Tool list for Bench crafted Roubo Split top build

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

Hi everyone, I plan on building a Benchcrafted Roubo. my question (I hope it is in the right place) was has anyone here built one? what were the small tools you felt most useful? I have the major tool list down (I am going to work all hand tools and a router ) but for instance, I recently discovered that they suggest I get a tap for the screws. I am wondering what other tools I may be missing for the build (leg and tail vise).

If anyone has a suggestion I would be happy to hear!

[Jim Koepke]

I recently discovered that they suggest I get a tap for the screws.

Something must have gone right over my head. Where does one have to tap for screws when building a bench?

Before reading that my reply was going to be some stout chisels for the mortises:

453058

Of course one needs a mallet to drive the chisels.

The chisel in use is a 3/4" found in a secondhand store. A 1" chisel was used for the cross members. The chisel on the bench is a 1/2" swan neck or lock mortise chisel. It is handy for cleaning up the bottom of mortises.

A few planes for cleaning up the lumber being used:

453059

A brace and bits is helpful for drilling out the mortises. For me it is almost as fast just banging them out. If you are going to use round dogs then a bit for drilling the dog holes is mandatory whether you will be doing it by hand or with an electric drill. It is also mandatory to have a drill if you are going to use draw boring to lock the tenons in the mortises.

And of course one will need a saw to cut the tenons.

jtk

[David Bassett]

... I recently discovered that they suggest I get a tap for the screws. I am wondering what other tools I may be missing for the build (leg and tail vise)....

Who's "they"?

The only reason for a tap I can think of is for the vise screw to thread into and I think most people inset a premade nut for that. What does "they" say you should use the tap for?

Confused.

[Jim Ritter]

The tap is used for cutting threads in the bench leg to fasten the nut for the leg vise. They use machine screws. Lie-Nielsen does the same thing. It is very strong. And since they don’t get removed and inserted but once no need for a threaded insert.
Jim

[ken hatch]

The tap is used for cutting threads in the bench leg to fasten the nut for the leg vise. They use machine screws. Lie-Nielsen does the same thing. It is very strong. And since they don’t get removed and inserted but once no need for a threaded insert.
Jim

What Jim said.

Assaf,

I've built the BenchCrafted Roubo, it has been a few years but if I remember correctly the metal tap and die set was about it for special tools. Hope you have someone to help, even with a split top everything is heavy and hard to sling around the shop. My only two suggestions are to use the crisscross and not the parallel guide for the leg vise and to think about your work flow before installing the wagon vise, I didn't find it was worth the effort to install.

ken

[Scott Winners]

In his most recent workbench book Chrtis Schwarz installed the leg vise with criss cross, but instead of tapping the wood he used a tapered drill bit and wood screws to attach the criss cross hardware. I can maybe look that up Saturday, I am kinfa buried here and it is still snowing.

Swan neck for the stopped mortises I agree. If you aren't going super deep you might could use a router plane, but with a swan neck you could go as deep as you want. Swan necks I see local are typically 3/4 or 1 inch. If yu can find a 1/2 inch one local vintage you won't use it often, but half inch might someday be useful on larger furniture items, 3/4 and up would be a thing to resell or save for your next bench build.

Gotta go.

[Jon Snider]

Starting the search to build a new workbench to replace the old one built many years ago. Can someone tell me the function of the split in the top?

[Christopher Charles]

Hi,

Sounds like fun. I don't remember any special tools either, though I think I did buy a milling bit to route the dogholes. I was not a fan of the split top except for the build itself. I did install the wagon vise and use it all the time, unlike Ken. For the work I do, I'd probably get a traditional tail vise because I often work with small parts.

The saga can be found here:

https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?169730-Is-the-Klausz-Frid-Scand-Bench-Dead

Have fun!

[Jim Koepke]

Swan necks I see local are typically 3/4 or 1 inch. If yu can find a 1/2 inch one local vintage you won't use it often, but half inch might someday be useful on larger furniture items, 3/4 and up would be a thing to resell or save for your next bench build.

Those big ones must be for timber framing or mine supports.

