Is there such a thing as a reasonable cost saw set?

[Aaron Rosenthal]

I bought a "clearance" Sash Saw. Manufacturer has a sterling reputation, but saw wouldn't cut wood - well, it started the cut but bogged down almost immediately. I sent it out for sharpening/setting, but they told me (later) they tend to concentrate on power blades. Bah!
Inquired of the manufacturer, could they do the teeth setting. They said "yes", so I mailed i to them (International to the USA).
Long story short, their setting machine is broken and they have no idea when it will be repaired - perhaps this week, perhaps almost never. I don't understand it, but then .....
So, when they send it back, assuming sharp but non-set, I looked at Craigslist locally, and Marketplace. I can't believe the prices of a Stanley 42X!
Is there anything else out there that I can look for that makes economic sense?

[steven c newman]

Have spent $1 on each of these....
456965
456966456967

YMMV......mine are both 100 yrs + old...

[Scott Winners]

I am in your same boat. Among Vintage the Stanley 42X seems to be the horse to beat, I haven't been able to find one local at all. Lee Valley has had saw sets on their website in the past, though I didn't see them this morning. The Lee Valley ones were on llong backorder last time I did see them. If I find a 42X local that needs some work to become a user I expect to pay about $75, or beg someone to ship to Alaska.

[Derek Cohen]

Aaron, look for a vintage Eclipse #77 saw set (in bronze). They are really excellent and fairly common. I have about three of them. As with a 42x, remove the hammer and grind it a little narrower for 15 or 16 tpi dovetail saws. The existing hammers on all of these are really intended for about 12/tpi., which may be about right for a sash saw.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Jim Koepke]

The cost of shipping has become a larger part of purchasing through ebay.

Along with this the pandemic has caused more demand for all kinds of tools and everything else. At the same time there are world wide supply line disruptions.

An auto dealer sales rep told me people with used vehicles know they are worth more now due to supply problems. People with stuff to sell are likely also in tune with this.


If I find a 42X local that needs some work to become a user I expect to pay about $75, or beg someone to ship to Alaska.

Don't the USPS flat rate boxes work for Alaska & Hawaii?

Just answered that:

456981

Hope it only needs the springs unless you can make your own screws. If my memory is working the screw that works for the handle's hinge pin is threaded 10-28.

jtk

[Rob Young]

There have been threads arguing for and against how to move the teeth for setting, in particular bending vs. twisting. If you are not adverse to a twist instead of a bend (in general, hammer and anvil style sets bend the teeth more or less at the base of the triangle) you can use a screwdriver between pairs of teeth and give a light twist.

I'm doing this method on my saws with teeth smaller than 14 TPI. In my case these are filed rip. I don't think I have anything that fine filed crosscut. Applying pretty minimal set too since I'm mostly using these in hardwoods. Can't tell you how much as I'm not measuring it. Very touchy-feely, going for the "it just feels right" amount of twist of the screwdriver handle.

It did take a little bit of practice to get the feel and produce a set even enough that the saw doesn't drift left or right. Worst case I had to stone one side or the other until I got the hang of things.

Works just fine. My saws, my rules as it were, YMMV (possibly significantly).

(And I have some Eclipse #77's that I use otherwise. I like the ergonomics better than the 42X. Easier on my wrist.)

[Mike Brady]

Unfortunately, there is no current maker of saw sets. You are at the mercy of the markets. To get a Stanley saw set like a 42x you have to go where the dealers or sellers are not savvy enough to know what they have. Flea markets come to mind. Last time I bought a 42X I paid $35. for it. That's about the market price. A really clean one would be more, of course. Prices are above average on almost all tools now, but be careful because when old tools were hot in the '90's, prices were higher than right now.

[Joe Bailey]

Is there anything else out there that I can look for that makes economic sense?

Yes. The Millers Falls 214 is an excellent, but little-known alternative to the 42X, and does not command the same prices.

[Tom M King]

PM me your address, and I'll send you one that works. I have a box full of them, and only use a couple of 42X's. I'm not interested in selling any, or having a run on people wanting one.

[Russell Nugent]

I've bought 3 different saw sets at small town antiques store here in Central alberta and they were all under 10 bucks.

[Jim Koepke]

Oh Canada!

Just looked up mailing a small flat rate box to Canada:

456987

That really puts a damper on cross border marketing.

