Sawstop Rusting Quickly

[derek labian]

I switched to a sawstop PCS about 3 weeks ago. I degreased it and coated it with Glidecoat. I got it out today and it has a sizable amount of rust on it. I must be doing something wrong. I didn't cut that much wood on it, so I hadn't re-applied another coat since unbundling it. Any advice on this and any advice on what to do about the rust on it?

I have no problems with other equipment including new jointer and old shaper, same process. The only thing I can figure is that the wood rubbed off the coating, and it rusted, perhaps I need to re-apply glidecoat ever weekend?

Attached pictures were after i soaked it with a WD40 degreaser today, cleaned it with mineral spirits, and then re-glide-coated it.

[Steve Eure]

In my experience, those spray coatings don't last as long as good ole paste wax. I had the same problem on my lathe using glide-coat, so it's back to the wax. I even tried some WD-40 silicon spray. It goes on much like glide-coat. Spray it on, let it dry, and rub off. Really makes things slide well, but it doesn't last long.

[Doug Dawson]

In my experience, those spray coatings don't last as long as good ole paste wax. I had the same problem on my lathe using glide-coat, so it's back to the wax. I even tried some WD-40 silicon spray. It goes on much like glide-coat. Spray it on, let it dry, and rub off. Really makes things slide well, but it doesn't last long.
What I find works best is a coat of rust preventative (I use CRC 3 36,) let it soak into the pores and dry, then a liberal layer of paste wax on top of that. Never a problem with rust, a year or more between touch-ups.

[Alan Lightstone]

I use CRC 3-36 also, but have had some minor rust issues with it. Perhaps I'm not applying it often enough, and I don't wax afterwards which I think I'll try doing now.

That being said, CRC 3-36 was tested very highly by a woodworking magazine a few years ago, and I do use a bunch of it here in 150% humidity Florida.

Where are you located? Your anti-rust regimen depends on how humid your shop/home is, and how often there are big changes in temperature/humidity.

[Bryce Andersen]

Do you guys use the spray bottle or the airerosol can?

[derek labian]

Alan,

It's in my garage currently so it can get pretty humid. I'm trying to build a dedicated shop, but the permit process is very slow if I get approved at all. Just trying to bide my time until I either move or build a shop.

Doug/Steve,

Good advice, I just ordered some. Ill do that and go back to paste wax. I want to get the rust off and its probably mostly surface rust. What do you guys find the best process? I tried some recommended acids but didn't like the results on other tools.

[Jason Evans]

I can’t say much more than the others have, but OUCH! A Brand new sawstop!

I’ve started using Crc 3-36 too sprayed onto a shop towel and lightly wipe down the top, then paste wax after a day or two of drying. The crc didn’t seem to dry all the way, I even let it dry for like 4-5 days when I first got the saw. So I can’t imagine the crc alone would last too long with use, could be wrong though.

I think I’ll just stick with the paste wax though since it dries fast.

[Doug Dawson]

Alan,

It's in my garage currently so it can get pretty humid. I'm trying to build a dedicated shop, but the permit process is very slow if I get approved at all. Just trying to bide my time until I either move or build a shop.

Doug/Steve,

Good advice, I just ordered some. Ill do that and go back to paste wax. I want to get the rust off and its probably mostly surface rust. What do you guys find the best process? I tried some recommended acids but didn't like the results on other tools.
I use the sandflex hand blocks: https://www.amazon.com/Sandflex-Sanding-Block-3-Pack/dp/B000GACU1Q/ref=sr_1_2?crid=1RD3UX58EFIVU&dchild=1&keywords=sandflex+sanding+block&qid=1615670951&s=hi&sprefix=Sandflex+sanding+block%2Ctools%2C181&sr=1-2 for minor rust touch-ups.

The CRC 3 36 I get in a spray bottle, you can get gallon refills for it.

[Charles Coolidge]

Glidecoat is a poor rust inhibitor. It's great for creating a slick surface wood glides over (love it for that) but I made the same mistake thinking it would inhibit rust. Now I wipe down the machines with Boeshield T-9 here in the pacific NW rain forest.

Another product, Evaporust will eradicate the rust. Very cool stuff I first used it on a vintage radial arm saw rebuild, unreal how well it worked.

[Cary Falk]

I use T9 followed by paste wax.

[jim sauterer]

I have used Johnson paste wax for years. Works for me

[Curt Putnam]

CorrosionX HD - spray it om, let it soak in, wipe off and follow with Johnson's Paste Wax

[Alan Lightstone]

I'm not sure the CRC 3-36 dries either. I use the Aerosol cans, and wipe it off the next day.

I have had small bits of breakthrough rust, though, so I think I'll start following this with paste wax. Don't like the stuff, but if it works, who cares...

[Frank Pratt]

In my experience, those spray coatings don't last as long as good ole paste wax. I had the same problem on my lathe using glide-coat, so it's back to the wax. I even tried some WD-40 silicon spray. It goes on much like glide-coat. Spray it on, let it dry, and rub off. Really makes things slide well, but it doesn't last long.