Also consider a 1/2" swan neck can work in a 3/4" or 1" mortise. A 3/4" or 1" swan neck won't work in a 1/2" mortise.

jtk

[Cliff Polubinsky]

Jon,

The primary reason for the split top is that it expands your clamping capabilities. Normally the center opening is filled with a removable piece to give you an unbroken bench top. I don't remember if it's in the plans but I put slots in the center of the filler to store chisels, marking guages, etc. while working. When you remove the filler you can now place clamps in center of the bench which is handy for narrower parts or allows clamping from the center of the bench when you need to clamp a piece to the front of the bench and don't have or want to drag out the clamps that will reach all the way across your bench.

My bench is a split top Roubo built from Benchcrafted plans and it does everything I need. Something that surprised me is that I use the wagon vise much more than the leg vise. Probably 20 to 1.

Cliff

Cliff

[Jon Snider]

Thank you Cliff. Much appreciated.

[Scott Winners]

Those big ones must be for timber framing or mine supports.

Also consider a 1/2" swan neck can work in a 3/4" or 1" mortise. A 3/4" or 1" swan neck won't work in a 1/2" mortise.

jtk

I think you are right. I haven't bought one of the bigger ones yet. If I see a half inch swan neck I will probably grab it. As you mentioned, a 1/2 inch swan neck can work in a wider mortise and _might_ someday be useful on big heavy furniture. A 3/4 or wider swan neck is good for workbenches, buildings, and as you pointed out mine supports.

[Todd Sebek]

I just finished building mine. It was a lot of fun. I’m a complete amateur that enjoys learning the challenges of it. The Benchcrafted hardware is really REALLY nice. It took me around 100+ hours but a lot of it I have never done before. A tools that I can think of are: a long calibrated straight edge, 12” combo square, dowel plate of draw boring instead of a knockdown style, 5/16 tap, 3/8 Brad point bit for the chop assembly, a 1 5/8 Forstner bit did a lot of the heavy removal for the mortise in the chop and leg - you could go slightly bigger. I’m sure I could think of more. I went to the store a LOT but I used a lot of power tools and hand tools. I hope this helps. Have fun!

[scott lipscomb]

"Starting the search to build a new workbench to replace the old one built many years ago. Can someone tell me the function of the split in the top?"

It seems to me a split top is really a whole different design from a traditional one piece top Roubo which avoids the issue of expansion and contraction of the top working against the joints between the legs and the short side stretchers. I am not sure if the clamping options drove that design.

[ken hatch]

"Starting the search to build a new workbench to replace the old one built many years ago. Can someone tell me the function of the split in the top?"

It seems to me a split top is really a whole different design from a traditional one piece top Roubo which avoids the issue of expansion and contraction of the top working against the joints between the legs and the short side stretchers. I am not sure if the clamping options drove that design.

Scott,

The only real advantage is in ease of build. The split slabs will likely fit in most shop's planer when a full slab will not. The smaller slab will weigh less and be easier to handle during the build. I find an asymmetric split slab is usually the best of all bench building worlds, but of course YMMV.

BTW, if you are looking to build a new workbench don't over look building a Moravian bench. I've built both Roubo's and Moravian benches, the Moravian has a lot to offer.

ken

[Jim Koepke]

Another useful tool was remembered, a pair of winding sticks. This will help with the truing up the top.

jtk

[Andrew Nemeth]

I find an asymmetric split slab is usually the best of all bench building worlds

Ken, Out of curiosity, what do you think the ideal proportions of the asymmetrical split would be? I’m about to start building a new bench and I have thought about an asymmetrical split.

[Andrew Nemeth]

Can someone tell me the function of the split in the top?
Jon, While I have never used a split top bench, I will most likely be building a split top bench very soon. One of the advantages I have not seen me sooner on here yet, and the one that I’m the most interested in, is the ability to “sleeve” narrower cases and drawers over only one of the slabs. I can see this being very useful for cleaning up joinery after glue up and fitting drawers. The only way I know how to do this efficiently without a split top is to clamp a narrower board flat onto the bench top that extends out over the edge of the bench and “sleeve” the case or drawer over that. It always feels kinda clumsy to me to do it that way, whereas a split top appears to be a pretty elegant solution.

[Peter Mich]

While technically not a tool, it might be wise to enlist the help of a friend from time to time when wrangling heavy pieces.

Peter

[Joshua Lucas]

My bench has a 12" section in front and a 10" section in the back, with a 1.5" split. Though I didn't plan that, those were just the proportions I ended up with when I sawed the pith out of the single slab i started with.

[ken hatch]

Ken, Out of curiosity, what do you think the ideal proportions of the asymmetrical split would be? I’m about to start building a new bench and I have thought about an asymmetrical split.