Aaron, do you ever come across the border towards Portland, Oregon?

jtk

[Aaron Rosenthal]

Jim, if they ever open the border I'll be on the way to visit grandchildren in greater L.A. before they change their minds - by motorcycle. I've often thought of stopping by for a coffee on the way, and meeting you in person.
Yes, I find the cost of shipping from/to the US to be only this side of ridiculous.
Waiting .......

[Tom M King]

I got an email showing my PM folders were full here. I just dumped everything, so should be able to get one now.

[Todd Zucker]

Does the PM have to be from the OP? :D

[Daniel Culotta]

Thanks for the replies here. I’ve been trying to find a set that worked well for finer saws, and the recommendations on the Eclipse and Millers Falls are good alternatives to just taking a chance on something random off eBay or paying bonkers prices for a 42x. If there are others worth searching for, keep posting please!

[Jim Koepke]

Thanks for the replies here. I’ve been trying to find a set that worked well for finer saws, and the recommendations on the Eclipse and Millers Falls are good alternatives to just taking a chance on something random off eBay or paying bonkers prices for a 42x. If there are others worth searching for, keep posting please!

At one time Stanley offered a smaller pin for the #42X to use on finer teeth. Many people have a second set and file the pin down for use on finer teeth.

Prices can be crazy, just look at the difference between the two #42Xs listed here:

457035

Even with the high shipping my first guess was it went fast. Looking into it the seller may have killed the deal and re-listed.

One of the tricks for getting a good deal on ebay is to keep looking and change up the search to look for listings where the person doesn't know what the tool might be.

Yard sales and junk shops can be your best place to find something like this.

jtk

[Rafael Herrera]

I've got this one. A Charles Morrill patented saw set. I have not figured out how to use it yet. Anyone here has any experience with it? I get by with the Millers Falls saw set, but I find the pistol grip awkward.

457047

Link (https://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?PageNum=0&idkey=NONE&SectionNum=3&HomeUrl=&docid=0441962)

[Rafael Herrera]

Here's another one that I have. The Disston Triumph saw set. I don't use it since it's missing the part labeled B in the picture.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/83/Disston_Triumph_Saw-set.jpg/800px-Disston_Triumph_Saw-set.jpg

[Jim Koepke]

If you are searching for the Stanley #42 Saw Set it is important to know it on sight. There are a few different saw sets in the #42 series.

If you think finding the saw set is hard, try to find the missing parts.

When thinking about price there are differences to consider:

457063

The one on the box is worth more to some folks due to the box. If the box was pristine some collector would likely pay more for the box's condition than the tool's condition. Some folks might not like this box because it has the stamp of a hardware store in Quebec, Canada. It might be preferred with no seller's stamp.

It is hard to tell but the one on the right is missing a lot of its japanning. That should lower the price even though it doesn't lower its usefulness.

Both of these have the extra piece for setting circular saw teeth. Not sure if that makes a difference to many buyers.

jtk

[Chuck Hill]

Oh Canada!

Just looked up mailing a small flat rate box to Canada:

456987

That really puts a damper on cross border marketing.

Aaron, do you ever come across the border towards Portland, Oregon?

jtk

It is the same, or worse, going the other way. Shipping was more reasonable a few years ago. This has really put a damper on my eBay sales. Meanwhile, packages under a kilo from China are subsidized by these rates. Lots of the Eclipse style ones there (https://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale?catId=0&initiative_id=SB_20210504191821&SearchText=sawset). But I doubt they have the desirable brass body.

[Jim Koepke]

Howdy Chuck and Welcome to the Creek.

My brother sells a lot on ebay and it seems the Postal Services around the world also subsidizes ebay shipping with the rates charged to those of us who mail one or two items at a time and walk up to the counter in the local Post Office.

jtk

[lowell holmes]

https://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=mcafee&type=E211US739G0&p=saw+set+tool

[Stewie Simpson]

Aaron; the Eclipse #77 Saw Set was manufactured with 2 different sized hammers. 1 designed for coarser set teeth, and the other for finer set teeth. The finer hammer is normally identified by red paint on the underside of the main body. A search within EBAY U.K is normally the best option to purchase both types of #77.

Srewie;

[Tom M King]

Aaron, I haven't forgotten about it. I have your address in my pocket, but have not gone in the direction that stuff is since this.