You should be aware that anything containing silicon should not be used in a wood shop. The tiniest amount on the surface will cause havoc with finishes. And it's very difficult to get off of wood.

[Mike Goetzke]

I used this process for my cast iron tops that many suggested years ago. It was know as "Dave's Dirty Dozen." I modified it a bit but mostly stuck with list below:

1) Scrape as much of the sludge as you can off with cardboard from the shipping container or a plastic scraper.
2) Use Simple Green right out of the container and tons of paper towels to get the rest off.
3) Wash off the Simple Green with more paper towels and clear water. Dry off with even more paper towels.
4) Spray the top down liberally with WD40. The WD in WD40 stands for Water Displacing, by the way.
5) Take a finishing sander, like a Porter-Cable 330, and put it on a ScotchBrite green pad. Random Orbital will work, but makes a hell of a mess.
6) Sand the top evenly until you feel like you've "massaged" the WD40 in very well. This also will knock some sharp spots off your top, a good thing.
7) Take even more paper towels, and wipe the top until dry. It will feel slightly oily.
8) Using a quality furniture paste wax (Johnson's, Minwax, Butcher's, whatever is available in your area), wax the top thoroughly and allow to dry.
9) Wipe off the bulk of the excess wax with paper towels.
10) Wax it again.
11) Buff well with paper towels.
12) Last step. Take a piece of wood with straight edges, and rub the surface of the saw in the direction of cut with the wood, as though you were cross-cutting it.
It's a damn sight more steps than "wash off with kerosene", which is what all the manuals say. But, it leaves a top that is seriously ready for work, and won't need to be screwed with every couple months. I rewax my tops every year or two, and they ain't rusty...


Dave Arbuckle

[Peter Kelly]

Someone here mentioned they'd trimmed magnetic sheets to fit the bare metal tops of their machines to keep moisture off when not in use. Haven't tried this but it sounded like a clever solution.

[Bill Dufour]

location and climate? Moving to the Mojave desert may not work as well as you think. Portions are not buildable due to flooding.

[derek labian]

Another product, Evaporust will eradicate the rust. Very cool stuff I first used it on a vintage radial arm saw rebuild, unreal how well it worked.

It looks like most people are submerging items in evaporust. How are you applying it to a TS?

[derek labian]

I actually was using Paste Wax (Johnsons) and then I saw one of those monthly meetings from WWGOA guy who said he doesn't use paste wax because it gets in your projects pores. Instead he uses Glidecote etc. I think the difference is he has a climate controlled shop. Bad advice. I'm going back to paste wax after I get this rust cleaned up. Thanks to everyone for the responses.

[Doug Dawson]

It looks like most people are submerging items in evaporust. How are you applying it to a TS?
I’ve had good success removing rust by dipping stuff in Evaporust for a while. But I’ve never found it very useful as a surface application. (Yes I’ve tried this.)

[Doug Dawson]

I actually was using Paste Wax (Johnsons) and then I saw one of those monthly meetings from WWGOA guy who said he doesn't use paste wax because it gets in your projects pores. Instead he uses Glidecote etc. I think the difference is he has a climate controlled shop. Bad advice. I'm going back to paste wax after I get this rust cleaned up. Thanks to everyone for the responses.
I’ve never had a problem with buffed-out paste wax contaminating wood surfaces, and I’ve never heard of anyone who seriously has.

[Ron Bontz]

I paste wax my tools once or twice a year and keep the tools I am not using all the time covered with those moisture covers. No issues. This time a year, in particular is easy for condensation to form due to the back and forth hot/ cold temps., ( if you shop is not temp control ) , and the normal rainy season moisture.

[Alan Lightstone]

OK, so you convinced me at least. I sprayed CRC 3-36 on my table saw, bandsaw, and jointer a few days ago, and yesterday put on Johnson's Paste Wax and buffed it. Had to use my car buffer - it really didn't want to buff off easily by hand. I must have put on too much.

Anyway, very smooth to the touch now. Ready for the car show. Or cutting wood. Time will tell how well it will work for rust in good old Florida, albeit climate controlled Florida.

[Alan Gage]

I'd recommend running a dehumidifier. I'm terrible about remembering to wax my equipment but I don't have any rust issues.

A dehumidifier will keep your lumber drier too.

Alan

[George Yetka]

My garage in NJ is on the opposite side the wind hits the house. For whatever reason when I get rain/snow in the cold followed by an unseasonably warm day I bring in enough humidity to surface rust everything in my garage. For the rest of the year its not too bad but will creap up on me.

I coat all my hand tools with ballistol every 6 month or so and after any sharpening. the tops get cleaned and I get away with just glidecoat/ felder spray. I added a dehumidifier and run the hose out to driveway.

I put Dessicant cans( I actually 3d print the cans and fill them with rechargable beads) in each drawer and stopped using a tool wall for anything bare steel.

DEHUMIDIFIER is key( i have an LG 50 pint but if you have the money get a permanent solution like Santa Fe)

[Roger Feeley]

I use T9 followed by paste wax.