Andrew,

I've two split top Roubos, one with near symmetrical slabs, the other asymmetrical. The symmetrical has a 12" front slab, 3" split, and a 11" rear slab. The asymmetrical front slab is 16 1/2" with a 2 1/2" split and a 7 1/2" rear slab. The asymmetrical bench is still in the shop used as a sharpening bench, the other is in the back garden used as a potting bench. My current daily user benches are a pair of Moravian style benches with tool trays instead of a split, one smaller than the other. The small one has a 14 1/2" work surface, the other's is 18". I use the smaller bench about 80% of the time and almost never feel the need for a larger work surface. BTW as an aside, I think a Moravian style bench makes a better work bench for the modern shop, it just doesn't have the "hoot" factor of an overbuilt Roubo.

ken

[Michael J Evans]

Andrew,

I've two split top Roubos, one with near symmetrical slabs, the other asymmetrical. The symmetrical has a 12" front slab, 3" split, and a 11" rear slab. The asymmetrical front slab is 16 1/2" with a 2 1/2" split and a 7 1/2" rear slab. The asymmetrical bench is still in the shop used as a sharpening bench, the other is in the back garden used as a potting bench. My current daily user benches are a pair of Moravian style benches with tool trays instead of a split, one smaller than the other. The small one has a 14 1/2" work surface, the other's is 18". I use the smaller bench about 80% of the time and almost never feel the need for a larger work surface. BTW as an aside, I think a Moravian style bench makes a better work bench for the modern shop, it just doesn't have the "hoot" factor of an overbuilt Roubo.

ken

Ken
Quit singing the praises of the Moravian. I haven't thought about a bench since I built mine 6ish years ago. Now I've been researching everyday, and I'm pretty sure Moravian will be my next bench. Either that or a shaker.

[Scott Winners]

While technically not a tool, it might be wise to enlist the help of a friend from time to time when wrangling heavy pieces.

Peter

This site needs a like button. Might be the best advice in thread.

In Chris' c2020 workbench book he skipped the tap and used #14 x 1.5" screws to attach the benchcraft hardware to the vise chop, and #14 x 2.0" screws to attach the crisscross hardware to the bench leg. I can get those and the correct tapered drill bit at my local home store for less than $20 if the OP would care to PM/DM a shipping address.

[ken hatch]

Ken
Quit singing the praises of the Moravian. I haven't thought about a bench since I built mine 6ish years ago. Now I've been researching everyday, and I'm pretty sure Moravian will be my next bench. Either that or a shaker.


Michael,

Building benches can start living in your head rent free if you are not careful :). Good luck on your new build.

ken

[Charles Guest]

Benches with a trough down the middle, where I'm from, were always associated with school benches. They had two vices at opposite, diagonal corners and were usually at least eight feet long. In use, these were like having the tool drop (well) at the rear of the bench for each student.

I don't see the advantage for the lone worker. I'd rather have the tool drop in the rear, with the full slab in the front rather than having to keep the top flat across the 'ditch' that is a central well. Tools sticking up in the dead middle of a woodworking bench makes no sense to me at all.

[Jim Koepke]

Benches with a trough down the middle, where I'm from, were always associated with school benches. They had two vices at opposite, diagonal corners and were usually at least eight feet long. In use, these were like having the tool drop (well) at the rear of the bench for each student.

I don't see the advantage for the lone worker. I'd rather have the tool drop in the rear, with the full slab in the front rather than having to keep the top flat across the 'ditch' that is a central well. Tools sticking up in the dead middle of a woodworking bench makes no sense to me at all.

One side of the well is for working, the other side is for holding the pieces to be worked and when they are finished waiting for assembly. The well can also be made to hold an insert to allow for a full flat top when needed.

Each worker has their own way of working. Some like a tool well some don't. Some like it at the back of the bench, some like it down the middle. Some like round dogs some like square.

Make what works best for your own style. Life goes on.

jtk

[Charles Guest]

One side of the well is for working, the other side is for holding the pieces to be worked and when they are finished waiting for assembly. The well can also be made to hold an insert to allow for a full flat top when needed.

Each worker has their own way of working. Some like a tool well some don't. Some like it at the back of the bench, some like it down the middle. Some like round dogs some like square.