[Derek Cohen]

Aaron; the Eclipse #77 Saw Set was manufactured with 2 different sized hammers. 1 designed for coarser set teeth, and the other for finer set teeth. The finer hammer is normally identified by red paint on the underside of the main body. A search within EBAY U.K is normally the best option to purchase both types of #77.

Srewie;

Interesting that Stewie. I have a bunch of #77s and was not aware that there were different size hammers. My understanding has been that the smallest teeth the #77 dealt with was about 12 tpi, which is why I grind them down.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Rob Lee]

HI -

We've got a saw set in prototype stages right now....

I would be interested in what y'all feel is a "reasonable" price. I think it's unlikely that a decent saw set will ever get made again (unless by a small firm such as ourselves) as most production saws have impulse hardened teeth, and are not really re-sharpenable. The demand is just not there to attract a volume manufacturer.

Right now - our estimated price is in the $75 range (lots of tooling).

Used saw sets are not that hard to find (at least in North America) and can be had for a few dollars to just shy of $100.

Cheers -

Rob

(in the the last (hopefully) 2 weeks of a two-month lockdown.....)

[Scott Winners]

I would be interested in what y'all feel is a "reasonable" price.
Right now - our estimated price is in the $75 range (lots of tooling).

Cheers -

Rob



The three things I see when I see a vintage set in an antique store:

How much time and effort will I have to invest to put this thing in working order?
How long will it last once I get it working?
Is it still accurate, or am I going to have to calibrate it too?

Score vintage=0, Lee Valley =3.

If you can some up with a saw set good enough to put the Lee Valley name on at $75, I will take four for handsaws 5-12 tpi and two for backsaws 14-20 tpi and be done worrying about saw sets for the rest of my life.

Thanks for considering the problem even if it never makes production.

[glenn bradley]

Have spent $1 on each of these....YMMV......mine are both 100 yrs + old...

Unless you're offering to sell him one reasonably I don't know that this helps ;-)

Certainly the used market was already skewing prior to COVID-19 and has now completely lost its mind. Like building materials and other skyrocketing goods, new and used, continued purchasing assures continued high prices. Since the alternative is to put things on hold we, who can't wait have little choice in the matter.

There are cheap alternatives to the de-facto standard Somax, Millers Falls, and Stanly offerings although their longevity may be reflected in their price. A "Great Neck SS&" is about $20 and should get you through in a pinch. Like Steve I run older units, a Millers Falls and a Somex. It seems that finding these without spending more-than-expected money or time is a non-starter right now.

[steven c newman]

IF the OP wants one of mine...I just need an address to send one to him. No biggie....

[Jim Koepke]

IF the OP wants one of mine...I just need an address to send one to him. No biggie....

It might be less expensive for you to drive across the boarder to ship it to the OP/ than it would be for most of us.

jtk

[glenn bradley]

IF the OP wants one of mine...I just need an address to send one to him. No biggie....

Cool offer Steven. Kudos! :). I missed the fact that the OP is in AK. I could see that putting a limit on the local used market.

[Jim Koepke]

Cool offer Steven. Kudos! :). I missed the fact that the OP is in AK. I could see that putting a limit on the local used market.

Look again Glenn, Scott is in Alaska, Aaron is in Vancouver Canada.

jtk

[Mark Rainey]

HI -

We've got a saw set in prototype stages right now....

I would be interested in what y'all feel is a "reasonable" price. I think it's unlikely that a decent saw set will ever get made again (unless by a small firm such as ourselves) as most production saws have impulse hardened teeth, and are not really re-sharpenable. The demand is just not there to attract a volume manufacturer.

Right now - our estimated price is in the $75 range (lots of tooling).

Used saw sets are not that hard to find (at least in North America) and can be had for a few dollars to just shy of $100.

Cheers -

Rob

(in the the last (hopefully) 2 weeks of a two-month lockdown.....)

I would buy a quality new saw set for $75.

[Curt Putnam]

What is the size range(s)? I have saws ranging from 20 TPI to 4.5 TPI. Swappable hammers? I lucked into a 42X for < $50. As Scott said, if easily calibrated and accurate covering the size range then $75 = Contented.