I had to put all my machines in storage for over a year while we constructed our house. I used t9 followed by paste wax on the machined surfaces and there was no rust.

I also protected the cast iron by taping cardboard over the machined surfaces. That was so we could pile things on top. The band saw table and table saw wings were removed and packed separately to cut down on the weight.

[Charles Coolidge]

It looks like most people are submerging items in evaporust. How are you applying it to a TS?

For flat surfaces like a table saw guys soak paper towels in Evaporust, lay them out across the table then cover the table in plastic wrap so it doesn't dry out. Somewhere there's a vintage machine forum, there are quite a few threads on this over there where guys are restoring old iron machines. I think that's where I first read about Evaporust.

[Myk Rian]

OK, I'm going to toss this into the ring.
Use Bar Keepers Friend to get the rust off.
Get the mess from that removed any way you want. Simple Green, etc.
Use naphtha or alcohol to scrub the table to the metal.
Apply paste wax and melt it into the surface with a heat gun.
Buff it up and use it.

[derek labian]

I've ordered a dehumidifier w/ 70pt capacity, I figure that can't hurt. I also received the CRC 3-36. I think I'm going to start with that and a paste wax layer on top.

Interesting tip on bar keepers friend, I have some of that around the house, I'll have to look into it.

[Carroll Courtney]

What I use and it does seem to work will last few months. I spray it on small rag maybe 6"x6" kinda soak it down with spray then work it into the cast iron top. Do that couple times, then I put that rag into a baggie so it will stay wet. Does not leave an oil film on surface but do have to let it soak in and dry. I also have couple cans of T9 which is also works for few months.

[derek labian]

Ironically, I had originally laid down paste wax, but took it off a few weeks ago after the WWGOA recommendation for Glidecote.

So I've gotten the Sandflex pads, the CRC 3-36 spray, and the dehumidifier. I stripped down all the exposed iron (jointer, saw, planer, sander, drill press, band saw, and shaper). I used WD-40 and the sanding blocks to get up the rust, it went pretty well. I was very gentile with the jointer and left rust that didn't matter.

I cleaned that up and then laid down the CRC 3-36 with a light stray over all the equipment. It wasn't clear how long to leave it on there though? I left it on about 10 minutes, then wiped off the excess. I've now applied the paste wax. and am letting it dry before i clean it off.

Dehumidifier gets turned on tomorrow.

Hopefully I did this right! it was a lot of work. I need a margarita.

New dehumidifier needs to rest for 24 hours after shipment.

454668

Wax applied. Any techniques for hand buffing this out? (Edit: I bought a little Ryobi Buffer)

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[Doug Dawson]

I cleaned that up and then laid down the CRC 3-36 with a light stray over all the equipment. It wasn't clear how long to leave it on there though? I left it on about 10 minutes, then wiped off the excess. I've now applied the paste wax. and am letting it dry before i clean it off.


Wax applied. Any techniques for hand buffing this out? (Edit: I bought a little Ryobi Buffer)

I like to leave the CRC on overnight so it dries more by itself, but it probably doesn’t matter. It takes a long time to dry.

As far as buffing goes, just an old tshirt and some elbow grease. I’ve used that Ryobi before and it was terrible, maybe you can return it.

[Richard Coers]

A simple way to limit rust in a garage is covering the saw table. A plastic sheet, custom vinyl cover, etc... Just anything that won't absorb water. Condensation falls from the air and settles on a surface that is a different temperature than ambient air. Cover the saw and the condensation settles on the cover. Paste wax is important too. If you don't believe me, cut a square of cardboard and place it on the table. Rust will cover the table, except for where the cardboard sits. Cardboard does/t make a good cover as it absorbs the moister and then sits there wet. A much more elaborate way to protect it is to build an insulated box around it and keep an incandescent light bulb going inside when the cast iron is colder than ambient air.

[John Gornall]

My shop is on an island in a rain forest near the ocean - no rust

The key is understanding humidity (hydrodynamics) - used to be part of my job as an engineer

Right now it's 44 degrees and 80% humidity outside

Bring that outside air into the shop and heat it to a comfy 70 degrees and the humidity drops to 36%

But seal up your shop, breath all day, and have your shop at 70 degrees and 80% when you close up for the night and turn down the heat and when the air cools the humidity will hit saturation (more than 100%) and you'll get dew and rust.

The key in my shop is ventilation day and night

What is the humidity in your shop? Get a hygrometer and find out. Even better is a recording hygrometer so you can see what happens all night.

100% - bingo there's dew

A little science goes a long way.

[Paul Haus]

I'm going to add 2 cents to this discussion. I have had basement shops for years, so that's my basis. I clean and wax the machines on a regular basis with Johnsons paste wax. Out of all the tablesaws, jointers, lathes etc I've owned over the years, only one ever gave me pain with rust. I had a import jointer that no matter what I did every few weeks rust started showing on the bed. I've had both newer and older machines and quite frankly they do not have issues like that Jet did. I ended up getting rid of it and getting an older replacement and that's been fine as have the other machines. Some just seem to be prone to rust, no matter what you do.