Make what works best for your own style. Life goes on.

jtk

Just makes vastly more sense to me to have a contiguous work surface, not one interrupted by a well in the middle. Battens can always be provided to support a well board, I think I mentioned that in another post in the context of having a well at all, but what you have then is an essentially hollow area in-between your two slabs. Again, not seeing an advantage. Just move it to the back.

These things are dual benches in my experience, beyond looking at pictures in a book that may not provide full context, think about it like a tandem bicycle for two riders. One can make it go, but it looks a little awkward.

[Jim Koepke]

Just makes vastly more sense to me to have a contiguous work surface, not one interrupted by a well in the middle.

As my post implies, what works for one person might not work for another.

To my way of working the Scandinavian bench design doesn't make sense. The shoulder vise seems to limit how long of a board can be worked. Those using them see them as their best choice.

For some a wagon vise is the best thing going. It appealed to me at one time until realizing it has limits my current set up can overcome.

Some folks find aprons on their bench useful. Some feel they only get in the way.

This can become a debate of there being a single bench for every woodworker versus there being various designs with different appeals to different people working on different projects.

jtk

[Jon Snider]

As my post implies, what works for one person might not work for another.

To my way of working the Scandinavian bench design doesn't make sense. The shoulder vise seems to limit how long of a board can be worked. Those using them see them as their best choice.

For some a wagon vise is the best thing going. It appealed to me at one time until realizing it has limits my current set up can overcome.

Some folks find aprons on their bench useful. Some feel they only get in the way.

This can become a debate of there being a single bench for every woodworker versus there being various designs with different appeals to different people working on different projects.

jtk

What’s your preference if no shoulder or wagon vise?

[Jim Koepke]

What’s your preference if no shoulder or wagon vise?

To be clear, to me a shoulder vise is one with the 'L' shaped extension from the left end of the bench with a screw coming through the foot of the 'L'. My preference is to have the ability to hold a piece in the vise extending beyond the end of the bench. Sometimes the lumber being planed is longer than my bench. In my shop a shoulder vise would likely be finding my hip on a regular basis. For some people they may be a fine choice. For me, sometimes my current face vise is in the way.

My current end vise may seem lame to some. It does have enough versatility to work well for almost all my needs:

453176

For many uses it is not much different than a wagon vise. It is often used to hold work while cutting tenons or dovetails. It is also used for holding stock being sawn.

The vise is of a simple design with a tendency to rack. On the right in the image is a shop made spacer stack to compensate for the racking:

453177

The blades are 1/8, 1/4, 1/2 & 1" thick making any size from 1/8" to 1-7/8". A separate 1"X2" block is used for larger sizes up to the distance between dog holes.

Plans for my bench include a twin screw full width vise at the tail end, a pattern maker's vise on the left face of one side. The plan is for the other side to have a leg vise positioned like a left hander's vise.

jtk

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

sorry it took me a bit to answer, I was traveling

"They" is Benchcrafted, they suggest tapping the screws for the leg vise. Caught me off guard, I was wondering what else I should prepare for

thanks:)

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

What Jim said.

Assaf,

I've built the BenchCrafted Roubo, it has been a few years but if I remember correctly the metal tap and die set was about it for special tools. Hope you have someone to help, even with a split top everything is heavy and hard to sling around the shop. My only two suggestions are to use the crisscross and not the parallel guide for the leg vise and to think about your work flow before installing the wagon vise, I didn't find it was worth the effort to install.

ken


thanks, I was banking on the Criscros

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

Those big ones must be for timber framing or mine supports.

Also consider a 1/2" swan neck can work in a 3/4" or 1" mortise. A 3/4" or 1" swan neck won't work in a 1/2" mortise.

jtk


thanks for the suggestion, I've never heard of swan neck chisel before, I had to look it up. Honestly, I don't think I will need one; the really deep tenons are going to be through (sliding dovetail). I have a big router plane which I hope I can manage with for the rest.

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

"Starting the search to build a new workbench to replace the old one built many years ago. Can someone tell me the function of the split in the top?"

It seems to me a split top is really a whole different design from a traditional one piece top Roubo which avoids the issue of expansion and contraction of the top working against the joints between the legs and the short side stretchers. I am not sure if the clamping options drove that design.

the split top is built with a removable partition which should lie flush with the top so that when you use it your theoretically not loosing the advantages of a continuous top. when you remove it, you can pull clamps through it to get greater clamping reach from the middle of the top. If you move it, it can rest at a higher step creating a "wall" to use to plane against. Also depending on how you design it, you can use the partition as a tool tray.