[Stewie Simpson]

Interesting that Stewie. I have a bunch of #77s and was not aware that there were different size hammers. My understanding has been that the smallest teeth the #77 dealt with was about 12 tpi, which is why I grind them down.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Derek; attached is an article that covers the 2 different sized hammers featured on the Eclipse # 77 Saw Sets.

http://benchblog.com/2013/12/eclipse-77-saw-sets/

regards Stewie;

[Thomas Wilson]

I am a contributor to the sky high prices on the Stanley 42x. I bought one in really good condition with the original box and instruction sheet on eBay. Based on the lack of wear on the hammer and anvil, the saw set appears not to have been used very much. Even though the price was high, I was pleased to get it. I have an engineer/machinist friend who might be able to make a hammer with a narrower nose. The instruction sheet mentions that they were available back in the day.

For those who wonder if I got a different model without realizing it, mine has 42X cast into the handle on the underneath side.

“What this country needs is a good 5 cent cigar” and and a good $75 saw set. It would be ok if the saw set came from Canada.

[Stewie Simpson]

The only fault I found with purchasing a highly used 42x is the original hammer springs tend to soften over time. Replacement springs are available.

https://secondchancesawworks.bigcartel.com/product/replacement-springs-for-stanley-no-42x-saw-set

Stewie;

[Jim Koepke]

The only fault I found with purchasing a highly used 42x is the original hammer springs tend to soften over time. Replacement springs are available.

https://secondchancesawworks.bigcartel.com/product/replacement-springs-for-stanley-no-42x-saw-set

Stewie;

One set of the replacement springs was purchased for one of my saw sets. In my opinion, if the old springs are working, don't change them out. The new springs require more effort to set a tooth. Also, the new hammer spring needed to be trimmed a bit to allow the hammer to fully reach the anvil.

jtk

[Tom M King]

The 42X takes out almost all, or at least the vast majority, of human error. For those that don't know, it has a decent sized plunger that grabs the saw plate, holding it in a consistent position, before it engages the tooth.

I used a 42W for decades before I ever knew anything about a 42X. The 42W didn't have the plunger. I had to stone teeth a lot more back then, than I do now since getting the 42X's. No doubt part of that is experience, but with a hand somewhat tired from filing all the teeth, that grabbing plunger is a welcome thing to have. I set most of the time after filing the teeth.

I don't see the benefit of any new design that doesn't include some type of grabbing mechanism.

[Stewie Simpson]

One set of the replacement springs was purchased for one of my saw sets. In my opinion, if the old springs are working, don't change them out. The new springs require more effort to set a tooth. Also, the new hammer spring needed to be trimmed a bit to allow the hammer to fully reach the anvil.

jtk

Fair call Jim. But if you read the sellers brief, based on feedback a design change was made to the outer replacement spring to address the issue you raised.


After selling out the original run I took the opportunity to make improvements based on feedback. The inner, smaller spring is untouched but the outer spring is 25% to help with return rate and resistance. The size and installation remains the same

regards Stewie;

[Jim Koepke]

Fair call Jim. But if you read the sellers brief, based on feedback a design change was made to the outer replacement spring to address the issue you raised.

regards Stewie;

Thanks Stewie,

This may have been missed or it may have taken place after my purchase. In any case the old springs are still in the shop and may be used or the new springs adjusted. It may also be the local Wilco hardware has springs in their bins that will serve well for this.

jtk

[Aaron Rosenthal]

Rob, depending upon which currency you're quoting, it would sound reasonable. I still have a balance left on my gift card .......

[lowell holmes]

Check this tool. https://www.amazon.com/s?k=saw+set+tool&crid=DTDEQUGE86XB&sprefix=saw+set+%2Caps%2C193&ref=nb_sb_ss_ts-doa-p_1_8

[Derek Cohen]

Derek; attached is an article that covers the 2 different sized hammers featured on the Eclipse # 77 Saw Sets.

http://benchblog.com/2013/12/eclipse-77-saw-sets/

regards Stewie;

Thanks Stewie

I used one of the red versions today. It did a good job on a 15tpi dovetail saw.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Stewie Simpson]

Thanks Stewie

I used one of the red versions today. It did a good job on a 15tpi dovetail saw.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Appreciate the feedback Derek.

regards Stewie.

[Juergen Mueller]

I've bought such a set. The anvil is soft as butter.

[Stewie Simpson]

I've bought such a set. The anvil is soft as butter.

