Vermont Natural Coatings on turned pieces

[Dan Gaylin]

Has anyone tried Vermont Natural Coatings (based on whey protein) as a finish for turned pieces? I try to use non-toxic or low toxicity finishes on all my work, and hadn't heard of the Vermont products until recently. I'm interested in knowing about your experiences with these products.

Thanks!

-dan

[Dan Gaylin]

Okay then...looks like Vermont Natural Coatings are not used by a lot of turners. I will probably give them a try and report back on what I find. Part of the fun of learning to turn for me has been getting more familiar with a range of finishes and their pros and cons.

[Don Stephan]

Think my search term was something like "FDA approved finish", anyway came across a Federal Register document that seemed to suggest (not in clear English) that most finishes when cured are essentially food safe.

[Rusty Nesmith]

Think my search term was something like "FDA approved finish", anyway came across a Federal Register document that seemed to suggest (not in clear English) that most finishes when cured are essentially food safe.
That is what I have heard also. The one thing to remember is curing time and drying time are not the same.

[Roger Feeley]

Dan,

I just stumbled onto this thread, I usually hang out over in general ww.

l’ve never use VNC on turned work but it’s my absolute favorite varnish, period. I was once told by their tech support that I could drink the stuff and not suffer any major problems. I got turned onto it after Fine Woodworking rated it as the best brushing varnish. AND they said that the brush of choice is disposable foam.

About the only thing you have to get used to is how little time you have to go back and tip off brush marks. the other issue is that it settles. It can take a while to get the gunk off the bottom of the can (plastic) and dissolved. After stirring, I’ve used VNC that’s a year old and it’s fine.

other than being easy to use and non-stinky, I love the hardness and feel. Tap your fingernails on a piece and the finish clicks like porcelain. The feel is hard to describe. Buttery? I’ve noticed that people like to run their hands over my projects.

VNC makes a floor finish that you might try. The floor finish is even tougher than the furniture finish but it can run. But what do you care? Just finish at the lathe and let it rotate dead slow for 20 minutes.

you can wipe it on but I never have. They make an heirloom wiping varnish but it comes in a jug, not a can. Given that this stuff settles, I don’t see how you could keep it around if you can’t stir it.

[Tom Bain]

Never used it on a turning (interesting idea), but VNC is the finish on the floor of my shop and it’s great in that application.

[John K Jordan]

l’ve never use VNC on turned work but it’s my absolute favorite varnish, period. I was once told by their tech support that I could drink the stuff and not suffer any major problems. I got turned onto it after Fine Woodworking rated it as the best brushing varnish. AND they said that the brush of choice is disposable foam.


I see several on Amazon with the label "Poly Whey." Do you prefer the satin, semi gloss...?
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=Vermont+natural+coatings+whey&ref=nb_sb_noss_2

JKJ

[Roger Feeley]

I see several on Amazon with the label "Poly Whey." Do you prefer the satin, semi gloss...?
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=Vermont+natural+coatings+whey&ref=nb_sb_noss_2

JKJ

ive used most of the sheens. I like satin.
ive finished a number of projects right on the lathe. It’s easier to avoid runs.

[Alex Zeller]

Never tried them but have always wanted to. I've inquired at a couple local retailers because I've never seen it on a shelf but they just say they can order it. Since it's so close I can't see ordering it on line when I probably drive by them once a month. But I don't think they are set up for retail business. One of these days I'll call them and ask if I can order on-line and just pick up as I'm passing by. But I really hoped that if I stopped there and got talking with them I would get a better feel for what they sell.

[Roger Feeley]

Never tried them but have always wanted to. I've inquired at a couple local retailers because I've never seen it on a shelf but they just say they can order it. Since it's so close I can't see ordering it on line when I probably drive by them once a month. But I don't think they are set up for retail business. One of these days I'll call them and ask if I can order on-line and just pick up as I'm passing by. But I really hoped that if I stopped there and got talking with them I would get a better feel for what they sell.

worth a try. I’ve talked to them a couple of time and they were really nice by Kansas standards. Then I travelled to Vermont and found that everybody is REALLY nice. So, by Vermont standards, they are about average.

[John K Jordan]

worth a try. I’ve talked to them a couple of time and they were really nice by Kansas standards. Then I travelled to Vermont and found that everybody is REALLY nice. So, by Vermont standards, they are about average.