[Tom Bussey]

I made my own criss cross out of wood, hickory to be exact. I have used it for 4 years now and have not had any trouble with it, In fact it is the criss cross that takes the weight of the chop. The screw can be turned with a couple of fingers. Also pictured is a good reason for a split top. The bottom of the tool tray pulls out for clamping in the middle. Maybe I am wrong but most tops are fit over pins to hold the top in place on the outside edges. The split top allows for wood movement during seasonal changes.

453307 453308
Probably the most important aspect of the bench is the height. Length and width are controlled by the space allowed for it.

I would make it 4 hands high and about 3 hands wide unless you can work from both sides and your space allows it. And I mean your hands. A hand is the length from the tip of your thumb to the tip of your little finger when your hand is stretched out comfortably. A hand for me is 81/2 inches so the height of the bench is 34 inches. If I really stretch it out it is 35 inches. It has to do with proportions. 3 hands wide is about how far your arm will go to pick something up comfortably. Again it is sizing your bench to fit YOUR body not mine. For me a split top should be no wider than 25 1/2 inches, so 24 works out to be somewhat ideal.

[Curt Putnam]

Benchcrafted wants machine screws into hard maple. Christopher Schwarz used # 14 wood screws into SYP. Softer, weaker woods will most likely do better with coarse thread screws.

[Derek Cohen]

Just makes vastly more sense to me to have a contiguous work surface, not one interrupted by a well in the middle. Battens can always be provided to support a well board, I think I mentioned that in another post in the context of having a well at all, but what you have then is an essentially hollow area in-between your two slabs. Again, not seeing an advantage. Just move it to the back.

These things are dual benches in my experience, beyond looking at pictures in a book that may not provide full context, think about it like a tandem bicycle for two riders. One can make it go, but it looks a little awkward.

I tend to agree with Charles, but I have not used a split bench. I am also biased by having a single-top Roubo.

One of the questions I have, not mentioned here, is whether there is any difficulty maintaining that the separate sides remain coplanar?

I just prefer the idea of keeping it simple and having a continuous surface upon which to work. This has served me well for 30 years.

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/HarlequinSideTableTheLegs_html_m70326a3f.jpg

With regard the notion that the split bench can be set up for planing drawers, can it be set for different widths, which I consider important? This is the fixture I made, and which attaches to my bench very easily ...

https://i.postimg.cc/R0PGDGwW/3a.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/LXwDHXCR/5a.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/y63nLmxN/6a.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/fLJ5nXvB/7a.jpg

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Andrew Nemeth]

That’s a pretty nifty set up Derek. I may have to try something like that if I don’t go with a split, and possibly even if I do go with a split.

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

Tom,

your criss cross design is amazing, as is your tip with hand height. I will look into it.
many thanks

[Dave Mills]

Just a note, you may have already addressed this... Split top benches are typically supported by adding skirts on the ends of the bench so the two tops don't collapse. Single tops (in Roubo style at least) don't have skirts under the top - just the legs hold up the top. The impact is in the installation of end vises that need to be able to clear the skirt.

[ken hatch]

Just a note, you may have already addressed this... . Single tops (in Roubo style at least) don't have skirts under the top - just the legs hold up the top. The impact is in the installation of end vises that need to be able to clear the skirt.

Dave,

Sorry to be dense but I haven't a clue what you are talking about. "Split top benches are typically supported by adding skirts on the ends of the bench so the two tops don't collapse". If you mean split slabs need a upper stretcher between the legs then you are correct but I use an upper stretcher when building a single slab as well, completing the box dontchknow, stronger than not.

ken

[Andrew Nemeth]

I made my own criss cross out of wood, hickory to be exact.

Tom, any chance you have more photos and/or details about your criss cross? I don’t want to hijack the OPs thread, so, if you do have the details/photos, it may be worth posting in a new thread. I’d think a thread on a DIY criss cross would be of interest to many.

[Dave Mills]

Dave,

Sorry to be dense but I haven't a clue what you are talking about. "Split top benches are typically supported by adding skirts on the ends of the bench so the two tops don't collapse". If you mean split slabs need a upper stretcher between the legs then you are correct but I use an upper stretcher when building a single slab as well, completing the box dontchknow, stronger than not.

ken

Ken, I haven't seen Roubo style benches that use a normal non-split top using upper stretchers. The top itself is monolithic and "completes the box". I'm not suggesting that nobody's using them, obviously you are, but that is not the normal design I'm seeing built or documented.

