude awakening...

[Mel Fulks]

I was happy to see that the feds were able to hack the hackers and got $2.3mil of the $4.4mil pipeline ransom back. Wonder if the trail may lead to some humans that could use a rude awakening...

yeah ,we can all be glad we only paid 2 million for our oil. But we would never be rude to those people. We paid for another pipe line but it
ain’t long enough right now. Maybe it’s in ‘the pipeline’.

[Ron Citerone]

As a happy ex-lawyer, now a woodworker, I defended dozens of computer takeovers and fraudulent wire transfers and ACHs. One commondenominator was the cheerful giving of personal information by the victim to the fraudster, like DOB, SSN, phone numbers. More common was opening up an email from somebody you didn't know and clicking on a link which was a keystroke monitor, which enabled Russians (oops, they are our friends now, right?) to literally see everything you type for several weeks, including getting your web sites and passwords.

The larger banks have agreements with other large banks to freeze the accounts of fraudsters, called hold harmless agreements, and we got a lot of money back from fraudsters, although anything over 50 cents on the dollar was a huge a victory.

Bottom Line: Don't share personal information, Don't open emails from people you don't know, and Don't click on embedded links in emails.

Good info from someone who has seen how it works. Thanks for sharing.