We drove around New England a couple of years ago. The area across the northern part of New England, including the small towns and countryside in Vermont, is one of my favorites in the country. Nearly everyone we met was friendly and helpful.

JKJ

[Alex Zeller]

worth a try. I’ve talked to them a couple of time and they were really nice by Kansas standards. Then I travelled to Vermont and found that everybody is REALLY nice. So, by Vermont standards, they are about average.

Unfortunately we all seem to make plans and then not find the time to make them happen. I look forward to to seeing some pictures of projects people have done with VNC products. I don't mind Minwax products but I certainly would opt for a local company when possible. Hopefully when the virus is behind us we all can go back to traveling around.

[Dan Gaylin]

Hi All,

Sorry busy week at work and just noticed all the great replies. Bob Flexner has stated (and many experts agree with him) that all finishes are food safe once cured. When I said low toxicity I meant the level of VOCs that you are exposed to when applying the finish. Vermont coatings have very low levels of VOC as does shellac mixed up with drinkable grain alcohol, Tried and True products, Sutherland and Wells Botanical Polymerized Tung Oil, Odies Oil (and many oil/wax blends depending on the solvent) and quite a few others. But as others have posted, what’s interesting to me about the Vermont products is that they seem to be more of a varnish, meaning they are film finishes that you can build up in layers. So potentially more protective than many of the others that I listed above. I also just love trying out different finishes on turned pieces to see how they complement the (or not) the piece.

[Dan Gaylin]

Left out another one of my favorite nontoxic wood turning finishes: Shellawaxcream from U-Beaut.

Roger thanks for all the great info on the Vermont products.

[Roger Feeley]

Left out another one of my favorite nontoxic wood turning finishes: Shellawaxcream from U-Beaut.

Roger thanks for all the great info on the Vermont products.

Aw shucks, you are too kind.
im always good for a shout out for made in USA. Always root for the home team.

[Don Stephan]

Found some very obvious typos on one web page and .pdf, which does not inspire confidence. Perhaps I missed them, are there MSDS sheets on the web site? Finally, I was looking for some results of industry standard tests, such as hardness and resistance to staining by common items, and/or side by side comparisons with well known finishes. I would like to support innovative products, but can't afford come-back on items sold to customers because a new finish failed in some way.

[David Walser]

Roger -- Thank you for your insights. Question: How easy or difficult is it to repair an item that has been finished with VNC? For example, say a piece is handled frequently and the finish is worn through in a couple of spots. Can you simply apply another coat, or do you need to sand back to the bare wood? With many film finishes, a new coat will lay on top of the prior coats -- leading to layers of finish that will show through if you try to simply touch up a wear spot or fill a scratch. (That's not the case with a true lacquer. The new coat will melt into the prior coats, leaving just one layer of finish. That can make a lacquer finish easier to repair.)

I ask because reparability is major consideration for me with items that will be handled frequently. For those, I generally prefer to use a polymerizing oil (such as walnut and BLO). It's not as durable as most film finishes, but it's much easier to repair with just another coat of oil.

[Roger Feeley]

David,
I would lightly sand the original finish before overcoating. Also make sure and remove any oils from handling. I’ve let 48 hours go by between coats without problems. But these questions are best answered by the folks at VNC.

truthfully,I’ve never repaired an item that used VNC. But the things I make are just for family. This stuff is a polyurethane so it’s resistant to just about everything. at least that’s what I would have told you two weeks ago.
but...
probably the item that has seen the most abuse is an oak coffee table I made for my daughter about ten years ago. It survived people putting up their feet, food and drinks and still looked like new. Then my two grandsons made it the center of their play. They spilled water, food, paint, you name it and it still looked great. About a week ago, something got on there and took off about two square inches of the varnish. It got down to bare wood somehow. I’m debating just relocating or sanding to bare wood, restraining and renovating.

I can’t give you any long term feedback but I recently did a project for a rehab hospital. They needed a set of platforms (2”,4” & 6”)to teach wounded vets how to jump curbs in a wheelchair. The leading edge of the platforms will take a lot of abuse so, while most of the platform is Baltic Birch plywood, the leading edge is hickory. I finished them with VNC floor varnish. As far as I know, the finish is ok after a month of daily use.

I like walnut oil too.