Juergen; if it has a soft anvil its likely you bought a Somax 250. A pitiful copy of the Eclipse 77.

Google "Somax soft anvil".

regards Stewie ;

[ken carroll]

It's funny how these theories get propagated. "The Stanley 42X" is the ONLY one to get! Everyone believes it, and prices skyrocket.
I have a 42X and a 77, a few Taintor #7s, a Disston Triumph. They all work more or less equally well. I also have another Stanley 42 (non "x")with a wide hammer, which would also probably be just as good with a little grinding.
Don't get hung up on the 42X, it is nothing special.

[Juergen Mueller]

No it is no Somax. Jieli ist printed on the saw and you can find it at amazon or ebay. Chinese or Indian made i think.
The copy of a copy of a... They even invented a new lense for the vise. So if you just could talk to the guys making them tell them what to do better...

[Jim Koepke]

It's funny how these theories get propagated. "The Stanley 42X" is the ONLY one to get!

One of the reasons the #42X is popular is it grips the saw blade just before it presses the tooth.

It is also a known entity over the life of its manufacture.

There are many with a similar operation made by other makers. Sometimes they will be listed in discussions of saw sets.

Some saw sets on the auction sites are more suited for tree cutting saws.

Of all the different saw sets Stanley put on the market, the #42X is the one people who work on saws for a living have chosen for the job.

Of all the saw sets that have crossed my path in the wild in the last decade, the #42X is the only one that comes home with me when it is offered at a good price.

If a decent one of a different make appears, it will be considered. Most of them have an overly large hammer or hold the saw plate with a bolt. Sure they could work. Most of the time they are more work than result.

jtk

[lowell holmes]

See this.

https://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=mcafee&type=E211US739G0&p=saw+set+tool

[ken carroll]

One of the reasons the #42X is popular is it grips the saw blade just before it presses the tooth.


jtk

The Triumph and the Eclipse 77 also grip the saw before the hammer sets the teeth. Triumph 280 hammer and early eclipse 77 hammers are simiar in size to the 42X. Later Eclipse or bigger Triumph have larger hammers which can easily be modified.
There's no magic in the 42X.

[Jim Koepke]

There's no magic in the 42X.

The magic is in the marketing hype that has raised user's desires.

jtk

[steven c newman]

As before...I have 2 saw sets the OP can have...we just need a way to mail the small flat rate box to a P.O. on this side of the border....and have someone pick it up there...I'll pay the postage that far...

458623
One is coarse teeth, the other is for fine teeth

[Brian Ward]

We've got a saw set in prototype stages right now....

I would be interested in what y'all feel is a "reasonable" price. I think it's unlikely that a decent saw set will ever get made again (unless by a small firm such as ourselves) as most production saws have impulse hardened teeth, and are not really re-sharpenable. The demand is just not there to attract a volume manufacturer.


I'm glad to hear that you're working on one (I'd been wondering). To me, your $75 target would be more than reasonable if it performs as expected, and has a certain set of features. The ones that stand out for me (and this is probably your laundry list as well) are:

(1) Ease of adjustment. This is a sore point in every vintage set that I own. It's just a pain to rotate or slide the anvil to just the right spot and lock it down again without slop somewhere in the system. I'm not asking for precise labels saying how far out the set will be, because that depends on plate thickness, tooth size, and stuff. Just having that thing behave when I move it would be great.
(2) Interchangeable hammers. For big and small teeth, and to replace when they get worn.
(3) The grip-the-plate (dual plunger) feature. This is the big one on the much-ballyhooed 42X, but the Disston Triumph has it as well. Though you can get by without this, it makes use a lot easier if you have it, and a premium tool should have it or an equivalent.
(4) Ergonomics. I don't use the 42/42X styles and Millers Falls sets because they feel awful in the hand, especially after setting a whole bunch of teeth. I've been using my Disston Triumph on larger saws and my Somax on the smaller ones. And it's not like those are great; they're just not totally dreadful.
(5) Better registration on the toothline. On most sets, the registration edges are kind of narrow, and they can slip around into larger tooth gullets. The Disston Triumph has a flap-like thing that you can adjust even with the sides of the set, or below it, giving you precise control of the where the hammer will land on the tooth in the vertical dimension. I think someone else here mentioned that thing, but it is pretty nice.
(6) Vision. Maybe this isn't such an important feature, but it would be nice if there were obvious visual cues pointing to the tooth that you're about to set.