[Tom Bussey]

My tip about hands is nothing new. I first I heard about it, it was a way of measuring a horse's height. In the movie Pretty woman, Julia Roberts comments when they were in the car, that a person foot is the same length as the persons arm is from the elbow to, I believe, the wrist. It deals with the make up of that persons anatomy. A kitchen cabinate is 24 wide and the countertop has an overhang and is the distance an arm can reach comfortably is 24 inches( 3 hands).

If you stand 2 adults side by side of different heights. A big variation is more noticeable, and yet if the arms hang loosely at the side the finger tips of both will be within 1 inch of each other. That is why countertops today are 36 inches from the floor. Again proportions.

And thirdly, I believe his name is Tom Choplin, a well respected woodworker, did a You Tube video on heights and that is where I got the 4 hands.

[Tom Bussey]

Andrew, please give me a couple of days and I will give a short response. There are a lot of people out there who because they have a Criss Cross form Bench Crafted or what ever will chime in and say their is the only way to go, their way is better, this is how I did it, or it is foolish to make it out of wood. In other wards I am going against the established way and therefor must be made to appear like a fool and I do not want to waist my time.

If a few more want to hear about it let me know otherwise I it is not worth my time to be made to appear stupid. There are whole chapters written in text books that apply to clamping principals and they are hidden in the criss Cross.

And as for the others, other than wood which is the same investment I have less than one dollar in my criss cross. and no tap to buy.

[Bob Riefer]

the split top is built with a removable partition which should lie flush with the top so that when you use it your theoretically not loosing the advantages of a continuous top. when you remove it, you can pull clamps through it to get greater clamping reach from the middle of the top. If you move it, it can rest at a higher step creating a "wall" to use to plane against. Also depending on how you design it, you can use the partition as a tool tray.


I just finished building my version of this bench, pretty closely following Benchcrafted's plans but using mostly power tools (and some hand tools). I left the center partition sitting just below the surface of the tops to ensure it couldn't possibly interfere when in the "down" position, and that is working very nicely.

With holdfasts I haven't yet found the need to use clamps through the split, but when the need arises, I'll be happy for it. And, handling the top as two pieces was a BEAST... joined together it would be brutal.

[Bob Riefer]

Also, to Derek's question about coplanar and split top..

I followed Marc's (the wood whisperer) approach for setting up rails to carry a router sled for final flattening. Basically, two straight rails are temporarily affixed to the sides of the bench - using two cords from corner to corner and crossing in the middle, coplanar is established. Then the router sled travels on those aligned rails. In my case, the deepest router cut was about 1/16" in one section (but the majority of the cuts were between 1/64" and 1/32") as I took a lot of time along the way to try to ensure precise top and to reduce the effort on this last step.

I checked all with small winding sticks on each individual split, and then wider winding sticks to check the entire thing as a unit... and also with a precision straight edge endlessly (obsessively). The thing is flat and coplanar, at least flat enough for my skill level at this point in time :)

Now, as time goes on, I may need to repeat that exercise in the future... But I'm good at it now, so it will be about a 1 hour event some years from now.

[Andrew Nemeth]

Andrew, please give me a couple of days and I will give a short response.

Take your time Tom. If your wood “St. Peter’s Cross” works, it works. Anybody can come of with a theory of why it shouldn’t, or why Bencrafted’s Crisscross is a superior product, but at the end of the day, it’s all talk. I can, however, understand why you may not want to partake in online debates if you feel your views or ideas are being criticized.

[Jim Koepke]

If a few more want to hear about it let me know

Add me as interested in learning about your wooden Criss Cross.

jtk

[Lawrence Burkett]

Add me as interested in learning about your wooden Criss Cross.

jtk

Also interested. Not sure I would do it myself, but it seems pretty interesting to learn about.

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

Andrew, please give me a couple of days and I will give a short response. There are a lot of people out there who because they have a Criss Cross form Bench Crafted or what ever will chime in and say their is the only way to go, their way is better, this is how I did it, or it is foolish to make it out of wood. In other wards I am going against the established way and therefor must be made to appear like a fool and I do not want to waist my time.

If a few more want to hear about it let me know otherwise I it is not worth my time to be made to appear stupid. There are whole chapters written in text books that apply to clamping principals and they are hidden in the criss Cross.