As you say, it's not a huge market. But interest in saw sharpening is higher now than it was a decade ago, and one of the sore remaining points is indeed that the options for plier-type saw sets are basically wretched. Personally, I have five saw sets, but I'd buy a Veritas set in an instant if I knew that I would never again need to use any of my old ones.

[Pete Taran]

There's no magic in the 42X.

Ken,

There is some magic in the 42X, and that is it is the best designed tool for the job, from a function standpoint and an ergonomics standpoint.

Functionally has been discussed above, namely the gripping of the plate before the tooth setting.

Ergonomically, it shines even brighter. The eclipse and triumph sets have the handles straight and are MUCH HARDER to squeeze in that orientation. It simply tires out your wrist much more quickly than a set that is rotated 90 degrees as in all the sets that Stanley made. Its just more natural and comfortable to squeeze that grip with your clenched hand than the other style of sets.

Sure, you might set a random saw and not notice anything, but spend a couple hours with that in your hand and you will quickly be putting it on the shelf in favor of a 42X style set. That is the main reason most people that doctor or make saws prefer the 42X.

So, there is magic in the 42X.

Happy squeezing.

[Brian Ward]

Ergonomically, it shines even brighter. The eclipse and triumph sets have the handles straight and are MUCH HARDER to squeeze in that orientation. It simply tires out your wrist much more quickly than a set that is rotated 90 degrees as in all the sets that Stanley made. Its just more natural and comfortable to squeeze that grip with your clenched hand than the other style of sets.

Huh. That's really curious, because my experience has been the polar opposite, with the Stanley (and other more upright-style) sets giving me a lot of agony over the years. I've found that after big saw setting jamborees, the rear grip is really uncomfortable in my palm and my wrist hurts. By comparison, the Triumph and Somax (Eclipse) sets give me little trouble, though I'm certainly not going to pretend that they're ergonomic wonders.

I wonder if this has anything to do with body position over the saw when sharpening. When working on a saw, I like to have it down fairly low and get right over top, with my forearm hanging at (some kind of?) diagonal while holding the set. So I tend not feel that my wrist is contorted when using a horizontal-style set. Even more speculatively, the Triumph and Somax sets have longer handles, so (maybe) they offer more leverage. I guess that could be tested sometime.

Maybe we could compare notes here? Do you put the saw up higher?

(note: this older post (https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?219965-Millers-Falls-214-Manual&p=2291711#post2291711) also mentions saw position)

[ken carroll]

Ken,

There is some magic in the 42X, and that is it is the best designed tool for the job, from a function standpoint and an ergonomics standpoint.

Functionally has been discussed above, namely the gripping of the plate before the tooth setting.

Ergonomically, it shines even brighter. The eclipse and triumph sets have the handles straight and are MUCH HARDER to squeeze in that orientation. It simply tires out your wrist much more quickly than a set that is rotated 90 degrees as in all the sets that Stanley made. Its just more natural and comfortable to squeeze that grip with your clenched hand than the other style of sets.

Sure, you might set a random saw and not notice anything, but spend a couple hours with that in your hand and you will quickly be putting it on the shelf in favor of a 42X style set. That is the main reason most people that doctor or make saws prefer the 42X.

So, there is magic in the 42X.

Happy squeezing.

Pete,
I guess that's why we say YMMV.
As you know the other two sets also clamp the saw plate before the hammer sets the tooth, so there's no magic there.

I'm sure you've sat in front of many more saws than I, but I find the ergos of the Eclipse 77 far nicer than the 42X. Maybe I'll give the 42X another shot to see if anything has changed.

[Jim Koepke]

The preference or ergonomics of the tool's design may depend on how one holds the saw during the setting.

If one is set up with the saw teeth at eye level the 'pistol grip' of the #42 may make more sense.

If one has the saw held lower and viewing from above the 'plier grip' may be more comfortable.

Different working styles can make one tool more comfortable than another.

jtk

[Tom M King]

I raise the saw up in the vise, for setting the teeth. Arm position must make the difference for people that like either, or.

[Derek Cohen]

I hold the saw plate in my left hand and grip the Eclipse or 42X in my right hand. This way it is possible to turn the teeth into the best position to see them.

Regards from Perth

Derek