And as for the others, other than wood which is the same investment I have less than one dollar in my criss cross. and no tap to buy.

I'm a straight up neophyte to woodworking who is about to order a Benchcrafted package which includes a crisscross. that being said I would love a detailed post on how you build it.
one of the things I love about this community is most people here seem to agree that there is more than one way to skin a cat. If you built it, and it works then I see no possible way to make you out as stupid or otherwise. Seems to me to do so would say a lot more about the naysayer...

P.S. until now the only tap I ever wanted gave me beer :(

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

I bought the guild lessons too, that is what I plan on doing

[Peter Mich]

Perhaps you’ve already uncovered the following, but maybe not. Kieran Binnie described his Roubo build in his blog (https://overthewireless.com/2019/01/) and in a series of articles in the Furniture & Cabinetmaking magazine. I enjoyed following along as he worked through the many challenges. Go get ‘em, best of luck.

[Assaf Oppenheimer]

I would make it 4 hands high and about 3 hands wide unless you can work from both sides and your space allows it. And I mean your hands. A hand is the length from the tip of your thumb to the tip of your little finger when your hand is stretched out comfortably. A hand for me is 81/2 inches so the height of the bench is 34 inches. If I really stretch it out it is 35 inches. It has to do with proportions. 3 hands wide is about how far your arm will go to pick something up comfortably. Again it is sizing your bench to fit YOUR body not mine. For me a split top should be no wider than 25 1/2 inches, so 24 works out to be somewhat ideal.


I looked into what you said, I have adjusted my plans accordingly and the bench now stands at 37" tall. thank you sir!

I am not sure about extending the top past 24" though, I want to build a tool cabinet to hang on the wall over the bench, I think keeping me far away from the wall will prevent me from getting to tools on a higher shelf.

[Warren Mickley]

I looked into what you said, I have adjusted my plans accordingly and the bench now stands at 37" tall. thank you sir!

I am not sure about extending the top past 24" though, I want to build a tool cabinet to hang on the wall over the bench, I think keeping me far away from the wall will prevent me from getting to tools on a higher shelf.

Andre Roubo recommends 20 to 22 inches wide.

[Curt Putnam]

For a bench height, HNT Gordon recommends placing a piece of the average stock that you will be planing. Put your most used plane on that piece of stock and grasp the tote. Your forearm should be level with the bench when you are in the correct planing position. Your bench height should be equal to the bottom of the topmost piece of stock. Makes sense to me.

[Derek Cohen]

For a bench height, HNT Gordon recommends placing a piece of the average stock that you will be planing. Put your most used plane on that piece of stock and grasp the tote. Your forearm should be level with the bench when you are in the correct planing position. Your bench height should be equal to the bottom of the topmost piece of stock. Makes sense to me.

Curt, I agree with this. Some years ago I was writing about pushing a plane handle forward rather than down.

Note that woodies, such as HNT Gordon, are influenced by Asian designs, and are lower than "traditional" wooden Western planes.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Tom Bussey]

I agree with both of you, Curt and Derek. I did exactly that. I built up a proto type bench to see what my height should be as well as how the size fit into the room. I even laid out my actual dog holes and everything actual size with a marking knife so there wouldn't be any surprises and I could get a any dimension anytime I needed. If you go this route tape paper to the bench while you work dimensions out. I changed things 3 times I think before I used the knife. I even took the floor mat I would be standing on into account.

And to my SURPRISE the bench is exactly 4 hands high. 34 1/2 inches high. 34 for the bench height and 1/2 inch for the mat I stand on. And the proto type leg vise was also worked out at that time. Which is i a different post.

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[Tom Bussey]

I agree with both of you, Curt and Derek. I did exactly that. I built up a proto type bench to see what my height should be as well as how the size fit into the room. I even laid out my actual dog holes and everything actual size with a marking knife so there wouldn't be any surprises and I could get a any dimension anytime I needed. If you go this route tape paper to the bench while you work dimensions out. I changed things 3 times I think before I used the knife. I even took the floor mat I would be standing on into account.

And to my SURPRISE the bench is exactly 4 hands high. 34 1/2 inches high. 34 for the bench height ( 4 hand) and 1/2 inch for the mat I stand on. And the proto type leg vise was also worked out at that time, which is earlier in this post or in a different post by me.

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